Has anybody heard anything about the 06 Impreza RS. The fourm is flooded with rumors (all of which I hope are true but......) for the WRX and STi but it seems that the RS model has been left out :(


With the "planned" huge power increase in the wrx and Sti's do you think there is a chance that subaru would tweak the 2.5 NA engine to give it a bit more get up and go? Is there much headroom left in the NA engine for them to play with (keeping in mind that it has to be a very streetiable setup and not race tune) ?

Or a even more general question, do you think subaru will redesign the impreza for 06 or hold out for 07?

Actually, I wish there were more discussions about what Subaru's going to do with their base N/A engine, especially as they are moving upmarket.

I think most will agree that Subaru has two excellent mid-200 HP, V6 equivalent engines. We are yet to see a V8 fighter, but the recent hybrid talk with Toyota may suggest what it's going to be.

Now what are they going to do with their base engine? They did a fine job of keeping the weight down on the new Legacy, but I still don't expect the next gen Impreza to be so much lighter than GD. Coupled with AWD power loss, the current 2.5 N/A seems a bit underpowered for a "premium" compact car, and definetely not enough to utilize AWD as a performance feature. So what can come in the future? Is Subaru working on direct injection? Will the base engine finally get AVCS next year?

while i feel that the 2.5 rs is due for an upgrade, lets keep in mind for example that acura's base engine is at 160hp, and even volvo and audi's base engines are 168-170. As for honda, toyota etc, they are still making base engines that are in the very low 100s for hp

*subscribe*

I would like to see about 180 chp upgrade.

181 HP, 183 FT. LB. has a nice ring to it...

while i feel that the 2.5 rs is due for an upgrade, lets keep in mind for example that acura's base engine is at 160hp, and even volvo and audi's base engines are 168-170. As for honda, toyota etc, they are still making base engines that are in the very low 100s for hp

But the RSX is FWD and is ~300lbs lighter than 2.5RS. Plus K20(?) is pretty high-tech for an NA 2.0, and it deserves to be in Acura line-up. As far as Civics and Corollas are concerned, I think it's the whole point of moving up-market to avoid a direct competition against those volume sellers. IMO Subaru needs to do a better job differentiating Impreza from other Japanese economy cars to become a premium brand.

I also thought about some of the european brands as you pointed out, and I agree if Subaru can offer the kind of luxury and prestige that these makes have, I think it will be fine with a somewhat mundane powertrain. But can it?

I'm not talking about some crazy HP numbers, just a little improvement here and there, more usable powercurve, smoother response, etc. Just the things that you would expect from a world-class engine.

do you think there is a chance that subaru would tweak the 2.5 NA engine to give it a bit more get up and go?

I've heard that the base 2.5 will get an upgrade for 2006MY.

Bob

yes I do agree that power wise it is close to other "base model" offering's out there. BUT..

Cars like the base corolla and civic are priced WAY under the subaru, more compariable in price are the "performance" versions of these cars. ie.. Corolla XRS - 170hp, Sentra Spec-V 170hp, Matrix XRS - 170hp, Mitsu RallyARt - 160hp, Acura RSX - 160hp.

What you have to realize that most of these cars are much lighter than the subaru and come in fwd (less drive train loss). They also have equipment loads similar to the sport edition of the RS. What this means is that a Corolla XRS costing 25,100 is a fair bit better performing than the similar impreza rs sport package costing 27,000.

I for one have owned both the matrix XRS (180hp, 03 version) and a subaru TS. In the engine department I can defently say the matrix has more get-up and go along with better high end response. Getting back into the impreza, it just seems like the engine gives up once you rev past 4500rpm or so.

unlikely
there has been a version of the jdm an 2.5 w/ avcs since 1999(?)

IIRC it was the first subaru engine to have avcs

While Subaru may be moving "upscale" or whatever, I'm not sure the 2.5RS is really along for that ride. It's the base Impreza with the base engine. There is only so much you are going to get for an $18k AWD car.

I'd like to see it make 175hp. In other parts of the world they have just gotten a 2L NA motor for years, and I believe in Japan the base Impreza now comes with a 1.5L enigne.

I believe in Japan the base Impreza now comes with a 1.5L enigne.

Yes, and in Europe it's offered in a 1.6L format too.

Bob

While Subaru may be moving "upscale" or whatever, I'm not sure the 2.5RS is really along for that ride. It's the base Impreza with the base engine. There is only so much you are going to get for an $18k AWD car.

I'd like to see it make 175hp. In other parts of the world they have just gotten a 2L NA motor for years, and I believe in Japan the base Impreza now comes with a 1.5L enigne.

That's also an interesting point. Can Subaru push to upmarket in JDM as well? Will japanese people ever consider Subaru to be a step up from Honda or Nissan as long as the products are good? Especially when the base line Impreza is actually a step down from Civic or Corolla.

Can they just leave the base Impreza behind and push the rest of lineup upmarket? Somehow I don't think that will work so easily.

Honestly I don't think it matters. With the niche market that Subaru has created, people may buy that car regardless of whether it's upscale or not. I don't think they are basing their future success on the base Impreza. It's similar to the Impreza L vs. RS in the past. The RS was the expensive frontrunner, the L was a car for those who wanted a Subaru and wanted AWD, but didn't want to pay that much. In 1998 I couldn't afford a 2.5RS, so I bought an outback sport. Right now for those people, the RS and the TS wagon are those cars, and I know 3 people personally that fit that profile.

I don't know anything about the Japanese market, but I would think things are similar, that's how they can get away with selling a 120hp 2900lb Impreza.

Perhaps getting rid of the 2.2L models in the US was a move to a more upscale brand, although that ocurred years ago now.

But the RSX is FWD and is ~300lbs lighter than 2.5RS. Plus K20(?) is pretty high-tech for an NA 2.0, and it deserves to be in Acura line-up. As far as Civics and Corollas are concerned, I think it's the whole point of moving up-market to avoid a direct competition against those volume sellers. IMO Subaru needs to do a better job differentiating Impreza from other Japanese economy cars to become a premium brand.


Improvement is always good, but my point is clear.... we are already way above the hp of civics and corollas, and closer to that of volvos and audis. Base volvos and audi's are just as fat and slow as subarus. (and faster than basic economy cars too)

IMO subaru needs to differentiate in terms of luxury and dealer service... not so much power. The reason the common man views a subaru closer to a honda than to an Audi is not because of Horsepower.... its because of the luxury look and feel via interior and exterior design and dealer service. I think you and can agree on that point.

yes I do agree that power wise it is close to other "base model" offering's out there. BUT..

Cars like the base corolla and civic are priced WAY under the subaru, more compariable in price are the "performance" versions of these cars. ie.. Corolla XRS - 170hp, Sentra Spec-V 170hp, Matrix XRS - 170hp, Mitsu RallyARt - 160hp, Acura RSX - 160hp.

What you have to realize that most of these cars are much lighter than the subaru and come in fwd (less drive train loss).

I know the price diff is huge with the base versions.. but some of those don't even have ABS or cd players, power windows etc.

the RS is compared to the "performance" versions by the automotive media. IMO it compares in performance stats and specifications just fine, and the price is inline, especially considering it has AWD.