Has anyone thought about putting an STi motor in there car, when ever it comes out, im seriously debating it.

oh im talking about the 2.5 T motor

Jiffy:)

gonna need some bling bling

you'd be better off importing a jdm 2.0l sti engine from a wreck...

oh on a side not to jiffy, i don't need an sti engine, i have a 3.3l H6 :disco:

I'd love to have a 2.5 turbo engine from the factory. I'm taking donations:lol:

i know people have the six speed tranny in their gc8. But i don't think anyone has had the chance to get the genuine engine or harness over here in theirs yet. I'm sure mechincally it all bolts in no problem, but the harness might be a bit tuff...

I'm gunning for the turbo forester engine. Gonna be cheaper, but basically the same engine :)

The 2.5T is what I'm aiming for, though I have NO idea what part costs would be (assuming 3 years or so down the road) nor where to source a North American drivetrain.

I have a source! (recycler yard :p )

I've got the whole STI RA Version IV in my 98 RS and I think it will keep up with the new one......I've researched the 6 Speed for mine and what I've found is that it's real heavy almost as heavy as a Automatic Tranny plus there still hard to come by especially since the 6 speed didn't come out until 2001 for the GC8..So cost is around 6000.00......Ron

I'd love to do the '04 EJ25-T if I had the money. :D But Kostamojen's got a good point, in the Forester XT engine.

A really good point, especially for we GC guys. :) The car's significantly lighter than the new-bodystyle Impreza is, so really it'd be like scoring yourself a really sweet, almost-new GC-EJ20-T, but with an extra half-liter of displacement. :D


(Plus, I mean 300hp is nice, but talk about askin' for trouble!! That and you'd probably have to go for the huge brakes... with the Forester XT setup I think the old-school 4-pot (f), 2-pot (r) STi brakes would suffice...)

-S2-

Originally posted by Kostamojen
I'm gunning for the turbo forester engine. Gonna be cheaper, but basically the same engine :)

Somehow I doubt its basically the same engine. The internals will most like be very different. don't forget that the STi has the forged pistons, rods, etc. etc. and is semi-closed deck. The forester engine is tuned to around what, 170 hp? the potential is there but i doubt you could reliably go to the STi's power levels without swapping in some parts.

Its like saying the WRX engine is basically the same as the current STi. Lots of differences there in very important places.

Still I'm curious to see what folks will do with the Forester.

Forrester turbo is most likely what he meant

Turbo Forester is also what he said.


Arnie, look up the Forester XT. Brand new, coming out this summer sometime, if not sooner. Turbocharged just like the STi with an EJ25-T, but tuned to less horsepower.

Your one point about the tuned internals of the STi vs. the Forester may still hold true, though. Though I assume the new XT will still be very formidable, if not as technologically advanced.

-S2-

I know he was talking about the Turbo version. I was just going off the current turbo 2.0 version Forester that has around 170 hp. Too lazy to check the new spec, ;) what's the hp looking like?

Its cool that they turboed the 2.5. good potential there. just wanting to emphasize the ubiquitous long term reliabilty arguement as well as the potential oversimplification of saying that its "just a detuned STi motor". many have said the same about the our WRX motor, that its just a detuned STi motor. Well its not. Not even close. dont' mean to flame, but we've seen how Subaru parcels out its good parts, and on what motors and its a bit shortsighted and oversimplified to say its turboed like the STi, just detuned.

Basically I just don't want folks who aren't familiar with Subaru's engines to think they are getting an STi motor for cheap in the new Forester. it will most likely have a different engine code to go along with the different internals.

Arnie, do your homework :p

USDM Forester XT engine = EJ25 with AVCS, drive-by-wire throttle, Semi-closed block, same internals as the STI exept perhaps the fancy valves. BUT a smaller turbo, smaller intercooler, different intake manifold, different (more conservitive) exhaust piping, and probably different injectors and ECU programing.

Rating: 210hp @ 5,500rpms and 235lbs torque @3,500rpms (Note the large torque number)

Originally posted by Kostamojen
Arnie, do your homework :p

USDM Forester XT engine = EJ25 with AVCS, drive-by-wire throttle, Semi-closed block, same internals as the STI exept perhaps the fancy valves. BUT a smaller turbo, smaller intercooler, different intake manifold, different (more conservitive) exhaust piping, and probably different injectors and ECU programing.

Rating: 210hp @ 5,500rpms and 235lbs torque @3,500rpms (Note the large torque number)

D'OH!!! :D Thanks for the heads up.

Hey that sounds rockin'! What is the point of the WRX motor then?! I can see all these mom's in tuned Foresters blowing away WRX's! Unfortunately we probably won't see as many wrecked Foresters as WRX's.

Yes, this sounds like a great engine swap for you Kostamojen. so add STi intercooler and turbo, exhaust and ECUTEK...hmmmm. Call up Chris and Bill and have them buy a Forester shop manual ASAP. You will have the torque monster!

Exactly....
These engines will start to become even more comon place when the Baja turbo and Legacy turbo gets them as well, albiet it differently tuned flavors :devil:

An engine swap is still waaaaaaaaaaay down the line for me... Like way way far away :(

man, what is up with the car market at the moment? so many ineresting cars available in the u.s.! don't worry kostamojen, baic will set up a fund for you sooner or later!

Originally posted by grnlantern1
I've got the whole STI RA Version IV in my 98 RS and I think it will keep up with the new one......I've researched the 6 Speed for mine and what I've found is that it's real heavy almost as heavy as a Automatic Tranny plus there still hard to come by especially since the 6 speed didn't come out until 2001 for the GC8..So cost is around 6000.00......Ron

I don't think there was ever a 6 speed made for the GC8, but please correct me if I'm wrong. :)

no 6speed for gc8, but the 6speed did come out in 2001. However MY02 in the US is equivalent to MY01 everywhere else. so thats where the confusion lies.

Interesting brainstorm.

After a year or so, would it be plausible to think that an EJ25-T from a Forester might be cheaper than an imported EJ20-T, because of the lack of need for transport?

I mean, a big part of the prices people paid for WRX and STi swaps came from shipping charges, so, to me it seems that since these will now be domestic, they might be a good deal, after the hype dies down a bit...

-Chris

Theoretically you might be right. But ultimately it will depend on engine availability and the mileage on it. The motors were pretty plentiful in Japan, hence all these STi motors for $1500 or so. In the US you were looking at $4000 for a low mileage WRX motor. Without shipping! I haven't looked into it in awhile so maybe the prices have come down a bit. The biggest advantage the US motors will have is the 50 state legality of installing it into an older car. With the JDM motors you could only do the swap in a few states that had pretty relaxed emissions laws.

It will probably be a couple of years before we are seeing a $1500 STi 2.5l motor for sale here.

low mileage wrx motors have dropped in price considerably. Much lower than $4k

That's cool. I wish I still had my RS, would definitely have done the swap. We're thinking of getting a car for my wife and an old OBS with a WRX engine swap looks pretty interesting. If we could get it all said and done for under 10k, that would be great.

used OBS - ca. $2-3k

WRX engine - ca. $2K-3k

install at i-Speed - ca. $3-4k

Misc. toys - $2k

total - ca. $9-12K


Time to start looking around, methinks!

ah comeon arnie, do you really need ispeed? i'm about to do the swap myself at the end of June with the help of others of course. but really there are plenty of subaru people with enough knowledge willing to help for free. You should just buy an STI motor for yourself and put the wrx engine into the wife's car. :D

Dan, you are certainly correct but I think I will work up to doing that. At the least I have one working car and I wouldn't need the project car to get around. Right now I'm going to see if I can tackle installing a new clutch in my sister's Festiva. That is my current project car. If I get through that then I'll consider moving up to something more complicated!

Let me know when you get into the meat of your install, I'd like to come check it out and learn a thing or two. Do you have all the shop manuals for your car and the donor engine? What engine are you going to use? Details please!

well i'm gonna do the mechanical part without the manuals, because thats pretty self explanatory, but a guy in canada is helping me with the wiring over the phone. he has a method of doing it thats much simpler than Ispeed's. I'm gonna be using either an 02 or 03 wrx motor.

For clarification:
If you had the conversion parts, our labor for install is about $2500
If you were located elsewhere and just needed a loom made (from your WRX loom)...~$850.
Good luck with your projects:)
Chris

Hey Chris! Thanks for the info. Nice to know the price for people's install options.

oh....so NOW you are making looms? :D

what exactly do these looms do? plug n play install? or do i still need to do basic wiring.

We use the WRX loom (which is provided by the customer), tear it down to what you need for your conversion, and provide some detail as to what goes where.
Yes, you will still need to solder.
Chris

so what would i need to provide you with? engine harness and chassis harness? and whats the turn around time.

Hmm, okay.

How about this... I know that converting, say, my engine into a turbo unit wouldn't be the same (nor anywhere close) as an STi or even a Forester XT powerplant. But.... done properly, what would the cost come to?

If I truly went turbo, instinct tells me to swap engines. I'll probably keep my car NA (like Cobb Stage 2 or so) when I have the money for engine work, but just for comparison's sake....

I know RS-T engines are a lot of work, so this is why I ask.

:)

I'm wondering since the STi has more electronics in the engine than normal NA engines, if the swap would be unusually difficult. How about getting the drive-by-wire to work in our cars? And if we only have a 5 speed, and the STi has a 6 speed, would there be a conflict? Is the ECU tied to the gearbox at all on the STi? Does the ECU look for info from the DCCD?

curious.

Siper2- check out http://www.i-speedusa.com/home/

They have an Excel Spreadsheet between RS - RS-T Setup vs. RS - WRX Setup. Very informative. Gives you a good idea what to expect. Its in the Motorswap section.

Steve- the point about drive by wire is a very good one. the USDM STi looks a bit more complicated, esp. with the DCCD, etc. compared to the WRX as far as electronics go. Even swapping brakes looks challenging with the new brake system they have on there. doesn't exaclty look plug and play!

The fly-by-wire throttle is mounted on the throttle itself. The wiring is relatively the same through-out. I should know over the next week ;) At least the bright side is that you can swap the whole harness since its LHD. I just hope the Sti does not get the immobilizer like the Euro cars do.

The brakes are the same bolt pattern as the Subaru 4-pots on the front, so its a bolt on aside from the larger rotor. The rear is simular as the Subaru 2-pots exept the backing plate and rotor is larger.

As for the 6 Speed Tranny question yes they did make a 6 Speed for the GC8 it was in the Version 6 and that was the only year which was 2001......Ron

i don't think so. where did you find that info?

I'm pretty sure there was no 6speed in a GC8. And 2001 was the new body style. MY00 was the Ver. 6, not MY01. :)

yah. i already explained the confusion, that MY01 for everybody but the USA is the newage wrx.

Straight from my Good Japanese Source....I actually test drove one last year when I was over there......

grnlantern1
Straight from my Good Japanese Source....I actually test drove one last year when I was over there......

Erm, I'm fairly sure that was a modded version 6. I checked numerous sites including saves of the old Subaru Japan website and my Hyper Rev Impreza STi Perfect Guide, and all state a 5 speed. Heck, if you want, I'll give you the darn ratios. If the version 6 did have the 6 speed tranny, it would have also been in the S201.

They didn't have a 6speed, I think there's some confusion here.

If you have any questions, pm me. I am doing mine right now.

bump

Jiffy:)