Ok so has anyone else been extremely frusterated with the fact that the Hydra (although powerful) is by far the most tedious to tune EMS out there as far as making global changes to the maps??

Well I had it with the editing interface as well as the onscreen information available to you as you are tuning. I will be working on both a supplementary HUD and a program which Rips the main maps out of the .s20 files for easy manipulation in excel. I'll most likely include some simple linear smoothing too.

anybody have any more issues with Hydra EMS tuning that they would like to see included in my excel map ripper?

I have the main fuel and spark maps done. out and back in of the .s20 files.

Stay tuned for the file!

Todd

I very interested, I think we all would be. I don't have my Hydra yet. How are you gaining access to the raw table files? It would seem that the Nemesis software only permits access through it. Can you view the contents of the Hydra ROM as a disk?

I'm interested in the launch control and or anti-lag maps as well. I think I'll be using those for water injection mapping.

Do have USB to RS-232 converter as your link to the Hydra?

Or ethernet to RS-232?

no it's straight RS-232 to the hydra. I am mostly done with my excell program. Basically it circumvents the lame editing tools the hydra offers by editing the map storage files directly. You will load a map out of saved file, and then write the new map back to the file using my program.

I have the Main Fuel and timing maps working in this way. Hydra .s20 files are extremely simple actually, It was pretty easy to find out where the maps are stored and modify them. This program will allow you to rip a fuel map out of a storage file and write it into another file.

With the HUD I am going to try and parse out the RS-232 data coming in from the hydra so we can have a fast data viewable in another window while the "floating grid" is open.

Todd

So are you reading the maps stored on your PC in S20 format, opening that file with Excel? In otherwords you are not reading files off of the Hydra, but a downloaded Hydra map. I agree the S20 format is pretty simple, all you need to do is figure out the delimiter.

There are programs to capture the RS-232 data stream, but you probably know that.

It's going to get tricky to know which version of the table is saved on the Hydra, but I agree some tool that allows multiple cell selection would be great. Especially great when trying to develop a very different map. Be careful with Excel it is notorius for inserting junk into even plain text files.

I believe in Dec. Hydra was talking about big improvements in the software, incorporating most of this stuff... although I've had my unit for 4 months now and have gotten used to most of these "problems" :p

I would love to see this act very much like an ECUTek map. I would love to see my map, and a dyno run/pull superimposed over the map.

Yes, the hydra already does this, but I want to see A/F in a comment window perhaps per cell as the car goes through the cell. Or on the advance map, the knock voltage (heck, why not max allowed knock correction and actual knock correction at the same time!)

Show the map, and show tracking through the cells, and show A/F and knock voltage values (along with max allowable knock correction). That would be a thing of beauty :D

My program will not allow connection to the hydra. It will simply allow an easy way to modify a .s20 file to a different changed map.

It is Basically a VBA module for excell that reads the hex numbers out of the file and generates maps in excell which can be easilly changed / smoothed / whatever. I would like to eventually write some extra modules that would help in spline smoothing and axis switching.

It will not modify any other part of the .s20 file. But it will put in the number you tell it without fail!!

I hope hydra comes out with a better vesion of the software as well! This one is hardly worth our money!! lol

Todd

I would love to see this act very much like an ECUTek map. I would love to see my map, and a dyno run/pull superimposed over the map.

I'd love that feature, but Excel has to be one of the worst graphing programs ever sold.

Todd, so it's a "VBA module," educate me, are you doing development in Excel or VB. I confess more than ignorance of many things Windoze. ;)

I understand, you are working on the PC saved files, then Nemesis "uploads" these to Hydra. Map numbers are in hexadecimal, and must be converted to base ten roman. To see changes in Nemesis you will have to shut down, and re-open the Execel altered map. I just don't see "on the fly" changes unless Nemesis is a more sophisticated a program than imagine (or dangerously simple).

I'd love to see this script developed and would even support a nominal shareware fee. I won't hold my breath for Hydra/Nemesis/Quantum developing "new" software, or making a production date. Their reputation precedes them by leagues.

Great Job, thanks!

My Hydra will be here Wednesday. :alien:

I'd love to have a copy of your edit tool.

Steve

If you need any help my buddy and I will assist. Really all you need to do is add a global copy + paste button that will allow you to select all CELL values in the nemesis software and paste those into an excell sheet, adjust and then copy+paste back into the map.

if it were easy to copy the maps out of the hydra software I wouldn't be writing this software. lol

"VBA" is short for Visual Basic for applications. If you have ever recorded a "Macro" in Excel what you have actually done, is excel has automatically wrote a little VB subroutine in the backround that will execute whenever you run your Macro. In Excel go to Tools-Macro-Visual Basic Editor and you will understand. Everything you do in excel actually works around visual basic. With the editor you have access to all the same objects and perameters of the software that are used automatically for you as you click on cells, or macke charts, etc.

I am working on a simple smoothing function that will allow you to select a block of cells within the map and have excel smooth out that area based on the corners of the range you selected. Linear for now, but it would be cool to implement a legrange polynomial interpolation for higher order smoothing. Basically all it will do is take the block of cells you selected, and change the interior of the selected box to smoothly transfer across the box. I have it working such that there will be two options. One will replace the interior values with smoothed values, and the other will average the smoothed value with the current interior value of the selected range for a kind of less severe smoothing effect. You will be able to select 1-100% smoothing which basically 100% would be throw out the old value alltogether and 25% would be something like this. NewValue = (.75*oldvalue + .25*SmoothedValue) Once that is done I will give you all a link. I will leave it unloacked so you all can look at the code in case you want to make some changes.

You will have to make changes with my program, then open the file you exported with the nemisis software, and then download it to the ecu. My program simply rips the maps out of the .s20 file, and then copies the enitre .s20 input file into the output file inserting the changed map in the previous map's place.

I would like to implement some kind of log overlay on the maps. Or at least map AFR onto the LoadxRPM map to get an idea of where AFRs stand during a pull and what corresponding cells are in need of adjustment. I think I can do it. I could definitly do it with a log that was completed and just pasted onto another sheet, having it update as the log is being taken will be harder as I will have to setup RS-232 capture within excel and decode the Hydra's RS-232 data stream. I havent looked at the stream yet so I am not sure how hard it will be. If someone wants to record the hydra's raw RS-232 data for me via hyperterminal or something that would be a great help.

Todd

bboy - I understand your issue with excel, but it offers spreadsheet functionality that I would have to write myself if I was to make this a file to run by itself. I think you would be surprised as to the functionality of Excel once you get into the programing VBA side of things. Its graphing can become quite powerful. Through the VBA side of things it gives the ability to make the process of inporting and compiling Hex for input into .s20 files as easy as a click of a button so anyone will be able to use it.

There are definitely cooler data analysis programs out there. Matlab after all would be an amazing environment for this kind of matrix manipulation and there is a ton of code out there do do some really amazing things, but it is not user friendly in the least bit. You basically have to be quite familiar with C programming to be able to pick it up in a reasonable amout of time. So Excel works well for what we need to use it for. Spreadsheet manipulation with the ability to write out oun little programs to do what we want to the maps.

I like your method of just altering the data file on the PC. It's very safe.

Messing around with the data stream can be disastarous, not so much data coming from the Hydra, but going. Please don't take that route.

I understand everything you are doing now. VBA is like Applescript. It's an extremely high level scripting language. I think that sounds great.

I'd love to see a 3D "textured surface" map of the fuel and spark curves with AFR line accompanying the RPMs, but I'll be damned if I know how to do that in Excel. I use Excel all the time, but anything but simple graphs are beyond my abilities (and I believe the program's).

There will be surface maps much like the ones Hydra produces in the software. Excel will color code them in ranges of data values. I am not sure exactly what you mean by the AFR line acompanying the RPMs?

Todd

I was just thinking of a copy paste utility where you paste into existing hydra software and apply formulas to the paste function so you can select a value and paste the value over a range of cells, or even apply a formula to the cells so that it can modify the data as you paste it. But the Excel VBA is cool, I was comissioned to write a Project Managment Tool in it for BofA. What a PIA.

Todd, somehow I missed one of your messages.....must have been interupted while you responded. In short, using Excel and all it's wonderful tools is brilliant. Please have no regrets. I'd do some cheerleading for you, but I ain't that pretty and I don't smile much. I'm sorry I have brought my personal frustration with excel into this.

Miguel, that is a wonderful idea, but it's not going to work unless Hitokiri has access to the actual Nemesis software code. He'll never get it. As it stands the Nemesis software is limited to single cell changes only, and that's why Todd is doing this wonderful project.

Todd, what I meant by the AFR running along side of RPM is this: You have your 3D fuel map, RPM on one of the surface axes, load on the other surface axis, and fuel amount added on the vertical axis. In front of you is a convuted surface map not unlike a contour map that slopes upward with fuel. The surface map sits between the three axes. Let's put RPM on the right side with zero at the origin closest to you (the viewer of the map, rotated counter-clockwise for perspective), and load of the left side, zero at the same corner.

So on one side of the RPM axis is the surface map (to the left of the axis) on the right side of the RPM axis, you place a ribbon of AFR. If you are looking at the map on the screen you see the surface map (it looks like a patchwork blanket that has poles proping it up), over on the right, closest to you (other side of the RPM axis) there is this little tape or ribbon (a very thin, single patch width blanket) that is suspend in mid air. This "tape" displays the AFR values.

An alternative approach, and probably easier, would be to define the AFR values in the same scale as the fuel units, and then include those values as part of fuel surface map. Let's say fuel units go from 0-1000, and AFR from 10-15, now if you keep those scales, the AFR ribbon will look puny next to the fuel values, you would not be able to see the undulation of the AFR. Instead if you multiply all the AFR values by 10 or 20, now the AFR units scale better with the fuel values. The scaled AFR units run from 100-150 or from 200-250. Looking at the fuel map then, the AFR portion will stand out enough to see how it fluctuates. If you also made the AFR a different color then it would also be easier to distinguish.

So, now I'll describe the way this approach would look. You have the same 3D surface map (blanket and poles), but along the edge of the surface map (one edge of the blanket) is the AFR curve in a different color that rises and falls with AFR on the same scale as the fuel values and it sits in the same "box" as the fuel values.

The problem with wanting the AFR curve running along side the surface fuel map (both of the two approaches have this problem) is that the surface map depends on joining the cells (patches) together to make the surface (blanket). The AFR curve would have to be uncoupled from the rest of the fuel cells. I don't know that that can be done in Excel.

So, here is a third option. If RPM has it's origin (0 RPM) at the corner closest to the viewer and the same is true of load (zero load at the same corner) then the fuel curve values will be at their minimum along the RPM axis. At zero load, fuel will be very low even as RPM increases (it's like reving the engine in neutral). If you placed the AFR values in the first set of cells of zero load they would form an edge that flucutate with AFR. The key is not not let AFR obscure the fuel values that are ahead of it as load increases. Again, if you pick the right scaling factor, you should be able to see AFR go up and down and still be able see over the AFR values to the fuel surface map as load increases. Instead of multiplying by 10 you might have to divide by 2 or so. You would keep all the cells in the map joined together (one surface). There would be an AFR mountain range, a valley of low load fuel values, and then a gradually sloping mountain range at high load (and high fuel values). Now you have one surface map, except the zero load values will not be zero load, they will be scaled AFR (diff color would be best).

I wish I could draw this instead of write it. In fact I will draw it if you want me to, and I can scan it and send it to you. Send me a PM with your email and I will.

I can't believe I even tried to write this, now that I re-read it. Oh well...

Actually, I understand that this is a limitation to the hydra software. But if a user can enter the data one cell at time, so can an interface program (that simulates the user) and do it alot faster. Maybe in the copy and paste utility you can specify the range if you can't select(select not edit) multiple cells in hydra. You will not need any Hydra code because you're coding to the user interface. Test automation software does this all the time.

mnavarro - that is precisely the problem - there is no way to enter data manually - even one cell at a time. You must use the arrow keys on the keyboard to walk around the maps and step the fuel up and down by .01 or .001 ms increments. Try making significant changes to a block of 32x32 cells with the arrow keys in .01 ms increments...... not an enjoyable experience.

bboy - Ok I totally understand now. That is going to be a tough one. I'll look deeper into the surface plotting ability of Excel though and see what I can do. There are alot of options hidden in objects that the user can't modify with the chart wizard.

update: Well I got the smoothing factor approach to linear interpolation based smoothing to work.. but I am unhappy with its performance in that it does not allow larger sections of the maps to be smoothed efficiently. It endes up cutting off high curvature areas of the mesh like crazy, and although this would be ok for rough basemapping, I want a moore elegant solution. In talking with some people I have decided to move to a method used currently by graphic artists to smooth and expand polygon meshes for rendering. Basically it approximates the selected range of the map using a peacewise Bicubic suface approximation. Then applies that to the map and essentially overlays the resulting surface over the map. Its pretty cool actually, and once I figure it out it should be very powerful. It is also used alot in the smoothing of Geological data for topo sufrace generation.

One thing I have found with the Hydra is that it is very picky about smoothness of the fuel curve in high vaccum, low tps areas, or maybe that is true of all EMS in general I don't know I am very new to tuning. It seems to me that the hydra leans on a larger MAP resolution rather than interpolating for values in between a smaller mesh size. If the hydra doesn't interpolate between neighboring cells, there is no wonder as to why I am seeing the need for a heavily smoothed map. Smoothing of these vac areas to eliminate moderate jumps in fueling has been my largest issue with the car. I am looking to this smoothing algorithm so that I can change a few values in the vac area and then smooth the area I was working on such that my changes don't introduce hicups into my tune.

keep the ideas comin!

Todd

Sorry about the diatribe last time. I was partuculary obessive that day.

Instead of applying a smoothing function what would be really neat is to click on the cells on the map (highlight them) and then be able to change that particular cell's value. It's not as elegant an approach as a smoothing function, but it would allow the tuner to smooth the map manually. Now given that the Hydra maps are 1024 cells it might be hard to select a particular cell, cells will be almost pixel size--tiny. So, either highlighting a set of cells that would simultaneously be highlighted in the data table would allow you to pick the region on the map and then smooth from the data table, OR if you could magnify the map so that individual cells could be highlighted, you could then pick a single cell for modification of the value.

The hydra does interpolate between values but because of the precision of the maps (at 1024 cells) you can fine tune the fuel curve to squeeze every last drop of power out of the curve. The number of cells is a curse and blessing. I accept the curse, and your excel programming will turn it all into a blessing.

I wish I could help you more, but my programming skills are just not in this area. As you probably know there are other tools out there that would be better for smoothing and graph production/manipulation, but almost no one has those tools. The terrific thing about using Excel is almost everyone has it on there computer no matter what the platform. Acheiving platform independence and mass adoption necessitates either using freeware or ubiqutous software. Excel is "hands down" your best bet for achieving all of this. Keep going!!!! I strongly encourage manual smoothing over an algorithmic approach. Yes, it is less elegant, but it is worlds more elegant than the Nemesis 2.1 software. In other words, manual smoothing would be a huge step forward, save the automatic smoothing for a later version.

I think you are confused about the size of Hydra maps. 32x32 is really not that big. Its bigger than most but nowhere near as large as you discribed. there may be 1000 total cells, but there are only 32 rows and 32 columns. Not 1024 rows and columns which would lead to pixel sized cells.

Its excel.. you can manually smooth however you want...
You can already manually smooth with the nemisis software.... you just have to use the arrow keys.. Download the software; you will see that magnifying the map makes no sense. I like the idea of selecting a region on the surface map, but thats not possible in excel.

It seems from the FAQ from 3S MR2 guys that the hydra does interpolate between the cells, but even so there are enough cells in the low vac area that the map position can bounce around quite a bit such that I have still experieced the need for a heavily smoothed map.

I may give up on the crazy Bicubic smoother for now... I am just not up to that level of commitment with this project as it will take a significant amount of programming to create. I am going to go with little program that will use the itterative capabilities of excel for smoothing.

Todd

No, I know what you mean. 32*32 = 1024 cells. In the Nemesis software the cells are pretty small, by viewabe. Not sure if you can rotate in Nemesis. OK, the map is "large enough" to see all the cells. Request withdrawn.

Yes, you can smooth manually in Nemesis, but I don't think you can pick a point on the map. For example, you've got a bump on the map, and you want to fix it. Click-->highlight-->change value in table or pop-up. If such a function is in Nemesis and I have not yet discovered it. Sounds like by "arrowing" through the table of values you can navigate around on the 3D map, but it sure would be nice to just use the mouse to select a cell if that is the case.

Let me know if you want me to test stuff out. I'll send you my email address via PM.

ok people who want to try out a alpha version e-mail me at todd.putnam@tufts.edu and I will send you one to mess around with.

Todd

I have been playin with the Alpha and it doesn't seem to work, keep getting an error finding project or library. if anyone who is testing has been sucessful i would like to find out if you made any changes

well the alpha work aesome in terms of the smoothing. Those of you who have got it from have mostly had a problem with me using a VB function called "mid()" - It is central in how I parse the hex data coming from the hydra file.

once I fingure out why you all don't have access to that function within Excel you should be golden.

try going to tools/macros/visual basic editor -
then go to help - and search for "mid" and tell me what you get.

in the mean time fiddle around with the smoothing functions on the template map that I included. They are fun!

Todd

this stuff is WAY over my head, but thanks for posting all this, im learning alot!

Todd:

I sent you an e-mail requesting the Alpha version of your map editor, but have not received any response. :(

Todd, here is the syntax I get for the 'mid' or 'midB' function in the VB help window (Example).

Mid Function Example
The first example uses the Mid function to return a specified number of
characters from a string.

Dim MyString, FirstWord, LastWord, MidWords
MyString = "Mid Function Demo" ' Create text string.
FirstWord = Mid(MyString, 1, 3) ' Returns "Mid".
LastWord = Mid(MyString, 14, 4) ' Returns "Demo".
MidWords = Mid(MyString, 5) ' Returns "Function Demo".

The second example use MidB and a user-defined function (MidMbcs) to also
return characters from string. The difference here is that the input string
is ANSI and the length is in bytes.

Function MidMbcs(ByVal str as String, start, length)
MidMbcs = StrConv(MidB(StrConv(str, vbFromUnicode), start, length),
vbUnicode)
End Function

Dim MyString
MyString = "AbCdEfG"
' Where "A", "C", "E", and "G" are DBCS and "b", "d",
' and "f" are SBCS.
MyNewString = Mid(MyString, 3, 4)
' Returns ""CdEf"
MyNewString = MidB(MyString, 3, 4)
' Returns ""bC"
MyNewString = MidMbcs(MyString, 3, 4)
' Returns "bCd"

That's the typical syntax for that function.

Have a look here:
http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/vbcn7/html/vaconprogrammingelementschangesinvb7.asp

It seems that MS has "replaced" commands that are redundant, and depending on your development environment you may want to choose another function that works, but uses a different name.

I went to the VB Object Browser and it lists four "mid" functions in the String class:
Mid
Mid$
MidB
MidB$

There are other functions in the string class such as Len and Trim that might be combined to produce the same output as mid, clunky but it might work better across environments.

I use XP and Excel 2003.

Hope that helps.

ok I figured out what the deal is!!!! Imput and Output should for for all now! yay!

It seems I had included a library file that you all don't have, but really had nothing to do with the program, I was playing with it for another project.

So try try this guys:
www.mcmxi.com/~todd_putnam/Hydra Editor Beta.xls

sorry about not returning emails in the last week.

I just finished with finals at school and not have more time to devote to getting this finished.

if you still have not recieved a reply from me please try again, as I now hope to be up to date

Todd

AHHH so the debugger was choking on the 'mid' function but it was something else. I tried sub'ing in the different mid commands into your code, but still no workie.

Todd the thing is awesome. :D

Are there a bunch of separate s20 files that come with the Element Hydra? I just have the software that has the "template.s20" file for opening.

I have a 3D water injection map in Excel if you are interested in trying to populate a whole new PWM map for custom WI injection. Basically, you would open one of the Aux output maps that are empty and then paste this map in.

Thanks!!

ps I forwarded your file on to others that wrote me (PM'd) in your absence. I didn't think you would mind.

Ohh, I forgot to ask. How are you checking that Excel is not introducing any errors into the Hydra file.

I would like to see a your program save a file with a different name (non-edited file) and then run a 'compare' to make sure they are identical before you download it to the Hydra. Unix has some great 'byte by byte' or 'bit by bit' tools to compare files with, maybe the MS environment has something similar. I only worry because MS is famous for stamping their stuff "mine" but not telling you. Kilobyte sizing just won't cut it.

well I havent done alot to insure that the output back to the hydra file is perfect and thats why I want to make sure you all check the file in the Nemisis software before downloading.

I pretty much insure that the data values that are being stuck back into the maps are in the right format. Ie the spark map is in increments of 1 dregree and the fuel map is in increments of .001 s.

thats all I do. By the final version I want to have checkers to make sure that the data is not out of range and a check following download that runs thru the file and makes sure that all information in the file is the same as the input file except for the map locations. This won't be hard to implement and I will most likely get to it in the next 2 weeks or so.

thanks guys

Todd

on the WI thing.

It would be easy for me to add pages for the other maps in the Hydra. ie. the aux maps or backup maps. Once we get the main program working nicely I will start on adding support for those other maps and hopefully some data analysis tools as well as we spoke of earlier.

I would like to see a map trace based on logged values and maybe a tuning window that would let you click on a cell in the map highlighted by map trace, and it would show you data from the log corresponding to that cell in the map as well as some good statistics information about that load site.

Todd

The Unix 'cmp' command will compare two files as binary, bit by bit, and report the first difference, or if no report, no difference. This is the fine tooth comb.

The Unix 'diff' command only works on text files and recusively reports the differences between two files (unless you option out of the reports). This command will compare the files at the level of alpha-numeric characters, and thus glosses over binary differences. Great for word processing.

diff has DOS equivalent called 'fc' but as far as I know no DOS equivalent to 'cmp' exists.

I'll compare files just as I have suggested and report back to you if there are any differences. If 'cmp' finds no differences, at least in the Unix world, they are the same, period.

OK I looked at the template.s20 file with the vi editor. It's quite simple, you have a 4 digit address that marks the map, with multiple entries for each map address. Everything is in hex, and all lines end in FF. Its a text file, so diff should be just fine for comparing or the DOS fc command.

I feel very confident now that Excel can make changes to the .s20 file and exit without perturbing any other part of the file. A few 'diff' or 'cmp' runs would convince me that Excel never writes or altes anything extraneous.

Actually I used a similar program to decypher the storage scheme for the .s20 files. I use a very similar product that compares files.

when I export the maps I simply set through the file up to where I know the map is stored - replace the hex values in the file that correspond to the map locations -
then step through the file to the next map.

It's impossibl for my program to edit any other section of the file than where the maps are stored, but anything can happen in programming if you are not careful. For instance, if you entered a value that was larger than the map could handle, it might through off the storage in the file. The timing map stores its timing values as a 2 digit hex number. if you tried to enter a really huge decimal number that when converted to hex would be more than 2 digits - then when my program try to insert that value back into hex it would through off the numbering scheme in the ecu and data would not transfer correctly.

It is to guard against people making mistakes like that that I ask you all to be careful and use caution when editing maps. I will implement error handling in time, but as a warning, its not there yet!!!!

Todd

Well said. Anyway this is a huge contrubution, and when Phil gets back from the races you should send it to him for testing. Or have Phil send it to Andrew at Hydra for testing (he is the only one who could "recover" from an error that "might" occur). Again, HUGE contirbutions. Applause for Todd!!!!! :D :D

Phil actually mentioned to me that he has some tools similar to this for moving maps around. I'm not going to bother him with it until I work it as much as I can to iron out bugs.

There is much I can do from my end to improve it in the next couple weeks too guys, so please refrain from sending it to them before I have a change to improve it. I named it the alpha version because I don't consider it tested enough for anyone to use seriously.

maybe when I am confident enough to call it a beta version :)

Todd

I'm not sending anything with your name on it, and I don't think anyone else should!!!! Don't worry about that. I'll play with the latest (minus alien library) version tonight.

Would you mind sending me the .s20 file from the Hydra so I'm testing on the actual data?

Also if you don't want public feedback I can take this stuff offline with you. Trent

OK - Thanks for the file! I spent the last couple of hours doing some tests, and it works flawlessly.

Dang, what a difference!

public feadback is fine :) thats what we are all here for!

Thanks for your interest everyone.

The template file is actually a real map file and if you import it into excel, you can save it as a another name and check it much in the same way as if you had a custom map of your own.

I can send you the template file if you don't have it. Its really a complete map file, its just the contents are junk lol.

Todd

Todd, it's working great. I ran all the interpolation and smoothing functions. The smooth all function is pretty extreme for a working map, but it would be nice for generating a new map from scratch.

Upon start up I get a runtime error "-91" and the debugger sends me to a line beginning "smoothfast". Despite that the buttons seem to function.

A bird told me that the next version of the Hydra software will enable you to change whole columns of numbers at once. However it will be a plus or minus function such that all selected values will be added to by a set value or subtracted from.

As far as I could tell the underlying format of the data file is unchanged so your excel program will still be writing as it does now. It's an improvement in the software, but your stuff is still much more sophisticated. I really like the interpolate and smooth functions for selected data range--very cool.

cool. I'll see if I figure out that error. its just initially on startup?? Like right when you open the .xls file?

I agree that smoothall is extreme. Thats why I put all the warnings on it. It was really just for my own amusement. lol Try using the weighting factor in the other smoothing functions though. It helps alot in customizing the amount you want the map smoothed out so you can step into it slowly.

- I've got some little data analysis stuff for my emanage/zeitronix WB all done in a nice little program. I am going to add the same idea to the Hydra Editor.

it will take a Hydra log that has been exported to excel:

- You will select a portion of the log that you want to investigate
- It will them parse out that log overlay the information on top of the current Hydra fuel / spark map in the editor
- You can have it put into the map trace any data stream logged by the hydra.
- Hopefully If the graphing seems cool enough I'll add some graphing stuff too.

Todd

Well I just opened the file again and no "91" error, so I don't know what was up last time.

Graphing the AFR off of the log against RPM is the most important bit of info for me.

Would it be possible to add further 'tabs' for the AUX tables that might be filled in later with say water injection values?

Great work!!

Hey I just have one question. I downloaded the program but cannot get it to open up can you help me.

Thanks Jeff

It's an MS Excel file. You'll need a modern version of Excel.

Todd, each line seems to begin S123 and end FF. Where do the breaks occur between maps, say fuel and spark. Are there AUX maps in the .s20 file. There look to be several maps, but I can't tell how they are separated.

Could you please allow us to open and share more of the compensation maps? I'm no programmer, and I don't know how hard this would be, but for the STI guys, viewing the AVCS map would help too.

Many of the compensation maps would be perfect for your smoothing routines.

I'm working with the MR2 template.s20 file. Todd has the actual Hydra .s20 file (s) and so should you.

I think Todd busy right now, we'll hear from him. We are asking for the same thing which is for Excel to read all the maps instead of just the fuel and spark. It should be easy to just add the other maps to the VB script and have them added as "workbooks" in Excel.

Bump. Anything new?

snail mail....

sorry guys I was away on vacation.

It would be easy to incorperate more maps, but is just time consuming.

I'll get to it! lol

Todd

no pressure, just interested

did a little work tonight.

I now have all Main Hydra maps into excel. The Control maps are next as well as the PWM maps. Then I have to write the output control and some error checking and well be in business with beta 2.

Functionality for Beta 2:

- Access to ALL Hydra Maps
Main Maps
Aux Maps
Anti-Lag
Spark Backup
Control 1/2/3 maps
2D and 3D PWM maps (ie. AVCS)

- Linear and Nonlinear smoothing algorithms optimized from Beta 1

- Cell coloring in Fuel maps based on duty cycle

- Program opens maps out of a source .s20 file, allows infinite modification of those maps via excel, and place the altered maps into a new .s20 file containing the exact hydra configuration contained in the source with the altered maps in place.

As more time pours into the utility I am leaning towards locking the macro so the code will not be accessible in the next version.

Todd

sounds awesome todd

all locking the code will do is prevent anyone from modifying it, yes?

i have no problem with that. if someone wanted to work on the code they could always write you.

todd you are single handedly pwning all of the privately develeped tools for the utec to date. well done!!! :banana: :banana: :banana:

kinda an afterthought but have you done any testing with the open source office suite openoffice? drop me an email at slouckatgmail.com with the latest and ill do some testing with some sample .s20's in both version 1.1.4 in linux and windows as well as with the beta version 1.9 m69 on both platforms as well.

I do believe that the version of the Hydra software that I got to play with had a feature like this, with offline editing you could alter the entire tables at a time. I believe the owner said it was a beta version and didn't work with any other versions of the Hydra (different firmware, I am guessing), so you guys might just want to wait for some of the next versions to come out. I won't disclose who or where it was that I played with this software as they've asked me not to discuss it... I just wanted to save you guys a little work. :)

Maybe you were playing with Todd's program and didn't know it. I have the latest, hot off the presses, Hydra software and it permits "column" changes but still has nothing like the features that Todd has built.

Yeap - That's true. Me too got the latest Hydra software. :banana:

Nope, this was actual Hydra software, and you could select large sections of the tables at a time.

8 - hey if Hydra releases better software that would be great for all of us! This project started because I was unhappy with their current software.

The new firmare and software for the Hydra permits multicell changes. I don't have it yet, but will soon.


Progress update:
Control 1 done.

Todd

So is there somewhere where I can download the new verison of the editor?

wgknestrick: not yet. I am still working on it.

hang in there!

please direct questions to HydraEDIT@gmail.com from now on.

The Next Version of Hydra's software is a HUGE inprovement over the first addition. So much better that I think if it had been around before I most likely would not have started this project.

You can now manually edit the cells more than one at a time and move maps around.

I am going to continue working on my program dispite Hydra's vastly improved software mainly because I am always wanting something faster than Hydra can update their software. The next area that hydra will have to address is data analysis, so that will most likely be the focus of the next installation of my program. Some AFR mapping with respect to load by RPM and maybe some typical Road Dyno functions would be nice.

Todd

ps. I did a little sniffing of the Hydra Software's RS232 communication with the main unit.......

a custom Dashboard like a DD Dash Disply would be pretttttty sweet

Even something that ported the data log to a Palm would be cool.

For those that doesn't know... Hitokiri, 8Complex, BBoy and myself reffer to Hydra's software version 2.14

For me a huge advantage to having Excel at your finger tips is the ability to add or subtract a percentage to a column, row, or table. Because the VE varies and other factors come into play with RPM, adding a discrete value is sometimes not really what's wanted. On the other hand, you may get close enough for autotune to clean up the misses.

all maps done :)

have to write output back to .s20 file now for new maps.

Todd

Dang! That was fast! :P

:) - super secret feature added.... lol

Shhhhh....don't tell anybody.

Todd, did this die on the vine?

bumpity bump

So heres the deal:

I have't worked on it in quite some time. I was being held up by PWM map 9 and issues around encoding and decoding the information that the nemisis stores there.

After talking with Hydra about the program. I have decided to not release any version of the editor which has the ability to modify PWM map 9. Not enough is known about VVti and AVCS / etc. and I agree with not allowing free control of it to people simply as a safety issue. As HydraUSA explained to me, AVCS runs off oil pressure, so given that you may want AVCS to preform a certain way, and the hydra may ask it to, AVCS may be physically unable to complete such a request possilbly causing damage to the engine.

As a result of this conversaion with Hydra I am not completing this project to the full extent of what it was originally designed to do.

bboy - if you are looking for Aux map and PWM 10/11 control for your water injection, PM / email me and I'll see if I can get you a version with that capability.

The Bottom line to this porject is:

I created this program so that we could have an easy way to modify/swap Hydra maps, and speed up the task of tuning with some nice smoothing functionality. Since then Hydra has noticed this and added many of the features that I was looking for in the Hydra to their own software. Hydra is a small enough operation that they can implement changes and updates to their program quickly and easily. They have added the ability to import maps, do linear interpolation, and enter values manualy. I am impressed with their prompt development and solution to issues we have brought up with their software.

So as of right now. I am leaving it to Hydra to continue to improve upon their tuning software such that we don't have to do things like rip their maps into excel.. lol If someone desperatly wants access to a certain map in excel, shoot me a pm, and well see if I can help.

thanks

Todd

Lazarus has visited this thread.

We've corresponded Todd, wondering if a release that does not touch the password protected maps and skips the "smoothing" is still a welcome idea to you and others. Smoothing is handled with the Nemesis 2.14 v7, but from playing with it, it smooths almost too much, or maybe too quickly.

I'm still looking for a means of changing values not by increments, but proportionally. For instance I'd like to take 0.25% fuel off of all the boost load sites. I can't do that in Nemesis.

Another thing I'd like to do is merge two maps, or rather substitute a portion of one map into another. In this case, at one point I tuned all the "off load" sites with the Nemesis autotune bringing the values in line with the 14.7 AFR set in the "AFR target table". I have another map that has been fine tuned with a new boost peak and some partial throttle tuning. I'd like to take the "autotuned" map and combine it with the "boost peak" map. There is no way to do this in Nemesis, unless the Mass Entry button works. I've not figured that button out (no manual for the software, so it's all trial and error)

Another thing I done in Nemesis but it was not pretty was to try to fine tune the AFR target table. The one that comes with the Hydra is.......um......safe....., yeah safe is the word (rich would be another word). If you were to compare your fuel map to the AFR target table (no way to do it) you'd see major differences. I'm not saying I want to autotune all the time, but I do like to use it to fine tune, smooth out maps.

Dice rolled.

OK the .s20 files are starting to look like the matrix. I got your original editor working, that permits file merging (copy paste) and multipling whole regions by 99.5% to lower fuel by 0.5% (special paste function). Now I'm working on getting the the Aux Fuel/Spark maps as additional separate ""Worksheets".

Once I figure out how the remaining fuel and spark maps are positioned/ordered in the s20, I should be able to pull those too into Excel, as well and export them with the your read/write subroutines.