I figured a new thread was in order given the major performance boost SOA will be giving the new car. This almost makes me want to talk my wife into getting one for her next car -- that way I can autocross either car on the wekeends! :p

Full SOA press release (link to SOA press release- Press Release (http://vocuspr.vocus.com/vocuspr30/Newsroom/ViewAttachment.aspx?SiteName=Subaru&Entity=PRAsset&AttachmentType=F&EntityID=106491&AttachmentID=a8f8759c-32d9-4923-aa82-9200b562608d)):

SUBARU BOOSTS 2009 IMPREZA WRX TO 265 HORSEPOWER

Cherry Hill, NJ--Subaru is revving up performance and handling in its iconic All-Wheel Drive Impreza WRX sport compact for 2009, following the debut of the all-new model in 2008. Performance leaps to a higher level in the 2009 WRX thanks to a 265 horsepower turbocharged intercooled Boxer engine, retuned suspension and wider, lower-profile summer performance tires. WRX enthusiasts will quickly identify the 2009 models by the ST-type grille and standard Aero Package. The 2009 Impreza WRX comes with a 5-speed manual transmission.

New Impreza GT Model
Subaru is also introducing a new Impreza 2.5GT model for 2009, powered by a 224-horsepower turbocharged intercooled engine teamed to a standard 4-speed electronically controlled automatic transmission with SPORTSHIFT.

Both the more powerful WRX and the new 2.5GT are available as 4-Door and 5-Door models. As on all Subaru models, the Impreza WRX and 2.5GT models are equipped with Symmetrical All-Wheel Drive (two different versions – see page 2 for details.)

The goal of the 2009 WRX team was termed “Kyo-Ka” (translated from Japanese as “strengthening”). To achieve this goal Subaru engineers thoroughly revamped the performance character of the WRX for 2009. Gaining a larger turbocharger, along with a new larger-diameter exhaust and low-density catalyst for reduced backpressure, the WRX engine now produces 265 horsepower at 6,000 rpm and 244 lb.-ft. of peak torque at 4,000 rpm – significant increases from the 224 horsepower and 226 lb.-ft. in the 2008 version.

The Impreza WRX debuted an all-new platform for the 2008 model year, featuring a longer 103.1-inch wheelbase and an all-new double-wishbone rear suspension system. Revised suspension tuning for 2009 further bolsters WRX’s street performance credentials. The standard 17 x 7-inch aluminum alloy wheels now wear 225/45R17 summer performance tires, compared to 205/50R17 all-season tires used on the 2008 WRX. The Vehicle Dynamics Control (VDC) stability and traction control system, which is standard on all Impreza models for 2009, helps to enhance the WRX model’s road handling safety.

Symmetrical All-Wheel Drive
Standard Symmetrical All-Wheel Drive, which forms the common core technology on all Subaru models, gives the Impreza WRX a significant handling performance advantage over front-wheel drive competitors. Symmetrical All-Wheel Drive is a complete system comprised of the Boxer engine and the full-time power distribution system (varies by model and transmission). The aluminum Boxer engine and simple, symmetrical drivetrain layout help to lower the car’s center of gravity, which in turn contributes to its handling characteristics.

The 2009 Impreza WRX employs a viscous coupling locking center differential that distributes torque 50:50 front/rear. Should slippage occur, this system transfers more power to the wheels with the best traction. The 2009 Impreza 2.5GT, like other Subaru models equipped with automatic transmission, uses a different version of the Symmetrical All-Wheel Drive system. An electronically managed continuously variable transfer clutch actively manages power distribution based on acceleration, deceleration, and available traction. This active torque-split system automatically transfers more power to the wheels with the best grip should slippage occur.

Suspension Re-Tuned For Sharper Handling
Subaru significantly re-tuned the suspension on the 2009 WRX, resulting in sharper turn-in and more responsive handling overall. Front upper strut mounts are adopted from the STI. The front spring rate is increased from 26.5 N/mm to 38 N/mm, and the rear spring rate is increased from 24 N/mm to 34 N/mm. Diameter of the stabilizer bars is also increased, from 20 mm to 21 mm in front and from 15 mm to 16 mm in the rear. Suspension damping has also been re-tuned. Notably, the new, stiffer suspension tuning did not require any further reinforcement of the inherently strong Impreza body structure.
Because the wider tires used on the 2009 WRX give more kickback than those on the 2008 model, a new damper valve was added to the steering gearbox to ensure a smooth and high quality steering feeling.

The Impreza WRX chassis is designed for improved rigidity and ride comfort and employs high-tension steel at key structural points. In addition to providing a basis for more responsive handling, the double-wishbone rear suspension that debuted in the new-generation Impreza models enables a smooth ride quality as well as decreased road noise for a quieter cabin.

The new-generation design results in a lower overall weight for the body while the longer wheelbase allows for improved ride dynamics, more interior room and reduced levels of noise, vibration, and harshness (NVH). In addition, the new chassis improves crash-worthiness and provides a stiffer platform for crisper handling.

Placing the engine slightly lower in the chassis than in the previous-generation Impreza models helped lower the center of gravity in the new Impreza platform, enhancing steering response. With the Subaru Dynamic Chassis Control Concept (DC3), Subaru optimized all elements of the Impreza’s chassis to deliver a better balance of handling response, ride quality, quietness and overall traction performance than offered by competitive vehicles. (See “Performance” section of this press kit for further details.)

New WRX Aero Body Styling
On both 2009 WRX Sedan and 5-Door models, a new STI-type grille carries the WRX badge. Both models get a sharpened new look from the standard Aero Package, which was formerly part of the optional WRX Premium Package. Both body styles also feature front and rear under-bumper spoilers and aerodynamic side ground effects. The sedan has a low-profile rear trunk spoiler, while the 5-Door adopts the WRX STI rear spoiler and a rear diffuser. The rear garnish panel between the light clusters is body color on the 5-Door and chrome on the sedan.

Other distinctions between the two models continue as before, including clear rear tail lamp lenses for the 5-Door and red lenses on the sedan. The 4-Door features dual tailpipe outlets, while the 5-Door uses a single, larger outlet (stainless steel on Premium Package.)

Rally-Inspired Interior
The WRX interior introduced new comfort and spaciousness for 2008, and for 2009 it gains new WRX-exclusive carbon black checkered upholstery accented by red stitching. The standard tilt and telescoping leather-wrapped steering wheel is accented by red stitching and standard aluminum-alloy pedal covers now include the driver’s footrest.

Performance-design front seats integrate the backrest and head restraint into a single structure. The sporty instrument panel features electroluminescent gauges, similar to the WRX STI. As in the WRX STI, the indicator needles sweep the gauge faces upon engine startup for a sporty effect. The WRX Premium Package gains a power moonroof; other contents carry over, including the 10-speaker audio upgrade with auxiliary input jack, projector-beam fog lights, dual-mode heated front seats, heated exterior mirrors and a windshield wiper de-icer.

The compact layout of the double-wishbone configuration helps to minimize intrusion into the cargo area, providing a wider and deeper luggage compartment. On the 5-Door WRX, the wide and flat load floor can accommodate two Tour-size golf bags with the rear seat backs in the upright position. In the WRX sedan, which is 4.5-inches longer than the previous-generation Impreza sedan and 6.5-inches longer than the new 5-Door models, the extra space provides for a larger, deeper trunk that can accommodate three Tour-size golf bags. In all WRX models, a 60/40-split folding rear seat further boosts cargo capacity and convenience.

Advanced Yet Easy-To-Use Technology
The available navigation and information center in Impreza WRX is the focal point of the center console. The navigation screen is located at the top of the dashboard for improved visibility and ease of use. With the navigation system, the center console provides an input for MP3 players as well as RCA-type video jacks that can accommodate portable gaming devices. These can be displayed on the navigation screen when the vehicle is parked.

Impreza models come pre-wired for XM® or SIRIUS® Satellite Radio. Both the standard and optional Impreza audio systems feature the Radio Broadcast Data System (RBDS) that can display a variety of information, including a song’s title and artist. The standard WRX audio system features an AM/FM stereo with single-disc CD player and four speakers.

The WRX Premium Package adds an AM/FM stereo with 6-disc in-dash CD changer featuring MP3/WMA file capability. Occupants enjoy powerful sound from 10 upgraded speakers (six in the front doors, four in the rear doors) and SRS® Circle Surround Sound. Also with this package, the steering wheel adds audio system switches. An auxiliary audio input jack enables connection of an iPod or MP3 player.

The optional Satellite Radio and Navigation package for the WRX integrates the Audyssey MultEQ audio enhancement. Used in high-end home theater systems, Audyssey MultEQ creates the optimal sound experience for passengers in each seat position by tuning equalization that corrects for time and frequency response. The navigation system itself presents major functions through an intuitive, easy-to-use touch screen interface. This option also includes Bluetooth® hands-free wireless capability (requires accessory kit.)

Safety Technology
The new-generation Impreza models are built upon the proven Subaru Ring-Shaped Reinforcement Frame body structure with front and rear crumple zones. All Impreza models for 2009 feature a 4-wheel disc Anti-lock Brake System (ABS) with Electronic Brake-force Distribution (EBD) and Brake Assist. (The WRX and 2.5GT models have larger front brakes than other Impreza models.) All seats provide 3-point seatbelts (height-adjustable for outboard positions), and the front seatbelts have electrically triggered pre-tensioners and force limiters.

Side-curtain airbags are standard on all 2009 Impreza models. The Subaru Advanced Frontal Airbag System (SRS) features front seat side impact airbags and a driver’s side front airbag that deploys according to the driver’s proximity to the steering wheel, as measured by a sensor on the seat track. In the passenger side front seat, a sensor module detects weight – first determining if it is occupied, and if so by a child or adult – to control airbag deployment. As part of the system, the dashboard features an “Airbag” indicator light.

About Subaru of America, Inc.
Subaru of America, Inc. is a wholly owned subsidiary of Fuji Heavy Industries Ltd. of Japan. Headquartered in Cherry Hill, N.J., the company markets and distributes Subaru Symmetrical All-Wheel Drive vehicles, parts and accessories through a network of nearly 600 dealers across the United States. Subaru makes the best-selling All-Wheel Drive car sold in America based on R.L. Polk & Co. new vehicle retail registration statistics calendar year-end 2007. For additional information visit www.subaru.com.

Subaru, Impreza, WRX and STI are registered trademarks of Subaru of America, inc.

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Link to specs sheet: 2009 WRX Specs (http://vocuspr.vocus.com/vocuspr30/Newsroom/ViewAttachment.aspx?SiteName=Subaru&Entity=PRAsset&AttachmentType=F&EntityID=106495&AttachmentID=bcfa9ad8-4201-4e43-b901-93e0cd1e441c)

The biggest draw-back is the continued use of the 17x7" wheels (was hoping for 17x7.5") which will limit the car to 245 r-comps (A6/V710/C7).

Using the posted gear ratios (from specs), the 3.9 final drive, the standard 225/45/17 tires and a redline of 6,500rpms, I'm showing that 1st will go to 39mph and 2nd will top out at 66mph.

Also, can someone convert the listed spring rates into lbs-in? Seems like a healthy increase though (43% increase front, 41.6% increase rear).
The front spring rate is increased from 26.5 N/mm to 38 N/mm, and the rear spring rate is increased from 24 N/mm to 34 N/mm.

With a larger turbocharger (supposed to be the VF series turbo used on the Legacy GT), this car could be a heck of an ESP car if SOA strengthens the 5spd transmission some more. :alien:

The front springs will be around 217 lb/in, if my calcs are correct. This would put the front frequency close to the GD STi... not bad at all. I think this would make it quite competitive in DS.

Rear springs will be around 195 lb/in , but I don't know what the motion ratio back there is so I can't really compare it to the pre-08's...

The front springs will be around 217 lb/in, if my calcs are correct. This would put the front frequency close to the GD STi... not bad at all. I think this would make it quite competitive in DS.

Rear springs will be around 195 lb/in , but I don't know what the motion ratio back there is so I can't really compare it to the pre-08's...
Cool. Thanks!

I still see no mention of a rear lsd, but after seeing the pro solo starts of the Strelnieks' 135i at Toledo, I don't think this short-coming will be an issue.

You assume it's going to be in DS.

--kC

What I want to know is, can I use the up/back date rule to put the new turbo on my 06 and either change the IC (free in ESP) or clock the compressor housing and make an adapter to use my current IC. Guess it comes down to is clocking the housing ESP legal.

That would be cool!

I guess this is Subaru's answer to all of the reviews saying that they had gone soft with the new model, more power is always welcome...

I guess this is Subaru's answer to all of the reviews saying that they had gone soft with the new model, more power is always welcome...

i dunno, the early WRX was way down on power and styling compared to the later modesl.

i look at it this way. the 08 and newer WRX is a reboot of the franchise.

the 08 WRX is the batman begins of the WRX line up. it was new and fresh and pretty different from what had come before.

the 09 WRX is the dark night of the WRX line up. it is everything the 08 was, and more.

You assume it's going to be in DS.

--kC
True. But based on the GS/DS re-org proposal, DS is a safe bet as to where it'll end up. Heck, the 135i ended up in the current DS! :lol:

What I want to know is, can I use the up/back date rule to put the new turbo on my 06 and either change the IC (free in ESP) or clock the compressor housing and make an adapter to use my current IC. Guess it comes down to is clocking the housing ESP legal.

That would be cool!
Per the rule book, the turbo charger is considered to be part of the engine. If you change the turbo you'll have to change engines as well. However, if the '09 WRX uses an identical engine to your '06 WRX, then you could just swap turbos.

Looks like I need to blow up my 2L motor sometime this year... ;)

If all goes to plan I'll let you know if its competitive sometime next May :devil:






















Anyone want to buy a soon to be outdated, and soon to be slower than KC's next RX-8, STX car? Didn't think so.

Looks like I need to blow up my 2L motor sometime this year... ;)
Correct. Turn up da boost!!!!! :lol::devil:
Anyone want to buy a soon to be outdated, and soon to be slower than KC's next RX-8, STX car? Didn't think so.
Nice! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Per the rule book, the turbo charger is considered to be part of the engine. If you change the turbo you'll have to change engines as well. However, if the '09 WRX uses an identical engine to your '06 WRX, then you could just swap turbos.

And by identical... *everything down to the last bolt length and width*.

Good luck with that one.

--kC

Another thing to add is that most current '08 WRX owners are getting about -1 degree of camber upfront. However, caster has improved greatly over the '03-'07 WRXs. The '08+ WRXs get about 6 degrees from the factory (caster improves dynamic camber i.e. car won't lose as much camber during turns). Stiffer spring rates should also help reduce camber loss during turns. On paper, this car is looking quite strong. Hope SOA offers a second wheel option. 17x7" wheels will really hold this car back...

Does anyone know if there are any strut/shock options yet for the '08 WRX or STI? I heard KAIBUTSU (Carris) mention in another thread that he was getting some for his '08 STI - but I'm not sure if they're one-off customs or simply off-the-shelf.

well I did go one full year w/o a car payment :D

Anyone want to buy a soon to be outdated, and soon to be slower than KC's next RX-8, STX car? Didn't think so. Does it have blue wheels? :lol:

Hope SOA offers a second wheel option. 17x7" wheels will really hold this car back...Even if it does, will it be legal for DS?
I heard KAIBUTSU (Carris) mention in another thread that he was getting some for his '08 STI - but I'm not sure if they're one-off customs or simply off-the-shelf.I doubt they are off the shelf - probably someone rebuilding stock struts w/ new guts...

Even if it does, will it be legal for DS?
Depends on how it's offered. I'm hoping for a from-the-factory model that comes with either 17x7.5" or 17x8" wheels. We'll see what SOA offers as this new WRX model develops through the years.

I'm staying rwd for the next couple of seasons -- after that I'll see what the future holds! :)

I doubt they are off the shelf - probably someone rebuilding stock struts w/ new guts...

From what I understand, it will become (or now is?) an off the shelf offering. Assuming the engine stays in one piece, we'll see how they work out at the NE divisionals.

Speaking of engines, anyone know of reliability issues with the 08+ WRX engine?

You assume it's going to be in DS.

--kC

I'd think it owuld be in DS. The intent is to speed that class up.

I'd think it owuld be in DS. The intent is to speed that class up.

But it now has more power, but AWD. With the track record of the SCCA, they tend to fear that combination.

--kC

But it now has more power, but AWD. With the track record of the SCCA, they tend to fear that combination.

--kC

Ah, so move it to BS and let in beat on the RX-8. Might be an even trade.

My money is still on DS.

my guess is DS as well

maybe Subaru should renew it's relationship w/ the SCCA again, seemed a lot more awd friendly back then :)

my guess is DS as wellThe way I see it, absolutely DS. It fits the current DS mold -- especially with cars like the MS3 and the new Cobalt SS turbo both of which make 260hp or more. There's also the "white elephant" of the class the 135i that makes a whopping 300hp (which in a mildly prepped state, was 2nd at the DC Pro and won the Toledo Pro Solo in the hands of strong drivers). From the July Fastrack that proposed a GS/DS re-org, it seems like GS will be the FWD LSD class while the new DS will be for RWD/AWD cars.

With F&R open diffs and a front McStrut suspension (i.e. camber limited), this car is definitely not up to running with the RX-8/350Z/968/MR2 Turbo in B-stock.

From what I understand, it will become (or now is?) an off the shelf offering. Assuming the engine stays in one piece, we'll see how they work out at the NE divisionals.

Speaking of engines, anyone know of reliability issues with the 08+ WRX engine?

I haven't heard of any yet, just the STIs.

this guy had some troubles: http://www.clubwrx.net/forums/everyday-impreza-talk/134291651-2008-wrx-shop.html

they ended up offering him a 09 in exchange :)

any upgrades on the tranny

evidently it ultilizes (as does the 08 WRX) the LGT tranny which is supposedly been relatively solid- I don't know if there is any significant difference in stoutness over the newer WRX's- it does utilize a different ratio that may help w/ it not getting broke

Cryo-treating...

You go ahead and look at my trans case and tell me you know for sure I am cheating. You go ahead and explain to the protest committee how my spending of $750 and NOT changing the physical ratios and performance of the car has somehow made me faster. Sure it improves reliability, but if you think you can get the protest committee to side with you because my trans might have broken and given you the win you're probably going to get laughed right out of impound.

Cryo-treating...

You go ahead and look at my trans case and tell me you know for sure I am cheating. You go ahead and explain to the protest committee how my spending of $750 and NOT changing the physical ratios and performance of the car has somehow made me faster. Sure it improves reliability, but if you think you can get the protest committee to side with you because my trans might have broken and given you the win you're probably going to get laughed right out of impound.

Did you?

As long as they are offered as an option from the factory they are legal.....
Even if it does, will it be legal for DS?


Concur - but don't think it stands a chance......BTW Chike - Erik took 1st place for 2nd time in a row at Wendover(DS 135i) .......

The way I see it, absolutely DS. It fits the current DS mold -- especially with cars like the MS3 and the new Cobalt SS turbo both of which make 260hp or more. There's also the "white elephant" of the class the 135i that makes a whopping 300hp (which in a mildly prepped state, was 2nd at the DC Pro and won the Toledo Pro Solo in the hands of strong drivers). From the July Fastrack that proposed a GS/DS re-org, it seems like GS will be the FWD LSD class while the new DS will be for RWD/AWD cars.

With F&R open diffs and a front McStrut suspension (i.e. camber limited), this car is definitely not up to running with the RX-8/350Z/968/MR2 Turbo in B-stock.


While technically not legal, since it does not significantly alter or increase performance I would not have issue.
- sooner or later though someone would figure out how to win a protest against it if you kept winning....

Cryo-treating...

You go ahead and look at my trans case and tell me you know for sure I am cheating. You go ahead and explain to the protest committee how my spending of $750 and NOT changing the physical ratios and performance of the car has somehow made me faster. Sure it improves reliability, but if you think you can get the protest committee to side with you because my trans might have broken and given you the win you're probably going to get laughed right out of impound.

Is there any provision to change transmissions in ESP, or is the "no competitive advantage" clause the only way to get around it? I'm looking at sourcing a second tranny to use as a back up and if the LGT trans is slightly stronger I'd rather stock one of those than another WRX trans.

You can only update/backdate. The LGT trans is no good.

Out of curiosity, does anyone know the spring rates of the current '08 STI? Wondering how stiff the '09 WRX will now be comparatively...

oops nevermind...

I'm looking at sourcing a second tranny to use as a back up and if the LGT trans is slightly stronger I'd rather stock one of those than another WRX trans.
Supposedly the '08 & '09 WRX use the same 5spd out of the LGT (different final drive). You can update/backdate to an '08 WRX 5spd. :)

Cryo-treating...

You go ahead and look at my trans case and tell me you know for sure I am cheating. You go ahead and explain to the protest committee how my spending of $750 and NOT changing the physical ratios and performance of the car has somehow made me faster. Sure it improves reliability, but if you think you can get the protest committee to side with you because my trans might have broken and given you the win you're probably going to get laughed right out of impound.
Part of this 'modification' is to enhance longevity. The way it has been explained to me in the past is that 'while it sucks things break, any modification not explicitly allowed must be OEM as delivered from the factory. Any processes afterward are illegal if not allowed in the rule book."

An example was the old Neon ACR motor mounts. ~3 events and you needed new ones. Any change to them other than OEM was illegal. Any treating of them to enhance longevity was illegal. It was something that the competitors had to put up with.

While solo is a competitor policed competition, I would be down-right pissed if someone was cheating in this regard as you have to roll the dice with the WRX tranny.

You take it easy, it'll last a while (never had an issue with mine with the 4 years of ProSolos, etc...). If you're heavy fisted, or do something wrong, then you have to put up with that the tranny decides to do. Doing something to your transmission to enhance the longevity that others don't do, because it's not allowed, *is* cheating, all for what? A $5 trophy?

Enjoy your shallow victory. You outspent your competitors. Congrats.

--kC

Cryo-treating...

You go ahead and look at my trans case and tell me you know for sure I am cheating. You go ahead and explain to the protest committee how my spending of $750 and NOT changing the physical ratios and performance of the car has somehow made me faster. Sure it improves reliability, but if you think you can get the protest committee to side with you because my trans might have broken and given you the win you're probably going to get laughed right out of impound.

Or if you dont say anything, it is basically impossible to prove anything since the gears are stock etc. Why even start the arguement?

Are cryo treated brake rotors also illegal in Stock?

Cryo treating doesn't change hardness, AFAIK, so it is not on the list of explicitly forbidden changes in a part.

Supposedly the '08 & '09 WRX use the same 5spd out of the LGT (different final drive). You can update/backdate to an '08 WRX 5spd. :)

Don't the 08's have the speed sensor on the wheels, and not the trans though? That could be a problem.

Are cryo treated brake rotors also illegal in Stock?

Cryo treating doesn't change hardness, AFAIK, so it is not on the list of explicitly forbidden changes in a part.
The rules are written to read "If it doesn't say you CAN, then you cannot do it." They're inclusive, not exclusive.

And on that point....

Alternate components which are normally expendable and considered replacement parts (e.g., engine and wheel bearings, seals, gaskets, filters, belts, bolts, bulbs, batteries, brake rotors, clutch discs, pressure plates, suspension bushings, drivetrain mounts, etc.) may be used provided they are essentially identical to the standard parts (e.g. have the same type, size, hardness, weight, material etc.), are used in the same location, and provide no performance benefit.Cryo changes the hardness. Ergo, illegal.

Arguably, one could say the WRX tranny is 'normally expendable'. :lol: But you still cannot cryo treat it as it changes the hardness to prevent flex. Sorry. I don't write the rules.

--kC

Did you?

Part of this 'modification' is to enhance longevity. The way it has been explained to me in the past is that 'while it sucks things break, any modification not explicitly allowed must be OEM as delivered from the factory. Any processes afterward are illegal if not allowed in the rule book."

An example was the old Neon ACR motor mounts. ~3 events and you needed new ones. Any change to them other than OEM was illegal. Any treating of them to enhance longevity was illegal. It was something that the competitors had to put up with.

While solo is a competitor policed competition, I would be down-right pissed if someone was cheating in this regard as you have to roll the dice with the WRX tranny.

You take it easy, it'll last a while (never had an issue with mine with the 4 years of ProSolos, etc...). If you're heavy fisted, or do something wrong, then you have to put up with that the tranny decides to do. Doing something to your transmission to enhance the longevity that others don't do, because it's not allowed, *is* cheating, all for what? A $5 trophy?

Enjoy your shallow victory. You outspent your competitors. Congrats.

--kC

To answer your first question...no, I have not cryo-treated my gears. I'm with you in the sense that if you take care of the car and trans it'll last. I've been autocrossing for 3 years now. The car sees a hundred or more hard launches per summer. I've just rolled over 98k miles without ever having a problem. The clutch hasn't even been replaced. I'm quite amazed at how well the trans has held up considering the number of people who claim its made of glass.

But there are those who can't afford to have their car down and out. Not everyone has a trailer and a tow vehicle. Some have to drive it to work on Monday. I'm sure there are people who would rather spend the $750 for cryo-treating and risk a protest and the reputation of being a cheater over breaking that trans once, twice, three times and spending $1500 per rebuild. Arguably these people probably shouldn't be spending the money to build an ESP car, but not everyone is smart.

^^ I'm in that last category of need to drive it to work Monday. FWIW, a used 06 tranny can be had for ~ $1K. My plan is to pick up a used trans for a spare and IF I do end up needing it, I'll take my current trans, get Mfactory gears and diffs put in and go to SM. At my last event, I placed 2nd in PAX with an ESP handicap and would still have placed 2nd with a SM handicap so maybe SM won't be that bad.


Maybe this can be proposed to the SEB (or whoever decides these things) to allow upgrades to transmissions in ESP. They're considering allowing major upgrades to the brakes for next year and, as I understood it, the reasoning was that allowed brake mods weren't keeping up performance wise with allowed power mods. The trans proposal could use a similar route (and some fancy wording) that would allow upgraded trans for strength, but (and here's where the fancy wording comes in) the ratios can't change more than X percent or so (to allow for more choices in selecting a trans that is stronger but might have slightly different ratios, but not allow complete gearset/ratio changes).

^^ I'm in that last category of need to drive it to work Monday. FWIW, a used 06 tranny can be had for ~ $1K. My plan is to pick up a used trans for a spare and IF I do end up needing it, I'll take my current trans, get Mfactory gears and diffs put in and go to SM. At my last event, I placed 2nd in PAX with an ESP handicap and would still have placed 2nd with a SM handicap so maybe SM won't be that bad.


Maybe this can be proposed to the SEB (or whoever decides these things) to allow upgrades to transmissions in ESP. They're considering allowing major upgrades to the brakes for next year and, as I understood it, the reasoning was that allowed brake mods weren't keeping up performance wise with allowed power mods. The trans proposal could use a similar route (and some fancy wording) that would allow upgraded trans for strength, but (and here's where the fancy wording comes in) the ratios can't change more than X percent or so (to allow for more choices in selecting a trans that is stronger but might have slightly different ratios, but not allow complete gearset/ratio changes).

I get the idea that the advisory committees and events board only propose changes that directly benefit themselves. Unless someone on the spac drives a car with a weak trans I don't see that ever getting through to the bod.

Cryo changes the hardness. Ergo, illegal.

My reading indicates that it does not. For example (http://www.nwcryo.com/FAQs.html):

Q. Will the cryogenic process increase hardness?

A. No. There is no significant increase in the hardness of treated parts. Some metals may see 1 or 2 points of increase on the Rockwell scale. More importantly, though, the part becomes more uniform and the hardness becomes consistent throughout the part.


Anyway, I guess it is an academic question since I don't intend to cryo treat anything.

Looks like you can run an '09 WRX in DS/ESP unless the SEB classes it otherwise. Under "Subaru" in both DS and ESP, the '08 rule book reads as follows:
Subaru
Forester 2.5XT
Legacy 2.5GT (05+)
WRX
So until they modify that entry, or decide on how to restructure GS/DS, that's the class for the car.

Maybe this can be proposed to the SEB (or whoever decides these things) to allow upgrades to transmissions in ESP. They're considering allowing major upgrades to the brakes for next year and, as I understood it, the reasoning was that allowed brake mods weren't keeping up performance wise with allowed power mods. The trans proposal could use a similar route (and some fancy wording) that would allow upgraded trans for strength, but (and here's where the fancy wording comes in) the ratios can't change more than X percent or so (to allow for more choices in selecting a trans that is stronger but might have slightly different ratios, but not allow complete gearset/ratio changes).

That's crazy!

Want to swap trannies, go to SM.

Maybe this can be proposed to the SEB (or whoever decides these things) to allow upgrades to transmissions in ESP. They're considering allowing major upgrades to the brakes for next year and, as I understood it, the reasoning was that allowed brake mods weren't keeping up performance wise with allowed power mods. The trans proposal could use a similar route (and some fancy wording) that would allow upgraded trans for strength, but (and here's where the fancy wording comes in) the ratios can't change more than X percent or so (to allow for more choices in selecting a trans that is stronger but might have slightly different ratios, but not allow complete gearset/ratio changes).
I'm on board with that idea, however, I don't think you should allow the gear ratios to change outside of the update/backdate allowances already in place.

The strengthening of transmissions could definitely help reduce the costs of running in *SP and might encourage more to take the $$$ plunge and run in those classes.

FWIW, a 275/40/17 A6 will fit on a 17x7" wheel according to this S2000 CR owner:

http://sccaforums.com/forums/1/314629/ShowThread.aspx#314629

He claims the tires provide more contact patch over a 245 A6 despite being pinched on the wheel, and are easier to mount than a 245/45/17 V710.

FWIW, a 275/40/17 A6 will fit on a 17x7" wheel according to this S2000 CR owner:

http://sccaforums.com/forums/1/314629/ShowThread.aspx#314629

He claims the tires provide more contact patch over a 245 A6 despite being pinched on the wheel, and are easier to mount than a 245/45/17 V710.

I'm sure they fit. I'm not sure there is clearance for them on an '06-'07 car though. Probably will work on the '08-'09s though.

the 08/09 looks to have much better tire clearance vs the older models- they should have upped the wheel a 1/2" though :)

they should have upped the wheel a 1/2" though :)
+12345 SOA needs to increase the size of the stock wheels by a 1/2". It would also be *nice* if a rear torsen lsd could be offered as a stand-alone option. ;)

These '09 models are definitely tempting me to get back behind the wheel of a Subaru. I'm definitely driving my RX-8 for the '09 season, but after that who knows... :devil:

<--- also thinking awfully hard about a 09 :)

<--- also thinking awfully hard about a 09 :)
The updated interior makes the prospect all the more enticing!

http://rally.subaru.com/gallery/2008_x/day3_LG4_4225.jpg

http://rally.subaru.com/gallery/2008_x/day3_LG4_4252.jpg

A couple of action shots by drivingsports.com:

http://media.kickstatic.com/kickapps/images/45077/photos/PHOTO_1561926_45077_3151885_main.jpg

http://media.kickstatic.com/kickapps/images/45077/photos/PHOTO_1569552_45077_3151885_main.jpg

http://media.kickstatic.com/kickapps/images/45077/photos/PHOTO_1561925_45077_3151885_main.jpg

http://media.kickstatic.com/kickapps/images/45077/photos/PHOTO_1569554_45077_3151885_main.jpg

I wonder what that 2nd shot would like w/ a 08 w/ 40% softer springs and smaller sway bars front & rear :)

I wonder what that 2nd shot would like w/ a 08 w/ 40% softer springs and smaller sway bars front & rear :)
These were shots taken by GRM of their 2008 WRX project car at an Evo School. Car was bone-stock except for shaved Nitto NT-01 tires:

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/media/img/projectcars/IMG_8972.jpg

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/media/img/projectcars/IMG_9120.jpg

I'm thinking out loud here- ESP, not D stock- I wonder if the 2008 might not be a wiser choice- the bigger turbo w/ the 09 is definitely laggier (peak torque @ 4000 rpms vs 2400 vs the TD04)- the suspension upgrades (along w/ the wheel/tires) don't matter spit in SP as they will replaced wholesale

I'm also wondering w/ the early announcement of the 09 if they will really be trying very hard to rid the lot of 08's

I'm thinking out loud here- ESP, not D stock- I wonder if the 2008 might not be a wiser choice- the bigger turbo w/ the 09 is definitely laggier (peak torque @ 4000 rpms vs 2400 vs the TD04)- the suspension upgrades (along w/ the wheel/tires) don't matter spit in SP as they will replaced wholesale

I'm also wondering w/ the early announcement of the 09 if they will really be trying very hard to rid the lot of 08's

That depends on how much of that lag is due to the turbo and how much is in the engine tune. Its possible that a new tune could shift that torque peak down. In which case I'll take the '09 because it won't be that much different and I'd rather have the additional area under the curve up top.

would be nice to see a side by side dyno and get good look at the torque curve :)

2009 Subaru Impreza WRX
After just one year on the market, Subaru has reworked its WRX to favor enthusiasts.
By Mike Monticello
August 2008

http://www.roadandtrack.com/assets/image/2008/W33/081120081324457050.jpg

It's rare that a manufacturer admits when it's wrong (but then, who would want to admit that?), but with a fairly major overhaul to its WRX for 2009 — after unveiling it as a completely all-new car for 2008 — Subaru is, in a sense, doing just that. Here were the major complaints we had about the 2008 WRX: The suspension was too soft, the power dropped off significantly at the top of the rev range, and the styling was too timid.

To address these issues (and bring back some enthusiasts it lost), Subaru increased the power of the 2.5-liter horizontally opposed 4-cylinder by fitting a larger turbocharger, increasing the boost (from 11.4 psi to 13.3), optimized the catalytic converter and installed a larger-diameter exhaust with a 30-percent increase in flow. Power jumps from 224 bhp at 5200 rpm to 265 bhp at 6000 rpm, with torque increasing from 226 lb.-ft. at 2800 rpm to 244 lb.-ft. at 4000 rpm. Obviously, the power is higher up in the rev range, but this also means the power shouldn't fall flat the way it did last year. Subaru claims a 0–60-mph time of 5.4 seconds.

The suspension has been improved by adding 43-percent-stiffer front springs and 42-percent-stiffer rears, along with the front anti-roll bar increased from a 20-millimeter diameter to 21, and the rear from a 15 millimeter to a 16. Subaru also added stickier (and wider — 225/45R-17s front and rear) Dunlop SP Sport 01 summer tires.

As for the rather bland styling from last year, the WRX for '09 will come standard with last year's optional aero package; the 5-door model will come standard with the STI's high-mount rear wing.

Last year's WRX will basically become this year's Impreza 2.5 GT, available only with a 4-speed automatic; the WRX will come only with a 5-speed manual. Although pricing hasn't been announced yet, figure on the WRX costing $24,999 when it goes on sale September 1, with the Impreza 2.5 GT similarly priced (despite its lower performance), due to extra-cost items such as its automatic transmission and a power sunroof coming standard.
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=10&article_id=6977

Note: They mention an increase in boost pressure from 11.4psi to 13.3psi. :)

Interesting they moved to summer tires. They are probably sick of losing all the camparos to the MS3.

Interesting they moved to summer tires. They are probably sick of losing all the camparos to the MS3.
They need to move to 7.5" wheels and a rear lsd to complete the package imho! :p

The surface of the '09 SCCA Solo Nationals site will really determine this new car's viability in DS. In the current DS, I'd take one over the MS3 or new turbo Cobalt SS in a heartbeat. But the 135i is a different story - I feel that'll be the car to have in the class...even in Pro Solos! :eek: :(

Well, that does it....paying down some bills and going to try to get one next year. Any word on when they arrive, and how much Subaru dealers are *really* going to gouge er, I mean, charge for them?

I'll take mine in white, please! :)

They need to move to 7.5" wheels and a rear lsd to complete the package imho! :p

The surface of the '09 SCCA Solo Nationals site will really determine this new car's viability in DS. In the current DS, I'd take one over the MS3 or new turbo Cobalt SS in a heartbeat. But the 135i is a different story - I feel that'll be the car to have in the class...even in Pro Solos! :eek: :(
I am still amazed to be classed in DS................

Well, that does it....paying down some bills and going to try to get one next year. Any word on when they arrive, and how much Subaru dealers are *really* going to gouge er, I mean, charge for them?

I'll take mine in white, please! :)
Good luck if you do get one James!

Edmunds and Road & Track both estimate sub 25K for one. I seriously doubt they'll be dealer gouging on them - you could probably get one at invoice within a few months. I've read that dealers were taking pre-orders after August 1, and that the first customer cars should arrive by Sept/Oct.
I am still amazed to be classed in DS................
I know a list of at least a dozen people who are "amazed" as well. :furious:

I wonder what that 2nd shot would like w/ a 08 w/ 40% softer springs and smaller sway bars front & rear :)

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e121/BSTON/Car%20Pics/DSC_1300_2.jpg

Keep in mind that my HS Impreza would roll over onto its mirrors with the stock FSB and stock struts, and was so stiff that you could bounce on the trunk and not really have it move much with the race struts on Full Stiff and little body roll with larger FSB. Are any of these pics in "real" DS setup?

Also (for my own information), is it anticipated that the suspension parts for the '08 will fit on the '09+?

I haven't seen an 08 on race rubber at a Tour or Pro except mine. I tried and removed a 22mm bar but didn't buy shocks because someone started lobbing 300-hp grenades into DS. If I still have it next spring you can try it at one of the Southeast events.

I haven't seen an 08 on race rubber at a Tour or Pro except mine. I tried and removed a 22mm bar but didn't buy shocks because someone started lobbing 300-hp grenades into DS. If I still have it next spring you can try it at one of the Southeast events.
Does this mean you're not running Nationals, Des? I really wanted to see how my '06 stacked up to your car now that the alignment is fixed.

Does this mean you're not running Nationals, Des? I really wanted to see how my '06 stacked up to your car now that the alignment is fixed.
Looks like Des is signed up in a HS mini:

http://ams.scca.com/netforum/eweb/dynamicPage.aspx?site=scca&webkey=9923d8a8-4595-4138-986e-5a66d470be49&evt_key=c0af3b30-2fbc-4903-846a-1df7cc0012e7&class=HS

Does this mean you're not running Nationals, Des? I really wanted to see how my '06 stacked up to your car now that the alignment is fixed.

Well, Nats should be special, and Dietz/Fastmike kick my butt pretty much every weekend. It's HS for me, where a completely different set of drivers will kick my butt.

I think the faster WRX will always be the one with you behind the wheel; you've got a very nice touch with a difficult car. But same offer for you as James -- you're welcome to take a shot at Dixie Tour or one of the regionals. Maybe by then I'll have an 09!

Unless someone kick some serious butt with the 09 wrx it will be d stock. I think Sam Stano's shelby in F stock was faster than Jason Isley's Rx-8 (B stock) at the nationals.

I'll take that offer, Des :) See you in grid in Topeka in HS! I'll be in the mostly-black Ford.

Unless someone kick some serious butt with the 09 wrx it will be d stock. I think Sam Stano's shelby in F stock was faster than Jason Isley's Rx-8 (B stock) at the nationals.
I don't see it being placed anywhere else but in D-stock based on the "300hp grenades" that were put into the class (nice one Des!). On concrete, the 135i will be DEADLY quick. On asphalt a strong driver in an '09 WRX could have a fighting chance. :)

As Kraus correctly pointed out to me earlier this season - you can't compare class times from Topeka when they ran in different heats. The "sand" at the HPT beach can really affect the speed of the course as the day goes on. Often Heat 1 has an advantage as a street sweeper goes through and cleans the course prior to the run groups being started (later heats are forced to run the lines laid down in the sand). FWIW, Strano did beat Isley's cumulative time by just over a 1/2 second.

As Kraus correctly pointed out to me earlier this season - you can't compare class times from Topeka when they ran in different heats. The "sand" at the HPT beach can really affect the speed of the course as the day goes on. Often Heat 1 has an advantage as a street sweeper goes through and cleans the course prior to the run groups being started (later heats are forced to run the lines laid down in the sand). FWIW, Strano did beat Isley's cumulative time by just over a 1/2 second.

That and the fact that the temperature really affects speed out on course. Running early last year really sucked. It was drizzling and about 45 degrees. We had the tires covered with bags between runs and were having trouble keeping temperature in the tires with two drivers. The one driver cars had a horrid time. If DS ran in those conditions I could easily see a WRX or TT cleaning house. Now obviously none of this will be an issue next year since we are moving to another site entirely.

That and the fact that the temperature really affects speed out on course. Running early last year really sucked. It was drizzling and about 45 degrees. We had the tires covered with bags between runs and were having trouble keeping temperature in the tires with two drivers. The one driver cars had a horrid time. If DS ran in those conditions I could easily see a WRX or TT cleaning house. Now obviously none of this will be an issue next year since we are moving to another site entirely.
Very good point about temp Keith - that could definitely have a huge impact on grip at HPT.

It'll be interesting to see just how fast a 135i will be with development. The Strelnieks' were owning A-stock cars through the first straight (over a 60ft distance) during practice starts at the Toledo Pro. :eek:

Very good point about temp Keith - that could definitely have a huge impact on grip at HPT.

It'll be interesting to see just how fast a 135i will be with development. The Strelnieks' were owning A-stock cars through the first straight (over a 60ft distance) during practice starts at the Toledo Pro. :eek:


Not surprising, these things are frickin rockets........:D

Not surprising, these things are frickin rockets........:DLOL... :lol: :(

Let's hope no one local shows up with an 09 WRX in D-Stock then...if they do, I may have to jump to a faster (read: more $$$) class. :lol:

Driving impressions from Road & Track....


Driving Impression: 2009 Subaru Impreza WRX
If at first you don't succeed...simply re-do the car the following year.

http://www.roadandtrack.com/assets/image/2008/W33/8142008223545.jpg

Most on staff here at R&T were big fans of the first-generation Subaru Impreza WRX that came to the States. We even had one as a long-term car, and not only was it fun to drive, but it was quite sturdy as well. Sure, it was a little rough around the edges — plenty of turbo lag, slightly harsh ride, cheap-looking interior — but honestly, those traits were also part of its charm.

Since we loved that car so much, we were certainly looking forward to the completely reworked 2008 edition. We weren't sure about the hatchback styling, although the convenience of the hatchback itself made sense. Plus, the true reason the hatchback bodystyle was added to the mix — to make a better rally car (due to far less rear hangover) — is so dang cool.

Unfortunately, in a bid to gain more "mainstream" buyers, Subaru chose to soften the 2008 WRX — softer suspension, smoother styling, power moved lower in the rev range. And we didn't like it nearly as much. Plain and simple, the fun had been taken away. Apparently prospective buyers felt the same way, because in an almost unheard-of turn of events, Subaru has given the car an overhaul again for 2009.

First the engineers addressed the engine, increasing the power of the 2.5-liter horizontally opposed 4-cylinder by fitting a larger turbocharger, increasing the boost (from 11.4 psi to 13.3), optimizing the catalytic converter and installing a larger-diameter exhaust with a 30-percent increase in flow. Power jumps from 224 bhp at 5200 rpm to 265 bhp at 6000 rpm, with torque increasing from 226 lb.-ft. at 2800 rpm to 244 lb.-ft. at 4000 rpm. While we can't yet legitimize Subaru's claim of 0-60 mph in 5.4 seconds, we can tell you after our first drive in the car that it revs freely all the way to redline without falling flat on its face like last year's car. It simply delivers loads of smooth power at all times. And it actually doesn't feel that far off the STI. A Subaru source even hinted the new WRX is making more than the claimed 265 bhp.

The suspension has been improved by adding 43-percent-stiffer front springs and 42-percent-stiffer rears, along with the front anti-roll bar increased from a 20-millimeter diameter to 21, and the rear from a 15 millimeter to a 16. Subaru also added stickier (and wider — 225/45R-17s front and rear) Dunlop SP Sport 01 summer tires. Now this is more like it! This is why you buy a WRX — gone is the wallowy, marshmallow-like suspension of last year's car. This '09 WRX is much more precise and sure-footed, and has returned as a terrific back-road charger. Yet, the car's ride quality has barely suffered. I drove one of the new '09s back from the press event in Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada, to Newport Beach, California (a 1600-mile trip, at least the slightly circuitous route I took) and I never once thought the ride was harsh or jiggly. Personally, it could even be a bit stiffer. The one thing that could be better, though, are the brakes, which heated up rather quickly around an autocross Subaru set up for us. But in real-world driving, you probably will never notice.

As for the rather bland styling from last year, the WRX for '09 will come standard with last year's optional aero package. The WRX will still be available as either a 4-door sedan or 5-door hatchback; the 5-door model will come standard with the STI's high-mount rear wing.

Last year's WRX will basically become this year's Impreza 2.5 GT, available only with a 4-speed automatic; the WRX will come only with a 5-speed manual. Although pricing won't be announced until August 25, figure on the WRX costing $24,999 when it goes on sale September 1, with the Impreza 2.5 GT similarly priced (despite its lower performance), due to extra-cost items such as its automatic transmission and a power sunroof coming standard.

To sum up: The 2009 WRX is what the redesigned 2008 WRX should've been. And good for Subaru for realizing this, admitting it...and fixing it!

What's Hot:
More power
Sharper handling
A WRX we can fall in love with again

What's Not:
4-door sedan not particularly good-looking
Seats need more lateral support
Brakes heat up sooner than expected

What's New:
265 bhp
Stiffer springs, thicker anti-roll bars
Aero package standard

Cars to Compare:
Chevrolet Cobalt SS sedan
Mazdaspeed3
Mitsubishi Lancer Ralliart
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=10&article_id=6993

Not sure how true the section is that I bolded in the article, but if this new WRX makes more than 265hp, it might very well be able to run with a 135i... :cool:

well I've checked w/ Koni and they have insert/shock set close to go for the 08/09's

WL has a decently sized front sway available

I've found a few relatively light 17x7's

The question I have is what about R compound tires- good choices in 225/45/17 which obviously would be a good fit w/ the 7" rim, but probably a little narrow

what other possible candidates?

245/40 Hoosier.....

Fenders should accomodate a 275/40/17 Hoosier.

As an FYI, AP2 S2000's drivers can squeeze a 275/40/17 A6 onto their front 17x7" wheels.

245/40 sounds like a good choice, I think 275/40 would fit body wise (the new WRX has a wider track than all previous models) but man that's a squeeze!!! :)

.....mmmmm don't think so ...... unless WRX has a superb driver and 135 driver is a dolt. The 135 has a better chassis and 300 ft lbs at 2500 rpm

Driving impressions from Road & Track....


http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=10&article_id=6993

Not sure how true the section is that I bolded in the article, but if this new WRX makes more than 265hp, it might very well be able to run with a 135i... :cool:

undoubtedly wider than 7" wheels I'm guessing too

undoubtedly wider than 7" wheels I'm guessing too
The 135i wheels are 18x7.5" front, 18x8.5" rear. The Hoosier sizes most 135i autocrossers run are 245/35/18 font, 275/35/18 rear.

From a roll, the 135i would keep up with an STi - possibly beat one. So it will definitely "own" the WRX. From a launch, the '09 WRX may stand a chance, but it'll be close.

^ that's what I was afraid of - 7.5/8.5" stock, not too shabby :)

It would fun to be a Subaru engineer and be told to build a WRX equivalent of a Neon ACR :D

mmmm 17 x 9s, fender flares and a 45mm rear sway bar :lol:

well at least lightweight 17x8's, adj rear sway bar, along w/ Koni dampers :lol:

Does anyone know if the tele-scoping steering column from the 2009 will retro-fit back to older Imprezas? I would LOVE to move the steering wheel out another inch or so in my '05 STi due to my long legs.

Which model 2 run, 4 door or 5 ?

Weird ... the Subaru email ad that I received today at around 4 PM ... for their 2009 models ... doesn't include the new WRX?! They only show '08 WRX's ... but '09 Legacys, Tribecas and Outbacks?

Looks like BigSky will be getting his '09 pretty soon...

Looks like BigSky will be getting his '09 pretty soon...

very soon :devil:

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j304/BIGSKYWRX/rimrock1.jpg

now the tough part. I'm a damn tinkerer by nature, not sure if I could leave the car enough alone for D Stock. Wouldn't be running ESP for a least a year, maybe two. I'm leaning STU, not because it would be competitive (well locally I'd fair OK), but would allow me tinker a fair amount w/o the hassle of worrying about hauling R compounds.

we'll see :)

Good luck bud. She looks purty.

I still haven't completely ruled out getting one in the future - I will at least wait to see the 2010 updates though...

^ test drive one- I think you'd pretty impressed- the springs/dampers are leaps ahead of any previous WRX :D

Congrats, Bigsky.:)

test drive one- I think you'd pretty impressed- the springs/dampers are leaps ahead of any previous WRX :D
I will when the time's right. ;)

At this point in time, I love the RX-8 and its handling just too much.

Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry8800/4.2.1 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/100)

Chike:

Maybe a 2nd car :)?

Can't have too many AX/track cars.

- Harry

Can't have too many AX/track cars.
Oh, yeah, you can. :(

Karen

Chike:

Maybe a 2nd car :)?

Can't have too many AX/track cars.

- Harry
We'll see. In this economy I'd rather pay stuff off than acquire new debt. :)

I'll see where I am by 2010 and make a decision then. If my wife gets a new car, I'll acquire her lancer as a daily driver, at which point I could start looking at 2 seaters -- so lots of options to consider.

This could be an interesting competitor who could join the fold if the '09 WRX gets classed competitively:

My dad is looking to get back into autocross (he used to co-drive with me in my MR2) and he's going to test drive one of these today. I have a feeling it could be a good ProSolo car...

Jonathan Roberts
http://sccaforums.com/forums/2/325553/ShowThread.aspx#325553

4X National Champ Annie B got her '09 yesterday. It will be cool to see how it does. Traded in her "new" '03 SS Z-06 for it. THAT's what I wanted to see her run! :(

http://images41.fotki.com/v1345/photos/4/43793/5921702/Annies09-vi.jpg

I was watching a new one run this past weekend at a local event. With stock tires, it'll still struggle in the corners, but it has more than enough power to be a serious contender.

I'd like to get the owner to let me have a whack at it to get a better idea.

Jay

Oh, yeah, you can. :(

Karen

No... you caaaan't

:lol:

--kC

LOL...if I can win prosolo in an '06...Roberts can definitely take the 335s...and win by like 45 seconds in an '09

4X National Champ Annie B got her '09 yesterday. It will be cool to see how it does. Traded in her "new" '03 SS Z-06 for it. THAT's what I wanted to see her run! :(
Ouch - that Z06 didn't last long. What gives? Paging Max or Annie...
LOL...if I can win prosolo in an '06...Roberts can definitely take the 135s...and win by like 45 seconds in an '09
Fix0red!

+12345 If the car is set-up correctly, I definitely feel an '09 WRX could get it done against the BMW 135i, Audi TT, VW R32, etc.

I'm going to get mine aligned here in the next week or so, from what I've read of the 08's they see a little less neg camber up front vs previous models- in the -1.0 range- not sure how motivated these folks were to eek out the max though

4X National Champ Annie B got her '09 yesterday. It will be cool to see how it does. Traded in her "new" '03 SS Z-06 for it. THAT's what I wanted to see her run! :(

http://images41.fotki.com/v1345/photos/4/43793/5921702/Annies09-vi.jpg

Whaaaat?? She just got that car! Oh well, I think she made the better choice :banana:

Oh well, I think she made the better choice :banana:
Agreed. ;)

So what's the likelihood of seeing you in one next season? I just love my RX-8 too much to move on from it... :alien:

Agreed. ;)

So what's the likelihood of seeing you in one next season? I just love my RX-8 too much to move on from it... :alien:

Not bloodly likely with the loan industry in the tank, I wouldn't have too much of a down payment available and would have to finance the whole thing.

I will be driving an '02 WRX in DS in the midwest, and an '08 VW R32 on the west coast, also in DS.

I've got a new project that I am working on (work-related) and I'd rather keep funding open for that if I can, at all possible.

Per the rule book, the turbo charger is considered to be part of the engine. If you change the turbo you'll have to change engines as well. However, if the '09 WRX uses an identical engine to your '06 WRX, then you could just swap turbos.

AVCS and vacuum pumps will kill that

Not bloodly likely with the loan industry in the tank, I wouldn't have too much of a down payment available and would have to finance the whole thing.

I will be driving an '02 WRX in DS in the midwest, and an '08 VW R32 on the west coast, also in DS.

I've got a new project that I am working on (work-related) and I'd rather keep funding open for that if I can, at all possible.
Personally, I would sit back and make sure that any motor-related issues aren't going to crop up, a la STi. Only Des Toup did any kind of National level driving with an '08 WRX last year (and only the Doublecross at that), so I don't know if the WRX was having issues like the STi was having.

Seriously, one reason I am not considering an '09 STi is because I am not convinced SoA has done anything to address the problems seen with the '08 (and '05-'07) motors.

Karen

They put out a reflash a month or two ago that was supposed to fix it.

... and very recently a friend's '08 STI blew its engine on the way home from it's first AX with a rebuilt engine with the new reflash. Now they're putting in a new from Japan engine. The 2nd blown engine had been carefully broken in (as was the original - owner is an engineer), he took it easy for most of the AX weekend ... but it still let go, even with the new factory map.

Issues, but big props to Subaru for fairly dealing with it!

^^^^ Pete?

Annie had to move back to Seattle for her job, and discovered that the Z06 sucked big monkey balls in the wet! If I'd had the money, I would have bought it off her, but alas, like others here, I don't want to be borrowing more money right now.

So, solution = 09 WRX. Great in the wet, great cargo space and hopefully, DS competitive:D

? Pete ? ... can't say

Z-06's sucks in the wet with the wrong tires ... ask Motonishi. Z-06 won the ProSolo in ASP in the rain ... oh ... but they were all Vette's except Jason's Elise in 2nd ... probably not the greatest in the wet either. :D

Z-06's sucks in the wet with the wrong tires ... ask Motonishi. Z-06 won the ProSolo in ASP in the rain ... oh ... but they were all Vette's except Jason's Elise in 2nd ... probably not the greatest in the wet either. :D

Ahhh... but compare ASP times with STU or STX at the wet Pro Finale:D

A Subaru on street tires in the wet is pretty much unbeatable.

[QUOTE=JamesWilson;23982295]
I will be driving an '02 WRX in DS in the midwest, and an '08 VW R32 on the west coast, also in DS.

QUOTE]


:D:devil:

Annie had to move back to Seattle for her job, and discovered that the Z06 sucked big monkey balls in the wet! If I'd had the money, I would have bought it off her, but alas, like others here, I don't want to be borrowing more money right now.

So, solution = 09 WRX. Great in the wet, great cargo space and hopefully, DS competitive:DMakes sense Max. Will you be co-driving with her or keep running the STi?

Hope to see Annie kick arse next year as well as Roberts if he joins the class. :banana::banana::banana:

Makes sense Max. Will you be co-driving with her or keep running the STi?


Ha - not likely, she's in Seattle and I'm in So Cal:D

I'll be running the STI unless someone wants to buy it off me, so I can buy a Z06!

Ha - not likely, she's in Seattle and I'm in So Cal:D

I'll be running the STI unless someone wants to buy it off me, so I can buy a Z06!


How many times do you want your Home painted, in trade for the Black Beast.

There is a sale on your favorite shade of Pink.

$25,000's worth of painting:D

$2,500's worth of painting:D


Cool only half the house.:D

Only Des Toup did any kind of National level driving with an '08 WRX last year (and only the Doublecross at that), so I don't know if the WRX was having issues like the STi was having. Des was around locally with his WRX for most of the season, the only issue I heard him mention was it's inability to keep plastic body panels affixed to it's underbelly... a problem easily soved by not running into them orange things so much. ;)

Annie bought a new car (again!) :banana:
rummor has it she broke her record with the vet, less than a month ...... also something about only owning 2-seater sports cars not being very practical. :p

Mako, you should have let me post the first pics of my new ride! :D

Yes, I'm not enough of a corvette girl to withstand the white-knuckled driving necessary to daily drive that beast in the rain (and bad drivers!) here in Seattle - since I'll be here for at least the near future, I just couldn't do it!

Plus, four wheel burnouts in the snow will be WAY more fun than standing there looking at the Z06 in a ditch :)

I test drove the '09 WRX and a '08 STI back to back. Absolutely NO question in my mind that the WRX is the better bang for the buck - while the STI did everything slightly better, it wasn't earth shatteringly better, and certainly not worth the $10K difference in price! The WRX is almost a STI now. Really! I've owned two STI's, raced both my '07 and Max's '06 and had TONS of fun (also did a few autox runs in an '08), so I wanted the STI to blow me away, but it didn't!

Yes, new record is 29 days, down from 32!

Congrats Annie. Looking forward to seeing your accomplishments in the new ride!

Yes, new record is 29 days, down from 32!:lol: and here I was thinking you had shattered your previous record... should of know better!

interesting about the WRX -vs- STi.... that's a pretty big step for Subaru, essentially diminishing the stature of their flagship performer. It wasn't that long ago that the (1st gen) STi had similar power (to the 09 WRX)...

It wasn't that long ago that the (1st gen) STi had similar power (to the 09 WRX)...
Under the new SAE rating, first gen USDM STi made 293hp, while the '09 WRX makes 265hp -- a difference of only 28hp and the WRX is about 150lbs lighter.

I think it's more of a statement on the drastic improvement of the 09 WRX, and the stagnant performance gains of the 04-09 STI. The 08 STI blows up, the 09 might blow up, the 07 had a crappy tune from the factory - the last good one was the 06!

I will admit the the 08 STI is a much nicer daily driver, but we Motorsports peeps don't care about that bollocks!:D

Under the new SAE rating, first gen USDM STi made 293hp, while the '09 WRX makes 265hp -- a difference of only 28hp and the WRX is about 150lbs lighter.150lbs? that's significant

btw, I speak of the "1st" 1st gen; version 1 (1992) started at less than 250 hp... ending with version 6 at 276hp
(those cars weighed on average around ~2,800lbs)

according to this site (normally very accurate) more like 200 lbs

http://www.cars101.com/subaru/impreza/wrxsti2009.html#dimensions

that would be like me out of the car and a ghost driving it (I'm sure the ghost can drive faster :lol:)

btw, I speak of the "1st" 1st gen; version 1 (1992) started at less than 250 hp... ending with version 6 at 276hp
(those cars weighed on average around ~2,800lbs)
Gotcha - well I was thinking of the first gen that Americans could purchase.
according to this site (normally very accurate) more like 200 lbs

http://www.cars101.com/subaru/impreza/wrxsti2009.html#dimensions

that would be like me out of the car and a ghost driving it (I'm sure the ghost can drive faster :lol:)
Wow - 200lbs?! That pretty much negates the 28hp difference.

hey Mike, congrats on your new car purchase as well! you'll have to head west next spring/summer; come out to one of our events.

Question is - who will be faster, Mike or Annie?:D

hey Mike, congrats on your new car purchase as well! you'll have to head west next spring/summer; come out to one of our events.

Doug- this year I had a goal to compete in all three NorPac divisionals- didn't get that done, hopefully next year I can :)

Question is - who will be faster, Mike or Annie?:D

My $ is Annie :D

Personally, I would sit back and make sure that any motor-related issues aren't going to crop up, a la STi. Only Des Toup did any kind of National level driving with an '08 WRX last year (and only the Doublecross at that), so I don't know if the WRX was having issues like the STi was having.

Seriously, one reason I am not considering an '09 STi is because I am not convinced SoA has done anything to address the problems seen with the '08 (and '05-'07) motors.

Karen

What's wrong with the 05-06 motors?... I know a guy with an 07, and the wacky throttle mapping sucks, so I understand that being an issue. And, I've read the anecdotal reports of 07's maybe being more fragile. But, I've not heard that of 05's or 06's. I'm concerned b/c I have an '05... autox'ed it for 3 years so far, no issues.. am I just lucky?..what should I be looking out for?

Your rings lands breaking off and lunching your motor? :p

Ha - not likely, she's in Seattle and I'm in So Cal:D

I'll be running the STI unless someone wants to buy it off me, so I can buy a Z06!

hmm... how much you selling the sti?:devil:

hmm... how much you selling the sti?:devil:

$25,000 in STU trim - PM me if you want more details.

Your rings lands breaking off and lunching your motor? :p

The only info I've seen regarding that is w/respect to 08's... and there's a TSB or some-such that will get you a reflash from the dealer.

I've never received such a notice about my 05 though... did I miss it?.. or is this just 'guilt by association' and/or other internet fear-mongering?

The only info I've seen regarding that is w/respect to 08's... and there's a TSB or some-such that will get you a reflash from the dealer.

I've never received such a notice about my 05 though... did I miss it?.. or is this just 'guilt by association' and/or other internet fear-mongering?
Not "fear mongering" but Subaru never really acknowledged there was a problem either. Ask Joel Fehrman ('05), Meredith Najewicz ('05), or Steven Kornhaus ('06).... among others... about their piston issues.

Karen

Not "fear mongering" but Subaru never really acknowledged there was a problem either. Ask Joel Fehrman ('05), Meredith Najewicz ('05), or Steven Kornhaus ('06).... among others... about their piston issues.

Karen

I didn't mean to mis-characterize anyone's posts.. it was a poor choice of words on my part... apologies.

What I was getting at was whether this was something perpetuated w/little actual documented cases... kind of like how people went nuts over worrying about the EGT probe killing turbos en-masse in the early days of WRXes on these shores.

If several folks have had their stuff fail, then that indeed worries me. I'll have to check it out. My car is 100% stock, tune-wise... is this an issue that mainly arises w/tuning? I ask this potentially obvious question b/c the 08 issue seems to be related to the factory tuning... but I know that at least some of the named folks above run in classes that allow tuning.

I just got my 09 WRX...

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm23/lundgrenj/NewWRX003.jpg

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm23/lundgrenj/NewWRX004.jpg

very soon :devil:

now the tough part. I'm a damn tinkerer by nature, not sure if I could leave the car enough alone for D Stock. tinker a fair amount w/o the hassle of worrying about hauling R compounds.

we'll see :)


:ome too....:lol: sucks

Nice Lund! ... my "color" :D

Does the WRX have less pronounced fender flares then the STI?

^ yes and I'm sure I'm in the minority, but I think the lines of the WRX are cleaner than the STi w/ the bulgy fenders

+1 ... but do the WRX fenders limit tire size?

Yes, but for stock class autocross the wheel is the limiting factor on the size of tires you can use.

Oh yeah ... 275's on 6" '99 CS Miata wheels! :D

Maybe someone did it, but I don't remember anyone fitting 275s on 17x7s. I thought Karen had considered it but never actually did.

Can it be done?

The fellow that won STU Nationals the first couple of years ... didn't he have 275's ... on early (narrow) stock STI wheels?

The fellow that won STU Nationals the first couple of years ... didn't he have 275's ... on early (narrow) stock STI wheels?

Mako - you're losing it buddy:D

Brandon won on 245's on a 7.5" wheel.

What size shoes was J. Roberts wearing?

Must be what I was thinking, duh ... STI STU = 245's

245 max for STU :) - awd anyways

What size shoes was J. Roberts wearing?

Must be what I was thinking, duh ... STI STU = 245's


Roberts has 275 hoosiers on the 17x8 wheels. Most AS STI's run 275's of some type on the 8 inch wide wheels

BryanH put 275's on a 7" wide MR2 wheel (15's)

Some S2000 folks have apparently stuffed 275's onto their front 17x7 wheels:
http://www.s2ki.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=606412&st=0&#entry13668432

Type-R/ MR2 guys do 275s on 6" wheels regularly.

NO WAY a 275 is clearing the rear of an 06-07 with the allowed offsets. Front? MAYBE...never tried because of the height difference between the 245 and 275 and not wanting to blow up a center diff.

I just got my 09 WRX...

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm23/lundgrenj/NewWRX003.jpg

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm23/lundgrenj/NewWRX004.jpg
Congrats - she's a beauty! :cool:

Annie got her car aligned at Fordahl Motorsports - this was the best they could do with the front camber.

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b193/blkwrxwag/download.jpg

^ that's not overly encouraging

the pos. caster will help overcome some of the deficit, also the rear camber is almost a .5 degree less then previous gens- that will help a little too

I should be getting mine on a rack next week- I'll post up my findings

Have one of those big Montana girls pull on the wheel while you adjust it Mike:D

Greg suspects it will settle a touch as the suspension loosens up so it may get a touch more, and gain a tiny bit more camber... :)

Have one of those big Montana girls pull on the wheel while you adjust it Mike:D

not exactly what I had in mind :) I do have a trick or two up my sleeve however

hope I see as much caster as Annie did, 5.5 is :banana:

Have one of those big Montana girls pull on the wheel while you adjust it Mike:D
LOL - as long as she's not an "elephant of a woman" you're good to go bud! ;) :lol:

http://image.motortrend.com/f/roadtests/hatchbacks/10391856+w455/112_0807_01l+2009_subaru_impreza_WRX+front_three_q uarter_view.jpg

Quick Test: 2009 Subaru Impreza WRX
By Carlos Lago

When the redesigned 2008 Subaru Impreza WRX hit the market, many enthusiasts expressed concern. The new WRX gave priority to civility and comfort, rather than outright driving excitement. Our long-term WRX sedan notebook is full of such comments: "When you want to tackle that twisty road, the WRX is not nearly as eager as before," says senior editor Ron Kiino. "It's simply not as fun to drive -- the previous WRX was really playful, like it wanted you to push it; now it just feels like it'll give you a few sprints but then it wants to relax."

Guess what? Subaru listened. To criticism and complaints, to forums and magazines, the company listened. And as a remedy, Subaru has outfitted the 2009 WRX with a stiffer suspension, better tires, and a bigger turbocharger. The updated WRX's 2.5L boxer-four now delivers a healthy 265 hp and 244 lb-ft of torque, enough to blow last year's WRX out of the water and nip at the heels of the current STI. Joining the refreshed WRX in the 2009 Impreza lineup is the Impreza 2.5GT, a vehicle that's essentially the same model as the 2008 WRX.

Out at the track, the new and improved WRX launches hard; all four tires spin as the car leaps forward as if it were rear-ended by a bus. A mere 1.6 sec pass before 30 mph is reached, a time on par with the new BMW M3 and Cadillac CTS-v. Sixty mph comes in 4.8 sec, and the five-door, five-passenger hatchback we tested covered a quarter mile in 13.5 sec at 101.1 mph. That's near a second faster than last year's model and just a tenth slower than the 2008 STI. Consider the $10,000 difference between the base WRX and the homologated rally car, and you'll be asking yourself, "STI why?"

The performance increases don't stop there. Stickier Dunlop tires and a stiffer suspension -- front and rear springs are up 43 and 42%, respectively, and anti-roll bars up 1 mm on both ends -- help to send the WRX through our figure-eight in 26.3 sec and around the skidpad at 0.85 g. The figure-eight time is a near second improvement over the 2008 model, but six-tenths off the STI's time. The biggest -- some might say only -- shortcoming is the shift linkage, which feels the same as last year with long throws and a rubbery feel. No one's going complain about the drop in fuel mileage, down one from last year to 18 city/25 highway.

While this WRX blows away last year's model and out-accelerates everything in class, it might not be enough to conquer the competition. Mitsubishi's Lancer Ralliart provides the most direct threat, matching the WRX's all-wheel drive and upping the ante with a trick new dual-clutch gearbox. Track rats should also keep an eye on the Chevy Cobalt SS and MazdaSpeed3, two cars that never fail to entertain.

In any event, we're sure those least entertained are 2008 WRX owners. Now if only we could find a way to trade in our 2008 long-term car...

2009 SUBARU IMPREZA WRX
Base Price $26,600
Price as tested $28,660 (est)
Drivetrain Front engine, AWD
Engine 2.5L/265-hp/244-lb-ft turbo DOHC 4-cyl flat-4
Transmission 5-speed manual
Curb Weight (dist f/r) 3214 lb (57/43%)
Wheelbase 103.1 in
Length x Width x Height 173.8 x 68.5 x 58.1 in
0-60 mph 4.8 sec
Quarter mile 13.5 sec @ 101.1 mph
Braking, 60-0 mph 113 ft
Lateral acceleration 0.85 g
EPA City/Hwy fuel econ 18/25 mpg
CO2 Emissions 1.1 lb/mile
On Sale In U.S. Currently

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/hatchbacks/112_0810_2009_subaru_impreza_wrx_test/index.html

:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

Hmmm, I was much more excited about this until I realized we are all going to get our fannies paddled by the Krauts. Seriously, how did the 135i sneak in to DS (you would think when classifying them in May that someone would have at least thought the 128i and 135i should be in different classes)? "Better chassis", these guys are going to have more tire, and then the torque! I've been seeing people throw around the numbers, 300 ft-lbs versus 245 for the 09 WRX...the WRX makes 245 peak, the Bimmer makes 300 ft-lbs from 1400 to 5000 RPM!

I know you're supposed to drive autox for fun, but a lot of the fun for me is competing. I'm new, and I have no illusions of running winning times in DS anytime soon, but come on why spend the money to play when the best you can do is get the first place behind all the bimmers? It reminds me of Counterstrike. I used to play a lot in college, and was very good, but eventually I grew tired of it because there were so many hackers that the playing field just wasn't even anymore. It's like the 135 guys are going to be the speed hackers of DS lmao!

Seriously though, I'm still going to run in DS next year. I'll just probably run nearly completely stock and hold off on any investments in a DS setup. I can't see myself investing 5k+ in a setup that will still get my fanny paddled. I suspect that this strategy would be recommended for an autoX newbie anyway though, or do you guys think it's better to get a proper setup car then learn to drive?

No ... learn to drive first. First Investment should be EVO Auto Cross school ... besides a set of 235/40/17 Dunlop Z1 Stars ... and a short shifter. That's a DS legal factory mod, right.

clearly the 135 is a formidable car- I think the biggest advantage it has is w/ big rubber (they get wide rims from the factory)

not saying it won't be a contender, because it will, but look at this years 10 trophy spots at Nationals

1. Integra
2. Audi TT
3. Cobalt
4. Integra
5. Integra
6. Integra
7. Integra
8. R32
9. Integra
10. Integra

the first 135i is 21st

my point is there are a lot of cars/drivers in the mix besides the 135i, maybe the 09 can be one of them :)

STi short shifter is a factory/port installed option- I have one (as did my last two WRX's :))

No ... learn to drive first. First Investment should be EVO Auto Cross school
+1 on the Evo School. The '09 has decent summer tires to learn on though. After the school, I'd recommend an alignment (similar to what Annie did above), and a big FSB to limit body roll.

If you then feel the need to step-up your competitiveness some more - get some konis, along with a 2nd set of stock wheels and r-comps.

clearly the 135 is a formidable car- I think the biggest advantage it has is w/ big rubber (they get wide rims from the factory)

not saying it won't be a contender, because it will, but look at this years 10 trophy spots at Nationals

1. Integra
2. Audi TT
3. Cobalt
4. Integra
5. Integra
6. Integra
7. Integra
8. R32
9. Integra
10. Integra

the first 135i is 21st

my point is there are a lot of cars/drivers in the mix besides the 135i, maybe the 09 can be one of them :)
The fastest driver in a 135i wasn't in DS. She won DSL. I think a better representation of what the 135i is capable of is how Erik Strelnieks did with it at Wendover and Toledo.... ie., he crushed the class. I'm not saying the '09 can't be a contender, but I'm also stressing (again) that Nationals results shouldn't be the end-all-be-all of classing decisions.

Karen

The fastest driver in a 135i wasn't in DS. She won DSL. I think a better representation of what the 135i is capable of is how Erik Strelnieks did with it at Wendover and Toledo.... ie., he crushed the class. I'm not saying the '09 can't be a contender, but I'm also stressing (again) that Nationals results shouldn't be the end-all-be-all of classing decisions.

Karen
Karen,

+1 on Nats results. Fastest DS 135i driver was Beth.

Erik definitely dominated the class at the Wendover pro. At Toledo, he was only a few 100ths of a second ahead of Trevor Hill's R32. However, Toledo was his first event in the car...

I'm not saying the '09 can't be a contender, but I'm also stressing (again) that Nationals results shouldn't be the end-all-be-all of classing decisions.

Karen

absolutely agreed, just pointing out that the 135i hasn't achieved Mini S status ala G-Stock quite yet, could it- certainly, but then again it could get bumped out too :)

I looked in to the Evolution AutoX School; do they frequent the great lakes region? I noticed on their website that they currently only have classes scheduled for El Toro and Ft. Myers.

As for setup, I probably will do the following by next spring (wheels, new tires, short throw, cat-back, and brake pads I would have obtained AutoX or not; I was debating between building a DS car or an increased hp street car):

Alleggerita HLT 17x7 http://forums.focaljet.com/tire-rack-tires-wheels-brakes-forum/588303-new-o-z-wheel-coming-tire-rack.html

Rubber, priority on mileage (so I can get a lot of seat time out of them) and performance. Do 235/40/17 Dunlop Z1 Stars fit that criterion?

I'll install the factory 5 speed short throw shifter.

Cat-back.

Brake pads and fluid are cheap so I'll do this right away.

Ditto on alignment. Although with the previously mentioned alignment, one preferable for autox rather than commuting, will I see faster wear on my street tires? 09 WRX will be my DD. Do you guys get alignment done before/after an event ($) or just deal with the autox alignment 24/7?

Sway bars are cheap too. How does White Line's 08 bar compare to the stock 09 I wonder? They did increase thickness by 1mm for the 09 WRX. Any thoughts?

I'll probably only hold off on the Koni's.

Next time Evo AutoX school holds an event in the Great Lakes region I will attend. Thanks for any information.

Ditto on alignment. Although with the previously mentioned alignment, one preferable for autox rather than commuting, will I see faster wear on my street tires? 09 WRX will be my DD. Do you guys get alignment done before/after an event ($) or just deal with the autox alignment 24/7?
Just drive with the autox alignment 24/7. :)

I had an alignment of -1.5 front, -1.2 rear on my former '06 WRX. Didn't notice a significant difference in tire wear. Toe can really impact tire wear severely -- so if you run 0 toe front & rear, tire wear should not be an issue.

Rubber, priority on mileage (so I can get a lot of seat time out of them) and performance. Do 235/40/17 Dunlop Z1 Stars fit that criterion?

I wouldn't expect much more than 10,000 miles out of full treads drivin' aggressively at aut0-x's. They seem to wear irregularly as well.

Performance for a street tire you will get, though.

If they're just fair weather/auto-x tires you should probably get a couple seasons out of them.

1mm pales in comparison to most aftermarket bars. I ran a 29mm front bar on the '06 and don't recommend anything else...

As was said, keep the F/R toe at 0 and wear will not be a problem. I run 0 toe and -3.5 degrees of camber and R-COMPS on my miata on the street and wear has been great (lol!)

Make sure you get an offset on those OZ wheels before you buy them. Most wheels like that get a 48 offset, which is 1mm too little to be legal for DS- unless they changed the stock offset for 08/09 (it was 55mm).

09 has +55 stock wheels...

Don't know if anyone has tried out front sway bars with the new WRX ... but probably at least the 27 mm Whiteline if not the 29.

Aren't those bars adjustable ... if so ... what is the range of adjustment. I believe there are two holes. 26 and 27 or 27 and 28 ... with the "27" bar?

Does your area do it's own AX schools ... take everyone that you can. Take advantage of your best drivers in the area ... have them drive your car and take rides with them. For me in CS, it's nice having Ryan Buetzer (National Champ in CS the last two years) doing laps with me! FINALLY starting to pay off. ;)

^ it's a different sway bar (front and rear)- the biggest front bar currently is a WL 24/26- I have one coming :)

as far as wheels go- Max is correct- 55 et. 1/4" converted to mm's is 6.35, 55 - 6.35 = 48.65mm

if I find a decent 48mm wheel, I'll have a machine shop remove .65mm

I'd also be curious to see if 55 et means 55mm on the nose, same w/ 48 et, .65mm is .03"- that not a hell of a lot IMO!

^ it's a different sway bar (front and rear)- the biggest front bar currently is a WL 24/26- I have one coming :)

as far as wheels go- Max is correct- 55 et. 1/4" converted to mm's is 6.35, 55 - 6.35 = 48.65mm

if I find a decent 48mm wheel, I'll have a machine shop remove .65mm

I'd also be curious to see if 55 et means 55mm on the nose, same w/ 48 et, .65mm is .03"- that not a hell of a lot IMO!

If we could get a precision measurement of the Subaru stock E55 offset rims, could we use that measurement, appropriately documented, instead of the 55mm stock specification? I'm not sure how that would hold up to a protest, tho. There must be some manufacturing variation on a cast wheel like the stock WRX rims, maybe as much as .65mm ?

Sure would be nice to be able to get access to those light weight 48mm offset rims. (but you can always just run 1/4" spacers ...)

- Harry

I think it would be worth doing- if it happens to be less than 55 (oh say .03" less :lol:) then I'd say we're good to go, if it's more we'll call it 55 even :)

also as an alternative removing .03" from a et 48 wheelisn't too big a deal

Harry- no 1/4" spacers- that's going the wrong way ;)

also as an alternative removing .03" from a et 48 wheelisn't too big a deal
that's a pretty good idea really. I wonder if Annie is privy to this discussion? I know she's shopping wheels this week...

that's a pretty good idea really. I wonder if Annie is privy to this discussion? I know she's shopping wheels this week...
Best bang-for-the-buck wheel out there is the 17x7" +50mm Kosei K1-TS. They are ~$199/wheel and weigh around 15.6lbs iirc.

You can get 5 wheels (i.e. one spare) for less than I paid for my RX-8's OZ Ultraleggerras ($1,300+).

With the Kosei K1 TS available cheap, light and legal, I'm not inclined to hassle with the shaving of +48 wheels :)

^ definitely a good choice- probably the lightest of all available as well :)

my DS wheel "list" looks like this (17x7)

oe 08/09 WRX wheels et 55 weight 23.2 :eek:
oe 06/07 WRX wheels et 55 weight 20.3
"UK" WRX wheels et 55 weight 18.5
Kazera et 50 weight 18.5
57Motorsport et 50 weight 18.0
Team Dynamics Pro 1.2 et 50 weight 17.6
Buddy Club P1 SF et 48 weight 16.8
BBS RK (was also a Saab 92X dealer option) et 48 weight 16.2
Subaru option BBS et 55 weight 16.1
5Zigen FNo1RC et 48 weight 15.5
OZ Superleggera et 48 weight 15.2
Kosei K1 TS et 50 weight 14.8

if anyone has any other wheels to add to the list, lmk and I'll add them :)

With the Kosei K1 TS available cheap, light and legal, I'm not inclined to hassle with the shaving of +48 wheels :)

But you'll be wearing the same thing as everyone else....

:lol:

--kC

But you'll be wearing the same thing as everyone else....

:lol:

--kC
She could paint hers pink...or gold...or bronze! :devil:

^^^ ALL of the above and slap a G-Fab decal on the hatch!!! :)

Jay

My 17x7 Kazeras (+50) weigh about 18.5lbs apiece.

OZ Alleggerita HLT 17x7" is available in upcoming months.

17x7 is 13.8 lbs! My understanding is that they can be had in a number of offsets and finishes. I've been hearing 3XX per wheel...

Another link to OZ Alleggerita HLT

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?p=233549#post233549

OZ Alleggerita HLT 17x7" is available in upcoming months.

17x7 is 13.8 lbs! My understanding is that they can be had in a number of offsets and finishes. I've been hearing 3XX per wheel...

I talked to Luke a couple of weeks ago, he was unsure what would be available in WRX fitment- I know a lot of guys clamoring for wider sizes (I know, I was one of them before I bought the 09 :))

Karen I'll add that to the list

17x7 is 13.8 lbs! My understanding is that they can be had in a number of offsets and finishes. I've been hearing 3XX per wheel...
On another forum, the ballpark price Chris Harvey (Trent@Tirerack) was mentioning was ~$325/wheel. That's right around the price of my 18x8 OZ Ultraleggeras.

Either way, a 13.8lbs 17x7" wheel is insanely light!!! :devil:

Alignment - check
Koseis - check
Hooters - check
Codriver who can't shut up - check

should be an interesting weekend... :)

Alignment - check
Koseis - check
Hooters - check
Codriver who can't shut up - check

should be an interesting weekend... :)

So your codriver is a woman?

nice- :) mine is still in break-in- only 300 miles on it :(

245/40? snap a pic or two

on another note looks like we can cross the OZ wheel off the list- Luke said no-go in 17x7

Ha! No, I have the hooters, and he talks more than most women :)

245's - looks like the 275's might hit the spring perch so we didn't even try 'em

Codriver who can't shut up - check
fast Mike?

we'll see you tomorrow... hope I can remember how to drive

fast Mike?

we'll see you tomorrow... hope I can remember how to drive

Gee, now *that* was hard to guess, eh? :D

He's had his panties all in a bunch over the car since I got it. I tried to get him and Kevin to come play against me with the Cobalt tomorrow, but Kevin's only doing Sunday...

See ya in the AM!

Alignment - check
Koseis - check
Hooters - check
Codriver who can't shut up - check

should be an interesting weekend... :)
Good luck - let us know your thoughts after your car's virgin autocross this weekend. Please post some some action shots if any are taken. :cool:

We Need Pics And Video!!!!!

He's had his panties all in a bunch over the car since I got it.
Yeah, I think I got an email from him the second he found out you bought the car. At least now maybe Beth will give me a reprieve for bailing on L1 for next year; she can just take the 135i to the west coast Pros instead of the east coast ones.

Karen

ah, but I plan to run open, not L1 :)

What are you doing next year?

Best of luck to all of you next year in DS. I will miss running with everyone but it appears I will have one last hurrah in DS in a distinctly different flavor of car from what the Crossfire was. It is white, FWD, and driven by one of the fastest drivers I have ever met. So I am set to get my butt kicked next weekend but it will be fun.:D

So your codriver is a woman?

Oh...somebody needs to go to sensitivity training! :lol:


on another note looks like we can cross the OZ wheel off the list- Luke said no-go in 17x7

Are you sure about that? The guy's from tire rack are claiming 17x7's will be the first to arrive and have a confirmed weight of 13.8 lbs! It's kind of hard for something that does not exist to have a confirmed weight...or do you mean there will be no 5-100 with Subaru happy offset?

There will probably be some 17x7's coming, but according to Luke none for the WRX :(

the weight he said is accurate and the price a little north of $300

Good Luck Annie ... I guess well have to wait for the Results to see who the lucky co-driver is. How about a link to your region's Results? :D

Good Luck Annie ... I guess well have to wait for the Results to see who the lucky co-driver is. How about a link to your region's Results? :D

Mako - you're way behind...it's Fast Mike.

What are you doing next year?
I have no idea. :( I want to build one of the three cars sitting in the driveway into an ESP car, but I need to find out how much more I'm going to be shelling out to the dentist this week before I make any final committment. And considering the finances, I might not have a choice but to build the Camaro, since to do the WRX "right" is going to cost at least 3x as much. :(

I won't drive any of them if I can't do the build "right." I am not a fan of driving a car I think is uncompetitive.

Karen

It is white, FWD, and driven by one of the fastest drivers I have ever met. So I am set to get my butt kicked next weekend but it will be fun.:D
You co-driving with the Feinburg-rocket again? G'luck!

You co-driving with the Feinburg-rocket again? G'luck!

Yup, I am all set to get schooled but it is always a great learning experience driving with him and I have to thank him for offering me a seat since I don't have a car that is competitive at the moment.

At today's event he schooled everyone on raw time but was dirty. He also told me this morning that he has never had the car aligned since he bought it and has no clue what the alignment settings are. Maybe that is one of his speed secrets?:lol:

Yup, I am all set to get schooled but it is always a great learning experience driving with him and I have to thank him for offering me a seat since I don't have a car that is competitive at the moment.

At today's event he schooled everyone on raw time but was dirty. He also told me this morning that he has never had the car aligned since he bought it and has no clue what the alignment settings are. Maybe that is one of his speed secrets?:lol:
Really?! :huh: Wow. :eek: That guy is just unreal.

I figured it was either Feinburg or Jinx -- both are stupid fast, but Feinburg especially. He almost made a case for moving the ITR to BS. If his fastest runs had been clean @ Nats, he would have trophied in BS (would have been 8th). :unamused:

Gee, now *that* was hard to guess, eh? :D

He's had his panties all in a bunch over the car since I got it. I tried to get him and Kevin to come play against me with the Cobalt tomorrow, but Kevin's only doing Sunday...

See ya in the AM!
So how did you and mid-pack-Mike do? Thoughts on the car's handling?

I must say, I saw two S2000 CR's this weekend with 275 A6's front, 295's rear, and the 275 mounted on the front 17x7" wheel didn't look as bad as I thought it would.

What are the '09 WRX DS guys looking for as far as swaybar diameters? We can make it happen. ;)

What are the '09 WRX DS guys looking for as far as swaybar diameters? We can make it happen. ;)
I used to own a DS WRX, but I have no dog in this fight currently. To help out those who might be interested though...

Which company are you with? Are we talking about a hollow or solid design?

What are the '09 WRX DS guys looking for as far as swaybar diameters? We can make it happen. ;)

there is a WL 24/26 mm available for the GH/GE- I'm thinking a 28/29-ish might be useful :)

Niles is of the "roll yer own" company. He's got the tools, knowhow and will get the material, whatever it happens to be. We've got a local sample to serve as fitment guide and guinea pig.....once the break-in period passes. It looked great on course from what I saw of it.

Jay

I'm really short on time today but the car was an absolute blast, did everything I wanted, handled really well, but did everything about 1-2 sec later than I expected (still have Max's STU car's handling in my system). So I hit EVERY cone on the course... sometimes 3 or 4 times. Oops! :)

Lots of inside wheel spin - when Des T. rode with me, he commented his car didn't do that (the '08) so a combination of the increased power with stiffer suspension induced that - hopefully a bigger bar and shocks will cure that.

Saturday was a PCA event and FastMike codrove, during timed runs I was 0.2 sec faster plus he was dirty, so 2.2 advantage to me (no, I didn't bring a skirt for him to wear!). I think I missed top PAX by 0.136 or something. But FM got me by a handful of tenths on fun runs.

DougM's wife took video of one of my Saturday runs from outside the car. Hopefully once things calm down he can post it. You will see a lot of body roll... but it still worked well!

Sunday I was just playing around, giving rides, so that's when I was super dirty (lots of people didn't have clean runs, it was just that type of course). Got lots of compliments on the car, how it handled, etc. So since I was playing and having fun and showing off, I was a bit off FastMike and Kevin in the Slowbalt. Not horribly so, though...

At the end of the day FastMike went and changed my tires when I was doing my work assignment. Anyone that knows him knows he doesn't even usually change his own tires, he gets his codrivers to do it! I think he wants to drive my car next year... :)

DougM's wife took video of one of my Saturday runs from outside the car. Hopefully once things calm down he can post it. You will see a lot of body roll... but it still worked well!I'll try and get that posted up tonight, along with a few fotos maybe.

Doug

:lol: It almost sounds like you're thinking of keeping it, Annie!!!:banana::banana: I think he wants to drive my car next year... :)

Jay

there is a WL 24/26 mm available for the GH/GE- I'm thinking a 28/29-ish might be useful :)

I was going to start with 29, hopefully this weekend, and go from there. Hollow, solid, multi-hole adjustable, modular, blade adjust.... Been there, done that, bought more DOT-R's with the proceeds. ;)

With the '06s they'll lift a rear with the stock bar....with the 29mm front I started to get front inside wheelspin issues, but only out of really tight stuff.

The lever arm on 08+ cars is longer than on the GD. So the 29 on an 08+ is more like a 27 on a GD. I'll have to crunch the numbers when I actually play with a car and get the measurements but I'm thinking somewhere around 29-31 would be good for most anything but concrete. :)

I know when my STi lifts the inside rear I can't put any power down until it falls, does the WRX do the same thing?

I know when my STi lifts the inside rear I can't put any power down until it falls, does the WRX do the same thing?
Yes. That's one thing I really noticed when I drove my WRX on some of the postage stamp lots my local SCCA region uses.

Better break out a good size for concrete -- looks like we're headed to Lincoln, NE next year.

:lol: It almost sounds like you're thinking of keeping it, Annie!!!:banana::banana:

Jay

As of today, YES! :) But many, many, many people have heard *that* before! :lol:

I need to break a record again - went from the longest ownership since my first '98 Type R with the '07 STI I had (1 yr, 9 months) to the shortest ownership (29 days for the Z06) to this. If I had a codriver I'd *have* to keep it for a while!

People are still amazed I have my orange Boxster S still, it's been a year for that car now too!

As of today, YES! :) But many, many, many people have heard *that* before! :lol:

I need to break a record again - went from the longest ownership since my first '98 Type R with the '07 STI I had (1 yr, 9 months) to the shortest ownership (29 days for the Z06) to this. If I had a codriver I'd *have* to keep it for a while!

People are still amazed I have my orange Boxster S still, it's been a year for that car now too!
Annie, what size tires did you go with on the car? Were they new or used?

DougM, got any pics for us? :D

Well, I was trying some unique things with tires, thanks to Greg Fordahl's advice/direction, which I want to keep low-key for now (can't give *all* my secrets away!) - that's why FastMike wouldn't tell you on SCCAForums :)

I can tell you it worked very well for me, I certainly liked the car! But that was one site, one weekend, etc... I want to do more testing.

I will say I *don't* think the 275 Hoosiers would fit (not a wheel issue, but we think it would likely hit the spring perches in the front). If no one beats me to it, at some point this winter I'll test fit them, though, just to see.

Annie

Better break out a good size for concrete -- looks like we're headed to Lincoln, NE next year.

When I did the '08 STi bars I saw there was alot of room under there and the control arm tab was a bit beefier than the 04-07 sti. I'm hoping the WRX front subframe is the same or similar, because it will readily fit a LOT of swaybar.

Well, I was trying some unique things with tires, thanks to Greg Fordahl's advice/direction, which I want to keep low-key for now (can't give *all* my secrets away!) - that's why FastMike wouldn't tell you on SCCAForums :)

I can tell you it worked very well for me, I certainly liked the car! But that was one site, one weekend, etc... I want to do more testing.

I will say I *don't* think the 275 Hoosiers would fit (not a wheel issue, but we think it would likely hit the spring perches in the front). If no one beats me to it, at some point this winter I'll test fit them, though, just to see.

Annie
Thanks Annie. One question - did you try A6's or V710's?
When I did the '08 STi bars I saw there was alot of room under there and the control arm tab was a bit beefier than the 04-07 sti. I'm hoping the WRX front subframe is the same or similar, because it will readily fit a LOT of swaybar.
That's good to know. This sounds promising...

Annie said Hooser's earlier

huh ... no she didn't, she said Hooters ?! :huh:

It was not a standard setup, that's all I'm gonna say for now - can't a girl keep ONE secret? :)

Oh, and Niles, let me know what you find out - I want a big fat bar :)

I remember at one point when I had my S2000's the description I loved was "a front bar the size of a small tree" - I need one! :D

Annie- sounds very promising for the first outing :)

Niles- you have my email

here's Annie's video, it seems to only be available in low-res right now, check back in a bit and maybe the hi-res will be done processing.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_ekwk6DbdM

http://lh3.ggpht.com/dmikko/SP5YEma-FZI/AAAAAAAABjw/weTrHJsEWpQ/s400/photo1.jpg

http://lh5.ggpht.com/dmikko/SP5YGEsifQI/AAAAAAAABj4/QI-DKz1i96I/s400/photo.jpg

Thanks for posting those Doug. Were any action photos taken during the event?

no, no action shots from us
results from Sunday's event are here though:
http://www.wwscc.org/event_results/2008/scca-08.html
if you remove Annie's cone penalties she looks to have averaged about a ~47.2 in the afternoon, PAX'd at ~38.3. At the end of the results page are all the top times and the PAX'd results (the PAX list includes your adjusted score only if you ran in a PAX'd class, which Annie didn't, nor did I in the afternoon). Not a bad showing (minus the cone carnage that is :) )

Wow, that is WAAAYYYY less body roll than the 08's.

Wow, that is WAAAYYYY less body roll than the 08's.
+1 I can't wait to see how the car performs after Annie gets shocks and a big FSB.

Looks like very minor differences (if any) between the STi and WRX in the front sub frame department. I had 34mm bar lying around and it fit through without rubbing on anything.
I tossed a 29mm on the '09 that's in my driveway. This is the first time I've gotten to play with one. Initial thoughts are "my cereal bowl is larger than the compressor on that turbo" and "the back end seems to follow along, I bet I could slalomn at a million miles per hour in this thing."
29 cut the roll pretty well on the dunlops. The guy who owns this car is planning on 225 or 245 nitto's as streetable r-comps for autox so I'm thinking this will be all he needs. *sigh* time for more testing.
Random pic (http://filer.case.edu/nrp6/09wrx29.JPG)

Storm it's Jim B's car.

Niles- bar looks great :)

figured I'd post up this pic of a recent stock 09 dyno run - the torque looks very impressive

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j304/BIGSKYWRX/Bensdyno.jpg

I hope to be able to ground truth the dynograph w/ one of my own (will also be on a dynojet)

I'm going to do a couple of base runs and then bolt these on and see if there is any bump at all

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j304/BIGSKYWRX/cobbcatback.jpg

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j304/BIGSKYWRX/cosworthfilter.jpg

250 wtq stock? holy craptestical

What's an STI look like on that dyno?

250 wtq stock? holy craptestical
I think in the original thread, someone mentioned that the intercooler heat-soaked pretty quickly on the dyno.

Peak numbers were 230whp and 272wtq for the 1st run only. Seemed to hang around 215whp and 250wtq once heat soaked.

Either way, very impressive numbers. Anyone know what the 135i dynos at? I swear I saw numbers around 270whp & 270wtq????

What's an STI look like on that dyno?

here's a 04 STi w/ full exhaust, GN solenoid and fully tuned :)

http://mnsubaru.com/forums/showpost.php?p=544228&postcount=245