Hello all,

I've done a search for a successful swap of the WRX engine and drivetrain into an RS, to no avail.

Anyone have any real proof of this anywhere? I would love to know. (For next spring :-)

-Brendan

you mean a 2002 WRX drivetrain?

If so, I think there reason we haven't heard of it yet is that those drivetrains are an arm and a leg -- for that price, you can start importing 280hp STi engines from Japan. Maybe when the prices come down you'll start hearing about it?

-Edwin

Actually Edwin, it's been confirmed by a local member that you can get everything (engine, tranny, ecu, etc...) for a very reasonable price!! The biggest thing is the labor to install it.

Yeah exactly, that was my idea.

Since it's not that expensive for the entire setup $5K why not go with it? My only issues are;

1. Does the WRX Tranny fit our cars crossmember mount points?

2. Does the WRX engine have same Bell Housing bolt locations as an RS? So i could go to a turbo legacy tranny if needed.

3. There must be some electronics that aren't going to match up. Even if they include the harness & ECU for that price (which i believe they did) there is going to be an issue somewhere where things don't line up. At least that's my gut feeling.

So this i guess is the info i need.

-brendan

PS- oh yeah labor is not an issue for me ;)

So if i can ask, what is the possible price for the parts for the engine swap?

Mike,

It's more than just an engine swap...it's everything! It's somewhere between $5-6K...I don't know the exact amount. If anyone is serious about this, they should contact Mike @ Exeter.

ah okay, I see. If it's $5K, I'd say that is certainly a workable alternative, assuming that labor is free. :) In fact, that's not bad at all.

As far as bolts not lining up though, well, someone's gotta be the guinea pig. All I can say is, I doubt that you'll get out the door for just 5K. I'm sure there's *something* you'll need that isn't included. The question is whether that "something" is another 2002 Subaru WRX part, or some custom piece that needs to be fabricated. And fabrication costs $$$, as we all know.

Offhand, I can't think of anything though. The engine seems to be pretty much the same, from what little time I've spent poking around WRX engine bays.

And of course, labor, labor,labor. Boy, that's gonna be one tough job. I'd put it up there with installing my turbo kit, Legacy GT-B trans, TEC-II, and tuning it all, if not more. The wiring is the most annoying part IMHO. I for one would not look forward to that. I'd almost just be tempted to pull the 2.5RS wiring harness and completely rewire the car using a WRX wiring harness and switch gear. But then the harness costs some major $$$ too.

Actually, one interesting alternative would be to install the WRX mechanicals in the car, but use a TEC-II to control them. Then you avoid the wiring issues entirely, and you still have your stock 2.5RS ecu handling 90% of the car, just not fuel, spark, and idle. And you don't have to buy a new WRX ECU this way either. The total price might well come out about the same - I'm sure a factory ECU costs a lot of money, so you'd might as well put the money towards a programmable one if you're going to be modifying the car further anyway.

Basically, the question is: Brendan, does the $5K include a rental car for the month or two (or three) you'll need? I have a 1996 wagon that is available for the low low rate of $150/week, unlimited mileage, you return it with a full tank of gas... and you can use the wagon to haul your engine back from Exeter with too! :D

-Edwin

I heard that everything pretty much bolts right up the only thing is the engine mounts, I heard that would really be the only diffrence that would cause any problem. The wrx "everything" :) Is pretty sure $5500 and if your someone like Mark Fitzgerald "FITZ" you could probably do it all yourself so the total cost woudl be just the cost of the motor may say a extra $1000 miscelaneous parts and tools you might need. Hey Brendan if you actaually decide to do it I would be more then willing to give you a hand I think it would be very interesting to do and see. ;) Cant give you any money but can give you my time :alien: .



Talk to you soon
Chad N

Well i put your TEC-II in, at least the first time. So that wouldn't be an issue.

I've worked on my friends 98 Supra. It was an automatic non-turbo, but we swtiched it over to a TT 6-speed. It took us two weeks, most of it because we had to wait for the clutch and exhaust to get here. We could have gotten it done in a day, maybe two tops. And i've pulled at least 8 DSM engines. So this will be nothing new to me.

If it does in fact include the harness & ECU , then that means i can pull it out whole, and replace it whole. That would be easy. And if the tranny is mountable to the RS chassis with no hiccups then i'm good to go. These are of course best-case-scenarios... haha.

It's obvious subaru doesn't change the blocks externally very often. So i'm not as worried about that as i am the tranny. And i'm guessing that the trannies also don't get changed very often externally either. But that one is a guess. I'm more worried about finding out that the stock exhaust manifold and turbo's won't clear the sidewalls in the engine bay, or something stupid like that. I guess comparing a jap MY99 exhaust manifold to the WRX02 manifold could answer that.

So if anyone hears anything or has some input on this, please let me know.

-Brendan

haha thanks chad!

Well i will most likely need to do it at my place. I don't think my landlord would like it, but i could do it at night. And take the T a couple of days. Plus i have to keep a watchful eye on my subaru neighbor, he may decide to finish it while i'm not there! (You know who you are!)

So i'll keep everyone posted if and when i decide to try this. Chad, why are the engine mounts different? Where did you hear this?

-Brendan

Originally posted by efoo
Basically, the question is: Brendan, does the $5K include a rental car for the month or two (or three) you'll need? I have a 1996 wagon that is available for the low low rate of $150/week, unlimited mileage, you return it with a full tank of gas... and you can use the wagon to haul your engine back from Exeter with too! :D

-Edwin

Does it come with insurance coverage, cuz I know me and 10 other guys would like to borrow it on Nov.4th!;)

Edwin,

haha so does that include bringing the engine and tranny down in the back of your wagon? :) Edwin: Always trying to pimp something! :)

-Brendan

Ha ha. Well hey, I've got more than one car. Might as well put them to good use when I'm not driving them. ;)

I think that everything should work. It's just a matter of finding all the parts you need, and having the time/patience to do it all. I'd collect the parts over the winter, buy the WRX shop manuals and your 99 shop manuals, and start planning it out very carefully. That way in the springtime you'll know exactly what you need to do.

Brendan, I think you don't have to worry about your Subaru neighbor finishing it for you... you have to worry about me coming by in my wagon and snarfing all the parts in the back, then making a quick getaway with all 135hp in my NA 2.2L! I may have to install nitrous temporarily just so I can make it out of there fast enough so you can't catch me in your RS, heh.

However, I'm not so sure that doing it in your apt. complex is such a good idea.. how in the world do you hide an engine hoist? Don't tell me you're gonna break it down and haul it upstairs to your apt., along with the 2.5L block, and put a sheet over it and some coffee table books on top to complete the look. :)

Pete, don't you have a wagon of your own already?!? What in the world would you need my car for? Is there something happening on Nov. 4th? Go beat on your own car, not mine. :)

-Edwin

No actually we have a storage space in the garage, that could house a compacted hoist. And enough space to hold the engine and tranny too!

-brendan

The EJ Subaru engine blocks have been the same configuration for over ten years. The gearbox should bolt in as well. The main problems you are going to have are with the wiring and the exhaust system. You'll need a 1993-2001 Impreza turbo (or Legacy) subframe to clear the turbo exhaust headers. The wiring will have to be derived from the donor WRX since the ECU used in the WRX is totally new and the WRX uses direct ignition on the spark plugs. If you have both wiring diagrams and a complete WRX harness it should be doable. You'll also have to fabricate an intercooler fairing to interface the WRX cooler to the RS hood.

Originally posted by efoo

Pete, don't you have a wagon of your own already?!? What in the world would you need my car for? Is there something happening on Nov. 4th? Go beat on your own car, not mine. :)

-Edwin

Hey, you offered!!;) We'd put those Audi guys to shame!!!(those who were there last year will know what I'm talking about!:))

http://www.i-club.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=89742&referrerid=1501

Yes, good points jude.

I forgot about the intercooler. The lower crossmember they include if i remember correctly.

I don't know how subaru does their wiring harness. Is the engine harness completely seperated from the body harness? Supra and DSM was like that. I put my own alarm in, but didn't notice the ECU side. dam...

My hopes is that the engine harness goes straight to ecu plugs, and only ECU plugs. If there is any body plugs to ECU that means i will have to splice. I really want to avoid that.

But this seems like the most reliable setup for a GC8 short of having the japanese spec car.

Thanks for the input gang!

-brendan

one thing to wonder is if this includes all accessories -- especially sensors. Are you going to have to get new O2 sensors, MAP sensors, yadda yadda yadda? Just things to watch for -- otherwise it starts adding up quick.

-Edwin

Your friendly neighbor might not finish it for you, he might steal a bunch of stuff though. I have a way easier schedule than Mr. Foo, and all I have to do is run back and forth from one storage compartment to another. :D

And, I have a card to get in the garage too. :D

Brendan, I would be willing to help you out. I would not recommend doing it in the garage, because I think they would get PISSED!

We can combine storage too, just keep the expensive stuff in mine. ;)

Paul G.

Well they might get pissed. But i would do it only after 10pm, which they would never find out, but i guess some old lady might tell on me. Dam... i guess we will see what happens..

Sure you can keep my expensive things in your storage, after i sqeeze your entire car into mine! :)


-Brendan

Originally posted by paultg
Brendan, I would be willing to help you out. I would not recommend doing it in the garage, because I think they would get PISSED!
Paul G.

Couldn't be worst than when Brendan first moved in!;)

ha ha ha! ;) oh boy, i can only imagine having been there for that...

While your at it, grabbing the engine, tranny, ECU, wireing harness, ECU... Dont forget the rear diff. The final drive ratio in the trannys got to be differnt than your basic grocery getter RS. Probably a 3.90 ?

Someone bid on Roger's car and get Wayne (or Jude) to do most of the work and you should be home free. :D

I think this would make an 'interesting' week-end project :lol:

yes, "grocery getter RS" has 4.11 or 4.44
OBS or L series impreza is 3.90 or 4.11
WRX is 3.90 or 4.11
Legacy (including Outback) is either 3.70, 3.90, 4.11, or 4.44

I bet my intercooler is shot.

Roger

Brendan the cost for the whole engine assembly is just under 5500.00 but ofcourse there are none in the country. we could try to have one clipped off the line for you but i doubt that they would stop production to pull an engine. just be careful from whom you get it from because the manual tranny number and the auto engine are different.

Ah, i do all my own work. Don't like to do things this big unless i do it myself.

Bill: I'm gonna contact you about this. Hey any word on the parts? (Whiteline?)

-Brendan

i sent them an email today to just ship what they have but they are still beddy bi bo so i haven't recieved any word back.

Ok thanks for the update.

-brendan

Hey mike,

You think you could post again exactly what comes with that $5500. worth of stuff? I can't find the original post.

-brendan

I don't think the subframe from the USA WRX will fit the 2.5RS frame. I'm pretty sure you will need a first generation Impreza/Legacy turbo subframe.

As for the wiring, every Subaru I have seen has the engine electronics integrated into looms with everything else. Subarus have around 6 or 8 separate looms that interconnect at various bulkhead connectors and the fuse box. I think you're best bet is to just get the big connectors that plug onto the wrecked WRX's ECU, and all looms for the engine controls. Then, using a wiring diagram, splice them together to create a completely separate stand alone engine loom that has a power supply, a ground, and some outputs for the tach and the fuel pump. Install this custom loom in the RS, leaving the stock RS wiring alone.

its a complete engine assembly with turbo and intercooler its the whole thing.. bill

Bill, it includes the tranny, right?

Brendan, this is a good read here:
http://www.i-club.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=85710

Paul G.

Well i put your TEC-II in, at least the first time. So that wouldn't be an issue.

Brendan, just make sure you call me over to inspect your wiring work next time. ;) (Remember, I saved you a$$ twice so far...)

-WaC
Wayne

Keep this thread alive, and document all your work!:) I am very interested in doing this myself one day! One can dream can't they?;)

BTW: Best of luck!

Later,
Seth E.

Well just to set the story straight, it wasn't my fault that the TEC2 came with the worst connectors known to man. And i think Edwin is still having issues with it after you touched it as well :)

I'm sorry i don't recount the second way you saved me?? Please let me know.

-Brendan

No the engine assembly doesn't include the tranny that would be the tranny assemble that includes the tranny. i would use your tranny over or get a better one

Right... And it still had problems after Shiv "rewired" it. And I had nothing to do with the "off" at Waktins Glen. It wasn't all your fault, of course. After all, Edwin is an electrical engineer. ;)

Remember Edwin's car running on two cylinders because you mixed up the plug wires at Chad's place?

-WaC
Wayne

*Fitz ducks and looks around wildly*.... Daaaaamn..... if I didn't know better I'd think this was getting ugly.....

Fitz

*Sneaks a peek from behind a brick wall*

Pssst... Mark, they're (we're) talking about you in the Aftermarket Forum...

-WaC
Wayne

Mark,

You blew another set of pistons??:eek:

ok, back to topic......

so the $5500 does NOT include tranny? so why bother with the WRX engine then if (including tranny) it'll only cost a bit less than an old STi engine? (well, besides the obvious reason of emission legal and such) i have no idea how much it costs to get an old STi engine, but i figure with tranny, depending on the condition, probably ~8k? i mean, if you still end up having to do the same amount of work on the wiring and other electrical stuff

-arthur

Why not just find a wrecked Rex. I'm sure by the end of winter there'll be plenty.


One man's garbage is
another man's treasure

Yeah i would love to find a crashed one....

Wayne, ok you got me on the plug wires..haha!



-brendan

Well, for starters, an OLD STI Engine had been driven like "?" and maintained by "?" and etc.. You have to trust someone you probably don't know.

A new 2.0LT has been on a crate, driven by a guy in a Truck. It is also designed to run with our 91 octane gas, and parts are available right at your local dealer. No one has been having problems with the WRX transmissions here in the states, so why would you need a 280Hp STI tranny. I don't even think you would need to replace the RS one. The WRX Turbo cars here don't have a torque curve like a 2.5 RS-T with 5-7Psi. Your always taking a risk with the RS tanny, I would take it and and see how it goes. If it aint broke, don't fix it.

Another thing to consider, a Turbo Kit is going to run you about $5-$7K dollars for a 2.5RS. Here you get a brand new engine, new turbo, intercooler -?, etc.. The only downside I see is needing the WRX ECU and wiring harness, but you would need that to do an STI conversion, and you would need lots of Piggy Back or Tec-II to do a RS-T to run right.

Brendan, don't forget a larger fuel pump might be required. Not sure what the fuel system specs are on the US WRX compared to an RS. You should do it! So I can watch and learn, and record a nice parts list to share with others, and plan for the future. :D


Ps- the wrecked WRX cars I have seen are either $12K and/or the motors are probably damaged/cracked.

Paul G.

Originally posted by wac
Right... And it still had problems after Shiv "rewired" it. And I had nothing to do with the "off" at Waktins Glen. It wasn't all your fault, of course. After all, Edwin is an electrical engineer. ;)


Wrong, Wayne. I'm a computer systems engineer. I can show you my diplomas to prove it. :) I actually was quite a klutz in my required electrical engineering courses - I was infamous for blowing up stuff like capacitors and ICs in lab. I make no claims as to my ability to wire up stuff - only that practice makes perfect, and since I've rewired my TEC twice now, I've had plenty of practice.

-Edwin

so that price is for a brand new US-spec WRX engine? ok i was under the impression that it was a very-low mileage engine instead of a brand new one

on a side note, anyone (waybe?) knows where to find the complete specs for 1997 Impreza L wagon?

-arthur

Where else? On Wayne's site.

http://wac.addr.com/auto/obs/obsspecs.html

Wrong, Wayne. I'm a computer systems engineer. I can show you my diplomas to prove it. :) I actually was quite a klutz in my required electrical engineering courses - I was infamous for blowing up stuff like capacitors and ICs in lab. I make no claims as to my ability to wire up stuff - only that practice makes perfect, and since I've rewired my TEC twice now, I've had plenty of practice.

Oops, my bad...

Well, I'm supposed to be the electrical engineer here at work, and my record in the past month includes:
1. Blew up a 750A SCR power supply. Three times.
2. Blew a 350A fuse on a 480V bus.
3. Blew up a 300A transistor on a machine designed for 200A.
4. Made the lights in the whole building dim each time #1 and #2 went off.
5. Set off a smoke detector that cleared everyone out of the building.

Apparently, I'm still practicing...

Back on topic:
1. You may not need the WRX tranny, but you may have to convert the clutch/flywheel to the WRX pull-type. And most people agree that the WRX' tall gearing makes for a potent auto-x car since you can stretch out 2nd gear. With an RS tranny and final drive, you'd have to shift into 3rd or ride the rev limiter.
2. Tumble generator valves anyone? This in itself will require an aftermarket ECU such as a TEC-3, LinkPlus, or other unit with extra outputs (to support the wastegate solenoid, as well as the tumble generator valves).
3. While you're shelling out $$$ for a new motor and ECU, you might as well consider a turbo upgrade.
4. Since you're worrying about making the intercooler match up with the RS hood, why not just get a big Spearco unit that will leave no questions about intercooler efficiency once you turn up the boost? What's another $800 when you're already spending $6K?

-WaC
Wayne

Well i'm actually just getting an idea as to the real costs...

I'm sure once i buy it from whomever, i won't be paying close to $5k for all of it. :)

-Brendan

Now that a job is back in my future, i'm resurecting this thread haha....

Bren

Hummm.. Mental note: Go out today and buy a hood lock. :D

I think we should do this Brendan. It would be fun.

Paul G.

I'd love to see this done on like a five year old base model Legacy "L".

A real 'wolf' in 'sheeps clothing'... LoL

Lemmie know how it works out, Brendan

http://i-club.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=153474&highlight=WRX+Engine+AND+2.5

This is so cool. You have to do it.

Paul G.

Hey guys,
I've done a lot of research on this and the only thing im not shure of is the exhaust. Other than that, everything , and I do mean everything will bolt in the car.
The only problem is the wiring. Even that isn't too bad. Just use the complete car harness out of a wrx, and change the plugs for the lights, a/c, cruise, heater fan, and a few other minor things. It realy isn't that bad. I was going to do it but ended up buying my bosses wrx wagon so he could build another rally car. Vermont sportscar sold a complete drivetrain and harness for six thousand to do this conversion and it should start somtime in March. I'll keep you posted (pics and all other notes since I will probably be involved).

You do need to keep in mind that the horse shoe on the front of the car will not bolt in so some reinforcing to the subframe should be done since it is week.

Rallyboy

sweet go for it man!!:D

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/ebayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1812215610&r=0&t=0

Man that would be great... if only his reserve was below $8k. as i'm sure it's not.

that's too much even with those parts Sh_t..

b

Email hims find out his bottom line

with the mods he has on that thing well what left of the i'm sure you can make some money back off it ;)

I emailed him to see what his reserve is. Let's see if he responds.:)

Here you go Bredan, right in CT, Motor, trans, and harness for $5500:

http://www.i-club.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=158214

I still think the car in FL is a better deal. All the APS stuff fits on my car. :lol:

Paul G. <--Has a wagon to put "stuff" in :D

ok, you give me $3000. and you can have all those parts, i just need the engine, tranny, ecu, and harness. The rest is yours :)

B

Hey Brendan,

Good luck on this project... I like it! Hope that $20.00 I sent you helps out. :)

Dave

ok, you give me $3000. and you can have all those parts, i just need the engine, tranny, ecu, and harness. The rest is yours

Alright, but I want $3000 for all the stock parts we take off my car that you'll end up using. :D How's that sound? Of, can I charge your $3000 to help with the project ( hold a light for ya :lol: ).

Let me know what you think? :D

I wonder if Tim would let you keep a wrecked car out back? Humm.. The engine/tranny would fit fine in the storage area. I can rent you mine for a one time payment of $3000. ;)

Paul G.

adding this link for documentation purposes....

http://www.i-club.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=147895

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/ebayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1812812316&r=0&t=0

Just some more taunting. :devil:

You suck

Just caught this thead while brousing through.

For the record, there are at least 3 people that have completed the conversion of a 2002 WRX engine into a GC8 (98-01) RS body here in California. I being one of them.

There are NO issues with the engine install. Everything bolts right up. Heck there is almost 4" of clearance for the Intercooler to the firewall. I'm using the RS Tranny (as I already have a upgraded clutch and flywheel) Plus I like the closer gearing, and from looking at all the probs showing on the WRX tranny, both seem equally strong (plus I can get RS tranny's used for $600.00 as compared to a WRX unit for $1800.00.....so if I do trash one it won't kill my wallet).

Cost is UNDER $5000.00 for the engine/ECU/Harness/Intake/Exhaust and every other item needed to do the job. My donor engine has only about 870 miles on it. Labor is what can cost some....but if you get a few friends (who know what they are doing) it can be cost effective(Beer and pizza).

Check the Bay-Area forum.....(you might have to go back a few days) there you will see the other guy who has done the conversion in a 98 RS. He posted pictures of his car.

Hope this help you guys back east.

Cheers

EddyL.
(From Emission Crazy California)

Eddy,

Thanks a bunch man... i haven't decided which tranny i will use, but you bring up a good point on the cost. And i'll be doing the labor myself.

Question(s):

My only concern is that once the wrx ecu is in the RS, what wires need to be spliced? just interior stuff? any specifics would be great. Or you can email me at boosting4@hotmail.com if you prefer.

What did you do to modify the crossmember?

Any other parts from the WRX besides complete motor, ecu and harness needed?

TIA!!

Brendan

Brendan i can get you a new legacy turbo cross member for cheap that you can use.

hmm if a complete swap can be done with the US WRX engine, how bout a japanese version 4 or version 6 STi engine?? or would i need a new tranny, clutch, and things like that?

Originally posted by IMPREZA GUY
hmm if a complete swap can be done with the US WRX engine, how bout a japanese version 4 or version 6 STi engine?? or would i need a new tranny, clutch, and things like that?


Yup. It can be done. Ive ridden in one of them on more than one occasion. Almost the same as the US swap except the wiring is a bit different and it's on the other side of the car.

It is also my dream to do something like this. Make a online parts list as you go. Here is what I was thinking you would need.
-complete US spec WRX dtivetrain/tranny/ECU/wiring/radiatior/fuel pump/etc.
-Legacy turbo cross member
-Half shafts from GC8 WRX
-Exhaust from GC8 WRX
-Intercooler from GC8 WRX
-hoses/bolts
-gauges?
-intake?

Later,
Seth E.:alien:

Bill,

Thanks.... o trust me, you will be hearing from me :)

Bren

Brendan, dont forget I'll be right around the corner if you need any help.

Brendan, I hope you document the crap out of this, maybe set up a web cam :lol: , cause in 25000 miles, the obs is getting boosted, one way or another.

Hey y2k4door, did the person that had the swap done get it done at ralli spec or did it custom? and did they get the STi 6 spd tranny or using a stock 5 spd, holy moly i forgot you guys are from boston too, i wanna see this with my own eyes. and when its doen imma bring a digi cam to take pics and video tape it driving around

He did it himself. He used the Ver. III 5 spd tranny that came with the motor he bought.

Webcam hehe i wouldn't mind. I think we would need edwin for that one. Speaking of which what happened to him? I will have to call him out.

Nate, yeah man, after our DSM days, i guess you can help me out :)

Brendan

Originally posted by Scoobed
Webcam hehe i wouldn't mind. I think we would need edwin for that one. Speaking of which what happened to him? I will have to call him out.


He took himself off the board.

Dave

i see. hmm i wonder where he got the motor from

Here's the just of what is needed to do the swap.

1. Ej20 Engine (complete with Intake and Exhaust)
2. ECU and Harness
3. Either the WRX Crossmember or a Legacy Turbo. (If you get the WRX unit, you will have to modify it by cutting off the tabs for the front support frame that the new WRX body (and RS) use.
4. The wiring manuals for both cars is a MUST.

You cannot use the WRX radiator, as it runs the top pipe from the center of the radiator. Looking at my car I now only have about 2" clearance from the radiator to the engine. Let me tell you....when you finish this mod there is NO ROOM left in the engine bay. But everything fits in perfect. I used the stock RS radiator and ran the return line from the Radiator resurvoir to where the overflow hose goes to the overflow tank. I modified the cap so that it would allow the fluid to pass both ways. The second line from the WRX resurvoir when to the overflow container. I bought the WRX radiator thinking the same as most, but found that it was not needed.

When doing the harness (Which is the hardest part of the install by far) We have found that the best approach is to integrate the Engine portion of the WRX harness into the existing RS Harness. Think about it, basically all that is being swapped is the Engine. The rest of the car is the RS (Or a legacy or a forester if someone wants to use those cars) So why change the rest of the stuff. Figuring out where what wire goes to which other wire, is where the RS and WRX wiring diagrams come to be KEY. Without those it would be almost impossible. Basically I now know fairly well the entire wiring schematics of both the 2002 WRX and 2000 RS. I can almost tell you what each connector looks like what where it goes from there. I'm thinking of writting up a document stating what needs to be connected between the cars (But this will only work for the 2000-2001 RS to WRX conversion. The 98 RS has a wiring that is basically that of a legacy, and the 99.....who knows.

It's late...got to go.

Cheers

EddyL.

Eddy,

Thanks alot man. i appreciate the info!!

B

DUDE! when your done i gotta see this, my dad told me he knows guys at a junkyard so i can maybe get a used engine and do the swap too. WOW!! A TURBO GC8! I will finally own the car of my dreams

Hey Brendan,

I saw that dent on your trunk yesterday. Paul told me the story.. that sucks. I hope you can prove it was his fault.

Dave

BUMP!

Update:

http://www.i-club.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=1780135#post1780135

Brendan,

Take a look here:

http://www.i-club.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=171247

Thanks Pete!

so did you buy all frieds?

Damn it dude, that was the engine I was after.:( Anyway, best of luck. I have to find out how to mix the wires for a 02 WRX into a 98 2.2L Type L.

Keep this thread alive!

Later,
Seth E.:alien:

bump! haha, old school thread. Efoo posted! :)

Wow, from way back when before you got your movie gig!

Raj

nah. rudy was before then.

nah. rudy was before then.

:lol:..

Wow. I wonder how much / if the cost for something like this has changed muched.

I'd really like to do a swap on the L in the future once it is paid off.

Paul G.

ditto.

well, from what i read, it sounds like $5K is a good round-a-bout number to start with. although, i guess it all depends on what motor you want to go with.
a USDM WRX motor can be had for ~1-2K
stuff from japan goes from ~$4K-$10K
I suppose you might also get lucky and find a rear-ended WRX for a few $K too, but i think that would be a long shot.

doesn't japan get different fuel than the US?
how do JDM engines run on US fuel? brendan? anyone?

Yeah they run on our fuel fine. I've been running mine on this crappy NE gas, and have no knock or anything. Even at 22PSI. The JDM ecu's are pretty dynamic and adaptive.

-B

What is interesting is that you can find US WRX motors/tranny/ECU used from wrecked cars for $1-$2K, but I wonder what the cost of the new setup (like this post discussed a few years back) has adjusted too.

With the Subaru platform changing to mostly 2.5L-T's, I wonder if any leftover 2.0L Turbo setups will start to be sold at a discount (like when they unloaded all the GC8 stuff when the new models came out).

If that $5K price came down to say $3500-$4K it would almost be worth it (to someone like myself) to buy all the stuff new instead of dealing with used parts from a wreck.

Paul G.

Yeah after keith's fiasco i'd consider the new route. Although, i doubt the prices have changed much. I guess if you could get a tested used motor i'd go for that.

are there new/tested EJ25's around for simple replacements? simply replacing what's already there to a zero mileage unit would be nice, but what's the cost for something like that? is it even worth it.
what are those going for? where are being sold?

brendan, I'm sure you've been asked this 2874389589345 times, but do you feel your swap was worth it? in terms of cost, reliability, and "tear your hair and want to cry at times" frustration?
is the wiring hard because its "hard to understand" or just "time consuming"?
my engine is approaching the 100k and swapping is something i've been pondering for the future.
USDM WRX seems cheaper, easier to find, and more repliable.
while JDM stuff is more exotic, more original, more hp, and more $$$.

brendan, I'm sure you've been asked this 2874389589345 times, but do you feel your swap was worth it? in terms of cost, reliability, and "tear your hair and want to cry at times" frustration?
is the wiring hard because its "hard to understand" or just "time consuming"?
my engine is approaching the 100k and swapping is something i've been pondering for the future.
USDM WRX seems cheaper, easier to find, and more repliable.
while JDM stuff is more exotic, more original, more hp, and more $$$.

Let's put it this way, next time you are in Boston, have nate or paul give me a call. Or come down to the snow meet tonight i'll give you a quick spin. You will leave with a huge smile on your face! :) (No Sexual acts included ). It was worth it. I planned it out very carefully and then i got lazy. It's a lot of work no doubt. You have to plan to spend more than you expect to... i insisted on doing everything the "Right way" (According to me at least) and that just took more time and more money. If you look at any part of my car, you cannot tell it's not factory. When i was putting in the UTEC my wires look just like an STI's wires, no butt connectors or stray wires about. Others can attest to what i've done.

I'm sure you've seen the pics;

in case you haven't;
http://www.brendan-stewart.com/hobby/album5/index.htm

If you are considering a swap, i'd call East Coast Suby and Gruppe-S and see what they have in your price range. If nothing, i'd wait until a member has a drivetrain for sale. Follow the conversion forums for wrx owners buying STI drivetrains, there are quite alot actually. Maybe you can get lucky that way.

In any case to answer you question clearly, yes it was totally worth it. By monday i will have a car that few can beat around the streets of Boston.
I'm extremely happy with it. Especially now that it's getting tuned and stuff, i think after one ride, you will be sold :)

-B

iamrazor,
I'd think a new 2.5L from Subaru is pretty cheap (say in the $1k-$2K range) for a complete motor. They sell current 2.5L Sti short blocks (no heads) for like $1500 I think, and they have forged internals and other expensive stuff.

Your best "cheap/reliable" option is to find someone doing a swap into a 2.5RS with lower mileage (say 40-60K miles). Those motors used sell pretty cheap, and would pretty much drop right into your car.

Paul G.

Why would he swap a 2.5 NA motor in his car? Or am i reading that wrong?

-B


iamrazor,
I'd think a new 2.5L from Subaru is pretty cheap (say in the $1k-$2K range) for a complete motor. They sell current 2.5L Sti short blocks (no heads) for like $1500 I think, and they have forged internals and other expensive stuff.

Your best "cheap/reliable" option is to find someone doing a swap into a 2.5RS with lower mileage (say 40-60K miles). Those motors used sell pretty cheap, and would pretty much drop right into your car.

Paul G.

He is concerned about having a 100K miles on his current 2.5L motor in his Legacy GT.

Sure a WRX swap would be more fun, etc.. but if cost is an issue he could really make out very cheap with a used 2.5L with 1/2 the mileage on it. Plus it is a much easier install.

Personally, I wouldn't bother with that I don't think. I do have alot of fun with my 2.2L, but if I was going to do all that work anyway I'd go USDM 2.0L. Cost alone though is 3 times the cost of a used N/A motor.

I was only suggesting if something bad were to happy (like his motor let go or popped head gaskets) he could just find a used 2.5L and be back up and running for ~$500 I would think, and a weekend worth of time.

Paul G.

oh ok, i didn't know his background. Yeah if you are strapped for cash and just looking for a new motor do what paul says. I was under the impression you were looking for forced induction and possibly a jdm motor.

-B


He is concerned about having a 100K miles on his current 2.5L motor in his Legacy GT.

Sure a WRX swap would be more fun, etc.. but if cost is an issue he could really make out very cheap with a used 2.5L with 1/2 the mileage on it. Plus it is a much easier install.

Personally, I wouldn't bother with that I don't think. I do have alot of fun with my 2.2L, but if I was going to do all that work anyway I'd go USDM 2.0L.

I was only suggesting if something bad were to happy (like his motor let go or popped head gaskets) he could just find a used 2.5L and be back up and running for ~$500 I would think.

Paul G.

So Brendan, with the new job I'm trying to figure out how I can save money for a motor swap and not have it all sucked into a wedding fund! Got any ideas! :lol: ;)

So Brendan, with the new job I'm trying to figure out how I can save money for a motor swap and not have it all sucked into a wedding fund! Got any ideas! :lol: ;)

Yeah don't get married!!! haha.

Hmm let's spraypaint your heater downstairs and say it's brand new, and that you had to put the money to that! :)

God don't let Heather see this , she will kill us both.

2.5L's are good for excessive mileage. Take care of it and you won't have any issues. I maintain a 00 legacy gt w/ 115k as well as a 02 legacy gt limited with ~70k.

Fitz

thanks guys for all the input. I welcome the information.
yes, while thinking about going FI, the thought of "replacing" instead of "swapping" still remains in my head. I haven't seen many (or any for that matter) vendors selling N/A EJ25's. I figured since they'd probably come directly from subaru, they'd be really expensive (in relation to a JDM motor). plus if no ones putting them in, maybe there's a reason?

I do plan on keeping my car for sometime, so the thought of an engine replacement is always there. either staying stock or going with something "non-stock". thats my debacle. The USDM WRX swap seems more doable, based on cost and availabilty of parts. However, doing something more exotic (B4 swap) would be really nice plus have way more power and it'd be original (which is always a plus in my book).

I'm also on the same page as you brendan. doing things "right" might take more time + $$$, but its just that, right. period.
my theory is you either go big or stay home. hell, if you're going to embark on the journey you did, it only makes sense to go one step further. hell, all the wiring is right there, why not make it look good while your at it?

Well my angle is this. If you buy a brand new 2.5NA engine i'm guessing about or over 3k, for that money you could have a used wrx drivetrain. Some even with low miles if you are lucky. Call exeter and get a quote on the crate motor. North will have it handy, i've gotten it before from them.

I personally would do a wrx swap in that thing, but of course i'm biased. But then again if you have money to burn, get the STI drivetrain! Now that would be sick!.

-B

Oh and on the subject of the B4, i have no idea who's done one before and if the wiring diagrams would be available, so that wouldn't be the best option (Although the coolest by far )

damn slow server!

I have only heard of 2 swaps (not turbo kits) done in my car. Both USDM (STI + Forester XT). Embarking on a swap no one has done before is great, but prolly not the best option for a first timer...
The B4 had an EJ20G (IIRC). thats like 280+hp :devil: :devil:

B, can't make it tonight, wifey=working. me=Tiger Woods 2005 on xbox
thanks for the offer for the ride.
sorry, but i have to decline. paul said your car is teh slow :lol:
j/k come back up north when your fear of farm animals has subsided... :D
I'll gladly ride shotgun