Would adding a 4-5 inch length of wire to the MAF wires hurt anything- I am putting the MAF in the fender and need a few extra inches- if i use a high conductive wire will it hurt the signal at all- and if not what would the best way of doing this

bump! HELP

I don't see how it would hurt anything...just make sound connections.

Just solder them together and use the heatshrink stuff to seal it.

thanks guys

be sure and use flux when you solder it. it will make the car run WAAAAAAY better, alot smoother and your timing will nit fluctuate like it does now especially if your sitting in traffic. you will need to adjust your IAT compensation since it will never go more tan 20 degrees above ambient (if that) and it will get a cooler reading when its cold outside. good luck, you will love the upgrade!!

what is flux?? and i actually think now by drilling a small hall i can avoid extending the wires- but what is flux and how does it make it run better than not extendng

Most solder has flux in it.It is just to make the solder stick better.

You can either solder your new extensions or use good connectors. Either way make sure you do it correctly. (If you crimp, make sure its crimped and not loose if you tug) I extended my maf for my blow thru setup and used connectors because my kid bro muffed up my solder iron. It works just fine! -3ft extension

what is flux??
1) By asking this, you prove that you're not experienced enough with soldering to work on something as easy to piss off as a MAF sensor

2) Changing the distance from the MAF sensor to the engine will result in the engine having problems maintaining a stable AFR during throttle position changes. In other words, moving it is a bad idea.

1) By asking this, you prove that you're not experienced enough with soldering to work on something as easy to piss off as a MAF sensor

2) Changing the distance from the MAF sensor to the engine will result in the engine having problems maintaining a stable AFR during throttle position changes. In other words, moving it is a bad idea.


Explain... You know thats not true as long as its done correctly. I am a technician, not a forum jumper. I give expert advice, not my opinion. I have built cars with blow thru turbo setups using maf extensions without issues at all. My own maf extensions. Not even harnessed kits. You tell me thats wrong. 500- 600 hp street cars. Now, if you are talking about an 02 sensor then I would say; stay far away from extending or cutting those wires. Get a new 02 with longer wires if you need to extend an 02.

Explain... You know thats not true as long as its done correctly. I am a technician, not a forum jumper. I give expert advice, not my opinion. I have built cars with blow thru turbo setups using maf extensions without issues at all. My own maf extensions. Not even harnessed kits. You tell me thats wrong. 500- 600 hp street cars. Now, if you are talking about an 02 sensor then I would say; stay far away from extending or cutting those wires. Get a new 02 with longer wires if you need to extend an 02.
Unfortunately, the data disagrees with you. The control logic Subaru uses in the ECU (this is in addition to tip-in) to account for the time-delay between air passing the MAF and air entering the engine appears to have a hard-coded delay value. Now that so many people are able to log their own cars (thanks to RomRaider), many, many of those who have altered the distance from the MAF to the engine (one common example being a front mount) are finding AFR or correction (AFC or AFL) fluctuations around throttle position changes. Again, this is on top of the control logic associated with tip-in. Every single person who has documented the problem and decided to fix it rather than live with it was able to entirely eliminate the problem by returning the MAF sensor to the stock distance from the engine.

Unfortunately, the data disagrees with you. The control logic Subaru uses in the ECU (this is in addition to tip-in) to account for the time-delay between air passing the MAF and air entering the engine appears to have a hard-coded delay value. Now that so many people are able to log their own cars (thanks to RomRaider), many, many of those who have altered the distance from the MAF to the engine (one common example being a front mount) are finding AFR or correction (AFC or AFL) fluctuations around throttle position changes. Again, this is on top of the control logic associated with tip-in. Every single person who has documented the problem and decided to fix it rather than live with it was able to entirely eliminate the problem by returning the MAF sensor to the stock distance from the engine.



Since you believe you have an issue with AFRs, tell me, how are high performance subaru builders including myself using blow thru maf with no problems? Its called tuning. You tune for something you change. There are ssi control logic hard codes all over the factory rom. In fact, when I hook my car up to an ssi computer, I see those values. I have a friend who happens to be a subaru master in south florida. When I first started openecu logging and programming he let me come to the shop a few times to read out my faults and compare information from the subaru ssi. There is absolutely nothing other than some adjustments that need to be made for things like this to work. So, in perspective, all you need to do is tune for it. willaty is correct by saying it makes changes to how your motor runs, but incorrect by saying you are causing problems because all you would need to do is tune for your change just like everything else you put into your car.

Since you believe you have an issue with AFRs, tell me, how are high performance subaru builders including myself using blow thru maf with no problems? Its called tuning. You tune for something you change.

willaty is correct by saying it makes changes to how your motor runs, but incorrect by saying you are causing problems because all you would need to do is tune for your change just like everything else you put into your car.

The problem with your theory here is that it's a non-tunable parameter. When the open source community started noticing this, some of the professional tuners who had many years' experience in tuning Subarus with other systems basically replied "Well, duh. The owner just has to live with that." However, when you're talking about a blow-through, you introduce enough weirdness from just that that a detail as fine as MAF distance gets lost in the shuffle.

Certainly not everyone who's experienced this problem has had to revert to a stock-distance. It's been worse for some people than others (who knows what other part of their setup was contributory) and some people are just more picky than others. The OP just needs to be aware that by moving his MAF he stands a decent chance of creating a problem he can't tune out. It's up to him if he wants to chance getting it and, if he does get it, live with it.

ie. if you are doing a big turbo setup and front mount with a lot of tuning then it would be worth your small 'problem' otherwise dont bother. It really isnt worth the tuning for a 4degree drop in intake temps. I agree with the ^^ statement. Depends on the setup.

I cant see how the ECU would have a hard speced amount of time the air enters the MAF to the TB. The ecu cant calculate the velocity entering the TB because it is constantly changing. What you are talking about is accel enrichment. This is a very difficult thing to tune if it changes.

I would guess moving the maf if it does cause problems is something else than that.

I cant see how the ECU would have a hard speced amount of time the air enters the MAF to the TB. The ecu cant calculate the velocity entering the TB because it is constantly changing. What you are talking about is accel enrichment. This is a very difficult thing to tune if it changes.

I would guess moving the maf if it does cause problems is something else than that.

Presumably, your objection is account for somehow by the ECUs logic.

And this is definitely different than accel enrichment (tip-in). On the Denso ECU's the tip-in is nothing more complicated than a specific number of pulses of the injectors based on the change in throttle plate position (plus compensations).

actually i have lots of experience wiring as I work for a controls company and did installs for the firs t12 mos i just have no experience actually soldering- but it worked out that i drilled a hole in the feder well that allowed the maf to use more of a straight path to the bung which made it long enough so i didnt have to extend it- but as stated above as long as you connect the wires with a great conductive wire and make a good connection an extra few inches shouldnt mean jack XXXXX

Presumably, your objection is account for somehow by the ECUs logic.

And this is definitely different than accel enrichment (tip-in). On the Denso ECU's the tip-in is nothing more complicated than a specific number of pulses of the injectors based on the change in throttle plate position (plus compensations).


Its logic goes off what it can sense. You would have to put a velocity sensor in the intake tract to know what the velocity is. The Maf cant get a accurite reading on this but could get close since it does know density(temp) and amount. However does the ECU have a dedicated atmo pressure sensor and a hydrometer? If it did the ECU would know what the velocity of the air enter is.

Besides this doesnt matter that much because unless there is a big change in load at close to idle speeds you wont notice and neither will the ecu because air is moving much fast at higher loads and engine speeds.


Also accel is difficult to get right on a stand alone. The modern oem ecus do a very good job of controling this.