Read in AutoWeek that the new Civic will no longer have the double wishbone suspension and there are no plans for a SI version - this just as Subaru brings the turbo Impreza to the US. Honda says the performance segment is too small to market to. Same thing Mistu said when they "softened" the Eclipse. I'd think this would boost sales of the RS and Celica. What is wrong with people?! Why are SUVs selling like hotcakes and good, affordable, fun-to-drive cars becoming more and more rare?

Because Americans have always liked cars that are huge on the outside, small on the inside, and are heavy as hell.

I seen one of the new civics in the parking lot of Premier Outlets in Orlando the other day and all I can say is eeeeeeewwwwwwwwww!

IMHO, the 92-95 civic was the best-looking and sporties with the most potential and it has been downhill since then....and now really downhill.

SUVs suck

The civic was a good car...it will be dearly missed

Has anyone realized how the Lexus IS looks almost exactly like a civic, especially the new civics?

After having been over to Europe, the American car market is WAY different. Out in Europe, there is no such thing as an SUV. There are small turbocharged ugly cars that weigh next to nothing. Biggest cars out there are the luxury cars, and there are hardly any of those. The small car market has been destroyed out here. No sane person will purchase a small, light, fast car here only to be run over by those damned SUV's.

i have one of those Lexus' in my household, and it looks NOTHING like a civic. The Lexus absolutely blows every other car i've seen out of the water in terms of looks. if you haven't seen one up close, in preson, you can't judge it

The same parking lot in the Premier Outlets had a yellow Lexus IS and a light blue 2001 Civic and I got a chance to compare both of them at the same time...I see very little difference.

Everytime I see a Lexus IS I always think it is a Civic first, and then realize it is an IS.

Now, performance is a completely different story.

you SERIOUSLY gotta stop smokin that crack if you confuse IS300s with civics, hehe, now an impreza and a dodge shadow i can understand... but COME ON!

ive HEARD that the si will be back, and the civic has improved quite a bit (power delivery/rigidity/size)... but lets jus say the new ludtegra better be DAMN impressive to make up for the gap between the civic and now the s2000

Americans, in general, like big things. Think about it... would you rather see someone blowing up lots of small fireworks on the 4th, or would you rather see a few REALLY big ones? I know which I'd run to see first.

And you forget something... the average American is NOT into driving for pleasure, they are in it for the ability to go faster then their slow-ass walking (with the exception of women at a big sale in a department store).

Wow! Am I the only one that thinks the Civic and the IS are, at least, a little similar?

Has anyone seen an IS and a new civic right next to each other yet?

OK.......someone get the IS to new civic morph or picture vs. picture going, please.


Impreza.......mistaken for Dodge Shadow?

How about Impreza looking similar to Isuzu Stylus or older Mitsu. Mirage?

Well I just got the new copy of SCC and they had an article on the new 2001 Civic. I briefly scanned the article and the specs indicated a new 1.7L engine rated at 127hp which is what the old 1.6L EX (Canadian Si) Coupe was at. Perhaps ina few years they will come out with a tuned 1.7L engine (AFAIK Honda doesn't currently have a 1.7L in their stable) probably in the neighborhood of 170hp. I don't think Honda has abandoned the idea of sporty compact cars in North America, at least I hope not, otherwise who will we race?

i've been making a living kickin the crap out of Probes always trying to start crap with me http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/smile.gif that's who we can race http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/biggrin.gif

Because Americans have always liked cars that are huge on the outside, small on the inside, and are heavy as hell.


Hey! I resemble that remark! Actually, landbarges like mine are very roomy on the inside. It may be heavy, but that's because of all of the luxury. All luxury cars are heavy. Despite that, it is a performance car.

Heavy because of all that luxury? Last I checked, leather & wood didn't weigh too much...

Anyway, I meant heavy as in big ladder-frame truck heavy.

The New Integra due to debut next fall is rumored to have 220hp derived from the S2000 inline 2.0L which will give the WRX a run for the money. It is also rumored to have one engine choice...much like the Eclipse.

There is also a rumor that the European New Civic Hatch Type-R (~190hp) will be here.

Next year is going to be exciting...believe me. http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/wink.gif

Perhaps Honda will be going out of the sporty compact car segment but what about Mazda and Nissan? Mazda will come out with the RX-Evolv and Nissan with the new Z. It we get both of these fine cars trust me you guys will have pleanty of competition. Also each time I see and IS300 from some distance and from the back I think it's an Accord. Dont like that. To many cars running around with those crome back lights.


Edit: Forgot to mention that Mazda will be coming out with a direct copetitor for the BMW 3-series and IS300. It's rummord to have a Renesis engine with 250 na. Here's a pic....

http://www.rx7.com/pics/rx-sedan.gif

[This message has been edited by Rally Man (edited September 27, 2000).]

whoa.. the is300 looking like the civic? heh.. thats new..

but seriouly though the 2001 civic looks like a focus from the back.. damn.. and that sucks that theres no more si's.. i loved that electron blue color.. oh well.. honda seems to have lots of stuff in the works.. with the integ..

eugene

Now, if that's AWD, I'm sold.. That Mazda that looks like a souped up Protoge that is..

Tim

Back to the original post . . .

The loss of the double wishbone will only be missed by a select few. 99.99% of the civic buyers never appreciated that their wheels stayed perpindicular to the road under ALL conditions.

Ma and Pa newlywed only care that they have a reliable car that won't lose its resale value.

Sayonara Si, but you haven't been the same since the CRX.

JD

the si can't go. honda just designed that new V-tec motor.

the si is comin back in the 2002 model year and the IS 300 not only looks like but is a direct copy of a 3-series beemer

Matt, what new VTEC motor? The B16 has been around since the Del Slo was here.

he might be talking about VTEC-i.. like VVTL-i now it has intelligence.. OoOoo but i dont think its gonna show up till the new teg comes out..

eugene..
2k celi-gts-vvtl-i-6speed..

What makes it intelligent?

I just realized, "VTEC" sure rolls off the tongue a lot better than "VVTL-i!" How do you even pronounce that one! http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/biggrin.gif

whoa, that's not even close to the many pics i've seen. here http://209.132.49.149/images-large/2000_mazda_rx_evolv-3.jpg

I like this better, and they're saying 276hp

Don't fret y'all civic lovers at heart. http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/wink.gif The Si or wutever it will be called will come back in 2002 or something. It's taking a breather.
And yes the IS300 does resemble the new Civic front end. And yes I saw one up close. I like it. It's not ugly. But the rear is just plain dorky. Gimme a bim bim please!

Heavy because of all that luxury? Last I checked, leather & wood didn't weigh too much...

Luxury is more than leather and wood draped over a tiny crappy chassis.

I don't understand you JGard18 http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/confused.gif I know that's the RX-Evolv having about 280 na, but the one pic that I showd is of a completely different car that also has the Renesis engine just like the RX-Evolv just no as much hp. It's supposed to have more luxury in it. Are we in the same playing field JGard18

[This message has been edited by Rally Man (edited September 27, 2000).]

Whats wrong with a Protege? (for the price)

Right now I'm seeing a IS300 almost every day already, theyre selling like hotcakes (I would by one if I had that kinda money!) and yes it does look kinda like a civic, but with much more $$$$ attached! (civics DO have nice lines, but details are another thing)

The pictures of the Integra ive seen look like a cross between a Paseo (rear+side) and a Camaro (front).... butt ugly if you ask me

EDIT: stupidity. sorry, i thought you were showing a pic that you thought was the evolve. sorry man

[This message has been edited by JGard18 (edited September 27, 2000).]

[This message has been edited by JGard18 (edited September 27, 2000).]

i personally can't wait to see the new NSX with 400 vette eating ponies. of course, even if i took all the money i will ever posses at some point and sum it (where's the damn greek charactor set?!) i still won't be able to aford it http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/smile.gif

Hey, speaking of VTEC/VVTL-i, does anyone know if the JDM Subarus have a similar variable valve timing thingy on their NA engines? I mean, most other Japanese manufacturers have it, at least in Japan anyway.

EVA01,

Yes they do. I do forget the exact acronym they used for it, but yes, it is there.

Tim

well doesnt the impreza use mcpherson struts? i mean they cant be THAT bad...
the 99-00 Si was the fastest/best performing civic out of the factory ever.. Si versions usually come at the end of the production line i believe...so well be seeing a new Si in a few years...

The new integra wont be designed off of the s2000...because it wont be RWD , and it WILL be based on the new civic platform, which means there is no way to fit the s2000 engine in there + FWD..

MacPherson struts can't be that bad, after all, the Porsche 911 Turbo seems to fair pretty well with them. http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/wink.gif

http://www.gigahosts.com/ballericons/icons/juice2000_com_cars25.gif http://www.gigahosts.com/ballericons/icons/juice2000_com_cars24.gif

[This message has been edited by MikeYOX (edited December 02, 2000).]

Guys, seriously, my 99 black Si (with debadged front) looks very similar to an IS300 from the front and front corner views.

The rest of it is a different story.

But the IS300 is a total waste of money. Anyone who would buy one is obviously not a performance enthusiast (auto, heavy, Toyota for Bimmer price). Note: To all owners of IS300 who take offense, uh, I really don't care.

-Dog

The IS300 isnt a waste of money when you compair it to a 3 series. Its actually less for more, and its much cooler!

But for performace per $, the WRX is much more money/performance friendly.

Subaru AVCS!

the is300 may look like a civic, but the chevy malibu also looks like my 4D impreza.. -g

Yeah the Civic's new suspension looks more like a "road" Subaru, LOL...
http://www.choberi.com/impreza/2000Meet/

<A HREF="http://www.choberi.com/impreza/2000Meet/_newcivicfrontsusp.html">http://www.choberi.com/impreza/2000Meet/image/_newcivicfrontsusp.jpg</A>

Maybe SUV's are selling because most people only buy cars do to how popular they are. Thats why you see sooo many Civic's out there. http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/tongue.gif

A few too many Civics, if ya ask me! not to mention the SUV's. Don't know why people feel they need them to go grocery shopping. But when it snows, all you see is Cherokees and Explorers in the ditches. Most people just don't know how to drive something that big. Probably trying to make up for a lack elsewhere http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/wink.gif And Honda can stay out of the econo-perfomace market for a little while, gives me time to make my RS even better! Not that the rice boys give me problems.

Boy, this post must be the ghost of Christmas past! I started it 2 months ago! http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/biggrin.gif

Uh, sorry you IS300 guys, no amount of rebadging will ever make a "Lexus IS300" anything more or less than a Toyota Altezza. Granted, it's not a bad car, but it's definitely not all the marketing types make it out to be.

Come on, you'd think they could take a Chevelle, put Lexus, Acura or Infiniti badges on it, and people would buy it thinking it was a "luxury" car! Give me a break! I consider the very existence of "brands" like Lexus to be an affront to my intelligence as a consumer. Infiniti G20? Come on, it's a Nissan Primera, and it's not even as nice as the good Primeras.

Stop calling the Toyota Altezza a Lexus IS300 and I might even like it. Hell, I'd consider buying one if it wasn't dressed up specifically to mislead American consumers.

Sorry, I give that kind of smug manipulation of the market a big thumbs down.

I belive the new civic type R and the new integra (whatever its new name may be) dont use the S2000 engine, but a new 2.0L engine with the same block as the S2000, because the FWD honda engines and the S2000 honda engine spins oposite directions.

The new Integra's going to be based on the Civic platform, kinda like how the Acura CL and TL are based on the Accord. Honda's new platforms are variable in track and wheelbase. The Prelude is already discontinued in Japan, so the Integra is moving up in specification to fill the performance gap. It's gonna have a 2.0-liter 220 hp n/a engine. The design is similar to the S2000 engine, but it rotates in the opposite direction. There are some rumors of a 6-speed transmission. Basically, think Celica GT-S with 40 more hp and a little bigger and you're on the right track. Oh, and here's pretty much what it's gonna look like:

http://mag-x.com/scoop/integra0011/1.jpg

As for the euro Civic Type R comin here, I don't see much of a chance of that happening. Look for a 2003 Civic Si coupe along the lines of the previous generation. Meaning stiffer suspension and a high-revving engine that's not quite up to whatever the Integra's doing. My guess is somewhere around 170-190 hp. It would be nice if they actually offered ABS in it (previous Si it was unavailable).

[This message has been edited by MikeA (edited December 05, 2000).]

the SiR in Canada (same as the Si) had ABS haha.. also had heated mirrors and we had silver too. Suckers!! http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/tongue.gif

IS300 is a pretty sweet looking sedan, but I can see why people think it looks like a Civic- I mean, its mostly the "size" of the IS- its so small looking (for some reasons the bimmer 3-series, with the same overall dimensions, look bigger) that its easy to mistake for a riced Civic at first glance. Also, the lines are very angular, as are the Civic's, and both have very cab forward short overhang front ends. If the IS were bigger, I doubt anyone would confuse them. But then they'd probably say it looks like an aggressive Accord.
The new '01 Civics look like they stole a whole lotta lines from the 3 series- the rear lights and side character line & short overhang.

You folks can read about the i-VTEC by following this link:
http://asia.vtec.net/article/ivtec/index.html

FreaK