i am about to buy my aspen white WRX but why do i keep reading threads on people crashing. I know they are safe cars but so what i dont want a car that is going to crash. I know im a good driver but so are these other people that keep crashing thare cars. does anybody have an explanation on all these wrecked WRX's?

The WRX is a car that every teenager wants. Some are spoiled brats, and their daddy buys it for them. Some are a little older and they pay for it themselves. Regardless, it is not a good first car for a relatively new driver. At 16 no one has enough driving experience to have developed the kind of reflexes and driving skill to avoid accidents when driving fast. Also they may not have developed the maturity to resist the urge to drive too fast for the situation. So that that is one reason.

Another reason which goes along with the first, is that the WRX begs you to drive it fast. There is something about the way the power builds as the RPMs climb that makes you want to drive it fast.

A third reason is that the RE92 tires cannot handle speed as well as the chasis and suspension. The WRX feels like it can handle more speed untill the the tires just suddenly give out.

what tires should i put on it so i dont wreck?

1st problem: "I am a good driver."

Sure ya are buddy. Step 1 to not crashing: driving school.

2nd problem: "What tires should I get so I don't crash?"

No matter what kind of tires you have, if you can't control the car, you are gonna crash. Step 2 to not crashing: practice. Go to driving school, then go to huge empty parking lots and practice what you learned. If you know how your car reacts, and know the limits of your car, you have less of a chance of crashing.

IAn

I can drive fine i dont need to go to driving school but i have heard to tires on the car stock are pritty ****ty and aomeone else said the car can handle more than the stock tires can handle and that is maybe why people are getting into wrecks so what tires would you use.

Every single car on the road can outhandle its tires. Trust me, go to one driving school and you will realize you have no idea what your car can do.

IAn

How much does it cost? and how do i find out about them?:confused:

They seem to come in clumps :lol:

I hadnt seen any posts about WRX wrecks for a couple weeks, until yesterday when like 4 poped up :p

Originally posted by WRXobsessed
I know they are safe cars but so what i dont want a car that is going to crash.
:lol:
Since when do cars drive themselves?!:lol:
The car doesn't crash the car, the driver does. A car is a colection of rubber, plastic, sheetmetal, aluminum, and other metals. A car does not just choose to crash on it's own, it all depends on physics and the driver. If the driver understands the physics involved in driving an automobile, then he will not crash.
If you don't understand that, you shouldn't be driving!

Like the others are saying, you don't need better tires really. The reason so many people wipe out is that they push the car past its handling limmits. You could get better tires, and still go that much faster to push past the new tire's limmits. Most direct answer for your orginal question is simply - people drive the WRX too fast too often. Don't be that guy and you'll be fine.

Heres a good example of why. Right now there is a guy in the Newbie Forum asking how to do 180s and 360s on public streets. He said he sometimes ended up in peoples front yards. Cripes!

Reality check here...

If you obey the speed limits and the limits of your driving ability, then any car is a safe car. If you abuse either of these, then any car can be an unsafe car. Use your head and don't drive like an a**. It's that simple.

Mike D.

P.S. Tracks are for racing and that's where it should stay.

Yeah man,

THe problem isn't the car as much as it is the crazy kids. The stock tires may be inadequate for track use, but they are by no means dangerous to use in normal driving (and spirited driving). I think people tend to think that ABS+AWD="Do what the heck I feel like and I'll be ok." Well that's just not true. Drive the car sensibly (I go fast at times, but there's usually nobody around and I'm far from immovable objects such as trees and guard rails) and it will give you years of enjoyment. It's easy to get caught up in the hype of the car, but A LOT of guys on this list use their WRX as a tuner/auto-x car and drive another car daily. Po' people like myself :lol: have this as their only car and can't take chances.

Keep the rubber side down!

Originally posted by WRXobsessed
what tires should i put on it so i dont wreck?

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Maybe giant inflatable tubes?

Driving schools? There are lots, just search on Yahoo! or Google or something. This is one I have taken though: www.gorally.com
The instructors are great, the cars are great, and the courses are great. I recommend it with 5 and a half thumbs up (out of two).

IAn

the stock tires aren't that bad...ask the guys on the RMIC forum who wondered how i could keep up in the canyons on stock rims. learn to drive the car, become one with the car...:D

but seriously....if you know the limits of the car and don't push past them, the car won't go careening into ditches and running into trees.

cars don't crash....drivers do. :rolleyes:

and dangit! they closed that thread about the moron doing 360s. i wanted to lay into him for that one :devil:

you guys have been a big help. So have any of you actually taken advanced driving courses if so how much did it really help you and did it cost alot of money?

my driving school consists of BIG empty parking lots...
some lines in my mind on what I want to do...
once you learn what not to do at 60+ is makes you understand what the car CAN do (yes this is hard on tires)
If the cops give you a hard time ask them if they would like a ride... and ask them if they would rather do it ON the street.
try not to be anywhere near other peoples homes though.
the thing I have noticed is that under hard braking in a turn the rear end does become squirley like people say...:devil:

Originally posted by DjRez4
the stock tires aren't that bad...

... until you drive the car with a set of real tires on it, then you realise just how bad they really are. :lol:
Of coarse they are no excuse for crashes, you just adjust to the lower limit of grip they provide.

I did the proformance class up here at SIR (like the one coming up soon all you NW i-clubbers!), and it was a real great experience.. you learn how your inputs affect the balance of the car and how to maintain the balance of the car so as to maintain control.. its a whole different kind of driving.. up here it was approx $350, your mileage may vary. It doesnt matter whether you are driving an L or a souped up WRX, driver input determines whether you will crash or not.

Originally posted by WRXobsessed
you guys have been a big help. So have any of you actually taken advanced driving courses if so how much did it really help you and did it cost alot of money?

thanks alot
and yea that was a stupid thing to say that the tires would make you crash but anyways better tires could help out though cant they?

The WRX is an awesome car - fast and sure-footed.

IMHO, there are a couple of differences between it and most every other car I have driven.

1. Do not do a "drag" brake turn. Make sure you slow down enough at the start of a turn - do not drag the brake - then coast through to the 1/2 waypoint and accelerate. The imprezza has a tendency for the rear end to swing out if you "drag" brake. IF you do find your car rear starting to slide out - hit the gas, the rear will then line up with the front - it's not obvious, but it really works.

2. It is a little hard to shift - you just have to take it easy until you learn exactly where to put the gears.

So if you don't speed excessively and don't "drag" brake then life will be good while you learn the feel of the car. If you replace the stock tires with something else (I just did this) you have to spend $$ "rebalancing" the suspension because the body roll is significantly worse with stickier tires.

GOOD LUCK!

WRX posted "So have any of you actually taken advanced driving courses if so how much did it really help you and did it cost alot of money?"

I'm sure I'm above the curve for driving courses (Perk of my job) But yes, they do help, no doubt. Even books help. Maybe someone on the list can think of the books name, it has received lots of paise from the car mags the last 6 months or so. I can not for the life of me remember it. I tried a search, but nothing rang a bell. So I'll list some driving schools and approximate prices (Most have lessons from 1 day to a week of instruction)

Skip Barber-Get to drive Dodges from a Neon to Dakota and Viper. High Performance driving-Getting the most from a car. Good school, around $1,500. Realise all the courses I took were for max duration.

Bobby Ore stunt car driving-Hehehehe, do 360 degree controlled spins at 60 mph. Not real useful everyday, but sure is fun. $3,000

Crisis Response International Counter-Terrorism Training School-Want to lose a tail or just plain get oout of trouble, this is the place. About $5,000

Bob Bondurant-Get to drive Fords. Much like Skip Barber, only with Fords. $1,500

Top Dragster Driving Experience-Drive top fuel dragsters and get the a license. $2,000 plus a professional drag racer must sign off on your approval for the license.

Bridgestone Winter Driving School-Winter driving techniques, excellent if you live in a location with winter. $800.

I've been through several more, but these are the larger ones (Ones with websites and sometimes courses all around the US) The prices I listed are high, because I took the full lessons, shorter lessons are cheaper. Starting at around $500 for a day. If you don't think alot can be learned in a day, you'd be wrong. I highly recommend driving schools. There is NO subsitute. Take winter driving first if you live in an area with snow. (Going fast around a track is great, but I'd rather you don't hit me on the open road) High Performance schools are great. People spend $1,000's of dollars making their car go quicker around a track, but for about $500 of instruction, they'd go quicker. My 2 cents

Neil

Originally posted by Rev
The WRX is a car that every teenager wants. Some are spoiled brats, and their daddy buys it for them. Some are a little older and they pay for it themselves. Regardless, it is not a good first car for a relatively new driver. At 16 no one has enough driving experience to have developed the kind of reflexes and driving skill to avoid accidents when driving fast. Also they may not have developed the maturity to resist the urge to drive too fast for the situation. So that that is one reason.

Another reason which goes along with the first, is that the WRX begs you to drive it fast. There is something about the way the power builds as the RPMs climb that makes you want to drive it fast.

A third reason is that the RE92 tires cannot handle speed as well as the chasis and suspension. The WRX feels like it can handle more speed untill the the tires just suddenly give out.

The WRX is the car that every teenager wants??? Erm I think not... at least from what I can tell.... people think my car is gay because its 4 door and they dont know what it is... they dont know its turbo charged they think this.... 4 door, subaru.. I think the main car that every teenager wants in a Supra... I dont know why thats just what it seems to me.. Since iH ave been driving my car there has been few people that have known what it is.... sides the other subie owners I see, maybe its just my area. I dunno... I agree with your 2nd reason.... I am 16 and I drive a WRX, I have been threw a driving school , I feel that I can drive the car pretty well, and I admit from time to time I do push, he dosen't? Your 3rd reason I can agree with alot... not gonna tell the story cos its in another thread... but those tires do suck.... anywho... like most people said.... some people just dont know how to drive.. and a lot of the accidents seem to be other peoples faults and not the people driving the WRX's... the WRX is a safe care if you drive it safely and responsible... least thats way I see it

Here is my view on this. The WRX is a very high performance car and must be respected. It's kind of like a motorcycle, you can get in over your head very easily and not realize you have a problem until it's too late.
The WRX is also the first car I've owned that felt like it would be very easy to crash. The stock tires scared me. The chassis feels very solid, but approach a corner with even moderate speed and instead of turning in, you get howling complaints from the front tires. You can get the car to rotate by careful use of the throttle (lift throttle oversteer), but the tires just are not up to the high performance demands of the car. They may work OK at slower speeds or in the snow, but I did not feel comfortable doing any sort of sporty driving with the stock tires. Needless to say I replaced them after 1600 miles with Yokohama AVS Intermediates (old tire now, but used to be one of the best). Much beter. The car turns when you ask it to without screams of mercy from the tires.

Steve
(I used to miss my Porsche before I got the WRX)

Originally posted by Sordid Philosopher


1. Do not do a "drag" brake turn. Make sure you slow down enough at the start of a turn - do not drag the brake - then coast through to the 1/2 waypoint and accelerate . . .

. . .So if you don't speed excessively and don't "drag" brake then life will be good while you learn the feel of the car


Braking and turning don't mix on the track in ANY car. Brake and downshift while going striaght towards the corner, lift brake, steer, apply light throttle (don't coast) to balance out the suspension, accelerate just before the apex. This has been told to me by many guys I know who came from skip barber and other schools. I also learned this myself through readings.

Originally posted by mtb_dude
Braking and turning don't mix on the track in ANY car.

So all you people out there trail braking better stop now.... ;)

And the funny thing is, I've had the stock tires on my car for about 9k miles and I've found them to be fairly decent acutally. They make a lot of noise though, but when they do start to break loose, it's surprisingly progressive. Usually the outside front wheel starts to slowly surrender towards the apex. I am getting Falkin Azenis Sport though with 17:" Subzeros :devil: so I wouldn't say the stockers are THAT good.

People who think this car is dangerous have obviously never driven a 911 or a Viper. Cutting the throttle in an aggressive turn in either of these cars leads to instant nasty spinning. The WRX is no honda/mitsu plow-through-the-turn front drive POS!

Hey driving schools, track days and driving events are about the most fun thing you can do with your clothes on. Heck its better than a lot of things I did w/o clothes in my college days:lol:

If a formal school is financially off-putting, try to find a club that hosts track day/driving events with instructors in your area. You can contact Willow Springs or Buttonwillow raceways and see what clubs are hosting events, and contact them. I personally would recommend Aaron Tachibana's events (Miata Performance Drivers Club), Tracquest (Todd Serrota), or Donutz Motorsports. I hear that NASA has very well run HPDE events in SoCal, so you might look at their schedule.

I'm a fan of getting personal instruction in your own car, as car dynamics vary. One also tends to take it easier on the track if their ride has to get them home too....

I was lucky enough to get Gary Sheehan as an instuctor at a few events many years ago, when he was still a kid, and the experience made me a far faster, smoother, and safer driver than any modification I have ever performed.

Originally posted by Kevin


So all you people out there trail braking better stop now.... ;)

Oh no! I have been using trail braking for about 6 months now! I better stop, since it is so dangerous!:lol: :lol: :lol:

Trail braking is NOT dangerous with proper training. Since my car is FWD, I need it in tight turns to make sure the front wheels don't lose grip. A little tail-out action is fun, and sometimes a good tactic to use in tight turns. The differnce between no-trailing and brake trailing is night and day, a good driver can take any car and make it handle beautifully.

I'm surprised that nobody has mentioned this yet, so I will.

Subaru buys a one-year SCCA membership for every WRX purchaser. Get out there and use it. Most relatively large cities have Solo II (Autocross) events within a few hours driving every month. It;s the perfect environment for:

1) Figuring out what the car will and will not do. (Yes, you can spin a WRX at low speeds. I've done it)
2) Learning what the difference between over- and under-steer is and how it makes the car handle. Lift-throttle oversteer is real, and many first-timers experience it on an autocross course-- without any damage except to ego.
3) Learning that no matter how good a driver you think you are, you still have MUCH to learn about performance driving.

All this is done in such a way as to minimize your risk of hurting yourself or your car. Also, most regions with active Solo II action offer driving schools, either with experienced soloists as instructors, or through Evolution. In the Denver area, the drivers' schools and autocross on the following day run about $65. Cheap thrills, compared with stuffing a guardrail in Golden Gate Canyon.

-jds

Is it just me or do all the young (20 yrs. old or less) WRX drivers scare you? I read these idiot posts about "I wanted to try drifting at Gran Turismo speeds, crashed my WRX at 120mph" and "how do I do 360s in the street" and I just shudder.

Then I see rebuttals coming from younger drivers who claim that they do not speed or drive aggressively...they don't fit the "stereotype"...they are "responsible drivers" in their own words. They claim "I'm responsible, I drive perfectly fine, I don't speed too much so there is no reason I need driving school." This scares me too (reminds me a bit of the nation of Ralph Wiggums article...inflated and undeserved feeling of self-esteem, or in this case, driving skill).

Even if you are a "responsible" young driver who doesn't do the TFATF crap, YOU STILL HAVE MINISCULE DRIVING EXPERIENCE. Learn from those who have come before you and survived to tell the tale.

Yes, you need instruction.
Yes, you need seat-time.
Yes, you need to figure out how to handle the car when a dicey situation arises.

You can't get this experience driving to freaking highschool in the morning. Take a school, or do some auto-xing if you want to really learn.