Has anyone blown their engine while using the UTEC?
I know Utec is sensitive to knock but has anyone blown a motor while tuning their UTEC on the road with the knock sensor in default setting?

Just wondering before I go play with my UTEC.

Some UTECs have been shipped with settings for no knock correction at all. Check your current settings...then go out and play.

There have been many many people who have had blown engines with the utec. The knock sensor help any until ya actually get a knock, and at that point it might be a bit late. It's there so the engine doesn't keep on knocking(after the first one).

peace

IF YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING OR UNDERSTAND EXACTLY WHAT YOU ARE DOING---DO NOT----DO NOT----'PLAY' WITH YOUR UTEC.

RTFM...
RTFM, AGAIN...

AND THEN READ IT AGAIN.

And if you STILL have ANY doubt about what's what.....

STOP......and call TXS.

More importantly, knock sensors don't detect/prevent pre-ignition, which is what REALLY breaks things. Your motor can take a certain amount of detonation before breaking, usually its long enough to tune it out (if it happens while tuning- if you drive on a knocking map for long, buh bye).

IF YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING OR UNDERSTAND EXACTLY WHAT YOU ARE DOING---DO NOT----DO NOT----'PLAY' WITH YOUR UTEC.

RTFM...
RTFM, AGAIN...

AND THEN READ IT AGAIN.

And if you STILL have ANY doubt about what's what.....

STOP......and call TXS.
Heh, tell 'em.

Slightly unrelated, but this reminds me when APEX-i first released the SUPER-AFC's for cars, I had so many people coming to a shop I used to work at wondering why their cars were suddenly running so rich/lean. :lol:

Thanks for the advice.

My current mods are GTSPEC GEN II, VF34, bosal down pipe, stock mid-pipe and greddy EVO cat-back.

No STI pink injectors and an IC upgrade. Can I run the stage 3 map from TurboXS website or just stick to stage 2 to be safe.

I want bring the car to a tuner with a dyno in NY but I do not know of one. I am on Long Island NY and I don't really want to drive 2 hours to tune the car everytime I ad something else to it.

Thanks

Your car with the stock midpipe has more backpressure than the stage 3 map is tuned for. I'd really get a custom tune if I were you. Also, you mean "now STi pinks" or "new STi pinks"? :confused:

I would recommend a custome tune... When I was shopping for an ECU solution, I DL'ed the manual from TurboXS's site, and read it through a few times.... It was a little too complicated... Some parts made sense, but I really did not want to test my knowlege out on my own car...

I would say that there are more people with popped engines out there who use the utec, but there are two reasons for that... Utec is most popular ecu solution (so more people buy them than any other solution) , AND, many of the people buying the things really don't have a handle (although they THINK they do) on tuning an engine, so they end up popping them sooner or later...UTEC is a really powerful tool, and it isn't until you read the manual that you begin to get an idea of how close you can be at anytime to blowing up if you enter the wrong figures in some maps.

Take the car to someone who specialises in tuning the things, and all will be well.

As previously mentioned by the above posts, you can most definitely blow up your engine with a UTEC. For that matter you can blow up your engine with any semi powerful tuning tools. That is something to fear. The thing about that fear is you can let it rule and never learn anything. I'm not saying abandon it. Just educate yourself and move cautiously. With some reading and a little patience you can do this. All you need now is a TurboXS Tuner (or some other wide band).

....Take the car to someone who specialises in tuning the things, and all will be well.

Not that I think adjusting things when ya don't know what's going on is a good idea, but there have been many many wrx's with blown engines which have been tuned by "experts". If you push an engine hard for a long time, something is gonna break. You might have a better chance of the engine lasting longer with a good tune, but that does not gaurantee the engine will last. It's all a craps game, and you better have some extra money layin around just in case something does go wrong. <edit>Here's an old relating thread... (http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=416756) Hey jigga, kinda amusing that you were one of the few people in that thread with an impropper tune, and it wasn't because of you messing with things(it was the tuners fault). There are also people in that same thread who are well respected tuners who have had multiple engine problems.........

peace

Not that I think adjusting things when ya don't know what's going on is a good idea, but there have been many many wrx's with blown engines which have been tuned by "experts". My EJ20 blew while running a Vishnu Stg 2 Unichip. While this isn't a UTEC, it was still tuned by a very reputable professional, Shiv himself loaded most of my maps when I 'up-staged'. I have since been running a self-tuned UTEC with my new setup for over 15K mi. (knock on wood).

Just some food for thought...

-jason

Not that I think adjusting things when ya don't know what's going on is a good idea, but there have been many many wrx's with blown engines which have been tuned by "experts". If you push an engine hard for a long time, something is gonna break. You might have a better chance of the engine lasting longer with a good tune, but that does not gaurantee the engine will last. It's all a craps game, and you better have some extra money layin around just in case something does go wrong. <edit>Here's an old relating thread... (http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=416756)

peace

agreed, but I think we can all agree that an engine would be less likely to pop if tuned by professional with expereince, as oposed to a rank amateur who needs to ask if anyone has ever blown an engine using utec.

With regard to that thread you posted, yes, if you push ANY engine (stock or modified) long enough, something will break. The moral of that thread is that people were either running the wrong map put on the unichip by a tuner (me :(), or they were trying to mine too much power out of the car, given the turbo and fuel. If you notice, those with vf30's were pushing damn near 300whp.... Remember, the VF30 is a turbo rated by IHI to be good for 350HP at the crank.

Some with VF23's are in the 27xWHP range, on 91 octane, which I am sure is well beyond what the turbo is rated for (crank-wise) by IHI.

The moral of the story of that thread was that people are pushing for too much power with turbos that are just too small to get the desired power..Those who wanted 300whp should NOT have been trying to get there with a VF30....They should have been looking at something bigger. Bigger turbos would allow for the use of a much fore conservative map, which in turn will let the engine live by minimizing possiblity of detonation creeping in.

jmussetter - Were these maps on your unichip custom tunes? Or mail-order tunes?
Also, I think it was established back in the day as to how the unichip and ecu had a very 'iffy' working relationship, constant battles over control of timing that often resulted in long-term changes in the ignition maps uploaded into the unichip. Not trying to shift blame or anything here, but perhaps something to think about?

Femi

Your car with the stock midpipe has more backpressure than the stage 3 map is tuned for.

3rd cat really isn't that restrictive.

imho of course.

ken

Thanks for the advice.

My current mods are GTSPEC GEN II, VF34, bosal down pipe, stock mid-pipe and greddy EVO cat-back.

No STI pink injectors and an IC upgrade. Can I run the stage 3 map from TurboXS website or just stick to stage 2 to be safe.

I want bring the car to a tuner with a dyno in NY but I do not know of one. I am on Long Island NY and I don't really want to drive 2 hours to tune the car everytime I ad something else to it.

Thanks

Then i would say go with ecutek dave brown of www.mspt.net (metric subaru performance tuning) will do an incresable job!!!! there located in huntington on rt25 if you want more opinions about him i would suggest checking out www.sqc-ny.com, many of there cars were tuned by him and they will answer any questions for you..

3rd cat really isn't that restrictive.

imho of course.

ken

Perhaps not, but a 2.25" cat is gonna have more backpressure than a 3" pipe. That raises EGTs and makes your engine more knock prone.

http://www.turboxs.com/_images/UTEC/Updatewrx/UTEC%20User%20Manual%204.2.pdf

Page 1 says it all..

So I still have a question?

Where do I go for a customer UTEC tune in NYC?
Or who is reputable and is closest to me?

Well, I purposely did not upgrade the mid pipe is because I need it to pass emission without changing the mid pipe everytime. Also the extra back pressure will give me a little better bottom end as compare to a turbo back. It's not a problem for the STI to go turbo back because the 6 speed really helps down low but I feel the WRX needs the little help in that field with stock tranny opf course. So I would say I need to have the UTEC tune for this setup.

I am willing to go but just need to knwo where to go.

jmussetter - Were these maps on your unichip custom tunes? Or mail-order tunes?

I had Vishnu's off-shelf maps loaded for all stages from Stg0, Stg1, and finally Stg2. After running Stg2 for about a month, I called to schedule a custom tune, and Shiv refused to dyno my car, since it had a exhaust dump (QTEC valve) on it. Less than 2 months after he refused to custom dyno tune me, my motor poped on a long 4 gear pull. I learned my lesson, rebuilt the car, and switched to the UTEC so I wouldn't be 'locked into' the mercy of a particular tuner to tune my car. And my street maps are working very well so far, with no dyno tuning done yet.

Lesson learned, just like with any mechanic/tuner, if you want it done right, do it yourself. The only engine component that is still stock in my car is the cams/heads, and my car has NEVER been to a mechanic...all done myself for better or worse.

-jason

So I still have a question?

Where do I go for a customer UTEC tune in NYC?
Or who is reputable and is closest to me?

Well, I purposely did not upgrade the mid pipe is because I need it to pass emission without changing the mid pipe everytime. Also the extra back pressure will give me a little better bottom end as compare to a turbo back. It's not a problem for the STI to go turbo back because the 6 speed really helps down low but I feel the WRX needs the little help in that field with stock tranny opf course. So I would say I need to have the UTEC tune for this setup.

I am willing to go but just need to knwo where to go.

The extra back pressure won't help bottom end at all. It is an old myth from hot rodders. The best turbo back is no exhaust. You want as little pressure after the turbo as possible. I'd rather spool sooner which gives much better torque.

Turbo XS is in Maryland. Which may be the closest reputible tuner out there.

The best tune in the world won't prevent mechanical fatigue. Nothing is unbreakable, everything has a life span... for someone to tell you otherwise, walk away.

Take that statement, and superimpose that on those who don't know what they're doing, or are going through learning pains. You accelerate the inevitable.

Jorge (RiftsWRX)
www.ProjectWRX.com

The reason Shiv wouldn't tune the car with the dump valve on it is the huge variable it places in the system. Backpressure is obviously hugely different with it open and closed, which is why you installed it. Since the Unichip has no map switching of any kind, your car would have an improper tune with the valve either open or closed, which would in turn guarantee a bad tune from shiv one way or another. You can't blame him for not tuning a car that was guaranteed to have a failure of some kind because of that.

Backpressure is obviously hugely different with it open and closed, which is why you installed it. Since the Unichip has no map switching of any kind, your car would have an improper tune with the valve either open or closed, which would in turn guarantee a bad tune from shiv one way or another.

This is true, and while it was NOT mentioned as a reason of why they wouldn't do it, I plainly stated that I wanted it tuned with it open and not closed, as if it's closed, I'm not pushing the car hard, and if I push the car, it's open.

Besides, while you can feel a power difference with the valve open, I don't get knock when I'm driving with it closed with my UTEC tune I have now. Only use 1 map on the UTEC.

-jason

1) your daily driving tune is more likely to be cause of engine failure than your "fast" tune.

2) You can destroy an engine without a single ping ever happening. More than one way to skin a cat.

..I plainly stated that I wanted it tuned with it open and not closed, as if it's closed, I'm not pushing the car hard, and if I push the car, it's open....-jason

Maybe this is why he wouldn't tune the car? He probably could have tuned it safely with the valve closed. Tuning it with the valve open could cause some serious problems when the valve is closed(from the extra load), and it seems like he didn't want you to go back whining about how your engine died because of his tune.

and it seems like he didn't want you to go back whining about how your engine died because of his tune.
So instead, he refused to assist me with the $700 Unichip I paid full price for on his recommendation (back in 2002), and I was stuck with a UniChip that couldn't be tuned by anyone else. And my motor poped due to his "inaction" in supporting the hardware that he recommended and sold me.

I don't blame him for how hard I've drive my car, but when he sells me a 'tunable' solution, and then $700 later refuses to tune it, you can see how I'm pissed about it. I just don't support him or his products anymore, nor do I recommend him to anyone.

-jason

i would be pissed too, fwiw.

So instead, he refused to assist me with the $700 Unichip I paid full price for on his recommendation (back in 2002), and I was stuck with a UniChip that couldn't be tuned by anyone else. And my motor poped due to his "inaction" in supporting the hardware that he recommended and sold me.

I don't blame him for how hard I've drive my car, but when he sells me a 'tunable' solution, and then $700 later refuses to tune it, you can see how I'm pissed about it. I just don't support him or his products anymore, nor do I recommend him to anyone.

-jason

You're completely missing the point. He can only tune for the dump valve one way with the POS Unichip. That means, when the valve is in the other position, you have a BAD TUNE. Why should he allow his name to be on a tune that is likely to cause problems? You should have discussed it with him before adding the dump valve. And now that you have a Utec, you really should have somebody make you maps for both valve positions, so you can see how different they are for yourself.

And now that you have a Utec, you really should have somebody make you maps for both valve positions, so you can see how different they are for yourself.
The POWER difference is noticable from open to closed now on the same tune. However, even with the dump close, I'm still running completely catless, so the only difference between open vs. closed is the difference in tune between a aftermarket catback vs. stock catback. I'm not running a QTP dp, I'm running a custom modified HKS dp that has been bellmouthed, and Y'd, so it's catless either way.

Do you have your UTEC redyno'd if you change from a stock cat-back to an aftermarket one? I bet not, people only say tuning changes are necessary when there are 1,2, or 3 cats removed from the car. Granted there is a power difference between the two, but it's because there is less backpressure and the motor is more effecient, etc. You *could* in theory, maybe get a marginally better tune with a freeflowing catback in place, but there isn't a tuner around that *I* know of that has a seperate stage MAP for the stock cat-back or an aftermaket.

I have a LM-1, and did the tuning on my UTEC myself, and it's still a work in progress, but I've alot of miles on my own tuning so far, and I can tell you that A/F ratio does not *noticably* change with the valve open/close. I don't have my car on the ragged edge as far as timing goes, but I'm running 24deg max at redline, and am completely knock free in WOT runs with the dump open and closed.

My point in this whole sidetrack though, is that I've been tuning for about a year or less, and have a knock free MAP, making good power (not ragged edge, but I beat an STi on the freeway), with the QTP valve open AND closed. Why couldn't (or why wouldn't) Shiv, who has years and years of tuning experience and better tools to do it with like that dyno dynamics "mother of all 4WD dyno's" at his disposal.

I was running a BASE MAP from a reputable tuner, that is supposed to tuned on the safe side, and it blew my motor, so it CAN happen, just not very often. I would also like to point out that it didn't scare me away from modding either. :D

-jason

Please do me a favor and bolt a stock catback to your car.

Please do me a favor and bolt a stock catback to your car. First - try *reading* my post with your eyes open next time before you *try* to be rude and end up looking like an a$$. I already HAVE the stock cat-back on my car! :rolleyes: The dump valve IS ONLY bypassing the stock catback, and that is it, there are no cats in my Up/Dn pipes either way.

Second - Why is everyone trying to flame me for something that DID happen to me, over a year ago, and there was a long thread on www.clubwrx.net that was made that enguages all the details if you want to know.

Third - The original thread poster ask if anyone has blown up their engine with a UTEC? And some responded yes to scare them away from tinkering, and told them to have someone tune it for them. I only interjected that 'professional' tuners CAN blow-up your motor too, so nothing is 100% safe either way. Which is something he should know in order to make a decision on whether to try tuning it himself. So why is everyone jumping on me?

-jason

I thank everyone for their help and advice.
I am going to run stock map and get the utec tune by turboxs as soon as the winter passes.

Thank you

First - try *reading* my post with your eyes open next time before you *try* to be rude and end up looking like an a$$. I already HAVE the stock cat-back on my car! :rolleyes: The dump valve IS ONLY bypassing the stock catback, and that is it, there are no cats in my Up/Dn pipes either way.

Second - Why is everyone trying to flame me for something that DID happen to me, over a year ago, and there was a long thread on www.clubwrx.net that was made that enguages all the details if you want to know.

Third - The original thread poster ask if anyone has blown up their engine with a UTEC? And some responded yes to scare them away from tinkering, and told them to have someone tune it for them. I only interjected that 'professional' tuners CAN blow-up your motor too, so nothing is 100% safe either way. Which is something he should know in order to make a decision on whether to try tuning it himself. So why is everyone jumping on me?

-jason

Sorry for my mistake, but my point about your map needs varying stands. Add a 3" catback on the car and it will have the same result. Same reason you have a downpipe- more backpressure=less flow and less knock resistance.

geez.

that means everyone running one of shiv's maps apparently should not change ANYTHING on their cars, since it will alter the backpressure and the car will immediately explode.

is there some kind of waiver he has you sign when he maps your car that has words to this effect? he'd better. otherwise--change your catback, car go boom.

More importantly, knock sensors don't detect/prevent pre-ignition, which is what REALLY breaks things. Your motor can take a certain amount of detonation before breaking, usually its long enough to tune it out (if it happens while tuning- if you drive on a knocking map for long, buh bye).
----

I thought knock = pre-ignition = detonation

Does the J&S help save this situation ?

More importantly, knock sensors don't detect/prevent pre-ignition, which is what REALLY breaks things. Your motor can take a certain amount of detonation before breaking, usually its long enough to tune it out (if it happens while tuning- if you drive on a knocking map for long, buh bye).
----

I thought knock = pre-ignition = detonation

Does the J&S help save this situation ?

Preignition happens before ignition by the spark plug. Detonation happens later. Octane no. is good. Tuning is good.
Theoretical Stuff (http://www.jandssafeguard.com/tech.html)

geez.

that means everyone running one of shiv's maps apparently should not change ANYTHING on their cars, since it will alter the backpressure and the car will immediately explode.

is there some kind of waiver he has you sign when he maps your car that has words to this effect? he'd better. otherwise--change your catback, car go boom.

Pretty much, yes. What's the difference between a VS0 + catback (you don't need to tune for catbacks on stock downpipe) and a VS1? The downpipe. IOW, backpressure. Going from a 2.25" catback to a 3" catback with a 3" downpipe would certainly change the backpressure. So why is one decrease in backpressure going to require a retune and another isn't?

More importantly, knock sensors don't detect/prevent pre-ignition, which is what REALLY breaks things. Your motor can take a certain amount of detonation before breaking, usually its long enough to tune it out (if it happens while tuning- if you drive on a knocking map for long, buh bye).
----

I thought knock = pre-ignition = detonation

Does the J&S help save this situation ?

knock and pre-ignition are two different things. clicky: http://www.streetrodstuff.com/Articles/Engine/Detonation/index.php

geez.

that means everyone running one of shiv's maps apparently should not change ANYTHING on their cars, since it will alter the backpressure and the car will immediately explode.

is there some kind of waiver he has you sign when he maps your car that has words to this effect? he'd better. otherwise--change your catback, car go boom.

Are you kidding? :rolleyes:

i'm not kidding.

i'm sitting here glad i didn't get locked into an EMS choice where someone ELSE dictates what's safe and unsafe.

how much difference in backpressure do you think existed on that car with the cutout in different positions? the cutout bypassed the oem catback. that's it. yes, the stock catback is restrictive, but if it's THAT restrictive then why don't we see choice of catback mentioned in any off the shelf remaps from any vendors?

we see # of cats. not choice of catback.

When people have different mods then stock, they get tuned so their car runs normally with those mods. Everyone knows not to change their mods after they get tuned. If I stuck a stock catback on my car the way it's tuned now, I have no doubt that it would be a very short period of time b4 my engine would "go boom". There's no disclaimer because the people who tune the car aren't held responsible for something going wrong. Course that doesn't negate their moral obligation to try and avoid doing things which they think will cause something to go wrong.

Companies which sell aftermarket engine management assume that we use their parts for their tunes. ie- if ya get a utec and use the stage 3 map, txs assumes that you're using their turboback, uppipe, and top mount intercooler. That's exactly what a stage 3 is, and they quote the power output according to those mods. If you use a more restrictive exhaust, smaller or bigger intercooler, or whatever, things obviously won't work out the same. Not saying the engine will blow(even though it could), but you get what I mean.

What if he said that he wanted the car tuned with 650cc injectors even though he was gonna put 550cc injectors after the tune? How about a different turbo? How abotu different spark plugs, or an intake? Not that I'm saying I wouldn't be pissed if what happend to jm happened to me, but I also get where shiv might be coming from. Ya can't just change the mods after a tune and expect the engine not to go boom. If the car was tuned(by shiv), jm's engine might have still blown(chances are pretty damn high imo), and he would probably be more pissed at shiv after paying for a tune. Course, that's just the way I see it.

peace

When people have different mods then stock, they get tuned so their car runs normally with those mods. Everyone knows not to change their mods after they get tuned. If I stuck a stock catback on my car the way it's tuned now, I have no doubt that it would be a very short period of time b4 my engine would "go boom". There's no disclaimer because the people who tune the car aren't held responsible for something going wrong. That doesn't mean that they won't try to avoid doing things which could cause something to go wrong. Companies which sell aftermarket engine management assume that we use their parts for their tunes. ie- if ya get a utec and use the stage 3 map, txs assumes that you're using their turboback, uppipe, and top mount intercooler. That's exactly what a stage 3 is, and they quote the power output according to those mods. If you use a more restrictive exhaust, smaller or bigger intercooler, or whatever, things obviously won't work out the same. Not saying the engine will blow, but you get what I mean.

What if he said that he wanted the car tuned with 650cc injectors even though he was gonna put 550cc injectors after the tune? How about a different turbo? How abotu different spark plugs, or an intake? Not that I'm saying I wouldn't be pissed if what happend to jm happened to me, but I also get where shiv might be coming from. Ya can't just change the mods after a tune and expect the engine not to go boom. If the car was tuned(by shiv), jm's engine might have still blown(chances are pretty damn high imo), and he would probably be more pissed at shiv after paying for a tune. Course, that's just the way I see it.

peace

Damn dirty hippies.... :D Good points made.

I could further the above with my own personal rants. The easiest thing to do when tuning a car is to pop the motor. The hardest thing to do is ensure you don't. Common sense yes, realized and understood by those that visit these forums more often than not... no.

I can't count the number of times in the 2.0 and 2.5 forums I see the following flow of events

1a) "HELP, I want to make 400 HP!!"
1b) What should my first mod be, I have $1000 to spend.
2) I gots my parts and a cool blow off valve, can someone help me install??
3) So I need engine management?
4) I have a stage 2 with some random parts I found on Ebay, my car is now acting funny.
The UTEC sux0r.
5) I think I tuned my car well because its FAST!
6) "HELP, my car smokes now!!!!"

Result 1) People like Joe Blow above clog up the boards with stupid questions and never use the search button. The 2.0 and 2.5 forums give me a headache. The engine management forums are my only escape.

Result 2) You wonder why SOA are such sticklers for those with mods now? See Joe Blow above. He damages his car and takes it into service. OR he takes the car in but first removes all performance parts (basically stealing if he gets away with it). The dealerships aren't stupid. Joe Blow gets pissed when he's denied.

My car is stock, and everytime I go to the dealer for service I'm asked if I have ever modded my car. Worse yet I know I can't trust my warranty because the dealer now labels me as being a Joe Blow above.

I remember an old post by Nathan at TurboXS. It went something like this.
"You just spent ~30k on a car, a few hundred on support guages and monitoring tools is cheap in comparison."

If Joe Blow would only watch his EGT's, AFR's etc.. and take the time to actually learn what he's doing to his car.

Sorry for the long post.
-Eric-

EDIT: Actually, I think it would be cool if engine management tools like the UTEC would NOT function unless EGT and WBO2 probes are attached. That could save sooo many engines.

i'm not kidding.

i'm sitting here glad i didn't get locked into an EMS choice where someone ELSE dictates what's safe and unsafe.

how much difference in backpressure do you think existed on that car with the cutout in different positions? the cutout bypassed the oem catback. that's it. yes, the stock catback is restrictive, but if it's THAT restrictive then why don't we see choice of catback mentioned in any off the shelf remaps from any vendors?

we see # of cats. not choice of catback.

Because it's presumed that anyone spending money on a 3" downpipe would also use a 3" catback to realize full gains from the downpipe. ANY 3" catback will have backpressure and flow values VERY close to any other 3" catback. Further, on a stock downpipe, the catback makes almost no difference in backpressure and flow. Another way to put it is, the gains from doing a full 3" turbobac are greater than the sum of gains of a 3" downpipe/stock mid/catback plus stock downpipe+any catback.

Now, the exhaust cutout is essentially the same as removing the catback. How can you say with a straight face (presumably) that a 2.25" catback doesn't affect backpressure relative to NO catback? That's ridiculous.

you're telling me shiv deemed it was IMPOSSIBLE to tune the car safely like that.

i say bull****.

tune it for the cutout closed. when it's open, you gonna tell me it's gonna blow? i can tell you right to your face that it will NOT, since i drove a couple of thousand miles with NO catback on my car. then i put it on. then i took it off. then i pulled off the cats. then i put the catback back on. then i put on a magnaflow. the whole time on an MBC. the car never had a breakdown, never threw a rod, melted a piston, burned a valve, cracked a ringland, etc etc etc.

shiv sold a product that he said could be reflashed, then said he wouldn't reflash it. that's the end of the story. quit pissing on my leg and telling me it's raining.

No, and I agree that it shouldn't blow if tuned with the cutout closed. Course jm made it clear to shiv(from what he says) that he wanted it tuned with the cutout open.

you're telling me shiv deemed it was IMPOSSIBLE to tune the car safely like that.

i say bull****.

tune it for the cutout closed. when it's open, you gonna tell me it's gonna blow? i can tell you right to your face that it will NOT, since i drove a couple of thousand miles with NO catback on my car. then i put it on. then i took it off. then i pulled off the cats. then i put the catback back on. then i put on a magnaflow. the whole time on an MBC. the car never had a breakdown, never threw a rod, melted a piston, burned a valve, cracked a ringland, etc etc etc.

shiv sold a product that he said could be reflashed, then said he wouldn't reflash it. that's the end of the story. quit pissing on my leg and telling me it's raining.

Good for you. But you're not staking your professional reputation on a very questionable call. If I tuned cars for a living, I wouldn't do it either. What one person does with his own personal car is a different matter.

you're telling me shiv deemed it was IMPOSSIBLE to tune the car safely like that.
He never said it was IMPOSSIBLE, he said he wouldn't do it. After switching to a UTEC and LM-1 w/b, and a year over 15,000mi of finetuning, I found that's it NOT IMPOSSIBLE to do, since I am doing it now. I just don't have to car so freaking close to the ragged edge, tune wise, that it hurts the car, either way. There are no measurable differences on A/F, EGT, or Knock with the valve open or closed, take from that what you want. Who knows, maybe in another 15k mi. I'll find out different, but who knows...

Now, the exhaust cutout is essentially the same as removing the catback. How can you say with a straight face (presumably) that a 2.25" catback doesn't affect backpressure relative to NO catback? That's ridiculous.
I agree that the backpressure changes, which can be felt by a shift in the torque curve when driving. However, prior to having the cutout, I was catless w/ up/dp and stock cat-back, and was told by shiv, that the cat-back didn't matter on his staged maps. He has seen my car, knew the mods I had. According to him, a Stg0 was for uppipe cat; Stg1 was for up/dp cat removal; and Stg2 was for VF30/34 + STi Inj. His shop reflashed all three maps into my unichip at one time or another.


If the car was tuned(by shiv), jm's engine might have still blown(chances are pretty damn high imo), and he would probably be more pissed at shiv after paying for a tune. Course, that's just the way I see it.
You may be right if I paid the money and it still happened. I also told him I wanted it be safe, because there was no way of logging and knowing for sure without a custom tune. I had just upgraded to a Stg2 (VF30+Inj) and had the UniChip reflashed for Stg2 so it could run. I drove it for 2 weeks to make sure everything was installed correctly, before making an appointment (which was another 2 weeks out). The DAY before my appointment I called to confirm, and they turned me away. I only got about another 1 month off the engine, after that, before it went.

BTW, I also want to point out (so I don't look like "Joe Blow" from above) that a have Never taken my car in for warranty work, and I never went back and complained to Shiv about the issue after the fact. The last time I talked to anyone at Vishnu was when he refused me for the tune, so as far as I know, he doesn't even know about the issue (unless he's read it on the boards). So I never went back crying to him about it was his fault either. I went without WRX for 6 mos. while saving for and installing EJ22T and UTEC myself.

-jason