Has anyone else had this problem?

I had installed the full turboback and the tip doesn't go out past the bumper.

Today at the race track + TurboXS turbo back = melted bumper.

Has anyone added a steel plate to protect the plastic at all?

Also when I downshift hard, about a foot and a half flame comes out.

Thanks

Rob

i just put mine on a couple hundred miles ago. no black residue yet. hopefully i won't experience the same problem, but if there is a metal plate made where can i get one?

Scott (Supra98) has the RFL muffler and after a few sessions at NHIS his bumper too was melting.

if someone w/ some metal skills could make a piece to fit in the half circle about the muffler i'd be happy to pay someone. i could probably do it myself, but if someone has some experience and could mold a piece of metal that will withstand the heat i'd really appreciate it. ~nick

I would think the manufacturer would be responsible for repair costs, if you installed it correctly.

Montreal STi

Failing that, could you just use some of the flexible insulator, such as commonly found in the engine bay of many cars? Remember what you had in your M3, that silver insulating blanket above the headers?

yup... meltorama

Originally posted by MontrealSTi
Has anyone else had this problem?

I had installed the full turboback and the tip doesn't go out past the bumper.

Today at the race track + TurboXS turbo back = melted bumper.

Has anyone added a steel plate to protect the plastic at all?

Also when I downshift hard, about a foot and a half flame comes out.

Thanks

Rob

Rob -

So sorry to hear about your damaged bumper. Hope you will be able to repair it nicely.

Perhaps it is my thick skull, but this still doesn't sway me away from my consideration for a TXS exhaust upgrade. :eek:

If you don't mind me asking... Where can I get TXS kits (TBE / TB Stealth) and get them installed professionally here in Canada??

Thanks,

-Rich

you, my friend should get this http://subydude.com/parts/details.php?8

Originally posted by STi Boy
you, my friend should get this http://subydude.com/parts/details.php?8

is there something out there that doesn't come over to the back of the bumper? also, maybe it's just me, but i don't feel a little piece of metal is worth $105. :eek:

That is the concept of what I am looking for but not exactly that look. That piece looks pretty awful.

Originally posted by MontrealSTi
That is the concept of what I am looking for but not exactly that look. That piece looks pretty awful.

so what can we do? i don't think that looks too bad, i was just looking for something more hidden. we need or someone needs to make something. i really don't need to have my bumper melted. MontrealSTi, see what u can do and i'll do the same. i may try and devise my own, but i don't have any experience w/ metals. someone please help!!!! :)

How about this? (http://www.rodneydickman.com/n112.html)

japanparts has the same one as subydude for $51.17 before shipping. http://164.46.112.185/SubaruParts/ImprezaGDGG/Aero.htm

Actually I met a guy at the racetrack who is a machinist and he told me he could make me something custom made for a good price in high quality stainless.

If anyone else sees a good product let me know, on my end I will see what I can do with this custom piece. If it's good maybe I can get it mass produced for other STi'ers out there

Rob

Originally posted by MontrealSTi
Actually I met a guy at the racetrack who is a machinist and he told me he could make me something custom made for a good price in high quality stainless.

If anyone else sees a good product let me know, on my end I will see what I can do with this custom piece. If it's good maybe I can get it mass produced for other STi'ers out there

Rob

rob, that would be awesome. see what u can find out and let me/us know. ~nick

I was thinking something along the lines of this might be useful.

I'm not sure that a fixed metal guard will work because it will absorb heat, not reflect it, and get just as hot, conducting that heat to the bumper it's attached to.


Insulator (http://www.alamomotorsports.com/thermotec/coolitmat.html)

This link also has a number of insulators, heat blankets, heat shields, etc:

more here (http://www.essexparts.com/CatalogPDF/Essex_86-87~Exhaust_Thermal.pdf)

i don't think it will look so great wrapping the tip of my muffler w/ some material. the rest of the exaust fine, but the tip is the problem and wrapping it just doesn't seem to be a great solution.

Well given the choice between something that may not look great and a melted bumper, I'd probably pick the first. At least it's a cheap fix until a better solution is found. Also, it may be possible just stick some insulating mat on the bumper rather than the exhaust.

Other option might be if the exhaust tip (I have not seen it) had both an inner and outer piece, that way the outer piece could actually be insulated from the inner one, reducing heat transferred to the area of the bumper.

Also, if people do find a suitable looking bumper guard made of metal, I'd wonder if it could be designed in a way that actually installs as a replacable valence installed right into a cutout in the bumper, rather than a tack-on piece.

I'm wondering if anyone's contacted the muffler vendor and what they have to say about it, if anything. A small alteration in the tip design might be all that's required.

Originally posted by rjhang


Rob -

So sorry to hear about your damaged bumper. Hope you will be able to repair it nicely.

Perhaps it is my thick skull, but this still doesn't sway me away from my consideration for a TXS exhaust upgrade. :eek:

If you don't mind me asking... Where can I get TXS kits (TBE / TB Stealth) and get them installed professionally here in Canada??

Thanks,

-Rich

Check out Worldoneperformance.com They seem to have about the best prices on TXS stuff. I plan on getting this same exhaust for my WRX, but don't want to melt the bumper. A guy around here has a 2004 rex with the axleback RFL and isn't having any problems? Also, could you try different exhaust hangers. I bet Kartboy has some that might work.

Originally posted by INTEGRAtoWRX


Check out Worldoneperformance.com They seem to have about the best prices on TXS stuff. I plan on getting this same exhaust for my WRX, but don't want to melt the bumper. A guy around here has a 2004 rex with the axleback RFL and isn't having any problems? Also, could you try different exhaust hangers. I bet Kartboy has some that might work.

Actually, I was hoping to find out if there which Canadian TXS distributor / installer (if he did indeed) MontrealSTi used...

But, I will check out Worldoneperformance.com. Thanks for the tip. I may, after all, have to order parts from them.

-Rich

i think a piece that fits right inside the cutout would be an easy make for someone with experience. basically, if my thinking is correct: 1) make a template out of paper or something flexible and easy to cut, 2) trace the template onto a sheet of metal, 3) cut the metal, 4) drill 3-4 holes in the metal, 5) place the metal piece on the bumper, 5) drill holes in the bumper to match the holes, 6) screw the piece down. too me it doesn't seem too tough. my only problem is cutting the metal since i have nothing to do it with. someone around has to have experience or know someone who does. i just don't know anyone around here so i'm kind of out on devising the metal piece.

just want to get this back up to the top for everyone to see. please, if someone has or knows someone w/ metal experience let us know.

I'm interested as well since I just ordered a turboxs axleback, and plan on getting the stealthback next. I know it's a relatively new muffler, but I'm wondering why noone else has complained about it thus far. I wonder if it happens more often during continuous track use compared to daily street use?

(sorry no metal fabrication skills here :( )

I would like something as well. I have put 2000 miles on my car and it is only slightly discolored, but I have had zero track time. I do have a high flow cat installed.

http://home.kc.rr.com/cerberus/images/Exhaust02.jpg
That stainless bolt on contraption is hideous.

Montreal STI please post pictures of the damage. Do you have the stock muffler and tip? Is it touching the bumper?

FWIW

Any time you do a hard track day most aftermarket exhausts melt the bumper. I have prodrive muffler and it melts the bumper. HKS is another.

Get some exhaust wrap and use some hose clamps for the track. Takes a couple of minutes to wrap the tail pipe and a minute to take off at the end of the day.

From a track day last year, read the end of the first post and a few more.
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=259981&highlight

Originally posted by STI 2 NV
i think a piece that fits right inside the cutout would be an easy make for someone with experience. basically, if my thinking is correct: 1) make a template out of paper or something flexible and easy to cut, 2) trace the template onto a sheet of metal, 3) cut the metal, 4) drill 3-4 holes in the metal, 5) place the metal piece on the bumper, 5) drill holes in the bumper to match the holes, 6) screw the piece down. too me it doesn't seem too tough. my only problem is cutting the metal since i have nothing to do it with. someone around has to have experience or know someone who does. i just don't know anyone around here so i'm kind of out on devising the metal piece.

You could do just what you decribed above with some sheet metal and tin snips, a dremel to soften the edges, then, do it again, and samitch some header wrap between the two pieces just to make sure the heat wont transfer.
You should be able to find everything at the hardware store for under 10$ if you have or can find a scrap of header wrap and have tinsnips and a dremel...
Even buying the tools youd still save over the worldown3sperformance piece...
Good Luck!
Trent

This thread needs a bump!

I don't know how so many people can put up with melted bumpers like it's no big deal. It is something that shouldn't be happening. It's not hard to make it so the tailpipe is 2-3" below the bumper and about an inch sticking straight out beyond the bumper. You can run the STi HARD all day long till the gas tank is empty on the stock muffler and your bumper won't melt. I cannot see the justification for paying $1000 + for an exhaust system only to have it melt my bumper. I can assure you I won't be buying one that does this. Goes to show that certain companies out there do not do much R & D on some products.

Honestly, for the TXS RFL-Ti guys, I think all TXS needs to do is have the muffler stick out about an inch or so more. It sits a little deep that's why all the soot builds up on the bumper, I dont think height of a muffler really matters(unless its 1mm away from kissing it) as much as how hard its driven. Otherwise, a lot of aftermarket mufflers are bound melt the bumper after a few hard track sessions. It's not like a somewhat melted bumper would be totally unexpected given that the car was running WOT or close to WOT over a certain duration of time.

-STiLL

My bumper is f-in horrible after the TXS RFL turbo back. I've put 1500 miles on it since the install and the bumper looks like golden fried poop, it bothers the hell out of me and I can't ration putting that hideous metal plate on the bumper. I may have my buddy weld in a piece of pipe to have the muffler stick out a little more, and different hangers to let it hang an inch or so lower. Its an eyesore, worst I've seen yet. I may have a pic for you guys to see later tonight. Running catless (as I am) worsens the problem.

Also, since the RFL comes out at a slight angle, that plate would do very little to stop bumper damage. My bumper has browning at an angle, away from where the plate would cover. I wash it off as much as i can every time I finish driving, which is a hassle, but bumper is perm. browned. Needs a repainting or something halfway attractive to cover it.

It would be nice if someone knew how to make a carbon fiber piece to place on the bumper that is wider than that metal plate thing (which is an absolute rip off, btw). Carbon fiber has very good heat dissipating properties, so that would be ideal and pretty cool looking. Any ideas, or anyone know how to mess with a piece of CF? I may look into having this custom done.

-Matt

^^ post pictures of this bumper browning. And I can't for the life of me understand why so many people are using TurboXS products because they seem like nothing but constant problems!

If someone wants to host the pictures, I can show you the pics of my melted bumper.

Remember I have a white STi so it looks even worse. TurboXS says it's an install issue but I don't seem to be the only one with this problem.

I agree. Maybe this is common to STi or WRX, but it certainly does not apply to all cars. I hang out on the M3, M5, and C5 forums for years now, where there are dozens of aftermarket exhausts that see track use, and I've never, ever heard this complaint.

I agree with the other posts, extending the exhaust tip an inch might help, as well as keeping the distance from the fender to at least 1/2 inch. Also if they made the exaust and tip separate parts, with insulation between them or just a crimp or rivet holding them so that the heat conducted isn't as much.

That this is somehow acceptable for a "performance part" is really just an excuse for not designing the tip right the first time and trying to cash in regardless of the mistakes made rather than trying to correct them.

Originally posted by 300blueballs
I don't know how so many people can put up with melted bumpers like it's no big deal. It is something that shouldn't be happening. It's not hard to make it so the tailpipe is 2-3" below the bumper and about an inch sticking straight out beyond the bumper. You can run the STi HARD all day long till the gas tank is empty on the stock muffler and your bumper won't melt. I cannot see the justification for paying $1000 + for an exhaust system only to have it melt my bumper.

Pics should be up soon, another user has offered to host them.

I am putting on the high-flow cat so I am thinking that the exhaust will run a little cooler now, we'll see.

Also the idea of putting on a plate suck so I have to go to a muffler shop to see what they can do. So far I am not impressed with TurboXS who seems to have been doing this for a long time.

I am still investigating if it is an 'install issue' however the mechanic who installed it said there was no room for maneuver and that the exhaust was a perfectly tight fit. He wondered how such a nice looking exhaust would not clear the bumper and be so close to the plastic.

Anyhow I will update you as this develops,

Rob

I have posted Rob's burnt bumper pictures at:

http://ritzy.sytes.net/STi

Look under "Rob's Burnt Bumper" directory and you will find the five JPG photos that Rob sent me for posting.

-Rich

Mine looks just like yours does. I don't think there is anything wrong with the install. My bumper has just stated to show signs of the melt. No where near as bad as yours though. I am running the high flow cat though. I am going to the hardware store today to try to come up with something.

Ben

Have most of you had this happen after track use or mainly daily driving? My RFL ti axleback should be here next week. I'm worried about it now because I don't want a melted bumper. That'll bug the hell out of me since I'm a neat freak about my car.

How about a list of some exhausts that are confirmed to fit the sti correctly without melting the bumper?

It would be nice if someone knew how to make a carbon fiber piece to place on the bumper that is wider than that metal plate thing (which is an absolute rip off, btw). Carbon fiber has very good heat dissipating properties, so that would be ideal and pretty cool looking. Any ideas, or anyone know how to mess with a piece of CF? I may look into having this custom done.

I am buying the APR CF radiator plate from Digital Racer and showed him this thread. I let him know that there would be a decent amount of interest in a CF piece for the bumper. He said he would look into it.

I am looking into making one myself. I have been a high-end custom car audio installer for ten years now. I have done a lot of fiberglassing, mold making, gel coating etc. CF is not much different to work with. I just think it would be easier to buy a $50 -$75 piece from someone else rather than make it myself. We'll see what I come up with!

Toby

Call me an idiot...but what's the difference between stealthback and turboback and which would be better for the STi?

The stealthback only includes downpipe, racepipe or highflow cat, and a mid pipe. It bolts up to the stock muffler. The full turbo back includes an axleback muffler as well. You'd get the most gains with a full turboback, but I've heard you only pick up 5 horse or so with an aftermarket axleback on top of the stealthback. (If I had an Sti I'd keep the stock Sti muffler and get a stealthback)

Originally posted by INTEGRAtoWRX
The stealthback only includes downpipe, racepipe or highflow cat, and a mid pipe. It bolts up to the stock muffler. The full turbo back includes an axleback muffler as well. You'd get the most gains with a full turboback, but I've heard you only pick up 5 horse or so with an aftermarket axleback on top of the stealthback. (If I had an Sti I'd keep the stock Sti muffler and get a stealthback)

A stealthback could be had with a high-flow cat pipe rather than a racepipe as well if I understand correctly.

But then, how do you justify replacing a working cat even in the case of the HF catpipe configuration? Apparently, even a catpipe replacement is not legal in many states & provinces?

-Rich

OK so my home made Exhaust shield is in place. Looks pretty getto but it does seem to work. Got a sheet of galv steel from the local HD and cut out a nice rectangle. Folder it in half and put sticky Insulation on the top side. Formed it to the proper curve to fit along the bottom of the bumper. It sticks out about an 1/8th inch to the pass side and maybe a 1/4 on the drivers side since that is where the exhaust seems to be directed. Screwed this make shift piece into the underside of the bumper.
Slight Exhaust harmonic at about 82-84 but as long as you go faster it's fine. I can try bending it different to see if I can get it to go away. True test will be on Oct 6th when I go back to the track.
I'll try to take pics in the next coupoe days if people are interested.

Ben

:( Seems to be an inherent problem with the new Sti. Here is a quote from the new modified magazine:
"Another obvious trait of the Sti is that it runs hotter than a hooker on payday" :lol:
"The engine is hot and the exhaust is even hotter, so don't plan on transporting any ice cream cakes in the trunk. It's like an oven. We contacted Fluidyne in Ontario, Ca. about the inevitable heat problem.........

broeli-
you've been a busy little beaver posting here and imprezwrssti and the evom board:lol: . Maybe you should take a second and read the post frm the start before you spread this sht. It's a problem with an AFTERMARKET exhaust. Man you like instagating don't you. funny you didn't cross post the one about the STi handing the EVO his ass three times ina row did you:o

nope ...:rolleyes:

pk!

Umm..yes I did. Go re-read the post. (I was the third person to post) :D :lol:
Your right..I've been busy posting :D I'll make sure I correct any post I made and insert the word "aftermarket" I'm just doing the same when anyone else hears about problems. I'm discussing the issue..is that ok?:rolleyes: No different than someone on this board discussing issues with the Evo or any other car for that matter. I quoted a magazine article that I'm sure most people haven't read yet. Settle down..I'm not trying to bash the STi :)

pk!,
The posts have been corrected. I added the fact that it is with aftermarket exhausts. You may want to review them to see if they are satisfactory. :D

I know you read the EVO-STI post...I said you didn't CROSS post that one to EVOm. But you did manage to cross post 2x the post about aftermarket exhaust problems.

Discussing the issues is fine (IMO) I just think grabbing one piece of bad news and running back to EVOm to gleefully report it is childish.;)

And I never accused you of bashing.....although I guess that's what you're doing:lol:

pk!

edit: correcting you posts is honest 'cause it's not really "another STi problem":cool:

I just think grabbing one piece of bad news and running back to EVOm to gleefully report it is childish
I posted it on evolutionm because I visit that forum the most and the Sti is another car that I like and read up on. I just want to hear input from others. Keep in mind alot of tuners such as Shiv post regularly on evolutionm....I would like to hear from people such as them :) Although the post probably won't get much attention from the tuners or anyone else since I posted it in the rarely read "other cars" part of the board and not in the Evo forums.

Well, those pics look pretty bad. But it's obvious to me that the tailpipe is way to close to the bumper and way to short! I can't believe the installer would have let that go! How much for a new bumper?

I have seen this happen on civics and all kinds of cars. The exhaust coming out can get pretty hot. And heat rises so if the bumper is not out far enough the plastic is going to melt. I mean its common sense to put the tip farther out and lower. I have a turbo xs stealth back with the stock muffler. Haven't had even a bit of black on my white STi.

I agree. Lowering the tip 1/2 inch and extending it out an inch to two inches might do the trick.

It also looks like the inside diam where it connects to the muffler is smaller than the outside diam. I'm guessing the tip could be made smaller diam to get a bit more clearance, OR, continue the inner diam further, closer to the tip, and have a double-walled tip design, which would give a bit of an insulating effect, similar to double-walled stainless steel cup.

For what it's worth, I've never seen this happen on any of the aftermarket E39 M5 and E46 M3 aftermarket exhausts, even those that are tracked. I think they all keep their distance from the rear valence and stick out a ways. Perhaps having 4 tips instead of one might spread the heat out a bit too.

Is it just me or does Rob's RFL-Ti looks like it was mounted WAAAY too high compared to other STi's I've seen with the RFL?
Maybe it's just the angle that's throwin' me off here, anyone see where I'm coming from?

http://ritzy.sytes.net/STi/Rob's%20Burnt%20Bumper/Burned%20STi%20Bumper%204.jpg

vs.

http://www.neneons.org/albums/album06/100_0009.sized.jpg

vs.

http://www.worldoneperformance.com/Sti/03.jpg

vs.

http://home.kc.rr.com/cerberus/images/Exhaust02.jpg

Do they all look the same to you or am I just trippin' out??? Help me out guys.

-STiLL

His does look a bit closer to the bumper, but I think it's partially due to the angle of the pic. I just installed my RFL Ti axleback, and the bumper definitely gets really hot. I'm thinking about checking out some of that aluminum high temp. tape from earlier in this thread. Maybe it might reflect some of the heat? Anyways, so far the sweet sounds and looks of the RFL outweigh the melted bumper worries :banana:

p.s. WorldOne is the best TurboXS vendor. Great customer service and quick delivery!

Just curious if anyone contacted TXS about this and if they had anything to say.??

From what I've seen, and the looks of these pics. of mufflers, you can only install it at an angle where it leads the tip to be very close to the bumper. It looks like a faulty design to me...

Originally posted by RS WRC
From what I've seen, and the looks of these pics. of mufflers, you can only install it at an angle where it leads the tip to be very close to the bumper. It looks like a faulty design to me...

Yeah, I'm kind of leaning towards that as well. Perhaps it would have been a better design if it did indeed hang lower and stick out about an inch or so, like this HKS muffler:

http://www.worldoneperformance.com/products/wrx/exhaust/images/hks_carbonti.JPG

http://www.gruppe-s.com/Subaru/subex/hks_cbtiex.jpg


-STiLL

Hi there folks...

I don't have an awful lot of time to post on this topic at this time, but I can tell you that this issue is not entirely as widespread as many are making it seem.

It is a problem? Yes, it certainly is however it is much more an issue with the way that this particular muffler hang on some, (not all) cars. Right now I am not completely certain which combination of circumstances/installations contribute to the problem but work is currently being done to isolate the issue.

It seems, at this point at least that this muffler does in fact hang a bit differently on certain cars. This is evidenced by the fact that there are 100's of RFL users, myself included who have not had any problems. I can say without a doubt that after looking at the pictures in this thread that I definately have a good bit more clearance between the muffler tip and the bumper than some.

A few have said in this thread that this issue is the product of poor r and d, and they are certainly entitled to their opionion. However given the reputation of Turbo XS in this community and the track record of their other numerous products, its simply ludicris to imply that this issue showed up in the development phase and went unaddressed.

Now, after hundreds of RFLs have been sold, a problem has surfaced for a group of users, and rest assured it will be addressed completely and in the quickest manner possible. Those of us who have been in this community for a while now know that if there is one company that knows how to take care of its customers its Turbo XS.

If anyone has any questions or concerns about the RFL muffler please let us know, we will do all that we can to assist you.

Thank You,

Garret
World One Performance
www.worldoneperformance.com
info@worldoneperformance.com
206.331.2004

Originally posted by WorldOne
Hi there folks...

I don't have an awful lot of time to post on this topic at this time, but I can tell you that this issue is not entirely as widespread as many are making it seem.

It is a problem? Yes, it certainly is however it is much more an issue with the way that this particular muffler hang on some, (not all) cars......It seems, at this point at least that this muffler does in fact hang a bit differently on certain cars.....I can say without a doubt that after looking at the pictures in this thread that I definately have a good bit more clearance between the muffler tip and the bumper than some.



Thanks, Garret, for your helpful input. I'm glad that you could offer up some thoughts on the pictures that I had used for comparison...that helps a lot too. If the blue STi is, in fact, the one that you are talking about, then I guess my initial thoughts were correct in thinking your RFL looks like it hangs the lowest out of the four that were posted. Without any confirmed reasons to this problem, I'm still leaning towards the "faulty design" idea about the RFL. However, that could easily change with some substantial insight on the problem. I'm looking forward to seeing what kind of conclusive information you can offer us as to why such a variation of hang heights exist for the RFL. Again, thank you.


-STiLL

has anyone tried not having a cat on the car? I think that's part of your problem. I run at the track with my WRX catless with a JIC 505 Ti exhaust but I have no melting problem. The tip sticks out a little farther than your TXS muffler but it's mine is also as close if not closer to the bumper cover.

The cats keep the exhaust temperature higher farther back. Even if you're spitting flame that shouldn't melt the bumper alone.

Hi everyone

I will be putting up better pics of the install that the installer took.

I have been speaking with TurboXS and the installer and of course the installer says there was no room for adjustments and TurboXS says it was installed improperly.

I purchased the exhaust from WorldOne and they have been excellent up to now. I haven't really talked to Garrett about this because to me this is a potential R&D issue with TurboXS.

In my opinion, I think that the exhaust doesn't stick out enough and it's a little too high. I don't know of many STI users that ARE running a full turboback with no cats, but the ones I spoke to had the same problem as me. The facts are:

Bumper melted only at the track (20-30 minute sessions)
full turbo back
no cats

On the other hand, apparently the guys in Puerto Rico are running the same setup and they haven't reported a problem (this is what TurboXS has said).

I definately wouldn't rush to any judgement and say that TurboXS is a bad product, etc etc. I just hope everyone acts responsibly.

I'll keep everyone posted

Rob

Originally posted by broadfield

I am buying the APR CF radiator plate from Digital Racer and showed him this thread. I let him know that there would be a decent amount of interest in a CF piece for the bumper. He said he would look into it.

I am looking into making one myself. I have been a high-end custom car audio installer for ten years now. I have done a lot of fiberglassing, mold making, gel coating etc. CF is not much different to work with. I just think it would be easier to buy a $50 -$75 piece from someone else rather than make it myself. We'll see what I come up with!
Toby

That CF piece would rock, thanks for looking into that. I am very interested....

Anyway, with regards to install issues......this exhaust doesn't require any magic to install (besides the magic needed to get subaru's nuts from seizing on the turbo).

Nino and Precision Tuning did my install, I watched the whole thing, all day, and it was done professionally and perfectly. I couldn't be happier with the TXS RFL turbo back(sound, power, looks). The fact is, the muffler section does not come out far enough. They need two more inches of pipe or muffler/muffler tip to make this exhaust perfect. If stock rubber hangers are used, it will hang close to the bumper, causing the burning, being catless elevates the burning and discoloration (mine is just as bad, if not worse than the pics posted earlier, from daily driving, no track yet).

I am a neat freak about my car as well, this is an eyesore. I hope TXS offers some kind of support, help, longer pipe somewhere in the system, and/or :cough: new bumper :cough:, that would be the right thing to do if customer service is a priority. Either they fix it, or I will by 1)grafting in two inches of pipe (ugh, don't want to rip apart a beatiful system) or, 2) that CF plate of some sort to mask the burnt poop color of my bumper.

-Matt

Forget carbon fiber....forget a piece of stainless to wedge in the exhaust cutout. TurboXS obviously did not do their homework when designing this pipe as it has done the same thing to my 1 month old black STi's bumper. Even when leaving the car idle for 10-15 minutes I can see a 3" haze around the cutout for the pipe where its heating up. The paint underneath the cutout is also melting from just everyday driving. (this car has also never been to the track) As for install issues, I personally drove to MD and had their mechanic do the work so they cannot play the "poor installation" card on me. I will try and get pictures hosted but I think turboxs needs to admit there is a problem with their RFL mufflers and start replacing them along with the bumpers theyve ruined. -T3RMIN4L

^^^agree with above^^^

this needs to be another STI sticky.

Here are the pics.

This isnt' a track car and has 2500 miles on it, exhaust has been on for only 1000 miles. Note the discoloration in the bumper in the pic from the rear and the obviously melted bumper in the pic from underneath.

http://gurft.net/images/terminal/STISide.JPG
http://gurft.net/images/terminal/STIBurned3.JPG
http://gurft.net/images/terminal/STIBurned.JPGhttp://gurft.net/images/terminal/STIBurned2.JPG

bump for melting bumpers :furious:

I think I may try some of this high temp. tape which is on the summit web page. Seems like it would at least reflect some of the heat right? :confused:
It's worth a try since it's only 15 bucks.....

http://store.summitracing.com/product.asp?d=13&s=131&p=1923&searchtype=ecat

It wont look right on the bottom of my BLACK STi's bumper. I called turboxs they say that it happens and to purchase a heat shield to prevent it.

now that you post those pics from underneath... the tip is too short...

Mine sticks out about an inch farther I'd guess. I have no problems with the bumper

here're some pics of my 505Ti...

http://24.210.66.43/advan/115-1523_IMG.JPG

http://24.210.66.43/advan/115-1526_IMG.JPG

ellisnc,

NICE pictures, awesome car. In reference to your JIC 505Ti pics, I agree, TXS RFL sits waay too deep, as I've stated before. Seeing that your JIC canister sits at about the same height as the RFL's, it looks to me that all TXS needs to do is either make the tip or piping longer to significantly clear the rear bumper, like many of you have already brought up. But then again, you can always make the rear half switch to the JIC unit as a full cat back set up instead...which is lookin' really nice to me.

ellis, judging from the pipe design, that JIC looks like a screamer...is it loud? Where will I be able to get a deal on one?

Thanks for the pics,

-STiLL

Originally posted by T3RMIN4L
It wont look right on the bottom of my BLACK STi's bumper. I called turboxs they say that it happens and to purchase a heat shield to prevent it.

If they knew that then why didn't they tell people BEFORE the install?

I agree especially since by the time I arrived home from the installation by their mechanic the paint was already blistering. Little late by the timer I found out. =\

Originally posted by T3RMIN4L
It wont look right on the bottom of my BLACK STi's bumper. I called turboxs they say that it happens and to purchase a heat shield to prevent it.

I only plan on putting a strip on the underside of the bumper on the curved bumper outlet. I bet if you spray painted the tape black and only applied it to the underside you probably wouldn't see it. (who knows though, we shouldn't have to do these kinds of things when you spend big money on an exhaust)

Here are the pics of the install as promised:

http://ritzy.sytes.net/STi/Rob's%20Burnt%20Bumper/TXS%20RFL-Ti%20Install%201.jpg

http://ritzy.sytes.net/STi/Rob's%20Burnt%20Bumper/TXS%20RFL-Ti%20Install%202.jpg

I sent another email to Nathan at TurboXS but have had no response as of yet :(

Originally posted by RS WRC
From what I've seen, and the looks of these pics. of mufflers, you can only install it at an angle where it leads the tip to be very close to the bumper. It looks like a faulty design to me...

Anyone have similar pics for the stock muffler?

Just curious. From looking at these photos, it seems that this muffler hangs a little lower & reduces the ground clearance a little, especially around the front seam.

Originally posted by STiLL WILL

Perhaps it would have been a better design if it did indeed hang lower and stick out about an inch or so, like this HKS Muffler:

http://www.worldoneperformance.com/products/wrx/exhaust/images/hks_carbonti.JPG

-STiLL

But, that practically robs the car of any useful ground clearance, it seems...! :eek: (Or is the car lowered, too?? :confused: )

-Rich

Even if it does "rob" the car of useful ground clearance, lowered or not, by all accounts, canister-style mufflers like the RFL usually will entail one to sacrifice ground clearance. You gotta sacrifice a little, and that should be known WELL BEFORE the purchase is made. Also, what is considered "useful" ground clearance to you may/probably will not apply to everyone. If ground clearance is a big concern, there are a plethora of other aftermarket non-canister style mufflers that will suit your needs, but you may also have to sacrifice a little power in reference to a canister style muffler, generally(not saying ALL!).

-STiLL

Originally posted by STiLL WILL
ellisnc,

NICE pictures, awesome car. In reference to your JIC 505Ti pics, I agree, TXS RFL sits waay too deep, as I've stated before. Seeing that your JIC canister sits at about the same height as the RFL's, it looks to me that all TXS needs to do is either make the tip or piping longer to significantly clear the rear bumper, like many of you have already brought up. But then again, you can always make the rear half switch to the JIC unit as a full cat back set up instead...which is lookin' really nice to me.

ellis, judging from the pipe design, that JIC looks like a screamer...is it loud? Where will I be able to get a deal on one?

Thanks for the pics,

-STiLL

My exhaust is the JDM version with no resonators or anything... just Ti piping all the way back and a Ti can and burned tip. I can hold the whole thing up over my head with one hand. The weight was the reason I bought it. Adam at Z1 got it for me... I'm sure he can get you one if you want. I've heard the US market one is a lot quieter. But just give him a call and tell him Nate said to call him for a JDM JIC exhaust. He'll probably laugh. You could probably just use a Cusco downpipe or whatever you like.

I'll PM you a link to a video. It's 5 meg so I don't want half NASIOC downloading from my PC. It's from outside the car on the front straight at Mid Ohio. Usually at that point on the track the car lets out a hugh gunshot like pop on upshifts but it didn't do it this time unfortunately... :D

To answer your question... it's very loud!

Do i understand it right? If i go with turbo back, with high flow cat (stealth back) keep the stock STi muffler, I wont have any melting bumper problems?

Richard
Miami, FL

Originally posted by rich728
Do i understand it right? If i go with turbo back, with high flow cat (stealth back) keep the stock STi muffler, I wont have any melting bumper problems?

Richard
Miami, FL

I doubt you'll have any problems since you'll be sticking with the Sti Muffler. From what I've read your exhaust temp's should actually be cooler since you'll be eliminating one cat and replacing the third cat with a high flow unit.

I've had my RFL for 3 days now and no discoloration or melting yet though I'm keeping my fingers crossed. I'm wondering if this is mainly an Sti problem? A guy that lives near me has had his for a month or two and hasn't had any melting on his 04 WRX. He did note some discoloration, but no melting yet.

Originally posted by MontrealSTi
I sent another email to Nathan at TurboXS but have had no response as of yet :(

As a last step before involving any legal efforts, you may want to supply photos and a letter and send it via registered mail. If you chose, at that time you could CC the letter to a few places too:
- advertisers / mags / shops that carry the product
- local BBB
- provincial consumer affairs office

:rolleyes:

Originally posted by WorldOne
:rolleyes:

lol

so true:D

I have been advised that this issue has been escalated to the owner of TurboXS, so I will let you know what comes of it.

Thanks

Rob

There is absolutely no reason to scream bloody murder or stupid stuff about involving the legal authorites (from Kanada at that A Id be concerned with those faulty bearings in that uber expensive bling) TXS takes care of their own work with your vendor and TXS no need to slander and threaten

I just put the high temp. tape on the underside of my bumper, and it looks okay, and seems to be working.

I did a complete write-up with pics included on Club WRX. Scroll towards the bottom and you'll see my pics. I know this might not be the best fix for a car that's not silver, but you can't really see it unless you get under the bumper. I think it will protect from most of the heat. I'll post in this thread again with an update soon.

p.s. I still love my RFL!


http://clubwrx.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=352488#post352488

Originally posted by INTEGRAtoWRX
I just put the high temp. tape on the underside of my bumper, and it looks okay, and seems to be working.

Part number, name and URL please!


Another alternative.
http://www.designengineering.com/floor_and_tunnel_shield.html

Here's the link. I got it from Summit Racing

http://store.summitracing.com/defau...+Tape+&x=9&y=10

That other stuff looks really similar, I wonder how it compares in price?

I simply used 1" spacers in the two rear hangers. I cut two 1" cross sections of 1" diameter metal tubing. As I stretched the hangers down I inserted the spacers in each hole. Was very simple and effective. It did take a lot of force to stretch the hanger that much. Would probably be easier if I had it on my lift....or with two peeps! I have full catless Turbo XS TB and no melting yet. Only a little discoloration on my white car.

Toby

broadfield.

Got any pics of what you did?

-STiLL

I will try to get them up Monday!

Just an update, TurboXS has still not contacted me.

I spoke with Nathan from turboxs this morning regarding this issue and he doesnt feel as though they will be able to replace any damaged bumpers due to their exhausts. I asked for the owner to please call me back and will update when I hear from him. I feel as though I have somewhat of a special case as I had their mechanic do my install. After the 3 hour ride home the bumper was already crispy and completely ruined. I called turboxs at this time and this is when they recommended the cusco heat shield however the damage was already done. We shall see where we stand when I hear back from the owner of turboxs but needless to say Im not a happy camper.

-T3RMIN4L

TERMINAL keep me posted!!

Thanks

Rob

Is there a link so I can see what the Cusco heat shield looks like?

Originally posted by broadfield
I will try to get them up Monday!

I'd like to see your pics as well. Can't quite visualize it in my mind.

Sorry guys, no pics! I will have them up Tuesday....I promise!

I've been reading all these posts and I'm really concern with the childish writings of a lot of guys. Please we are making mods to our cars that doesn't come from factory. Turbo xs is one of the better fitment parts that I have work with. Here on the island what we've done it's put a little aluminium tape and thats all. It looks like you've never been on the aftermarket parts because let me tell you that HKS, Greedy, Top Speed, MRT, M2 and others, all hit with the frames or the body or get stuck to your rear bumper for a really melted bumper. Here on the island we really hit the track almost every 2 to 3 weeks and yes there's a little melt but forgetted is running as hell. If you don't want any melting put the stock muffler I believe this one wouldn't melt the bumper. I don't know if I'm right but the white STI seems it doesn't have any cat, what you expected, that it wouldn't throw any fumes out. Please all that talking about legal stuff really upsets me about subaru owners. This is my car and I don't care!

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid75/p77ed23f700f563fe319d979ba6e999b4/fb578e6b.jpg

Hi Alcrudojr,

I actually have never mentioned any legal action, I think we are all civilized and all I am looking for is a fix of some sort and an apology, even a 'sorry dude for the melted problem, it's our bad and the next version will fix this' would be great.

Also, unlike what you said, not all aftermarket exhausts cause this. I never had this problem on my (no cats on any of them):

Integra Type-R (mugen)
S2000 (j's racing)
BMW E46 M3 (eisenmann)

Why am I having this problem with the subaru?

The car wasn't R&D'd at the track, it was R&D'd on the street which is fine for the majority of people. But people like myself and others were not told that this would be a problem from the vendor or reseller if I were to track my car, and like you I am on the track 3-4 times a month.

I am waiting for the owner of TurboXS to get back to me (I was told he is out of town and should be back soon) to resolve this as soon as possible. I am new to Subaru and from what I have seen up to now TurboXS seems to be a great product and unfortunately my first experience wasn't pleasant however I will not judge TurboXS on this one experience until I have chatted with the right individuals.


Regards,

Robert

Originally posted by alcrudojr #00
I've been reading all these posts and I'm really concern with the childish writings of a lot of guys.

Here on the island we really hit the track almost every 2 to 3 weeks and yes there's a little melt but forgetted is running as hell.

This is my car and I don't care!

:huh:

We are just trying to remedy/avoid melted bumpers, especially those of us who do not track the car all the time and care how the rear bumper looks. We paid mucho $$$ for this exhaust and didn't expect melting/bad discoloration with daily driving/ light track use, as I am. For this price, we shouldn't deal with melting at all and/or using hideous metal bumper plates/tape.

And, most of us HAVE been around aftermarket parts for years and haven't seen such a blantant R&D mistake for an exhaust system MEANT for our cars. Most of us still love the exhaust, except for this issue, TXS makes some of the best parts out there.
I mean, how hard could it be for them to make it a couple inches longer to clear the bumper, seems ridiculous unless there is a very good reason for it, which we are waiting on.....

No, legal action is not the answer at all. I agree with that point, and hate to see people even considering it.

I agree with both of you guys. I've wanted this exhaust for some time especially since TSX is a great company with a reputation to match, but am going to hold up on buying it until the problem is resolved. A melted bumper is a tough pill to swallow for me. I will wait for version 2.

To be fair, all the brands in the above post by alcrudojr don't melt the rear bumper MINUS the Blitz that does have a history of burning them in the tip's shape.

Ihave the carbon-ti and I flogged the car so much that is the only one that I have seen on the web that the whole tip has turned blue, not just the edge:devil:

Before:
http://netdial.caribe.net/~leocal/DSCF0097.JPG

After:
http://netdial.caribe.net/~leocal/DSCF0343.JPG

That part of the OEM lip hangs lower than the bumper itself and no harm has come to it. I took it off and have used at ther track and nada!

As I said, not all aftermarket parts hurt the car. When they do, the problem is fixed and the broken part replaced. Happened to the Rota guys that had failures while auto-x'ing and had the whole set replaced!

Robert, today at the shop we were working with two STI with the RFL Muffler and let me tell you something I do that my help you a lot. I install on the factory rear hangers (2) a nut or some type of spacer more or less half to 3/4 of an inch and grab the muffler down and insert them at the middle of the hanger. This will lower the muffler and at least help you with the burns. Sorry if my message was a little straigth forward but as a shop owner and knowing personal the Turbo xs people I think is was getting out of proportion.

A Friend here on the Island of Puerto Rico,

Miguel Alcrudo Jr.
APTuners
787-251-2850

Here are the pics I promised......

Here are the spacers I used from Lowes, 1" diameter found in the drawers where all of the bolts and nuts are. I used black epoxy spray to keep them from rusting and to make them look "somewhat" factory



http://images4.fotki.com/v39/photos/4/47612/220584/STiExhaust001-vi.jpg

Here are pics before spacers

http://images3.fotki.com/v30/photos/4/47612/220584/STiExhaust002-vi.jpg
http://images4.fotki.com/v39/photos/4/47612/220584/STiExhaust005-vi.jpg

Here are pics after spacers

http://images4.fotki.com/v38/photos/4/47612/220584/STiExhaust012-vi.jpg
http://images4.fotki.com/v39/photos/4/47612/220584/STiExhaust010-vi.jpg

Pics of the spacers in the hangers

http://images4.fotki.com/v38/photos/4/47612/220584/STiExhaust014-vi.jpg
http://images3.fotki.com/v30/photos/4/47612/220584/STiExhaust016-vi.jpg

Finally, a slight distant pic

http://images4.fotki.com/v38/photos/4/47612/220584/STiExhaust013-vi.jpg

how did you manage to get those spacers in? i'm having a hell of a time doing it :(

I have a friend that has and 03 WRX with the TurboXS standard cat back exhaust. He also has a bit of discoloration and soot around his bumper but no melting of any kind.

I think the sum of the issue is around the length of the TurboXS exhausts. They simply do not extend far enough past the rear bumper. I specifically bought the SPT/STi exhaust for my 02 WRX and have noticed that my exhaust extends a good 1-2" past the Turbo XS.

I have no doubt in my mind that TurboXS will make the issue right for you guys.

After speaking with nathan again because no phone calls had been returned it seems there will be a post coming this afternoon from turboxs to this forum. When asked what it might say, he responded that he would not speak about the issue any further. When asked about the, hopefully upcoming, STi utec he said he would not comment on further STi products. Seems like they arent happy about this issue but who could expect them to be? I just ask for some civility in resolving it properly.

-T3RMIN4L

This is Mark, the owner of TurboXS. First off, I’d like to apologize to those of you who have had problems with our RFL-Ti muffler. If you are having a problem, I ask that you call TurboXS toll free at 877.887.2679 and ask to speak to the owner. Although many of our customers have not experienced the problems that some of you have with their RFLs, clearly enough of you have that at this point we have suspended selling the RFL-Ti for use on the STi. We are in the process of instructing our dealer network to do likewise until further notice.

We are currently investigating options on how we can reduce the amount of heat that the bumper is exposed to in order to eliminate the problems some of you have experienced. When we have come to a resolution on this, we will post information here and on our website.

Meanwhile, if you have already purchased the RFL-TI muffler from us or from one of our dealers for your STi, and have experienced problems or are just concerned and would like to return it for a full refund, please call us toll free at 877.887.2679 from 9:30am to 5:30 pm. We will arrange for pickup of your muffler for shipping back to us and for payment of your refund.

Again, if you have experienced any problems with your TurboXS RFL-Ti muffler or if you have any questions at all, please call us toll free at 877.887.2679.

Best Regards,
Mark
TurboXS

.........

-Matt

Mark also took care of me. I will surely continue on as a TurboXS loyalist.

:D

As if there was any doubt that things would work out in this manner. This folks is why we stand behind Turbo XS parts and their service.

If any of our customers have any questions about their mufflers, feel free to contact us as well.

www.worldoneperformance.com/turboxs

Cheers,

Garret
World One

Originally posted by TurboXS
This is Mark, the owner of TurboXS. First off, I’d like to apologize to those of you who have had problems with our RFL-Ti muffler. If you are having a problem, I ask that you call TurboXS toll free at 877.887.2679 and ask to speak to the owner. Although many of our customers have not experienced the problems that some of you have with their RFLs, clearly enough of you have that at this point we have suspended selling the RFL-Ti for use on the STi. We are in the process of instructing our dealer network to do likewise until further notice.

We are currently investigating options on how we can reduce the amount of heat that the bumper is exposed to in order to eliminate the problems some of you have experienced. When we have come to a resolution on this, we will post information here and on our website.

Meanwhile, if you have already purchased the RFL-TI muffler from us or from one of our dealers for your STi, and have experienced problems or are just concerned and would like to return it for a full refund, please call us toll free at 877.887.2679 from 9:30am to 5:30 pm. We will arrange for pickup of your muffler for shipping back to us and for payment of your refund.

Again, if you have experienced any problems with your TurboXS RFL-Ti muffler or if you have any questions at all, please call us toll free at 877.887.2679.

Best Regards,
Mark
TurboXS


Now THAT'S peace of mind. Service can't get any better than that. Thanks Mark.

-STiLL

Just subscribing myself because I have some interest in an extended length/reworked TXS turboback!:)

Originally posted by WorldOne
:D

As if there was any doubt that things would work out in this manner. This folks is why we stand behind Turbo XS parts and their service.

If any of our customers have any questions about their mufflers, feel free to contact us as well.

www.worldoneperformance.com/turboxs

Cheers,

Garret
World One

I am very interested in txs exhaust. It is great to see customer service is still # 1 priorty. Let me know when the problem is solved. I am in for an exhaust!!!
This Is a good sign: a company who takes responsibility will get my money!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I talked with Mark today. He was very nice and solved my problem. I recommend TurboXS highly.

I have left 2 messages to TurboXS now and I haven't had anyone get back to me, am I unlucky or what?

Originally posted by Hummer
I talked with Mark today. He was very nice and solved my problem. I recommend TurboXS highly.

Hummer,

So what exactly did Mark tell you to do to fix the problem?

-STiLL

I am swapping the RFL for the "regular" TurboXS muffler. Mark did say that they are slightly changing future exhausts {pipe angle and hangers}. My wife HATES the RFL and it was giving me some discoloration and slight melt. EDIT: I do have the high flow cat

Originally posted by Hummer
I am swapping the RFL for the "regular" TurboXS muffler. Mark did say that they are slightly changing future exhausts {pipe angle and hangers}. My wife HATES the RFL and it was giving me some discoloration and slight melt.

The swap won't do you any good. The other muffler will still dicolor yoyr bumper and melt some of the paint away, at least it does on the catless TXS TBE on my STi.

I ended up putting a high flow cat on and pulling the racepipe off. Mine hasnt melted persay, but my bumper is discolored none the less.

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Hummer
I am swapping the RFL for the "regular" TurboXS muffler. Mark did say that they are slightly changing future exhausts {pipe angle and hangers}. My wife HATES the RFL and it was giving me some discoloration and slight melt.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



The swap won't do you any good. The other muffler will still dicolor yoyr bumper and melt some of the paint away, at least it does on the catless TXS TBE on my STi.

Has anyone had their bumper melt/discolor WITH the high-flow cat and "regular" TurboXS muffler (along with the rest of the TBE components)?

Does anyone have any pics of the "regular" TBE so we can see how far the tip sticks out/how close it hangs from the bumper?

thanks,
Mike

Originally posted by alcrudojr #00
I've been reading all these posts and I'm really concern with the childish writings of a lot of guys. Please we are making mods to our cars that doesn't come from factory. Turbo xs is one of the better fitment parts that I have work with. Here on the island what we've done it's put a little aluminium tape and thats all. It looks like you've never been on the aftermarket parts because let me tell you that HKS, Greedy, Top Speed, MRT, M2 and others, all hit with the frames or the body or get stuck to your rear bumper for a really melted bumper.

I agree and disagree. I agree that people are taking things way too far. Aftermarket exhaust CAN melt plastic. Duh. It's up to you to gauge. You can adjust the hangers after all.

I also agree that the person(s) who had TXS install it, weren't told about the possible damage, and had the bumpers ruined (as described as "crispy", etc), have a special case.

I disagree that all exhaust "hit, rub, melt, etc." I have had the Greddy EVO on my car over a yr and it has not hit the frame once nor melted my stock bumper. Now, what it DID do was start to melt the rear lip on my OEM kit. I simply, put metal bits inside of the rubber hangers (the two that hold the can) which pushed the exhaust down about .5". But I didn't go call Greddy about it.

Now, if I had TXS install it and my whole bumper melted (or melted in such a way that I could see if from directly behind; the melting wasn't circular), I'd be hella pissed.

[edit] I just read broadfield's post about the spacers, and that precisely what I did, fwiw.

TXS has ALWAYS shown me 110% in regards to customer service.

Hey guys...I've had a bumper dis-coloration on my 05 with the Blitz NÜR Spec and so I've been researching like crazy to find a shield to keep my bumper safe. I kept finding them for EVOs but no STis so I contacted Rally Sport Direct and they said that they would contact a company called Authority, which makes a nice carbon fiber one for the EVO, and ask them to make for the STi if I could scrounge up some interest for the part! You can call them at 1-800-488-9174 or email and refer to ticket# LTK3201107913X. Please make yourselves heard if you want to have a good looking, high quality piece to protect your babies' bumpers. Thanks guys(and gals). :banana:

Still no Carbon Fiber cover?
My 06 Sti is suffering the early stages of bumper melt. Need help! :confused: :furious:

http://www.rallysportdirect.com/shop/varis-wrx-sti-carbon-fiber-heat-shield-2004-p-1693.html


Hope this helps!

bump...