Man that sucks. I noticed those seals (same for the oil seal on the oil pump) have a small spring inside the inner lip. Make sure those don't fall out. I had it happen on the oil pump, but caught it.

On a different note, is it normal for the pistons to sound real "clacky?" they are really noisy when it cold, especially with the cold air we have been having lately. When the car warms up, I only hear the sound at low idle. I'm assuming (hoping) it's just piston slap. It's really noisy before it warms up though.

2nd update- driving home tonight and car shut off under about 3lbs of boost. i think that this had nothing to do with it, and something between the fuel pump/relay/ecu or something along those lines. the pump isn't priming and i am getting no fuel pressure. more later

:p
I don't plan on going any time soon. It will be a road trip to the nearest 4wd dyno. I would love to hit one up, but I have to clear the credit card first....once again. :D When I do get a chance, I will definitely let you know. And that goes ditto for you.Thanks much. Yeah, right now I'm strapped for time and money.Pat if you have your engine back together I'll hopefully be ready to tune my RS. I'll head up to the dyno with you. I just want to rent the dyno for a few hours and do my own tune.It won't be for some time.


...Man, I hope y'alls cars are fine with the seals.

Any real way to fish the oil seal out a little without damaging it? I don't see any way so far so maybe I'll need to get a new seal?


Alrighty, got another rear crank seal today. My local dealer fortunately had one left. I just put it in and all is now good (cross-n-fingers) :)

On a different note, is it normal for the pistons to sound real "clacky?" they are really noisy when it cold, especially with the cold air we have been having lately. When the car warms up, I only hear the sound at low idle. I'm assuming (hoping) it's just piston slap. It's really noisy before it warms up though.

You've got forged pistons right? Can be normal yes. However, there are certain things to affect the noise from what I've learned. 1.) is the piston to wall clearnace and 2.) is whether the piston is 'on center' or 'offset'. Apparently piston slap is exaggerated with on center pistons and would be further exaggerated with excessive wall clearance.

my .02

Todd

fuse sbf #5 under the hood keeps blowing. only when plug 187 on the ecu is plugged in. far right plug. think the fuel pump is grounding out in the tank?

To get the rear main seal out, I cut the flexible material out that rests on the crank. Took a screwdriver and put it between the block and seal and bent the seal. Then took some 90* picks, stuck them in between the seal and the crank, got it locked down on something, then started yanking on it.

Made sure everything was cleaned out and no seal debris in there. Then pushed the new seal in with my fingers until it wouldn't go anymore. Then used a rubber mallet and beat it in till it was flush with the block.

All is good now.

slorice,

No more smoke I hope?

did you just remove the tranny to get to it? or pull the engine? mine isn't smoking. its a very minute leak.

After the rebuild, I had two issues.

First one was a blue tinted cloud of smoke on cold startup...smelled like unburnt fuel. But I think this was due to pulling the butterflies out of the TGV's.

Second issue was when coming to a stop, I'd push the clutch in and the revs would drop. Sometimes it would just stumble then pick back up, sometimes it would stall out.

Both the issues just magically dissappeared. Damn learning ECU's...

I pulled the motor out to redo the seal. My buddy and I got the motor out in a hour and 15 minutes. Put the new seal in in about 30 minutes. Then dropped the motor in the next evening in about 3 hours. My leak was like someone opened the floodgates on the back of the motor.....

did the leak start out small then get bigger? or as soon as you started it up?

What about breaking these motors in? Should we treat them like they are brand new (well, it is for some of you) and do the 1k miles on dino oil then switch over to synth (my preference) or would it really take that much time to break in? My block is used, but the pistons/rings/crank/ rods are all new of course.

What about breaking these motors in? Should we treat them like they are brand new (well, it is for some of you) and do the 1k miles on dino oil then switch over to synth (my preference) or would it really take that much time to break in? My block is used, but the pistons/rings/crank/ rods are all new of course.


Depends on the rings you used....if you used the stock Subaru rings, I'd go very easy breaking it in. If you used a good quality plasma moly coated ring, heat cycle the engine 6 or 8 times, change the oil, then let 'er eat. ;)

I thought that the whole point was just in seating the rings, so I'd say that you should still do the 1k.

My rings are the ones that came w/all my othe stuff from Crawford. They seemed a little beefier than stock. I may do the 1k thing just to be safe. 690 miles and counting......

soon as I started the car and oil made its way back there, it started leaking ~10 seconds after startup.

i changed my oil at 250, cut the filter, and put dino back in it. then i will switch to synthetic in another 500 miles.

I ran synthetics from the first startup. Changed the oil at 50 miles. Then changed the oil again at 500 miles

Cut the filter?



I ran synthetics from the first startup. Changed the oil at 50 miles. Then changed the oil again at 500 miles
Yeah, I don't really know the theory behind all that...as far as why to use dino or why not to.

If you want to be like Subaru you will use a 30 weight dino oil with tons of moly in it. Valv synpower oil treat in the silver bottle will work to boost the add pack. Maybe 4 quarts of your favorite dino plus one quart of redline or something like that would work too.

cut the filter: used an oil filter cutting tool, or a large pipe cutter, on the end with the opening. remove the filer media, and cut with a knife all the way around each end to the middle, so that you can unfold it like an accordian. hang and allow to drain. inspect for metal shards, pieces, slivers, and or chunks. i found two verrrrrrry tiny slivers that i am not worried about, its a lot less than any other new motor i have ever seen. a minute amount of metal is normal, and you can identify it by color, ferrous or non, size, etc.

edit:http://www.marknorris.com/Single-Pilot-IFR-images/Oil%20Change/oil%20filter%20cutter.jpg

Its creepy how much metal ends up in the filter after break in but its completely normal. Side note- I was changing the oil on a busch car I've been tinkering with it last ran at daytona and there was very little metal in the filter it was very very fine like talcum. Which is surprising for the way it was used.

I plan on running dino until I finish break-in.

Hey, this weekend was spent on cleaning all of the sealent on the heads and such. I plan on using a lot less sealant (Fujibond) than the previous owner did. Using brake cleaner to get a lot of that crud out and then I'll use an air sprayer on my air compressor to get all of the crap out.

I'm wondering while I'm at this point if anyone has any advice, pro or con, as to whether it's a good idea to clean and polish my exhaust ports?

i didn't touch them, and am having no problem with flow. teh t-67 spools ok with them the way they are.

Thanks.

I'm going to do a quick bit of research in the manual as to where I need to apply sealant b/w cam cover/heads, as well as between the cam bearings and the heads, but how did you go about it? Did you replace or at least reseal the cam buttplugs?

Found it.;)
http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/heads_header/headcover.sealant.jpghttp://gpatmac.us/SubaruPics/Head_Sealant.jpg

Did any of you guys have your heads rebuilt? Strangely enough, I had three bent intake valves and two bent exhaust valves. The shop has a bench that they test the heads on for vacuum sealing of the valves and that's how the problem was identified. These are shim over bucket heads though but don't think that would make any difference. Could valve float have caused this??? I did have the redline set up to 7600rpms for while and shift just before that (7500). Very odd I think!

i didn't replace the cam butt plugs. they are not leaking.

Any status updates?

We are supposed to be having a baby today. I'm off this week. I see great potential for getting quite a lot of work done this week once my in-laws arrive.:)

good luck with the baby gpatmac! maybe he can get his first lesson in engine building this weekend? =D

Congrats! New baby in teh house and 4 new ones in the block ;) Good luck!

Congrats!!! :banana:

Congrats! New baby in teh house and 4 new ones in the block ;) Good luck!
Ha ha ha ha.

Thanks all.

We're still waiting...but my 2y/o is taking a nap.:devil:

Hey, OT.

What HP/TQ do y'all think I will see if I were to tune it myself. I feel pretty comfortable doing it myself. I completely tuned my own stage 4 back in Hawaii (along with a guy named Is2Scooby) where there wasn't an AWD dyno, and got a 12.7 @ 104.6.

Rehash of my mods besides the 257 w/ CP pistons: Fujitsubo tri-Y, unequal length headers (ceramic coated), UTEC, hacked/stock injectors, Walbro, FP Green 7cm, Greddy FMIC, TXS dp, Stromung catback, and V7 STi heads w/o AVCS.

I'd like to take it to a dyno, but based on my schedule and my location, it's not as easy as it seems.

Go for it!! I am in the same boat, unfortunately it's almost time to start tuning and the laptop took a dump. Go figure. My car dumps so much gas at anything over 12 psi that it stutters. (this was my way of making sure I didn't get too anxious. :p) Now I'm stuck for a bit. Oh well. I would think you would see the higher side of the 300-400 hp range with your setup?!? Just a mis-educated guess.

Thanks Matt.

I need a little help.

I had just sealed the AVCS cam caps and was applying 7lbs of torque to the gold bolt (closest to the gear) when the bottom 1/4" of the bolt snapped off down in the hole.

Man, this is the slowest engine rebuild known to man.:(

WOW! that's not good

Drill and tap set??

Yes.

I'm just worried about the thin aluminum wall.

Right now, I'm thinking of just retapping and cutting one of my old bolts shorter.

I'm too frustrated right now. I'm going to do a little CSI later tonight.

Damn! I only had 7lbs on it.

How thick is the bolt. If it's thick enough to drill a 1 mm hole in the center of it, you might be able to use a extractor. I've had pretty good luck with them.

Need to know the size of the bolt and what kind of access you have to it.

If you have good access it should not be a big deal, if its difficult to get a clean shot at it, then things get complicated.

If you have access!

Put a few drops of penetrating oil in the hole --- let soak for a while.

Get a punch that will just fit in the hole, and sharpen it to a good point.

Slide it in the hole and get a clean center punch "EXACTLY" in the middle of the bolt. Don't whack it too hard or you'll swell the bolt end, you only want to get a clean starting point for your drill bit.

Take a drill bit that is a couple sizes too small for your easy out and just start a hole in the bolt. THis is only to get a good pilot hole for the next drill -- you only need to go in a mm or two.

Next take the recommended size drill for your easyout and drill the hole through the center of the bolt. Be very careful to make the hole as close as possible to exactly on center and in line with the axis of the bolt.

Don't drill too far, you don't want to strike oil or water !!!! ; )

Put the easy out in the hole, give it a gentle tap with a hammer to seat it and carefully turn it in the proper direction to remove the bolt.

You want to turn it while applying firm downward pressure so the easyout flutes stay engaged in the hole in the bolt end.

If it refuses to budge, relax take a break ------- This is a process you do not want to rush ---- it will take as long as it takes.

Try again, if it still fails to move, warm the area of the hole with a propane torch , or by placing a 100 watt light bulb a few inches from the hole until the metal is warm to the touch, and try again. Even though the bolt does not appear to move it may in fact be backing off a very small amount on each attempt. keep at it and you will nearly always get the job done.

You absolutely do not want to break the easy out off in the hole so slow and deliberate is the key word to this process.

Larry

I will have some answers and some form of a result tomorrow.

Thanks (for the 100th time) Larry.

Thanks also STiDreams.

It's been soaking all night. Here's what it looks like. Not as bad as I initially thought.
http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/Second_Try/broke.head.bolt.jpg

http://gpatmac.us/SubaruPics/New_Engine/BrokeHeadBolt.jpghttp://gpatmac.us/SubaruPics/New_Engine/BrokeHeadBolt.jpghttp://gpatmac.us/SubaruPics/New_Engine/BrokeHeadBolt.jpg

Disregard.

Bolt is out.

There was enough above the surface that I used a cold chisel to make a small ridge and then used channel locks to loosen it enough. Then it came out easily with my fingers.

At what point is it easiest to slide the engine back in? What I mean is, will it be easiest to leave the intake manifold, ac/alt/ps and belt off until the engine is back in the car?

You can pretty much put the engine in whole, but you have to take into account the PS and AC pumps, as I'm guessing you popped them off the motor and laid them to the side when removing the motor.

Also, leave the radiator & fans out until the motor is bolted into the mounts and trans.

BTW, I think those cam bolts all need to be lubed (3bond or something) before tightening... check the manuals on that one. I remember stripping one out before and thought that knowledge was the result of my oops.

BTW2, I can't believe this car STILL isn't back together. :eek:

My job is long hours and drains me. That and I have a 2y/o and a 1 week old.:) Those are the best excuses I have. That and I don't trust myself to go too fast (or too slow, for that matter.)

Yes, I pushed the a/c to the side and the ps is laying on the trans.

Cam cap bolts? Nah, it just said to apply oil to the cap bearing face and to lube the oil seals. It also said to use a couple of special tools to get the oil seals in.:rolleyes: I just put them on the gear-ends of the cams. I imagine that there's good reason to use the ST's, but it didn't make sense to me.

I will tell you that the cam bolts on the AVCS dealy, the gold ones, certainly feel like they require EXACTLY the proper torque specs.

Good job !!
You usually only need a fraction of a turn to get a twisted off bolts out.

You done good !

Larry

gpat,

Wow, seems like I'm following your foot steps :lol: Although I think you've got maybe a month or so more on the build time right now than I do (my situation is similar but no new born right now just a bunch of things that I'm juggling including a 22 month old).

On the gold cam cap bolts, yeah they definitely feel different when tightening them down. It's like they're weeker to some extent vs their green cam cap bolt cousins.

On my build I ended up with a lot of down time with the cyl head rebuilds that I had completed and good thing I did since I had five bent valves. Plus add in wait time on gaskets, valves, etc etc through Subaru parts. Oh yea, and all of the porting BS that I got caught up in which doesn't seem to end :) Other than that, my engine looks like a real engine now. Everything is pretty much bolted on the engine stand and the last thing I need are my new shims (that was a PITA to measure but glad I did) and they will be here by Friday this week.

Good luck on everything and congrats on your new baby!

Todd

P.S. You should probably put the engine in assembled with the intake mainold and PS/Alt as those are your lift points. Radiator goes in last.

glad to see progress... even if it is slow, it is still progress. :)

thanks for sharing the pitfalls with the board.

-ken (dad any day now)

ps. pat, got your email... no worries man! ;) i'm glad to give back to the community.

At what point is it easiest to slide the engine back in? What I mean is, will it be easiest to leave the intake manifold, ac/alt/ps and belt off until the engine is back in the car?
I waited to put all that stuff back on until the engine was back in and fitted to the tranny. I guess because that's the way it came out. I ended up cutting and drilling two boards and bolting them into where the 4 bolts (per side) that the intake manifold was on. That's how I lifted the motor in and out of the engine bay. To make a long story longer, I guess you could do it either way.

;)

Thanks.

I'm thinking I'm going to go ahead and bolt everything back on.

go gpatmac go! make sure to take MANY pics for all of us who will be doing this swap this summer. thanks again for this gift back to the community.

Here it is right now.:Dhttp://gpatmac.us/SubaruPics/New_Engine/putting_together.jpg
http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/Second_Try/putting_together.jpghttp://gpatmac.us/SubaruPics/New_Engine/putting_together.jpg

dood!! I think you are missing a couple things!!! :D

Weight reduction.;)

...how were you able to see that cam cover washer that I can't find?;)

dood!! I think you are missing a couple things!!!

dude, you are evil. :devil: :lol:

no i'm not.....I was drunk! :lol:

But seriously, you ARE missing some stuff...there's no way it's going to run like that...






:lol:

I've taken my engine in/out and assembled/disassembled it about 5 times now, just assemble everything on the stand, it's less leaning over the car.

Here is mine currently. Heads aren't torqued down yet. EJ257 w/forged pistons, worked V8 RA heads. Waiting on buckets to be machined for the DPR AVCS cams.

http://my.execpc.com/~pbedard/newcar2/IMG_1744.jpg

And it's going into this car :devil:

http://my.execpc.com/~pbedard/newcar2/IMG_1739.jpg

Put it in the 442.;)

Nice. That thing is going to be a monster. What? 2700-2800lbs? Which trans?

Weight will depend what trans I end up using, I'm debating right now. I have a 6MT with a Cusco front LSD but I may go with a 5MT 1/2 dogbox setup. If I do the 5MT it will probably be close to 2650 lbs (minimum allowable weight is 2600), 6MT it will be closer to 2700. It's being built for autocross and probably won't see too many street miles. I'll probably do a full writeup on the car once it's done. Maybe a month or so...hopefully.

The 442 currently has no engine, there is enough room in there to maybe put in two subaru engines...

gonna go play in SM?

Alright, I have to stop and redirect towards something else until I learn the answer to this....

My new heads are missing the intake manifold gasket 'dowels'. They're on my old heads but obviously won't come out without me tearing them up (I guess unless I use the torch or something.)

http://www.streamload.com/gpatmac/dowels.jpghttp://www.streamload.com/gpatmac/Car/Clutch_and_Stuff/dowels.jpg

edit: the picture is not my cylinder head.

The dowel pins are mostly for your convenience, rather than being necessary.

If I recall correctly they are standard run of the mill "roll pins".
You can probably buy an equivalent pin at any large hardware outlet.
Or order them from Mc Master and Carr.
They come in standard sizes and lengths. If the OEM are a bit short of a standard length you can shorten generic roll pins with a grinder, put a little chamfer on the shortened end and your good to go.

Just measure their installed diameter and over all length and get new ones.
Tap the new ones in the holes and your off to the races.

Larry

Sweet. Thanks Larry.

More tomorrow.

Alrighty, got stopped again. Problem: how to plumb and electrically connect v7 AVCS heads when I don't plan on using the AVCS (Ron @ Axis built them for that purpose.)

I'm not completely certain how to hook up the v7 heads. There's an electrical connector on the back of the heads (red) and one on top of the AVCS (yellow). I'm pretty certain that the one on the back of the heads is the only one I need to be concerned with, re. cam pos. sensor; what do I do with the AVCS elec. connector? Bottom line, I don't have any more male electrical connectors to plug into either. BTW, the 2nd picture has a better view of the AVCS electrical connector. I denoted it with a yellow arrow.

Also, with regards to blue and green arrows, do those just need to be plugged?

http://www.streamload.com/gpatmac/plugs/car/RightRearHead.jpg

Now on the second picture, you can see where there were 2 breather holes on the head (red and green). One hole has been plugged (green) and the other has a threaded connector on it. I don't see where I have any extra breather hose(s) for them. Do I just plumb them into my catch can?

http://www.streamload.com/gpatmac/plugs/car/LeftTopHead.jpg

Last question. In the second picture I denoted a oil hole (light blue) on the AVCS. Below is the oil line that goes to it. Do I need to connect that oil line since I believe that that capability has been eliminated? I know that sounds like a stupid question but it brings up the question for me: 'how will my cams get any lubrication?' That, and I believe that I only have one oil line and it's for the left head.

http://www.streamload.com/gpatmac/plugs/car/HeadOilLine.jpg

tttbump

in the first pic, the two plugs wont be used, the yellow one is on top of the AVCS solinoid, the one in the back is a hall effect sensor thats used to time AVCS. You have no plugs for these on your harness and your ECU wouldnt know what to do with them. the only one you should keep is the one that reads off your cam gear. as for the oil lines, on the AVCS car you would need these lines to continue out to the turbo, at least on the pass side, Im not 100% sure what the routing is on non STI so I would double check on your own car to make sure the oil delivery doesnt need to extend past the head, if not then they will need to be plugged, hope this helps:)

It most certainly does. I sent you a pm, but I think you can disregard.

Thanks very much for your help.

Unfortunately, it looks as though the WRX right head has an oil inlet on the bottom right that's in there pretty good.

This is the rear of my old WRX right head.
http://www.streamload.com/gpatmac/plugs/car/WRXoilpassage.jpg

This is the plugged hole on the rear of my new STi head.
http://www.streamload.com/gpatmac/plugs/car/STi_rear_plugged_oil.jpg

Yea thats the oil return line for the turbo. Is it plugged permanently? If it is, running a new return line to your oil pan is all I can think of.

:(

Thanks.

I feel like I'm swimming upstream in molasses.:) The more answers I get, the farther I get from completion.:)

Edit: nah, I don't think it's necessarily permanent. That's just Fujibond around that plug, but I'm not doing anything further until I get a chance to talk to Ron Williams.

Why would they have plugged that hole Pat? That seems to be a little rediculous to plug the oil return line.

Its possible the previous owner ran a larger turbo that had to have an oil return line fit elsewhere. That or it was plugged to protect it when it was yanked before. Still odd tho.

I spoke to the previous owner. The plug is coming out, but boy it's not cooperating.

That and the oil return pipe on my old WRX heads has to come out. It's not very easy neither.

At least I now have the answer to the electrical connectors. All are to remain unplugged, but I took the old cam position sensor off of my old heads and put it on the new heads. It goes in that little aluminum hook (white arrow) that, in the pic below, is between the oil filler tub and the intake cam gear.

http://www.streamload.com/gpatmac/plugs/car/LeftTopHead.jpghttp://www.streamload.com/gpatmac/Car/lefttophead.jpg

Lastly, I have one of the oil pressure lines (one of the pictures above) that bolts up to the drivers' side AVCS solenoid but I need to buy one for the pass. side.

Ok, here's some pics to show the most recent conundrum.;)

WRX head - Pass. side
http://www.streamload.com/gpatmac/Car/Clutch_and_Stuff/old_head_oil_return.jpg

STi head - Pass. side
http://www.streamload.com/gpatmac/Car/Clutch_and_Stuff/new_head_oil_return-plugged.jpg

Can't get the oil return line out, and can't get the plug out.

is it possible to drill the plug out?

You might be able to purchase a new oil return line, doesn't seem like it would cost much. Wasn't able to find a part number for it.

blue wrench? ;)

Drill & tap it for an NPT fitting and just put a 90° fitting in there to return to.

I think all of y'all are right....but that isn't the answer I was looking for.:(

:)

Of course this'll add months to the project.

Any chance I could get y'all to look at this thread: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=783868 ?

Thanks much.

I think all of y'all are right....but that isn't the answer I was looking for.:(


I know you must be anxious to get her up running again

Hotrodding trick #362

Get a bar of beeswax. Melt it into the threads of the pipe plug using a small butane torch. Remove the plug.

As far as the oil return: I removed two different ones by simply turning it so I could whack it with a urethane hammer...presto!

Good luck.

Steve

<Back-pat>
I don't know if I read it in the FSMs or in the Motor Age ASE Certification Self-Study Guides I purchased (as general self-study material, not for certification for myself), but I knew of that trick!

If anyone is interested, I found them pretty decent:

http://store.yahoo.com/motorage/moagaseceseg.html

I got:

Engine Machinist (M1,M2,M3)
Advanced Engine Performance (L1)
Engine Repair (A1)
Engine Performance (A8)
Manual Drivetrain and Axles (A3)

I can tell you that the oil return pipe comes out fairly easily. Like Steve said, it'll twist by turning it and either smack it with a mallet or pry it out (that's how I did it with litle effort). I've done this on two cars now. It's a simple push fit. Careful though, it was confirmed recently by the Subaru help line (the ones that the dealer service dept uses direct) that the oil return is NOT available by itself. You must purchase the whole head :lol: seriously!

On the other STI head, maybe once you get that plug out it'll turn out to be a push fit too which I bet it is. Hopefully for you and you can be on your way.

Wow, I can't believe that the return line isn't sold separately that is silly. Imagine going to the dealer and getting charged for new heads when all you needed was the return line ;).

Explains why I couldn't find a part number for it.

Exactly! I looked for months and months with the aid of others at a dealer service dept. If you really needed to though you could have one made by a machinist, which is a piece of cake.

I know you must be anxious to get her up running again
You, sir, ain't whistling Dixie.;)

Thanks Steve and Mr Marcel. I will most certainly give it a try tonight.

JBlaine, I am constantly on the hunt for good books like that. Thanks a million.

SWEET!

Anyone know what the OEM head bolt type/style is? Whatever it is, I don't have a socket for it. Need info as quickly as possible. Thanks for any info.

12pt 14mm socket is what I find via search... is that the proper tool, or "one that works" ?

It isn't the proper tool, but you'll see that it works perfectly. When I used it I saw that I need not worry about stripping the head of a bolt.

Back at it (yeah, pretty much haven't touched it since June. Been busy.)

***Anyhow, this is a bit long and today was a tremendous lesson in humility. I never thought I was even a good mechanic, but today was an example of inefficient time management and organization. That and I was better able to see how limited my assembly knowledge is.***

The Indy Suby crew convoyed down early this a.m. and was very motivated to gitterdun. About 10 eagerly selfless enthusiasts that I quickly bored and disappointed.:)

We did however accomplish completing the heads. They just needed a final clean, some good lube. I was rushing it, and we ended up putting on a cam cover and the cam gears, only to realize that the plastic cover hadn't been put on, or realizing we hadn't lubed the cam under the caps...

We got the pilot bearing in the flywheel, bolted it on, and got the clutch and pressure plate on. I had bought this clutch assy from n2xlr8n for $250. It's a Hypersingle that Steve advised me only needed to have the flywheel resurfaced and a new clutch disk. I finally received the disk (got an awesome deal from Brett @ Rennick). My feeling is that I got an almost brand new Hypersingle for about $525.:)

Got the spark plugs in and the coil packs bolted on.

Got all of the cam gears and rollers bolted on and torqued, but as we started to install the timing belt, realized that belt that I'd bought from the dealer was for a 2.5 RS or something. Way too small. I should have counted the teeth as soon as I got it...or at least held it up to my old one.

We were about ready to drop it in but I couldn't find the pressure plate bolts. My friends Nate and Zach went out to get some but by the time they got back, it was pretty late, so I decided to call it a day (actually I didn't ask them to get some lock washers and didn't want to torque any of the pp bolts until I went and bought some tomorrow.)

It was a good time to break anyhow, because I'm not totally convinced that I have a good plan for a couple of things.

1. Based on the fact that I have an oil-cooled only FP Green, I want to make absolutely sure that I'm feeding and returning the oil into it appropriately. I think that I had it setup correctly before I pulled the engine. It's just that since I'm using JDM STi heads vs. the WRX heads I had on before, I saw how my friends STi's had the long, bendy brass line coming from the top of the right side avcs solenoid, routed under the turbo inlet pipe, and then what looked to be fed into the top of the turbo. That didn't make sense to me. I'm now convinced that the way I had it before is the best option, but I want to research further to make sure I have it rigged wisely.

Lastly, I'm still not convinced that my plan for head/crankcase/PCV ventilation is the best. Right now, I'm leaning towards routing cc and PCV into one catchcan, and the heads into another.

I bought a USDM STi PCV assembly, complete, but to be honest, I can't make heads nor tails of it. It's got some sort of electrical connector on it, and the valve itself doesn't look anything like my old one that I took out of my old (but still on the engine) throttle body.

Pat, no one was disapointed other than the fact we all want to see your car back online. I can help with the PCV, I understand how it hooks up, but like I said yesterday. You don't need two catch cans. You can easily hook the PCV, and both heads into the same catch can. I had mine done that way. I can't wait to get down there soon to get everything done, and I think that is the consensus with everyone. **** happens, don't blame it on poor planning. You are busy as hell all the time.

I was only down a month!!

hurry up!! :p

j/k good luck..let us know if you have any questions.

Last night I felt like the biggest n00b and was more than a little deflated. But then, I saw the title of this thread and remembered how much trepidation I had when I began. I'm an Infantryman trying to do an engine swap; something that another profession makes a lot of money doing.

I've since learned that anyone can do this. It's not hard but can be pretty involved, depending on how well or little your understanding of what everything in the engine bay does, how many systems there are and which parts are each system comprised of...

I avoided having people over while doing my work, aside from a friend who was helping all the way with the work. I did it because I never wanted to feel watched while working. It leads to far too many oversights and a removal of my mind fully from the process which I want to be totally immersed in for learning's sake and care's sake. As a first-time event, for me, it was unacceptable to feel like I could not focus due to people being around my space doing whatever. Hell, they could have been inside my house out of sight and they would have been in the back of my mind still.

A bunch of people asked if they could hang out on various days while I did my work. I said no politely and explained why. If I do 2 more, I'll likely loosen up on that.

Keep at it, man.

It makes me chuckle that you posted that. I was sincerely touched by the showing. The dudes actually woke up at 7 am in order to drive an hour to my house. Many of them were still at that stage where swapping a downpipe is menacing, but there was one guy, very nice, but I got the feeling that he'd done this a time or two. I thought to myself how much of a dufus I must've seemed.:)

Why do I see a puzzle here? I'm using my old WRX intake manifold. I bought the US STi PCV (what you see here.) Also, the gray plug is an electrical connector.
http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/Second_Try/080705/pcv.system.jpg
http://gpatmac.us/SubaruPics/New_Engine/080705/PCV_system.jpg

your wife/so is gonna be pissed about that living room rug.

;)

the 04 and later pcv systems had that solenoid. you don't have the harness for it, nor the ecu to control it, i'd wager.

Hey Pat, it may be set up like the 04 WRXs, where the PVC was relocated to a bracket or something, instead of being directly placed on the intake.

I'll have to take a look under the hood of one. I need to see what the elec connector is for.

*yank*
*yank*

Is it in yet? :)

No.

No excuses, but 1) I'm in Army recruiting, and 2) the 'recruiting year' ends in about 2 weeks.

Thanks for following the saga, though.

Tell us when you are ready for help Pat.

You'll be the first to know.

I've got the timing belt and I put washers on the pressure plate, so as soon as I get the chance, it should drop right in.

Sounds good!

I hate to ask n00b questions....

[this isn't my tensioner] Up where his thumb is on top of the rod, is there some sort of spacer that is intended to go beneath where I've currently got the allen wrench on mine; something to keep the hydrolic innards inside?
http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/Second_Try/tensioner.jpg
http://gpatmac.us/SubaruPics/New_Engine/tensioner.jpg

Pat, it just occurred to me that I have my old one to look at. Of course that wouldn't occur to me on the phone with you :)

I looked. There is nothing there but the snap ring and the black piece that the ring is holding in place.

By all means, other people please comment and confirm though...

^^^Same here; I've got both the 257 and 205 tensioners (they look the same), and there's nothing there but a snap ring.

S.

Sorry,

Just getting back from work. Thanks Jeff and Steve.

I'm moving right along....

What happened was that as I was taking the engine out and apart, I tried to put things all together or putting bolts back where they came from. A few weeks (or months) ago I had grouped some sort of washer and a small rubber o ring with the tensioner, then today I couldn't find them. I thought that since I had put them all together....that they must go together.

Well, now that I'm back, the belt is going on tonight. Thanks again.

We're gettin' there...
http://gpatmac.us/SubaruPics/New_Engine/080705/together.front.jpg
http://gpatmac.us/SubaruPics/New_Engine/080705/together.rear.jpg

Go go go go go go :)

Atta boy.

Hey...that clutch assy looks familiar. ;)

I forgot to send the PP bolts to you; If you want 'em, let me know. If not, make SURE you use GRADE 8 (metric equivalent) bolts

Good luck with your project, Pat!

S.

I'm proud of you. It took guts.

be careful with those aftermarket pullies, stock ones have harmonic balancers for a reason. good luck with your project, it will be a great feeling when you turn that key and her fire up :D

be careful with those aftermarket pullies, stock ones have harmonic balancers for a reason.......
Actually (and this is just hear-say) I read thru a couple "debates" on the subject and per Subaru it's just a pulley (the stocker that is) and nothing else, but I might actually be wrong. I wish I still had the link... But, as with any info you get from a forum, use your best judgement.

Edit: Link http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=834253&highlight=pulley+harmonic+balancer

I'm sure there are plenty other "for" and "against" threads.

Anyways.......Go Pat!! Woot! heh heh

Go go go go go go :)
Atta boy.

Hey...that clutch assy looks familiar. ;)

I forgot to send the PP bolts to you; If you want 'em, let me know. If not, make SURE you use GRADE 8 (metric equivalent) bolts

Good luck with your project, Pat!

S.
I'm proud of you. It took guts.
Anyways.......Go Pat!! Woot! heh heh

Thanks for the encouragement. I have been wracking my brain all afternoon thinking of what else needs to be done (or would be most feasible to do first) before I drop it back in, but didn't come up with anything. Tomorrow morning, as soon as I get my coffee-induced mojo going, it's going in. I think I might go get a motorcycle jack for the trans before I start, though.

Steve, thanks much but I'm gtg. Those are 8s with locking washers. OEM torque spec for pp calls for 11.8lbs. Does the Exedy call for another spec?

Also, I didn't understand what this extract from the manual means and didn't see the special marks it's referring to.
When installing the clutch cover on flywheel, position the clutch cover so that there is a gap of 120° or more between "0" marks on the flywheel and clutch cover. ("0" marks indicate the directions of residual unbalance.)

be careful with those aftermarket pullies, stock ones have harmonic balancers for a reason. good luck with your project, it will be a great feeling when you turn that key and her fire up :D
I had been running that pulley for about 1500-2000 miles before the engine broked on me. No noticeable problems. Thanks for the mo. I'm shooting for 'all conditions are a go' next weekend.:)

Did you use loctite on the flywheel bolts?

When installing the clutch cover on flywheel, position the clutch cover so that there is a gap of 120° or more between "0" marks on the flywheel and clutch cover. ("0" marks indicate the directions of residual unbalance.)
I read that too. I didn't see anything real obvious though. There was a kinda circular indentation on my clutch cover. I just set it around 120 deg from the spot where the flywheel was drilled out for balance. I really don't know if it even matters. Sorry I don't have anything more concrete.

Did you use loctite on the flywheel bolts?
Yes. Not until yesterday, though. The only things I've used loctite on are the flywheel, heads-to-header, and up/turbo bolts.

I read that too. I didn't see anything real obvious though. There was a kinda circular indentation on my clutch cover. I just set it around 120 deg from the spot where the flywheel was drilled out for balance. I really don't know if it even matters. Sorry I don't have anything more concrete.
I get the feeling that it isn't so important with aftermarket. Here as soon as I get back to work, I'm gonna check my oem for what they're talking about. Isn't it funny how I'm just thinking of that now?;)

I'm for balancing anything that rotates at high RPM and that includes the flywheel. There was a guy here on NASIOC that said his/her flywheel was 9 gms out of balance. At 7000 RPM that's a lot of force.

http://gpatmac.us/SubaruPics/New_Piston/backtogether.jpghttp://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/new_piston/back.together.jpg
I can admit to it now (because it may be appropriate to my next question) but I got the engine and trans back together and realized I'd left the clutch release fork out.:rolleyes:

Anyhow, how do I check to ensure that the engine and trans are mated properly? I have to add that right now, the linkage is in pieces in the console. Tom@Kartboy sent me a free 6mt shifter and bushings, so the shifter is unbolted from the 'pushrod' that the shifter is bolted to. I can push it forward and pull it backwards and it 'notches' and you can hear it clunking a little up near the input shaft, however, when I push the clutch in, the release fork moves but the clutch pedal stays on the floor until I pull it back.

If I'm good, then I've just quite a bit of bolting on before I can start it up.

the clutch will do that until you bleed it. the engine and trans wont mate if they aren't lined up.

I can push it forward and pull it backwards and it 'notches' and you can hear it clunking a little up near the input shaft, however, when I push the clutch in, the release fork moves but the clutch pedal stays on the floor until I pull it back.
Pat, are you sure that the clutch release fork is properly seated in the two brackets on the release bearing? Not to cause alarm, but I had a similar situation once. I somehow managed to only have one arm of the fork set properly into the release bearing and it bent to bracket on the bearing. Just a thought...but what attitude posted may be more plausible in this case. I've never bled my clutch though in all the bajillon times I've pulled that tranny.

Matt,

I'll have to look when I get home. I'll probably give you a call, too.

Thanks,

Hey Pat, sorry we must have had a bad connection. I only caught about 10% of our conversation. :p Give me a call later if you need to!

I'm for balancing anything that rotates at high RPM and that includes the flywheel. There was a guy here on NASIOC that said his/her flywheel was 9 gms out of balance. At 7000 RPM that's a lot of force.


:D That was my brand new from Folger Subaru 6MT flywheel...unbelieveable.

Hey Pat, sorry we must have had a bad connection. I only caught about 10% of our conversation. :p Give me a call later if you need to!

After getting off the phone with you, I'm going to pull the engine/trans apart again because there's no way I could have gotten 'lucky' and mated the release fork to the to bearing.

Thanks Matt.

it'd cause a long term damage, but hey. not trying to be a tool, just don't want to see anything bad happen :D looks like you're getting close !

Pat, are you sure that the clutch release fork is properly seated in the two brackets on the release bearing? Not to cause alarm, but I had a similar situation once. I somehow managed to only have one arm of the fork set properly into the release bearing and it bent to bracket on the bearing. Just a thought...but what attitude posted may be more plausible in this case. I've never bled my clutch though in all the bajillon times I've pulled that tranny.

I'm having a heckuva time getting them to line up. A friend suggested leaving the engine and trans mated and pulling the rubber boot off so I could see as I'm trying to guide the fork over the to bearing collar.

http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/Second_Try/t.o.bearing.jpg

I think I'm about to go ahead and separate engine from trans and do it the hard-but-correct way.:)

I'm getting frustrated. Can't seem to get the fork on the TO bearing collar. Now one side of the fork is attached (I think) but the other isn't. Now the attached side won't come unattached.

http://gpatmac.us/SubaruPics/Clutch.Fork1.jpg

Hmm. Wish I could more help, but this part is all a blur in my memory now. It all just went together. I do remember, however, that when I got in the car and thought it was all done, I went to disengage the clutch and the pedal went to the floor and stayed there. BlackEyeII, who was helping me, was leaning over the engine bay while I was in the cabin. He "did something" and it was fixed. The release fork definitely was already in place properly before he did anything though.

If you PM him and reference your posts, he may remember.

We didn't have any trouble/hangups at all with the release fork as you mention above though :(

Did you remember to take the release lever shaft out (side)?

Yeah, now I can't get it back in.

I wouldn't have had any trouble if I had put it in when the engine and trans were apart like I was supposed to.

I'll get it in tomorrow, one way or other.

Just a quick one, are you going to wrap those headers/uppipe?? Sorry if the engines already in but if not its easier with it out :)

Looking good though, I've been following this thread in spirit :)

He had the header and uppipe ceramic coated. Pat, like I have said give me a call if you need help. I haven't head from you for a while.

Clutchcargo,

No, I forewent wrapping them because I didn't want them to corrode.

Nate,

What are you doing tomorrow evening?

I'm up in Michigan for work Pat.

Hmm. Wish I could more help, but this part is all a blur in my memory now. It all just went together. I do remember, however, that when I got in the car and thought it was all done, I went to disengage the clutch and the pedal went to the floor and stayed there. BlackEyeII, who was helping me, was leaning over the engine bay while I was in the cabin. He "did something" and it was fixed. The release fork definitely was already in place properly before he did anything though.

If you PM him and reference your posts, he may remember.

We didn't have any trouble/hangups at all with the release fork as you mention above though :(

what he did was to forefully push the throwout lever back towards the firewall so that the tob snapped into the pressure plate. then the pressure plate's springs did the rest of the work (ie normal operation).

hth
ken

Yes. That ^^^^

PM' you Pat....

what he did was to forefully push the throwout lever back towards the firewall so that the tob snapped into the pressure plate. then the pressure plate's springs did the rest of the work (ie normal operation).

hth
ken
Ken & Jeff,

Um, I'm not trying to be dense but is this what you recommend or just saying how he did it?:)

I dorked around with it again this morning. I'm about to pull it apart again because one 'tine' of the fork is apparently locked in but I can't get the other in....and I can't get the locked one unlocked in order to reposition.

GODDAMNIT!

Thanks for the help.

no pat, unfortunately i don't have 1st hand experience with your PARTICULAR issue. :( you very well might be separating the tranny+block one more time.

when we put mine together we made sure that BOTH fingers from the fork were in place in the TOB, which was on the tranny input shaft. the pivot rod was also installed at this time.

we pulled the alignment tool, then we (well, i) muscled the tranny in place, my partner ran to the front of the car, gave the crank a few degrees left and right to make sure it was mated properly, then came back aft, grabbed a couple of the studs, got it at least mounted, so i could take a breath. then we carefully drew the bellhousing to the block by tightening the studs evenly.

as a last step, while i was in the cabin, ted (the partner) snapped the TOB into the pressure plate by the steps listed above.. essentially put a prybar on the top of the fork and pushed aft. a loud click was heard, and i suddenly had a clutch pedal again.

so tranny pull = tob on pp, which is bolted to flywheel.
tranny replace = tob on tranny, held by fork which is held by pivot

I think I'm following what you're saying.

My tob is already snapped onto the pp. Does that change anything, or is it not supposed to be yet?

not supposed to be yet. that's the last step, after all the bolts are tight and everything back in place.

edit: it's just a snap ring that you SHOULD be able to squeeze back down so that you can remove the tob from the pp. never tried it myself though.

Roger that.

I've had the snap ring on the tob come out pretty easily, especially if you pull it out from an angle (but I think I had the clutch assembly out of the car when I did it).....but I had no idea you could re-install it that way. Maybe I was doing it the hard way???? Oh well, whatever works.

Alrighty. Not much of an update except to say that I'm like 98.9% there.

My friends John and Mark came over; the clutch release fork is in correctly, the engine and trans are together and mostly torqued (I'm gonna need some helicoil in the starter bolt holes. AC/alt/PS are on. Vbelts are on and adjusted. Most electrical connectors are on.

Those guys are what the Subaru community are all about.

Current status:
http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/Second_Try/in.progress.jpg
(http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/editpost.php?do=editpost&p=11243506)

Purty :)

That looks like an old OEM fuel filter. They've been all silver for 3 years now. Might want to replace that? *shrug*

I'll check out the price for them.

I also learned they made my car with the same long accelerator cable as an RS. My buddy's cable is a lot shorter than mine.

My buddy's cable is a lot shorter than mine.
That's not what he said when I talked to him...


Sorry, I couldn't resist.

Hey, they don't call me Horse Peck for nothing.;)

What's the general guidance for using helicoil? Starter would probably be a bit of a hazard if I don't either re-thread or use helicoil.:(

Hey, they don't call me Horse Peck for nothing.;)

What's the general guidance for using helicoil? Starter would probably be a bit of a hazard if I don't either re-thread or use helicoil.:(

I know this doesn't help you much, but it's going to be a bear in that location. What I've done in the past (usually cylinder head intake bolts) is simply follow the directions given. Take your time.

S.

This says it way better than I could ramble about from memory:

http://www.roadstarmagazine.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=233

Thanks much, Steve & Jeff.

I'm going to stop by NAPA as soon as I get off work. Seems easy enough (though to do it right, I hope I don't have to pull the engine back again.)

Thanks much, Steve & Jeff.

I'm going to stop by NAPA as soon as I get off work. Seems easy enough (though to do it right, I hope I don't have to pull the engine back again.)

A 90* 3/8" Angle Pneumatic drill comes to mind. Chicago Pneumatic P.N. CP879...sold for $85 @MSC. I'd pay $85 not to pull the engine again.

Good luck to you, Pat. Let us know if we can help further.

S.

http://www1.mscdirect.com/ProductImages/0498981-11.jpg

Roger that.

This shouldn't be too much of a task. Thanks again.

Everything's together (except for the starter). I'll be tapping (that ass) the starter holes tomorrow (today).

The DP I bought is about 4" too long.:rolleyes::lol:

I have a couple more electrical connectors and vacuum hoses to attach and I still have to fill up all of the fluids. I've gotta get the IC pipes back on and the MAF/air filter. Well, of course I'm gonna need another DP too.

Pat,

Not sure how much length is left in the starter holes but if there is, you should consider using longer bolts (rather than tapping new ones). I've got a few stripped threads on my block and I simply matched up the thread pattern and got the next size longer.

This thread is nearing a year old. I have only one thing to say in response to the original question --

DON'T DO IT!! YOU'LL BE STUCK IN THIS THREAD FOR ALMOST A YEAR BEFORE YOU GET IT TOGETHER!!!!

:D

No one succeeded in talking Pat out of the swap. :-0

Given the tools and some bucks I would do this myself. I've taken the a "general contractor" approach where I hire out the heavy lifting and check all the clearances, gapping, and detailed work myself. While I'm an amatuer, I care more about getting it right than anyone else.

The main caveat is that new pistons and rings, or any other internal component change, is that it changes the "stock" specs. Forged pistons warrant more bore clearance. Intention to run more boost warrants larger ring gaps. Ring material can change ring gap. Boring and honing the cylinder walls raises compression (even if it's slight, it can push you over the edge of tunability). New cams that permit more power at higher RPM benefit from new valve springs and also from changed to the crank to improve high speed oiling. The list goes on and on.

It's all very doable and patience and carefulness rules the day.

DON'T DO IT!! YOU'LL BE STUCK IN THIS THREAD FOR ALMOST A YEAR BEFORE YOU GET IT TOGETHER!!!!

HA HA HA HA HAHA HA.....ha...ha...HAHAHA HAhehe. I should start another thread for a summary. It'll start out, "...anyone can do this, but beyond the normal analysis you might do before you decide to do this yourself, remember to consider the IMPORTANT STUFF! What effect it'll have on your family if you get halfway into the project and realize that you don't have the ability to get it done in a weekend or 6 or 20.:D You still need a means of transportation, so you'll have to buy another car. You could strain your marriage. You could strain your finances. You could a new boss who feels you need to be working 12-14hrs a day and 6 hrs on Saturday. You could break something and have to wait to order it. You could get pissed and put it down for a while (LONG WHILE). Oh yeah, did I say you could spend a lot of money?"

:D

Todd, what do you think about putting a washer and nut on the other end of the bolt? I was thinking of tapping, but haven't put aside the nut idea, tho.

Todd, what do you think about putting a washer and nut on the other end of the bolt? I was thinking of tapping, but haven't put aside the nut idea, tho.

I would go towards the path of least resistance :D Obviously that would not be tapping the holes (now that sounds funny) since doing that with the motor in the car probably won't be easy. When you get it out in the future, then do it.

I bought some longer (113mm) grade 8 bolts with the wider thread pitch. We'll see how it goes. I also bought a tap, but I still need to look long and ponderously at the worksite and make a decision. Thanks.

Sorry Pat, no bites on the downpipe thing.

Matt, thanks for trying.

I guess it turns out that it's a 'jdm' downpipe which I guess the seller felt like keeping to themselves. I guess the distinction between usdm & jdm is something I should have known about.

Matt, thanks for trying.

I guess it turns out that it's a 'jdm' downpipe which I guess the seller felt like keeping to themselves. I guess the distinction between usdm & jdm is something I should have known about.

Man that's bullshish. I hate when people try to unload their crap by screwing over others. Bad karma for them I say.

When we created my prototype turbo system, I had the BPM TBE. I wanted to retain the mid-pipe and axle back and all we had at the time for the new DP that was needed was a USDM HKS unit. Of course, the BPM mid-pipe being longer like the JDM ones required us to cut a section out of the DP. You can do the same. Get a two bolt flange made and weld in place.

The difference between a JDM and USDM downpipe is like 3-4". I forget which was which, but we had to cut the midpipe on a friend's car to make everything fit up together. IIRC, it was a JDM Fujitsubo exhaust he has on the car, and a USDM downpipe.

BTW, the new boss and extra hours thing... thumbs down. I hate working hideously long hours, and flat out refuse to work weekends. If I can't sleep in, there better be a DAMNED good reason.

I didn't even see the last 2 responses. I appreciate it and cutting and welding was my first thought, but I decided to try another cat-delete pipe. I've got a ScoobySport enroute that was a real good price.

A few more issues...... :D:D:D

-No bung for EGT in uppipe portion of header. Will need to get the 2.2ohm resistor.
-Can't figure out where the ~7" long, bent 3/8" hose coming off of (I guess the TGV motor) goes to.
-Haven't come to a conclusion as to how I'm gonna ventilate the crankcase.
o Since I only have the one breather (http://gpatmac.us/SubaruPics/Heads_Header/Heads_22OCT/Heads_5.jpg) on each head, I'm probably just going to thread some sort of filter onto them.
o I read through n2xlr8n's entire vacuum pump thread and it shed some light, but I don't think I'm going with the pump. However, I'm pretty certain I'd like to keep my intake clean, so I'm still studying what I can.
-I'm trying to figure out the best way to heat-proof my wastegate/compressor/boost signal hoses. I tried using some cheapy braided lines, but I don't think the fittings are very sturdy or capable of clamping on well enough. I'm probably gonna just use some wrap around them. BLING!
-All that's left is to go back through and re-torque every bolt I see, fill my fluids, put the [dead-by-now] battery back in, and reinstall all of the ic pipes. I am looking for some good clamps. I think pepboys has some that aren't too bad.

I'm tired of studying.

-Can't figure out where the ~7" long, bent 3/8" hose coming off of (I guess the TGV motor) goes to.

Believe it or not, it doesn't go anywhere. It just hangs there. I guess it's like a vent or something to that effect?!

-Can't figure out where the ~7" long, bent 3/8" hose coming off of (I guess the TGV motor) goes to.

-I'm trying to figure out the best way to heat-proof my wastegate/compressor/boost signal hoses. I tried using some cheapy braided lines, but I don't think the fittings are very sturdy or capable of clamping on well enough. I'm probably gonna just use some wrap around them.
- Definitely need a pic to help out on that one

- Heat sheaths (DEI and others) or DEI cooltape

I'd like to see your breather setup when you get it done. I still need to redo mine with catch cans.

Believe it or not, it doesn't go anywhere. It just hangs there. I guess it's like a vent or something to that effect?!




+1 he is correct

DAMNNNNNN! That's a forehead-slapper.;) I remember now! I was spending about 3min. ea. looking at JBlaine's pics. I'm was thinking to myself, "man, I wish I could pan and tilt these pics."

Today's 'research' will be centered around PCV.

2x crankcase breathers, 1x intake breather, 2 (of 4 originally) valve cover breathers. Which are pressurized already? Which are specifically designed as 'feed' and 'return'. My feeling is that there is probably no distinction; they are probably all pressurized or vacuumed, but I just don't know. And I wonder how much pressure for each. I wonder if that is a 'spec' in the FSM or maybe on here somewhere.

Vacuum pump?

:confused: :p The "EJ257....goodbye PCV" thread, which you posted in extensively.

Was I misunderstanding the theme?

While a vacuum pump would be nifty, why not just get one catch can for now and hose from Home Depot and be done with the PCV and Crank case vents for now.

I'm going for the vacuum and have taken tons of ribbing for it. I've not yet heard the thing. According to Darth its like having a shop vac in the passenger seat, but I have a hard time believing that something goes on a Cadillac Escalade is going to be that loud.

While a vacuum pump would be nifty, why not just get one catch can for now and hose from Home Depot and be done with the PCV and Crank case vents for now.
Just being me.:)

During the week, I can't get too much done. Come weekend, I'll get it setup one way or another.

Pat, check the FSM. Mechanism and Function book. It describes the conditions and directions for the airflow through the crankcase, intake, and valve covers.

Roger that. Thanks Jeff.

OT question here for those that frequent the thread:

What is it that triggers the crank sensor? I know the sensor sits right above the crank sprocket on the oil pump. But I'm not sure what it is that it's reading.

Looks like it's reading right off the crank gear....but not the part the timing belt sits on.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v295/SloRice/cranksensor.jpg

From this article, it looks as though it's reading teeth:
Of course, our machine shop experience didn't end there. We still had to fabricate a device that would hold our magnetic pick-up securely in place. Not just any place, mind you. With cylinder one rotated to Top Dead Center (TDC), we had to reference our magnetic pick-up off the eleventh tooth (counting clockwise from the two missing teeth). Making things more challenging, our magnetic sensor had to be air-gapped to the trigger wheel teeth by a scant 0.045 inches--not much wider than a standard spark plug gap! This would necessitate a rigid and stable pick-up bracket.

http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/projectcars/0010scc_subaru/

Hey, shouldn't you guys be in bed!?! :p

Thanks for the info. If it's a magnetic pick-up, I am assuming that it is just using the metal on the crank sprocket "teeth" to determine it's revolution. So I wouldn't imagine it has to be set any certain way. It just works as is...if that makes any sense.

Hey, you just had the drunks answering your questions....well at least one of us was. :lol:

I doubt it has to be set a certain way. As long as the cam sensors are in agreement with what is going on. If you look in my picture, the secondary "teeth" don't go all the way around. There are two flat spots on the gear (one at 9 o'clock and the other at 3 o'clock). That's the only thing that makes me think it has to be a certain way.

Hate to crosspost, but wondered what y'all thought.

This is my diagram for how I'm seeing the crankcase/heads ventilating:

Catchcan (http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/Second_Try/catchcan2.jpg)

Look feasible?

The only thing missing is that I'm thinking about putting some sort of filter just before it goes back into the intake.

What are the considerations, negative and positive? Will this affect rings sealing? If, for whatever reason, I've got more blow-by than I should, what will be the result? Will there be enough vacuum? Too much restriction? Am I just pulling crazy notions out of the air?

Thanks

Man, I'm completely missing the boat.

From an old scoobytech/awdpirates thread (http://awdpirates.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=1106&highlight=pcv) (that many of y'all posted in), the heads are the least of my worries.

I'm going to redo that schematic. I'm either gonna get another catchcan for the heads or just find some breathers for them.

Did anyone try that Krank-Vent valve for turbo applications? http://www.et-performance.com/whats_new.html#turbo

List of what I got done tonight.

http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/Second_Try/almost.jpg

Fitted Stromung shorty dp to turbo, no sweat; fitted Scoobysport front centerpipe to dp (they ain't made for each other. Can you say harmless exhaust leak?) Fitted cp to rear centerpipe (would mate up better but I'm missing donut. They're together, though.)

Got most of the FMIC on and quite a bit more sturdy than before. Setup HKS SSQV to route back into the intake but I'm going to need a longer hose. I may just set it up again to make that horrid, 100% atmo sound, though. We'll see.

Hooked up battery to check the charge and to see if the EDFC wiring fix I did would take. It didn't. (ripped a coupler from RF strut solenoid which defeats the whole system. I'm just now...trying...to fix it.)

Lastly I did some more hard-core pondering of how I'm gonna do the PCV/catchcan thing. (Steve, I know I need to call you.)

Breather1 (http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/Second_Try/breather1.pcv.jpg)
Breather2 (http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/Second_Try/breather2.pcv.jpg)

I just can't come to a conclusion as to how I'm going to manage that 2nd breather seen in the pic. I'm really starting to lean towards letting it vent to air with some sort of a pep-boys breather filter on it.

Here's a diagram for a WRX:
http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/Second_Try/pcv.diag.jpg
I'm thinking that if I were just to Y or T that 2nd breather in between the PCV valve and the Y atop the 1st breather, the pressure from the PCV valve might not allow any vapor to come from the 2nd breather.

2 last thoughts/questions.

I've read and read. I am skeptical of the HARD break in.

I've had the same gasoline in it since it's been on crutches. It's 100% pump. Should I drain it and put 5 gal of new in it?

I've read and read. I am skeptical of the HARD break in.


Don't be. You'll wish you had down the road. Who are you going to believe? The guys that have built and raced engines their whole adolescent and adult lives, or some internet gurus? :lol:


I've had the same gasoline in it since it's been on crutches. It's 100% pump. Should I drain it and put 5 gal of new in it?

Replace it.

S.

i didn't baby my engine. took delivery, heated it up, went 100 mph. ;) hey, it was 4krpms, just like they said at the dealer. :lol:

my compression is tight and oil consumption is low.

fwiw
ken

Well, skeptical isn't exactly the right word. Anxious about doing something wrong is more apt.:)

I'd take it easy for a day or two to make sure it isn't leaking anything, overheating ect. Past that do whatever feels comfortable.

Don't be. You'll wish you had down the road. Who are you going to believe? The guys that have built and raced engines their whole adolescent and adult lives, or some internet gurus? :lol:

S.

Not all the guys that have "built and raced engines their whole adolescent and adult lives" recommend the hard break-in. Here is a thread where Crawford recommended the SOA break-in method on a 2.6L engine:

http://www.iwsti.com/forums/showthread.php?p=329294&highlight=break-in#post329294

...albeit second hand.

Not all the guys that have "built and raced engines their whole adolescent and adult lives" recommend the hard break-in. Here is a thread where Crawford recommended the SOA break-in method on a 2.6L engine:

http://www.iwsti.com/forums/showthread.php?p=329294&highlight=break-in#post329294

...albeit second hand.


I'm not speaking for those folks, I'm speaking for my self....BTW, how many of the remaining recommend "easy" break-in? Do tell. Quirt doesn't, regardless of what some thread stated; I've spoke with him about it.

Do what you want. You may get lucky.

S.

don't use this, get one from TOTALSEAL, it's a 50$ part. but it'll make your piston inserting a breeze.
http://www.totalseal.com/toolsaol.html it's the first on one the list
i tried using a cheap one and didn't work. had to get new rins.(thank god it was only rings)
As for removing wrist pin, it's easy.
1. get a pot small one that will fit a piston
2. fill it with water about 1/2 inch deep(don't get it too high)
3. don't get it boiling but get it hot
4. put paper towel, or shop towel on the bottom,(don't worry it won't burn as long as it's wet
5. put your piston rod assembly in the water with piston top down, and leave in for half a minute(you're heating the piston so it'll be slightly expanded)
6. gently tap the wrist pin out. (assuming you've already removed the lock pin before you warmed it up)
7. same process for attaching new pistons


I would use this type of ring compressor:
http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/OBJECTS/19200/19126.JPG
If you change rods you'll have to remeasure and possibly change out the rod bearings.

I think he's a little further along than that. ;)

Seems so long ago, though.:)

http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/Second_Try/happy.jpg

Fired right up. Crappy idle. Smokey as ****. Then idle jumped up to about 3g's. Then I shut it off.

Scared the f*** outa my wife and kids and neighbors 10 pitbulls.

Goodnight.

I just restarted it this morning. Expected the smoke and initial crappy idle, but after about 10sec, it shot up to 3k rpms again. Then it went back down like it was going to stall, then back up to 3k, but it was like I was steadily hitting the accelerator, "vroom, vroom, vroom..." So I shut it down.:confused:

I don't have it off blocks yet. There are a couple more things I wanted to do before I take 'er out for a spin. Namely adjusting my rear lock-out cable again.

Damn, look at the arms on Gpatmac. he don't need no stinking engine hoist...

I just restarted it this morning. Expected the smoke and initial crappy idle, but after about 10sec, it shot up to 3k rpms again. Then it went back down like it was going to stall, then back up to 3k, but it was like I was steadily hitting the accelerator, "vroom, vroom, vroom..." So I shut it down.:confused:

I don't have it off blocks yet. There are a couple more things I wanted to do before I take 'er out for a spin. Namely adjusting my rear lock-out cable again.

Look at that ham shot!


Are you sure you have all the hoses back on the manifold?

That's an old camera trick.;)

Are you sure you have all the hoses back on the manifold?

Yeah. I mean, I'm not really sure of anything.;) You know, after you start it up, you immediately realize what you forgot to do or did wrong. I'm guessing that being down for 10 months and because of the new pistons and rings, there would be some difficulty.

Lol, yeah, you'll get it.

Sounds like the IAC is freaking out. Just because I'm lazy and don't want to read through 450+ posts, what EMS you running?

UTEC. Still set to 4.2c.

Congrats, Pat!

Thanks much, Jeff.

Now I've gotta adjust my reverse lockout. It doesn't...

Ok, I'm done for now. I wish I had good news but I don't. I did take 'er for a spin, but I'm amazed how crappy it's running. No 'break-in' at all. I just wanted to fill up a tire.

I attached the UTEC and I was right. It was on the 0 or stock map. I hate to admit that that is not the first time I've done that. HOWEVER, while it initially drove ~not bad/not good~, by the time I got home, it was running as bad as when it was on the stock map with the vroom vroom problem back again. DAMNIT!

I went in and change my injector scaling, which made it worse. Something's telling me that it's the ECU. That or I've got some vacuum hoses unhooked somehow.

Lastly, it's light on it's feet, meaning that it's all over the road. I'm going to have to recheck the engine mount bolts.

Such an unpleasant experience. I want to wash my hands of it.:(

I'm more than likely gonna start a new thread in the EM forum (already started one in the tranny forum, but it isn't getting much attention.)

Anyhow, my suspicion is the ECU. It's crazy lean in closed loop. Runs much better at ~25% TPS or 25-40% load. I didn't log, but in 1st & much of 2nd gear (nowhere near full throttle whatsoever) it ran purely crappy, then in 3rd it seemed to run much better. However, I dunno whether this is related or not, when I let off the throttle (non drive-by-wire), it would remain at the same revs for a second before the engine would decelerate. I probably need to readjust my cable.

Of course the things I'm gonna be checking (spent the day wrenching on a buddy's car and thinking about my own):
compression test
MAF, ie. swapping out with another
vacuum hoses/electrical connectors
UTEC...
I don't know what else to look at.

I'M GOING TO QUIT POSTING UNLESS NICK FIXES HIS FRIGGIN' WEBSITE!!!!

Multiple pics, no order: http://gpatmac.us/SubaruPics/New_Engine (http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/)

Zipped: http://www.streamload.com/gpatmac/Car/for.zip.zip (rc/sa)

Hopefully, by the title of this thread it is understood that I'm someone who's never swapped an engine nor replaced internals on my own.....so mistakes would be made.....

-my latest and most humiliating/humbling...I was trying to identify the cause of this my idle so an idea I stumbled across this idea (thanks RiftsWRX and Kingtut12 (http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=879900))[PIC of mine (http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/Second_Try/intake.leak.tool.jpg)]. Unfortunately, I stumbled across another area to check while I was preparing to identify any leaks....

Initially, my throttle cable had been out of adjust. I adjusted it and it idled better but then I while I continued my research, I saw where someone said, "you know I readjusted my cruise control and the problem went away." (thanks Valkahar (http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10391211#post10391211)) I thought, "I never thought to check my cc while I was adjusting the throttle...":rolleyes: Of course it was out of adjustment too, so when I fixed that, I got all fired up that my problems were solved. Went to start it; now it won't start. I couldn't figure it out for the life of me.

.........I LEFT THAT TOOL (CORK) IN MY INTAKE!!!!!

So now, of course, I've got gasoline in my oil, in my combustion chamber, on the tips of my plugs. I've already cleaned my plugs and drained my oil. I'm about to go get another filter, a crush washer, and my buddy told me to look for some sort of Lucas product to maybe negate any trace gasoline in the oil pan and such.

Hey, I'm not above it. I made a mistake. It's that ADHD.....yeah, that's the ticket.

What else have I erred on......?
-Started car with UTEC on stock/zero map.
-Left a pipe on my FMIC unsecured.
-Couldn't get clutch release fork into the throw-out bearing collar.
-Went for a short ride with my rear lug nuts untorqued.:eek:
-You know, I'm convinced now that the reason I had to rebuild because of this very SMALL;) error when we initially swapped the SB in; I had no idea that there was a PCV valve behind the throttle body. Remember I had a bad problem of oil pooling on top of the block? Well, it had to have been because that PCV valve was blowing to atmo. (you know, I'm still not absolutely sure if I've got my crankcase/valve cover venting routed correctly.) Right now, I've got both valve covers connected, with a T to the center crankcase breather, then to catchcan, then to turbo-inlet hose. I've got the passenger-side breather and the PCV valve in the intake manifold in oem configuration; going to the Y then to the turbo-inlet hose. I've got a 2nd catchcan coming; hopefully it gets here today.
-My reverse lock-out on 6mt was way out of adjustment. I don't know if the two are related but that may have caused my reverse fork to bend. I don't know. Anyhow, the car won't stay in reverse; won't go backwards at all, it just pops out of gear.
-While I'm pretty sure how to break the motor in (I think I'm opting for the 'hard break-in' method;)) I also have a brand new clutch and flywheel. I have no idea how to break the clutch in. Before I take another spin, I'll read-up and ensure I do it correctly.
-There's got to be more, I just can't think of anything right now.

Lesson: If you have any indication that your rebuild may take 10 months for whatever reason.....either don't do it, or take it to the dealership, or if you do decide to do it, take very many pictures, and/or write copious notes in a log.

:lol:

"-Went for a short ride with my rear lug nuts untorqued."

Did that. Only it was my fronts. Luckily it dawned on me while doing 70MPH down the interstate and there was an exit ramp. Torque wrench and tools were all back at home, too. We had to stop 5 times and tighten them by hand before we got home (buddy of mine and I).

My breather routing is more braindead than yours and it's been fine for 3000mi, including a track day. I have both crankcase breathers, PVC, and pass. valve cover breather going to turbo inlet hose. I have, separately, the driver valve cover breather going to turbo inlet hose. That's it. I hooked it up temporarily like that and haven't been motivated to screw with it.

Sorry to hear about the 6MT reverse and gassy oil :(

Hang in there.

Jeff,
IT WILL BE UP AND RUNNING TODAY!

Jeff,
IT WILL BE UP AND RUNNING TODAY!
DON'T DO IT!!!

Another two weeks and you can claim it a whole year! Now THAT is a milestone worth that wait. :D

Yer funny.

Jeff,
IT WILL BE UP AND RUNNING TODAY!

Good you better, turkey day (and PDX along with that) will be here before you know it! :p

TADA!!!!!

Purring like a kitten.:D

I cleaned my plugs (rechecked gap .028), drained the oil, changed the filter (another story in itself...first, why are Mobil 1 and K&N so pricey? I know they're no better than Fram. Second, why do the high-end filter makers have two variations for the STi and WRX? We all know they use the same filter.:rolleyes:) Then I added a pint of Marvels, a pint of Lucas, and 3.2 quarts of Dino 10w30. Fired it up. Started in a New York minute.:D

Of course it's smokey as hell coming from the engine. Either it's just dregs or errant droplets burning, or I've got to retorque my header.

misfired on all 4.

If you were burning a lot of oil out of the engine you may have oil fouled the plugs.
The other thing to check is that your ignition harness connectors to the coil on plug modules are firmly seated and the clips are good to hold them in place. The little plastic lock tabs break pretty easy.

Larry

Roger that. I'll report back shortly.

It's idling perfectly, but when I take it for a short spin (very low load/rpms), it still misfires after about 1 mile.

Short vid of it idling (http://www.streamload.com/gpatmac/car/very.nice.idle.mov) RCSA

I shot Larry a PM.

Hooray!!! I sounds great!!

I did rebuild mine, but just oversaw everything I could. We turn over the ignition on Monday, then it's on to tuning.

Sounds like your close, you probably have some minor problem you need to find.

At this point it is sometimes easier to determine what is not wrong rather than what might be wrong.

There are three systems that have to work right for the engine to run smoothly, air fuel and ignition.

I'd take them one at a time and step by step go from one end to the other and double check things and do simple diagnostics to confirm they are not part of the problem.

For example -- air intake system -- visual inspection from the air filter to the turbo, does it all look good? clamps tight, no vacuum hoses missing? are the vacuum hoses on the right connections, maf plug tight, maf installed facing the right way --- etc. etc.

Tape hose connections or spray them with oil or something that will temporarily block a small air leak --- simple step by step process of elimination and it will eventually point you toward a problem or eliminate that system as the probable cause.

Good, luck these sort of problems can be tough to find but are usually something as simple as a hose that "you know you put on" that got knocked off a connector while you were doing something else.

Sometimes the easiest way to validate air hose connections is get a friend with a good running car to park next to yours and do visual comparisons between where your vacuum hoses and his go. The problem is usually in a hard to see place so get a good bright flashligh and mechanics mirror so you can look behind and under stuff.

Larry

...but are usually something as simple as a hose that "you know you put on"

I'm keeping that in mind.:D

I'm back at it.

I'm just kicking around in my mind what might cause misfire at mid-low load and not at idle or revving while not under load.

At this point, I'm thinking from front to back what would cause the mixture to not combust properly; either not at all or insufficiently.

Spark too weak - bad plugs (but all 4?), bad coils (again, since all 4, my first thought then is ECU), too much fuel (my scaling is set to 420/740), bad injector (...again, all 4?). God forbid it's bad exhaust valves.

Would a higher amp alternator cause misfire? I bought a JDM one off of Innovate Automotive.

One last thought about the valves. When I messed up and plugged my intake and tried to start the car and had to do the Kabuki Dick Dance to remedy the gasoline in my oil, could that have damaged my valves?:( GOD! I'm such a dumbass.

Hey Pat, just food for thought. A long while back I had a bad coil pack, and it threw misfire in all 4, but it always started at the same cylinder. I replaced the one coil pack (#3 in my case) and all the other misfires cleared. Maybe you have one bad one?

How do you check?

Well if you assume you only have a single bad coil pack --- I'd probably use a binary search, using known good coil packs off of a friends car.

Replace both coil packs on one side of the engine.
There are 2 possibilies -- no change implies the bad coil pack is on the other head
Problem goes away, -- one of the coil packs you replaced is bad.


================
Changing the coil pack pair makes problem go away,--
replace one of them and see what happens.

If problem returns that is the bad one
If problem does not return the one still not mounted is the bad one.
================
No change, -- swap out one of the other coil packs on the other head

If still no change the remaining coil pack is bad
if problem goes away, the 3rd coil pack was the bad one.

=============


Larry

Larry,

Again I just visually inspected.

I went for a longer ride tonight in order to log. [UTEC logs 1 (http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/Second_Try/14NOV05a.xls) & 2 (http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/Second_Try/14NOV05b.xls) (they are long, low-rpm, low-throttle logs), and Delta Dash logs A (http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/Second_Try/DeltaLog.Mon.Nov.14.2005.a.csv) & B (http://awd.chargeair.boxerwagon.gpatmac.com/New_Engine/Second_Try/DeltaLog.Mon.Nov.14.2005.b.csv)] <--both are in excel format.

What I noticed are that my CEL never flashed unti