I like driving my car as opposed to being a racer, but I do want it to go damn fast! The problem I see is that the 2.5L engine just doesn't have the initial torque of the bigger engines I'm used to. Maybe it's my driving but it's not throwing me in the back of my seat like I had hoped. What mods are specific to gaining maximum torque off the line?

Stage1 accessport... lots more torque! Stock STi dyno'd that day at 238hp and 242 ft/lbs

http://69.143.112.172:90/STi_dyno_10.30.04_small.JPG

I think for some people the AWD changes the feeling of torque a lot. But ya, you are just a couple mods away from getting some of that feeling back even with the AWD.

offset

A ported and polished turbo adds nice gains to your low end torque curve as well.

So you are saying that my stock '04 STi has less than 240whp?? I thought they advertised it as 300whp?

So you are saying that my stock '04 STi has less than 240whp?? I thought they advertised it as 300whp?
Show me one advertisement that says that and I'll eat a turbo with a spoon.

ok, my mistake but how much are they supposed to have then? hp and torque?

300 HP and Torque at the crank.

ok, my mistake but how much are they supposed to have then? hp and torque?


cars are quoted at crank horsepower or "bhp". that is how much the motor makes, but when it is transfered to the ground (through the transmission and differentials) some power is lost. so, your STi makes ~300bhp and ~240whp. same thing. kinda.

common mistake, no big deal.

I have an s-10 Blazer for daily driving so you can understand that I'm new to tuning. So getting 300+whp would be damn impressive still. All these posts are making more sense. I was reading and guys were measuring 270whp and I was like :huh: what is everyone doing wrong??

Anymore ideas for some torque gains for some wicked fun driving?

Cobb Stage 2

277 hp
316 tq

http://cobbtuning.com/sti/images/ap-sti-stage2.gif

Anymore ideas for some torque gains for some uber fun driving?

I know this'll sound smartassish, but use the torque multiplying stick next to your right hip.

Oh, is that what that thingy is?? :p

I like that Stage 2 kit. I'm going to search for people who have it and their thoughts. If anyone else wants to reply here that's cool too. I just want to know if it'll work with any TBE (catless.)

I just want to know if it'll work with any TBE (catless.)
Yes, it will work with any catless tbe.

DP is also a must, correct? And no need to replace stock UP since it's catless anyways, right?

Correct the STi comes with a catless uppipe. From the turbo back needs to be replaced (i.e., dp, midpipe, axle back, cat back - all depending on what system you are getting)

What diameter is appropriate for the Stage 2 AccessPort? I've heard 2.5" is plenty from Scoobysports but everyone else seems to go with 3.0". I want wide bands of torque not one wicked HP peak @5krpm.

Two words:

Twin scroll!

Two words:

Twin scroll!

one word:

expensive!!

:lol:

Fess

I have the Cobb Stage 2 :D

I used the Perrin TBE with the AccessPort and it works great :cool:

One of my friends couldn't believe how much power could come from such a small car as I throu him in his seat every shift :devil:

what ever Stage 2 you get (reflash,TBE) I think you will find the torque you desire ;)

Nitrous will give you plenty of torque!

V8 for torque

V8 for torque

DING DING DING, we have a winnar!

I like driving my car as opposed to being a racer, but I do want it to go damn fast! The problem I see is that the 2.5L engine just doesn't have the initial torque of the bigger engines I'm used to. Maybe it's my driving but it's not throwing me in the back of my seat like I had hoped. What mods are specific to gaining maximum torque off the line?

spend some money... FP green, UTEC, big injectors, etc.

once again, expensive to make power on STI

use the torque multiplying stick next to your right hip.
:D :D :D, that's good, ( adds phrase to quick comeback list!!)

What mods are specific to gaining maximum torque off the line?


For maximum low rpm performance, there are really only 2 solutions, raw displacement or gear ratios.

Larry

I'd like to do all that and make people crap their pants when I hit the gas, but I'd rather spend that kind of money on a V8 and get >1000HP. I think a simple remap and TBE is for me.

TBE, EBC, and alcohol injection did the trick for me. I have yet to throw some EM and upgrade the turbo. Right now this car pulls pretty nice though. I can't wait for the turbo upgrade this spring :D.

-Wes

excuse the noobiness but alcohol injection?? Isn't that for drag cars?

VF37 isn't too expensive.

Dangerous tho?

excuse the noobiness but alcohol injection?? Isn't that for drag cars?

Alcohol or Water injection works wonders on our turbo'd cars. What usually limits tuning on pump gas is detonation, and WI can help virtually boost your octance rating closer to that of something like C16 race gas. I definately think I will be going with some WI of some type (looking at an Aquamist system controlled by Hydra, a bit expensive setup though).

offset

I cant believe the BAD BAD BAD advice thats getting spit around in this thread. No one listens to anyone anymore... they already have their reply ready based on the thread subject alone.

so lets start over and analyze this:

"I like driving my car as opposed to being a racer, but I do want it to go damn fast! The problem I see is that the 2.5L engine just doesn't have the initial torque of the bigger engines I'm used to. Maybe it's my driving but it's not throwing me in the back of my seat like I had hoped. What mods are specific to gaining maximum torque off the line?"

So what do we learn from these four sentences:

Fact: alexcd is a new member. Sep of 2004
Fact: alexcd isnt concerned with tracking/racing his car..
Fact: alexcd is from MA... so he gets good 93 gas.
Fact: alexcd is used to the instant low end response of bigger displacement engines
Fact: alexcd wants more usable grunt in lower RPM's
Fact: alexcd wants to make people crap their pants. :p

Assumption: This is a new car to alexcd, and it may be his first turbocharged car.


Now for the responses:
get an accessport stage 1: good response (of course im biased) :) 33+ft/lbs of torque to the wheels!! with no other mods.. 15 minutes.. plug and play.. done. And if he wanted more.. add a turbo back exhaust to the accessport have have 68+ft/lbs or torque to the wheels with less then 5 hours of easy-do-it yourself wrench time.


port and polish turbo: lots of effort, not an easy do it yourself project. little measurable gain in torque. no dyno proof of that it would beat an accessport. (i think everyone here would agree that it wouldnt out perform an accessport bang-4-buck)

Two words Twin scroll!: SHAME ON YOU!!! you're telling a new member to to a turbo/exhaustmanifold/ECU/fuel/pump/fuel/injectors/gauges and other supporting mods that will probably cost around 7-8 grand by the time he is done? :huh:http://forums.nasioc.com/ubb-files/smilies/mad.gifhttp://forums.nasioc.com/ubb-files/smilies/eek.gif


Nitrous will give you plenty of torque!: :o uhhh dont listen to this guy.


spend some money... FP green, UTEC, big injectors, etc.: This is true.. spend about 4-5 grand on this suff and you will make lots or torque. But whos to say that you wouldnt be happy with 70 ft/lbs of torque to the wheels for about 1500. ( accessport + tbe)


alcohol injection: not a whole lot of ppl running alcohol injection around here. I'm not saying thats bad advice.. but its probably not for the forced induction novice.

VF37 isn't too expensive.: again... with the "must have new turbo"

get yourself a turboxs utec and turboback, instant torque

i second turbo back and tune. 05 accessport will not be out for a few months though.

So you are saying that my stock '04 STi has less than 240whp?? I thought they advertised it as 300whp?


ROFL hahahaha

this guy....

Two words Twin scroll!: SHAME ON YOU!!! you're telling a new member to to a turbo/exhaustmanifold/ECU/fuel/pump/fuel/injectors/gauges and other supporting mods that will probably cost around 7-8 grand by the time he is done?

You're way off base here. A complete twin-scroll setup can be had for under $2K and will run just fine on the stock injectors, pump, and even ECU. I would still recommend at least an EcuTEK flash to get things nailed down tight, but the stock ECU has a wide enough authority range to adjust to the extra low end boost the VF37 will give. A Walbro (< $100) fuel pump would be cheap and easy insurance. Gauges are matter of preference at this point.

The real caveat here is the install, and whether it is beyond someone's personal mechanical or financial abilities. Truthfully though, it would only be slightly more effort than installing a TBE.

You're way off base here.
With respect, no he's not. By your own admission, you say $2k for the set-up but then qualify it by adding you need an ECUtek and fuel pump to "nail it down". Chances are if turboed cars are new to this guy, he doesn't have the knowledge to tune it right, so in steps the tuner shop and next thing you know, $5k out of the pocket. I think $7-8k might be stretching it, but what you described is a $4k affair if you do it all by yourself. Doesn't really sound like much of a bargain to me.

I dont think a twin scoll is $2k... but lets say it is you still need to install everything or pay to have it done and get new gaskets. I belive there is one vendor that can get jdm gaskets... so good luck with that. :lol: It would be totaly stupid to run a differnt turbo on your stock ecu.



alexcd Go with the accessport. Go with a stage 1 then later if you need more power buy a turbo back and load the stage 2 FOR FREE!


So you are saying that my stock '04 STi has less than 240whp?? I thought they advertised it as 300whp?

Yes it has less then 300whp. Depending on which dyno and where you live it will have very differnt wheel hp. Subarus rating is 300 crank hp.

Now you asked about exhaust tech.
http://www.cobbtuning.com/tech/exhaustdesign/index.html
http://www.vishnutuning.com/exhaust101.htm

With respect, no he's not. By your own admission, you say $2k for the set-up but then qualify it by adding you need an ECUtek and fuel pump to "nail it down". Chances are if turboed cars are new to this guy, he doesn't have the knowledge to tune it right, so in steps the tuner shop and next thing you know, $5k out of the pocket. I think $7-8k might be stretching it, but what you described is a $4k affair if you do it all by yourself. Doesn't really sound like much of a bargain to me.

With respect, he is, and so are you if you really believe those costs. :) My qualification was in regards to extracting the most possible power from the twin-scroll setup. Just as the car runs perfectly fine with stock SOA programming, yet runs much better with an EcuTEK or AP flash, the VF37 will also run fine but much better with a custom tune. It's not required, but if you are looking to get the most from the least, then it's something you want to do.

So let's do a little math:

JDM Twin-Scroill (header, up-pipe, turbo, down-pipe, b-pipe) $1600-$2000
Fuel Pump $100
EcuTEK tune $750
1 Hour of Dyno time $100-$150

Total: $2550-$3000

Now if you need the install done for you, figure another $600-$700 @ $80 an hour. You're still under $4k and home free. Now as to what's a bargain for you, only you can speak to that question

I dont think a twin scoll is $2k... but lets say it is you still need to install everything or pay to have it done and get new gaskets. I belive there is one vendor that can get jdm gaskets... so good luck with that. It would be totaly stupid to run a differnt turbo on your stock ecu.

$2K is the most I've seen the twin-scrolls go for, and that's from Gruppe S. Stephen at IA has them much cheaper. Stephen also happens to have 50, yes that's five zero ;), gaskets in-stock as of Friday, so I would say anyone's luck would be pretty good in that respect.:D

The VF37 is so close to the VF39 that the term "totally different" doesn't really apply. Other than the twin-scroll exhaust housing, it's no different than running a VF30 or 34, which have been shown to run on the stock EM just fine. Like I said before, is it ideal? No. Is it doable until you decide you want, or need, to get it tuned. Yes.

You want more power? Easy to do=Accessport and turboback exhaust. Good stuff:)

You want more torque? I flashed my car with the Accessport and my car ran 273 hp/293 ft.-lb. I'm happy with my torque:)

Mika(still puttin' together my turboback)

I like driving my car as opposed to being a racer, but I do want it to go damn fast! The problem I see is that the 2.5L engine just doesn't have the initial torque of the bigger engines I'm used to. Maybe it's my driving but it's not throwing me in the back of my seat like I had hoped. What mods are specific to gaining maximum torque off the line?

Come see Me and TheMadScientist in Beverly. We will show you the meaning of Torque in an STI.

I dont think Mark even has 2 grand into his STI yet and he is easily over 300/300 at the wheels. His car is brutal. My WRX has a slight edge on top end, but everywhere else his car rapes.

This is a really good post. Thanks. Anyone else from MA with 320whp want to show me their cars?

how much torque do you guys really want I mean the thing can smoke the heck out of any v8 on the street...i mean you can get like an extra 30-45 lbs/tq. with just headers/downpipe/exhaust with the right set up

Z06? I think not.

Z06? I think not.

Change his '...' to 'in the rain' and it will make sense ;) But ya, not a Z06 normally. That is the need for more torque. Who wouldn't want at least enough power to smoke any stock production cars?

offset

Ummm c16.