The subaru tech school informed our techs that they will have 6 speeds available for the new Forester AND legacy lineup for 2006.


I'll try and get more details...


STi versions?!?!?!

Will believe it when I see it, but very cool

Yea that's what I was saying... Just happened to be talking to one of our techs in the back and he mentioned Forester and 6 speed in the same sentence so I had to stop him and grill him on it. The trainer for the Subaru techs informed them about it so they knew what to expect, etc. Hopefully he wasn't just sleeping during a boring seminar and dreaming it up!

Legacy STI please, something resembling it, just add a 6 speed and HIDs and I'm game. Ok Ok, add something similiar to the JDM bumpers and you're all mine :p

Now we're getting somewhere...

<-- prays the tech wasn't smoking crack so he doesn't get lynched this year when the 06's come out :lol:

The subaru tech school informed our techs that they will have 6 speeds available for the new Forester AND legacy lineup for 2006.


I'll try and get more details...


STi versions?!?!?!

That's great news!

Bob

this was the reason, or one of the reasons, there was no new Forester announcement at the Chicago show. If they had announce that, it would have diluted the news as far as the legacy was concerned. I wonder if the WRX will also get the 6-speed?

Bob

man, my buddy will be pissed. He just bought an '05 GT limited and would kill for HIDs and a 6 speed. If the '06 have those features, he's gonna have a stroke.

You can bet the WRX will stay 5 speed. The 6 speed will be part of a higher trim level I'm sure. The reasoning behind the limited use of HID's is Subaru's aim of safety via daytime running lights, etc...

After autocrossing my fathers GT that I sold him a few weeks ago I might jump the STi ship to get a Legacy if they really do this :)

As a recent Legacy GT purchaser, I think I will actively lobby Subaru to not bring out a six-speed in the Legacy GT :lol:

I'd buy a forester XT with a 6-speed and HID.

man, my buddy will be pissed. He just bought an '05 GT limited and would kill for HIDs and a 6 speed. If the '06 have those features, he's gonna have a stroke.
i think i would have a stroke too if the Legacy STI came out

I bet that will help the gas mileage, as 6th would be a great low-rpm cruising gear.

Bob

^^ Yeah, I hope so too, although if you look at the Impreza lineup 6th in the STi is not any wider than 5th in the WRX; they just spaced the ratios closer together. Still wider than 5th in the Forester, though, so maybe there is hope ...

I'll trade in my 05 LGT!

i dont think we'll see a 6 speed in a forester xt or wrx. they'll probably just stick the 6 speeds in the sti versions.

as for the legacy. i'd guess either the current sti drivetrain or the 3.0/6speed combo.

I'd buy a forester XT with a 6-speed and HID.

I'd at least consider one, or a wagon version of the Legacy STi. :)

This might be obvious, but we're talking 6MT not 6EAT here, right?

Ken

MT was what i was told

As a recent Legacy GT purchaser, I think I will actively lobby Subaru to not bring out a six-speed in the Legacy GT :lol:

I'll join you in that lobby. If I don't get it no one gets its :furious:

The only companies now making 6EATs are Toyota/Aisin (Touareg/LS430) and Ford (Mazda6/Five Hundred). I don't think Subaru's provider, JATCO makes 6 speed autos yet, so it's most likely a manual.

Oh, and I'll join the lobby too! :devil:


Just wondering: does anyone know if Subarus use FWD or RWD style automatic transmissions?

This might be obvious, but we're talking 6MT not 6EAT here, right?

Ken

Eww, this would mean much cheaper and more plentiful 6 speed swaps.

Of course... Right when I get my 05 on order they offer this :mad:

A 6EAT is exactly what the B9 needs.... oh well.

if they release a six-speed forester, they better build a seven-speed STi to keep the exclusivity.

Eww, this would mean much cheaper and more plentiful 6 speed swaps.

Halleleujah!!!

Just wondering: does anyone know if Subarus use FWD or RWD style automatic transmissions?
Newer Subaru auto transmissions are rear-drive biased. I can't remember the exact ratio but it's either 45/55 or 40/60.
The first Subaru AT with rear-bias was the 2002 WRX.

I almost hope that the 6 speed isn't true, because I will HAVE to have it. I won't be happy with a 5 speed version knowing that there's a 6 speed available! My wallet will not be happy. :lol:

So, if the Legacy and Forester get a 6MT, that nicely rounds out the 2.5T+6MT combination across the Subaru line (the other being the STi).

I wonder, however if the Legacy and Forester 6MT will still use a VC...

Also, I wonder if this means if the Forester XT auto will move up to 5EAT to keep things consistent?

Ken

I'd be looking for the trade in.

hmmm I would really enjoy a Legacy Spec B ... hmm smooooooth
I think the B9 with a 6spd would be out of place. Who drives a manual SUV?

Nice!

I'll be real pissed too if they offer a 6-speed LGT. I already took care of the HIDs.

Please Please be true.

This is exactly why Ive walked off the subaru lot twice in the last 8 months not buying the legacy I intended to order.

im thinkin the only models that will receive the 6 speed will be the forester XT and the legacy gt.. maybe even WRX.. considering that the 300hp and 227 (or 250 upcoming) will still differentiate bw the models greatly

if they release a six-speed forester, they better build a seven-speed STi to keep the exclusivity

:lol:

Newer Subaru auto transmissions are rear-drive biased. I can't remember the exact ratio but it's either 45/55 or 40/60.
The first Subaru AT with rear-bias was the 2002 WRX.

What about the '01 Outback VDC? As far as I know, the VDC has always had a rear-biased torque split (opinions seem to differ on what exactly that split is- some sources say it's 35/65, others that it's 45/55).

I think the B9 with a 6spd would be out of place. Who drives a manual SUV?

BMW X5 3.0 is available with MT. Interestingly, Subaru explicitly benchmarked the performance of the B9 on the X5 3.0 Why not go all the way?

The split on the automatics is 55 rear 45 front.. Active All-Wheel Drive I believe is the term they use.

I'm hoping for an STi version rather than the standard XT getting a 5 speed :)

Hmm... a 6th would be a nice cruising gear, probably make for better highway mileage too.

Although I must say, I really like the punch available while cruising in 5th. :)

Unless mileage/performance is significantly improved, I don't think it's worth it. 5-speeds in BMW 330s get about the same mileage and have very similar performance to the 6-speeds, so it may be a matter of perception more than anything.

We'll see 1) if they bring 6-speeds, and 2) what the advantages really prove to be in the real world... if any.

I'll have some confirmation monday... One of our other techs is headed to the same class Thurs-Friday and I've informed him that he WILL find out for me :)

im thinkin the only models that will receive the 6 speed will be the forester XT and the legacy gt.. maybe even WRX..

Good job at narrowing it down! :lol:

I'll have some confirmation monday... One of our other techs is headed to the same class Thurs-Friday and I've informed him that he WILL find out for me :)I imagine that, by now, the instructors have received nasty-grams from above warning them to keep their mouths shut about MY2006 stuff until the new-model-update classes begin in the spring. :)

having driven the six spd TSX quite a bit (mom's), i'm really not sure what all the excitement is about- could someone plz explain? having the extra gear to row through is more work, and not much fun in bumper to bumper traffic, since the first couple gears are pretty short. i think it makes sense if you have an engine like the TSX's which is low on torque and likes to rev high, more gears seem to help that by keeping the revs up, but w/ the Boxer engines, seems unnecessary. 1st gear on the FXT is already too short i'm not sure how an extra gear alleviates this. if anytyhing, it seems like it'd help on the WRX which can get bogged down in the lower gears fr. turbo lag. if 6 speeds yieldss a taller cruising gear, i think that'd be great for gas mileage, and would be all for it. otherwise i just don't understand why they're all the rage? product differentiation? Is 6 really better than 5?

having driven the six spd TSX quite a bit (mom's), i'm really not sure what all the excitement is about- could someone plz explain? having the extra gear to row through is more work, and not much fun in bumper to bumper traffic, since the first couple gears are pretty short. i think it makes sense if you have an engine like the TSX's which is low on torque and likes to rev high, more gears seem to help that by keeping the revs up, but w/ the Boxer engines, seems unnecessary. 1st gear on the FXT is already too short i'm not sure how an extra gear alleviates this. if anytyhing, it seems like it'd help on the WRX which can get bogged down in the lower gears fr. turbo lag. if 6 speeds yieldss a taller cruising gear, i think that'd be great for gas mileage, and would be all for it. otherwise i just don't understand why they're all the rage? product differentiation? Is 6 really better than 5?

Good point. I just drove a new Xterra 6-speed manual a few hours ago. While a lot of fun, you are always shifting. In addition, because the gear splits are so close, it can be hard sometimes to remember what gear you're in. 4th gear really isn't that much different than 6th, in terms of feel. I guess if I spent more time with it, it wouldn't be a problem.

Bob

having driven the six spd TSX quite a bit (mom's), i'm really not sure what all the excitement is about- could someone plz explain? having the extra gear to row through is more work, and not much fun in bumper to bumper traffic, since the first couple gears are pretty short. i think it makes sense if you have an engine like the TSX's which is low on torque and likes to rev high, more gears seem to help that by keeping the revs up, but w/ the Boxer engines, seems unnecessary. 1st gear on the FXT is already too short i'm not sure how an extra gear alleviates this. if anytyhing, it seems like it'd help on the WRX which can get bogged down in the lower gears fr. turbo lag. if 6 speeds yieldss a taller cruising gear, i think that'd be great for gas mileage, and would be all for it. otherwise i just don't understand why they're all the rage? product differentiation? Is 6 really better than 5?

I think everyone used this same argument when the switch was made from 4 to 5.

-Allen

Agreed, there is little point to the STi 6spd in america. However it will be better than the legacy GT 5spd as that has retarded gearing. Wow. 1st too tall, 5th too short, and the ratios way closer than needed.

I think the excitement over the 6spd is NOT limited to that new option alone.

Its the other pieces of the puzzle that arent released yet that make the 6spd good news for those of us hoping for even better offerings from Subaru.

Specificly, a us legacy model between a gt and a STI legacy, if not exactly that...an STI legacy would fine as well. :)

I could care less about another gear, I only want the 6 speed because it's so much stronger than the 5.

You guys who don't see the excitement over the Subaru 6 speed must be new to Subaru's, or just don't care about a strong tranny for whatever boring reason(insert the usual I don't race it, don't launch it, don't whatever). ;)

I could care less about another gear, I only want the 6 speed because it's so much stronger than the 5.

You guys who don't see the excitement over the Subaru 6 speed must be new to Subaru's, or just don't care about a strong tranny for whatever boring reason(insert the usual I don't race it, don't launch it, don't whatever). ;)
I'm with Eby on this one, the main reason I got rid of my 02 WRX was that stinkin 5 speed tranny. I will never again buy a Subby 5 speed, now the 6 speed that is a different story. :cool: It is not so much the new gear, but the new tranny.

Richard

if this rumor is true, that the 6-speed models come with a gear indicator, like that found on the STi. With the close gear splits, it helps you remember which gear you're in. Now that may sound silly, but I've driven several 6-speeds, and sometimes it's tough to remember which gear your in, especially if you're just driving casually.

Bob

As a recent Legacy GT purchaser, I think I will actively lobby Subaru to not bring out a six-speed in the Legacy GT :lol:

IBletsStartaClassActionSuit

Agreed, there is little point to the STi 6spd in america. However it will be better than the legacy GT 5spd as that has retarded gearing. Wow. 1st too tall, 5th too short, and the ratios way closer than needed.

have we driven the same car? :) the 5 speed legacy gt i drove had excellent gearing, a lot better than a 5 speed wrx. if anything the 2.0 in the current wrx needs a six speed, i've driven a euro 6 speed on a mostly stock wrx and it was a completely different car.

i havent experienced a gt on the highway, so i cannot comment about the top gear, but as for the rest (not starting a flame war) i have to respectfully disagree.

i still stand by my prediction of an usdm sti drivetrain or 3.0/6 speed in the legacy. :)

I'll trade in my 05 LGT!

Silly Wabbit, never buy a first year model :p

I bet that will help the gas mileage, as 6th would be a great low-rpm cruising gear.

Bob

Bob,

Unfortunately, this would be below 3,000 RPMs in the "off-boost" are of the rev-range. Unless doing extended high speed cruising, might actually hurt gas mileage as drivers would keep it in 5th (which would be lower than our existing 5th) to keep boost on the boil.

And for the record, I'm happy with my 05 5MT LGT but would really have liked to at least driven a 6MT. The LGT 5MT's gearing is just about where it needs to be. 1st is just a smidge to short for my tastes and 2nd could stretch out just a tad too, but then I'm in the 6MT ratios, so keep it like it is as a 5MT.

And, IIRC, Subaru had been intending to bring the STI Forester to the USDM in 06 as a STI-enhanced 6MT beast. I only relay this because I was going to replace my wife's 01 Forester S with an 06 STI FXT which several Subaru insiders had told me was coming to the US in May/June 06. Now, it looks like I'll be getting her an OB XT instead because we like the new OB so much better

Br, Dale

If subaru is about to bring in a 6speed in the LGT, sorry for them, but too little too late, should have brought it from the beginning, it will only get first year owner mad of not having it, and kinda look like the car wasnt completly ready to be sold

it's one of the factor that made me not to buy a legacy GT, that and lack of certain features in the car, and a proper warranty/maintenance package

anyone thought of the fact that the only subie models to get 6 speed would be the STi models?? (the STi models coming to the U.S.) Impreza STi has it now.. and what if they bring the Forester and Legacy STi over... i'm thinkin the only models with the 6 spds will be the STi ones.....

anyone thought of the fact that the only subie models to get 6 speed would be the STi models?? Nobody's thought of that because it isn't a "fact." Today, except in North America, one can already buy a 6-speed Legacy, and it ain't an STi.

^^Agreed; we might get the H6/6MT combo like Europe.



Unfortunately, this would be below 3,000 RPMs in the "off-boost" are of the rev-range. Unless doing extended high speed cruising, might actually hurt gas mileage as drivers would keep it in 5th (which would be lower than our existing 5th) to keep boost on the boil.


Nothing wrong with being "off-boost" while cruising on the highway. I leave my WRX in 5th when cruising in the 60-75 mph range, which is below 3000 rpm.

I think everyone used this same argument when the switch was made from 4 to 5.

-Allen

I think that's different- 3 and 4 speed manual trannies, including column mounted 3's didn't have overdrive. The introduction of an overdrive 5th addressed that. 5 to 6 though, both have a cruising gear already. The addition just spaces the non-overdriven gears closer together.

anyone thought of the fact that the only subie models to get 6 speed would be the STi models?? (the STi models coming to the U.S.) Impreza STi has it now.. and what if they bring the Forester and Legacy STi over... i'm thinkin the only models with the 6 spds will be the STi ones.....
a few have already mentioned the H6/6-spd Legacy, but the only Forrester w/ a 6-sp is the STi version. Let's hope Subaru stops dilly-dallying and offers the STi hat trick! :)

I think that's different- 3 and 4 speed manual trannies, including column mounted 3's didn't have overdrive.

I beg to differ. In days of old, US car and truck manufacturer Studebaker offered 3-speed column-shifted manuauls with overdrive. OD was engaged using a push-pull knob mounted on or below the dashboard.

In this photo of a late '40s Studebaker pickup interior (modern seats installed by owner) you can see the OD switch at far left on the dash. Hard to tell in this pic but the knob is marked "OD." :p

http://billstudepage.homestead.com/files/2r5int.jpg

Studebaker also offered the infamous Hill-Holder clutch, still loved, hated and/or tolerated by today's Subaru owners.

Ed

the main advantage of the 6th gear will be to allow for higher (comfortable, lower rpm!) cruising speeds—say 90+ mph. ;)

Bob

the main advantage of the 6th gear will be to allow for higher (comfortable, lower rpm!) cruising speeds—say 90+ mph. ;)

BobThat likely won't be true if the 6-speed is packaged as a performance STi version.

Dammit, I just quizzed both out techs that have already been to the 6-speed training and they confirmed both of these statements.
Legacy line and Forester line will get the 6MT for 2006. They weren't sure which trim level they would come in though.

I'm more concerned about horsepower and how much better the 6 speed works in getting even more performance out of the Forester. If I'm going to trade my 04 in already, the XT STI better offer dramatically better performance than the one I have. Frankly, I'd be thrilled if it accelerated better than the WRX STI ( which it might if they kept the 444:1 axles). My father had a six speed Porsche, and I know there are enthusiasts out there that regard the six speed transmission as more marketing hype than anything else. After driving a six speed 911, I tend to agree. It's not that big a deal.

is it true a 6 spd tranny weighs more than a 5 spd, and if so, how much weight are we talking?

is it true a 6 spd tranny weighs more than a 5 spd, and if so, how much weight are we talking?


to the best of my knowledge, the tranmission alone weighs 85 lbs. more than a stock wrx 5 speed unit.

My father had a six speed Porsche, and I know there are enthusiasts out there that regard the six speed transmission as more marketing hype than anything else. After driving a six speed 911, I tend to agree. It's not that big a deal.


It all depends on the car and the gear ratios.
Our MCS has a 6-speed, and we love it. With MINIs we had a choice between 165hp and a 6MT Getrag, or a 110hp 5MT by ZF. No contest.

OTOH, I'd take a 4-speed if it came with the 4-speed WRC Pug's performance. :devil:

to the best of my knowledge, the tranmission alone weighs 85 lbs. more than a stock wrx 5 speed unit.

IIRC, that's including the weight of the front LSD (however much) vs the WRX's open diff, too.

I think that's different- 3 and 4 speed manual trannies, including column mounted 3's didn't have overdrive. The introduction of an overdrive 5th addressed that. 5 to 6 though, both have a cruising gear already. The addition just spaces the non-overdriven gears closer together.

The car I learned to drive on--1977 Plymouth Volare--had a 4MT with overdrive. It may even have been marked that way on the shifter: 1-2-3-OD. That meant some really w i d e gear spacing, though.

I think 4th in some of the 80s 4MT Subies may have been overdrive too. I'm also pretty sure both 4th and 5th in most modern cars are usually overdrive.

Quote:
Originally Posted by only1agam
anyone thought of the fact that the only subie models to get 6 speed would be the STi models??

Nobody's thought of that because it isn't a "fact." Today, except in North America, one can already buy a 6-speed Legacy, and it ain't an STi.

i didnt mean for it to sound like a "fact" sry

Maybe it will have DCCD too!

Maybe it will have DCCD too!

DCCD is a complete waste on a street car. I'd rather not have it.

id only offer DCCD on the STi models

DCCD is a complete waste on a street car. I'd rather not have it.

Um, there are a lot of things on Subaru's higher end models that aren't necessary on a street car. It's not like nobody's ever taken a Subaru to an autocross or track event. Dare I go out on a limb and say it also just makes driving more fun.

This is an enthusiasts forum right?

As a recent Legacy GT purchaser, I think I will actively lobby Subaru to not bring out a six-speed in the Legacy GT :lol:

You damn right have my support. With 650 miles on my Legacy GT, I do not need to know Subaru made another sedan that can smoke mine. They can make a Subaru Legacy STi with a 3L H6 turbo and a 6-speed. That is all fine and nice...and I may even trade mine in for that. But they should leave the GT alone...as it is.

They could add HIDs and Navigation though, and make those available for retro-fit in the 2005 LGTs.

I guess DCCD would make sense for a Legacy STi, but does the Forrester STi come with DCCD overseas? Honestly...the Forrester would not be targeted towards track duty nearly as much as a Legacy or WRX, so would it really need the DCCD? I don't see it as detrimental if it had it, but if it kept the cost down some, it would seem to be a viable option to dump it.

if this rumor is true, that the 6-speed models come with a gear indicator, like that found on the STi. With the close gear splits, it helps you remember which gear you're in. Now that may sound silly, but I've driven several 6-speeds, and sometimes it's tough to remember which gear your in, especially if you're just driving casually.

Bob




I have that same problem on my motorcycle sometimes.

Um, there are a lot of things on Subaru's higher end models that aren't necessary on a street car. It's not like nobody's ever taken a Subaru to an autocross or track event. Dare I go out on a limb and say it also just makes driving more fun.

This is an enthusiasts forum right?

:rolleyes:

OMG! You're so much more hardcore than I!!1!


It's a Legacy, man. A GT car. If DCCD is superfluous crap for the WRX STi, it's a complete waste on any iteration of a Legacy. When we're talking about an already moderately overpriced car to begin with, you can't go around throwing in every single option Subaru has ever offered unless you're looking to ensure it's failure.

6-spd, Nav, and xenon plus a more aggresive look (ie JDM bumpers) would make it a real contender. Especially if they could keep it around the price of a TSX.

I have that same problem on my motorcycle sometimes.

It really is. I was test driving a new Xterra 6-speed the other day, and I couldn't remember whether I was in 4th or 6th. Now it could have been because I was in a new and unfamiliar vehicle. I've never had that problem with 5-speed manuals, but it happened with the Xterra and the Honda S2000 I drove too, both being 6-speeds.

Bob

Opie: Dude that's sad that I got this out of the techs first ;) You know how they just LOVE sales guys back in the back! :lol:

...
If DCCD is superfluous crap for the WRX STi,
...


I didn't use it much, but it did come in handy a few times.

50/50 lock is a blast with snow tires on sand roads :)

:rolleyes:

OMG! You're so much more hardcore than I!!1!


It's a Legacy, man. A GT car. If DCCD is superfluous crap for the WRX STi, it's a complete waste on any iteration of a Legacy. When we're talking about an already moderately overpriced car to begin with, you can't go around throwing in every single option Subaru has ever offered unless you're looking to ensure it's failure.

6-spd, Nav, and xenon plus a more aggresive look (ie JDM bumpers) would make it a real contender. Especially if they could keep it around the price of a TSX.

I never said anything about the application of DCCD in the Legacy. If they put it in the Legacy great, it would be a lot of fun. If not and it's cheaper, that's good too. I was simply replying to your statement that DCCD is pointless on a street car. So are a lot of other things that can add to the driving enjoyment of Subaru's, like the Xenon lights and Nav that you're wanting.

The only way a 6 speed in an LGT would be useful if if the 6th was a real overdrive, as in a highway cruise gear to up the fuel economy. The existing Subaru 6 speed trannies don't fit this model - they have 6 close ratios. 5th on the LGT is OK for normal driving, but a real "overdrive" it is not, hence excessive fuel consumption at highway speeds.

I reckon what we may get is the 3L 6 speed like the ROW gets - more luxury, more upmarket image, more $$$ and less performance than the LGT.

i think a dccd would make sense in any 6 speed equipped legacy simply to give the marketing folks at subaru another feature to glorify. i bet they'd spin it somehow to make it appear to be subaru's competition for acura's sh-awd.

if they do offer some form of dccd, maybe it will just be two options, normal (auto) and snow (50/50).

Bill, I've driven an S2000 and a TL both with six-speeds, and have never had a problem remembering which gear I was in.

It really is. I was test driving a new Xterra 6-speed the other day, and I couldn't remember whether I was in 4th or 6th. Now it could have been because I was in a new and unfamiliar vehicle. I've never had that problem with 5-speed manuals, but it happened with the Xterra and the Honda S2000 I drove too, both being 6-speeds.

Bob

It really is. I was test driving a new Xterra 6-speed the other day, and I couldn't remember whether I was in 4th or 6th. Now it could have been because I was in a new and unfamiliar vehicle. I've never had that problem with 5-speed manuals, but it happened with the Xterra and the Honda S2000 I drove too, both being 6-speeds.

Bob


Going from my 5MT regular car (the WRX) to the 6MT MCS (my wife's regular car) I sometimes put my hand on the shifter to put it in 6th, but I've always remembered before actually trying it. ;)

As for the lower gears, who cares what gear you're in. You're either in the right one, or one too high or too low and shift accordingly. From whatever its position, you know where to put it to change gears as needed (up or down -- it won't let you go any further up or down than necessary).

And, unlike the WRX's 5MT, the MCS's 6MT will easily shift into 1st. :)

You would think if they were going to bring out a 'NA' Forester or Legacy STi they would have anounced it at the recent car shows.

I heard the same thing at work today, that 06 legacy's will have 6-speeds. that was from a tech that just came back from training. Didn't hear about foresters though

"You would think if they were going to bring out a 'NA' Forester or Legacy STi they would have anounced it at the recent car shows"

Probably not. This is why they denied up and down that they'd ever bring over the WRX STI. They want to sell as many WRX's first. Tell people an STI version is coming and you'll kill your sales.

Yup; no point in announcing improvements to a model until the cars actually arrive.

Roger, IIRC 6th in the STi is very close to 5th in the WRX, but 5th in the LGT is actually lower than both. So putting the STi 6MT in the LGT might help. Or we might get different gears with a little wider ratios.

maybe it will drive the cost of 6 spds down...we can only hope

Any hint of the 3.0R engine in the '06 Legacy?

Only other thing I've heard is that they've seen a number of new model codes.... Which just means they will have a few more trim levels out there... No specifics on what they are though. The sales reps had NO idea about the 6 speed.

Only other thing I've heard is that they've seen a number of new model codes.... Which just means they will have a few more trim levels out there... No specifics on what they are though.

New model codes, introduction of 6 speeds to the lineup, sounds like a pretty good chance of being STI's to me.

or just the euro spec-B

For the Legacy maybe, but what about the Forester, STI?

or just the euro spec-B

fine with me....

Any hint of the 3.0R engine in the '06 Legacy?
My guess would be that the 6-speed manual will come mated to the 3.0 H6 in a 3.0R trim, like they currently have in Europe.

maybe it will drive the cost of 6 spds down...we can only hope

That's exactly what I was thinking. Of course with a 6 speed Legacy GT, it will be even harder for me to resist trading in my WRX

6spd fxt or lgt with the 2.5l turbo = likely sale for me. Its the weak 5spds that keep me away.

A note from the loony bin:
This discovery does not, in itself, rule out an Impreza STi wagon as well:
Since there are already Imprezas with a 6mt, there would be no need to tell the mechanics anything new about them. ;)

yeah subie doesn't even tell us mechanics much, but there is a buzz around the shop about purchasing the $$$$$ tool set for 6mt's, and we wouldn't be purchasing it just for the STi's on the road, just not enough of them up here to justify the cost.

That and the new $10,000 select monitor you guys need... OUCH! But yes... the idea is for the dealerships to finally be able to work on the 6MT rather than having to send it in ;)

didn't know about the new select moniter yet, what more does it do? maybe new features in 06 like nav? last update to the moniter was the imobilizer cartridge at our dealer. The "yes" button is almost inop, so a new one will be nice.

BTW I was talking to sales today and they have no idea about any 6mt info, but they usually find out last anyway. I bet that it will be in the 3.0R, as previously stated. Especially since it's already sold in europe. Also the new model codes could be with and without nav, as that will prob. change some things.

I'll pass on the 3.0R; I'd rather have more torque (GT) than more gears.

Yeah love the torque bath that my 2.5T gives me at the slightest hint of go throttle. Cannot say the same thing about the 3.0 in any incarnation.

Talk about and 3.0T and things might be different.

FWIW - the 5MT in the new LGT, really does feel more solid that previous gen 5MTs (Legacy, 2.5RS, WRX, etc.) so I'm not too concerned about this one coming unglued. I would presume that the 6MT with it's internal pressure lubrication would be that much more tough, even without the DCCD hardware.

I'll pass on the 3.0R; I'd rather have more torque (GT) than more gears.

Ditto. If the 3.0 is heavier and slower, what's the point?

what's the point?
A smooooth 6 cylinder engine.

Some people prefer smooth and effortless torque delivery of an H6 instead of the "delayed torque" caused by a turbo. The H6 is supposed to be a high tech, superbly balanced engine.

Also, I could only imagine what the H6 would sound like with a nice exhaust... think Porsche.

Also, I could only imagine what the H6 would sound like with a nice exhaust... think Porsche.
Actually, think Ferrari flat-12. I haven't heard the EZ30 opened up, but an EG33 with sport exhaust sounds like a high-strung Italian. Very musical, not raspy like the 350Z.

hmmm ... I doubt they are going to put the H6 in the Forester, though, so maybe the Forester will get 2.5t/MT6 combo. Maybe even STi model ...

http://www.wrxhackers.com/6speedproof.jpg

SOA types: I trust I'm not giving anything away since I haven't seen anything that says I can't post that info. I definitely checked. ;)

Incidently.. a 5CA = Outback Sedan 3.0R

My guess is that we'll see a 3.0L 6 speed coming in the near future.

So anyother info?

H6?
H4T?

Available on the wagon?

Oh please, please give us a Legacy STI!!! I don't just want the 6 speed, I want the power, give me at least 350 horses with equivalent torque!!! And I'm so there! :banana: :D :banana:

No other info... like I said this wasn't "announced" It was probably a slip up from someone working on the dealer website. They have 06's listed along with some model codes... Let me see what they have in there.

Actually, think Ferrari flat-12. I haven't heard the EZ30 opened up, but an EG33 with sport exhaust sounds like a high-strung Italian. Very musical, not raspy like the 350Z.

Infiniti FX45 and G35 Coupe have the nicest exhaust note, hope it's something similar.

Correction: There are 3 new model codes. They don't have them listed as 6 speeds but..... I have a feeling :)

6AK and 6AL <-- two new legacy model codes for 06... The previous models ended at 5AI and 5AJ (The legacy GT LTD's....)

Anything higher in the lettering scheme = more expensive.

So.. there will be 2 legacy's at least with MSRP's over 30k... STI?

Any news on the Forester yet?

Correction: There are 3 new model codes. They don't have them listed as 6 speeds but..... I have a feeling :)

6AK and 6AL <-- two new legacy model codes for 06... The previous models ended at 5AI and 5AJ (The legacy GT LTD's....)

Anything higher in the lettering scheme = more expensive.

So.. there will be 2 legacy's at least with MSRP's over 30k... STI?
Would models with and without nav be considered separate trim lines? If so, those >$30k model codes could be the GT Ltd Sedan and Wagon w/nav since navigation generally runs about $2k and that would push both models' sticker over 30k:

Legacy GT LTD Sedan = $28,595 MSRP + ~$2k NAV = $30,595
Legacy GT LTD Wagon = $29,795 MSRP + ~$2k NAV = $31,795

That doesn't leave a lot of room for a 6 speed option ;) The navigation will almost definitely be an option or option package vs a model code

Nothing on the website with any info on the foresters I'm afraid

oh dear lord....if the legacy sti is truly here this year, i will be first in line to order it...quote me on it...

So please educate me......what would be so special about a Legacy (sedan) STi compared to an Impreza STi, supposing they're both touting the same power output etc. (I'm not being flippant, I'd like to know).

So please educate me......what would be so special about a Legacy (sedan) STi compared to an Impreza STi, supposing they're both touting the same power output etc. (I'm not being flippant, I'd like to know).

Well, you get those voluptuous Legacy bumpers...

oh dear lord....if the legacy sti is truly here this year, i will be first in line to order it...quote me on it...

Done.

mtms4 - some of us are sick of getting harrassed by cops and hondaboys, the legacy sti = all the fun, more creature comforts, and none of the annoyance...

I'm seriously interested in knowing more about the Legacy STi, just in case a USDM version becomes available. I'm definitely changing cars this year and so far it's between the (Impreza) STi and the Evo IX.....is there something else I should be tempted by ?

Basshead,
Would the Legacy STi have an FMIC and the huge-ass bonnet scoop that goes with it. Would it sport the same picnic-table boot spoiler ? Not that those things bother me; they're inherent to the design of the Impreza STi ;)

Oh please, please give us a Legacy STI!!! I don't just want the 6 speed, I want the power, give me at least 350 horses with equivalent torque!!! And I'm so there!


so lets say we do get this "Legacy STi".. what type of engine will it have?? A H6tt or a H4 upgraded from the Impreza STi?? i HIGHLY doubt we'll get a regular H6 with the 250hp/219 torque for the STi model.. what do yall think?? H6tt or upgraded Impreza STi model?

Correction: There are 3 new model codes. They don't have them listed as 6 speeds but..... I have a feeling :)

6AK and 6AL <-- two new legacy model codes for 06... The previous models ended at 5AI and 5AJ (The legacy GT LTD's....)

Anything higher in the lettering scheme = more expensive.

So.. there will be 2 legacy's at least with MSRP's over 30k... STI?
Interesting that you saw 2 codes starting with 6. But the 6__ code is for the Tribeca I believe. Could they be 5AK, 5AL?

If so, my guess is:
5CB - 3.0R Spec-B 6MT sedan
6AK/6AL - 2.5GT Spec-B 6MT sedan (difference being interior color)

I doubt a Legacy STi is coming anytime soon...although I'd love to see it!

*Edit - Oops I just realized that the number is the year? :D I'm still sticking to my guess anyways.

Subaru rocks. . .1st: AWD every model. . throw a turbo into the mix and why not offer a 6spd too. . . hmm. Wonder what direction Subaru is going? Love my 6 speed.

Well, you get those voluptuous Legacy bumpers...
bumpers bumpers bumpers, bring something better than current bumpers and I'm putting a preorder in right now, oh yeah and HIDs

6- = 2006

The tribeca isn't going to be listed under legacy since it's a completely different chasis ;)

bumpers bumpers bumpers, bring something better than current bumpers and I'm putting a preorder in right now, oh yeah and HIDs

Ding!

me want FSTI
please oh please oh please :D

Basshead,
Would the Legacy STi have an FMIC and the huge-ass bonnet scoop that goes with it. Would it sport the same picnic-table boot spoiler ? Not that those things bother me; they're inherent to the design of the Impreza STi ;)

FMIC? The Impreza STi doesn't have a FMIC either. That's why they have the hood scoops, for the Top Mount Intercoolers. Odds are, the Legacy with have a top mount. Front mounts make bumpers more difficult.

Odds are, the Legacy would have slightly higher horsepower and torque, whenever it shows up. Nobody here really knows. However, it won't be quite as sporty as the Impreza STi, but very, very close. Looking at the history of Japan's Legacy STi's, you get the stuff mentioned earlier(nicer interior, smoother ride, much more sophisticated looking exterior) and a surprising amount of power and handling.

It's not really directly comparable to the Impreza STi, but in the U.S., many potential Legacy STi customers started out as Impreza owners, either due to youth or lack of availability. There aren't any other choices that offer the Legacy STi's performance and features anywhere near the expected price point in the U.S.

Sorry my bad.......i knew it was a TMIC....I was typing too fast and not thinking (probably the effects of the Merlot I was drinking !!).
Bill.

I wonder if they might pertain to Legacys equipped with navagation?

In Europe those are specific models, with an "n" after the name, such as "Legacy 3.0Rn."

Bob

so lets say we do get this "Legacy STi".. what type of engine will it have?? A H6tt or a H4 upgraded from the Impreza STi?? i HIGHLY doubt we'll get a regular H6 with the 250hp/219 torque for the STi model.. what do yall think?? H6tt or upgraded Impreza STi model?

Well, obviously this is all speculation, but I would hope for an H6 twinturbo, that way we're getting low end and high end boost. But an H6TT should *hopefully* give out a lot more power than 350.

Ahgh! I'll say it again, I want that RS6, E55 AMG, M5 competitor, the subie version. A sub-5 second Legacy with sportscar like agility? sign me up!

It's most likely that we will get the 3.0 H6 Spec-B with 6 sp. Then again, no one really expected the Impreza STI to have the 2.5L w/ 300hp. Please just give us this with a turbo:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v600/sasquatch95/ks1_P101090208.jpg

Ha haa, that's the same exact pic I sent my brother when he was mocking it. If you scroll around the Japanese language site, you can find all kinds of "STI parts" for the legacy, included in that, are Brembo's, quad exhaust, sweet seats, and a really appealing shiftknob. I hope we get all those in my Legacy STI. :D

I went through a saved a number of pics that I ran across on a word doc. but I don't know how I could share it with everyone here.

All this Legacy STI talk, for some reason I highly doubt it. There has been talk of Forester STI talk and yes I can see them doing a STI version across the board, but just because a 6 speed is coming supposedly in two lines of the Legacy doesn't mean STI. I'm hoping but I won't hold my breath, if one does come expect me doing a preorder well it depends on the bumpers. If we get the boring GT bumpers I will be highly disappointed.

yeah, I love that pic so much, I've posted it at least 3 times :lol:

if you want to post pics go to www.photobucket.com and get an account. It's free and you just upload your picture and copy the img URL it gives you in your post here.

^^^Cool thanks, I'll do that and post some up.

And Benny, I know, of course, we're all speculating, no one is holding their breath, but we're just sending out positive vibes hoping to get a Legacy STI. It's just fun to anticipate the possibilities. :D

if a Legacy STi shows up at NY this year. I very much doubt it will happen. I expect 6-speed Legacy GTs, and maybe even a 6-speed Legacy H-6, and not necessarily the the Spec B either, but another LGT-like car but with the H-6 engine and not the Spec B suspension.

Bob

... and you'll never see the JDM bumpers on a Legacy sold in a US showroom. Time to get over that one or find your favorite JDM supplier and open up your wallet. ;)

... and you'll never see the JDM bumpers on a Legacy sold in a US showroom. Time to get over that one or find your favorite JDM supplier and open up your wallet. ;)
Yeah, open it REALLLLY WIDE....

So please educate me......what would be so special about a Legacy (sedan) STi compared to an Impreza STi, supposing they're both touting the same power output etc. (I'm not being flippant, I'd like to know).

Refinement vs. sportiness, is the best way to describe it. Many people who would buy a GT sedan wouldn't even consider driving an STi.

Hey, that 6-speed doesn't specify manual...could Subaru be following the Mercedes trend of offering more cogs with the AT? If there is any 6-speed at all, my guess (stated earlier and often in other threads) is that it will be the "Spec B" that they are selling in other markets, with uprated suspension, H6 and six-speed box. Amenities such as nav and HID would logically be attendant to such a package.

I would have bought that car in a second.

Kevin

I would probably trade my WRX wagon for a forester if they give us a 6 speed.

Or just by a JDM v7 swap....

Hey, that 6-speed doesn't specify manual...could Subaru be following the Mercedes trend of offering more cogs with the AT? If there is any 6-speed at all, my guess (stated earlier and often in other threads) is that it will be the "Spec B" that they are selling in other markets, with uprated suspension, H6 and six-speed box. Amenities such as nav and HID would logically be attendant to such a package.

I would have bought that car in a second.

Kevin
But you wanted a Legacy immediately. Would those new items be enough to get you out of a year-old previous model Legacy?
I bet not for a lot of people.
Will they be enough to sway people waiting for a STi version?
Who knows?

SOA may be losing out on potential customers on both ends of the spectrum. This may not be a major jump at all. Just a "next year's model" evolution.

I'm still hoping for something more substantial than just a H6 6MT version of the present car.

Here are the photos of what appear to be Legacy STIs and their parts that I had found on varied Japanese sites. Hope we get something like this.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y14/Nawambo/LegacySTIs.bmp

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y14/Nawambo/LegacySTIs.jpg

Someone just dropped a boner in my pants!

*drool*

What happened to the pics of the STi Forrester I thought I saw posted a couple fo months ago? I searched and cam up empty, I am sure it's out there and I am just missing it.

Here are the photos of what appear to be Legacy STIs and their parts that I had found on varied Japanese sites. Hope we get something like this.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y14/Nawambo/LegacySTIs.bmp

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y14/Nawambo/LegacySTIs.jpg
that car = pure sex

Nice!

I doubt the 6spd is an AT; the 5EAT only came out recently.

Yea the 5eat is really new, and the 6mt isn't that old either. If we take Subaru's past record it will be another 10 years or so till we get a new transmission offered. :lol:

Everything I've heard from the techs says it's going to be a manual

http://www.wrxhackers.com/6speedproof.jpg

SOA types: I trust I'm not giving anything away since I haven't seen anything that says I can't post that info. I definitely checked. ;)



This has to be a fake!!!!! Model codes for 06' would start w/ a 6 not a 5! Unless this is the locator page for NZ.
Mike.....

Someone just dropped a boner in my pants!

*drool*

:huh: Well... ask them to kindly remove it. Unless you like it there. :D

6BK = new legacy model code as well... It's a wagon of some sorts.... 6A = Sedan, 6B=Wagon

Just for reference a 6BJ would be a GT LTD Wagon

Maybe they're going to start offering some moonroof options with 5 speed and cloth??

[Beavis]heheh...you said "BJ" heh![/Bevis]
no you asswipe, he said...heh..."SIX BJ" hehehehehh!

... and you'll never see the JDM bumpers on a Legacy sold in a US showroom. Time to get over that one or find your favorite JDM supplier and open up your wallet. ;)
What makes you think that?

The Impreza and the Forester both share bumpers with the JDM models, why not the Legacy? Is there some kind of technical document floating around out there indicating that "JDM bumper = UNpossible to crashtest!!1!!one!"?

What makes you think that?

The Impreza and the Forester both share bumpers with the JDM models, why not the Legacy? Is there some kind of technical document floating around out there indicating that "JDM bumper = UNpossible to crashtest!!1!!one!"?

The Legacy we get does have longer bumpers than the JDM ones. Do you really need to see a document making it any clearer than that? The Legacy JDM slim bumpers don't pass US standards.

Anyone know if Japan uses the huge aluminum bumper beams that we do? Ours have about 4" high reinforced aluminum beams that take up a good chunk of room.

They do not. What TopSpeed was talking about was the bumper cover, not the bumper beam itself. The JDM Impreza and Forester do indeed use the same bumper cover as the USDM models, I don't know enough about how the Legacy is made as to why they couldn't have done the same thing with that car.

Anyone know if Japan uses the huge aluminum bumper beams that we do? Ours have about 4" high reinforced aluminum beams that take up a good chunk of room.

JDM Legacy (in any variant) does not use the large bumper beam that the USDM Legacy uses. Adds, IIRC about 40-50 lbs of weight and dimensional bulk to the front end, rears, not so much. Some have even speculated that you could take out the front bumper beam on the USDM Legacy and replace it with the JDM that alone would trim alot of the bulge from the front ends.

Br, Dale

I was talking about on the legacy's... that's only on the legacy/outback lineup. The Imprezas and Foresters still use steel

Oops.. lil late in my posting there. Those beams are actually VERY light from what I can tell. Heck of a lot lighter than our steel ones

What makes you think that?

The Impreza and the Forester both share bumpers with the JDM models, why not the Legacy? Is there some kind of technical document floating around out there indicating that "JDM bumper = UNpossible to crashtest!!1!!one!"?

The Legacy certainly does not. The Forester doesn't either. Look at a Forester STi and then a UDSM FXT. There is a much shorter overhang.

I'm not sure why they actually got it right on the Impreza.

The Legacy certainly does not. The Forester doesn't either. Look at a Forester STi and then a UDSM FXT. There is a much shorter overhang.

I'm not sure why they actually got it right on the Impreza.
The Forester STi uses a unique front bumper. The standard Forester and Impreza models in Japan have exactly the same bumper skin as the US models.

The Legacy is the only vehicle with unique bumpers for the US market. IMHO the longer US bumpers ruin the profile of the front end of the car. The thing that makes the JDM legacy so appealing is the snub, sporty look of the front end.

It's an insurance company thing... they don't want to pay for headlight assemblies. ;)

Just my $0.02.

-Porter

It's an insurance company thing... they don't want to pay for headlight assemblies. ;)

Just my $0.02.

-PorterThat, of course, is nonsense. Subaru SELLS headlight assemblies, not PAYS for them. Subaru actually makes more money when you (or your insurance company) have to buy headlight assemblies.

I don't know about that

the euro spec wrx wagons bumpers look signifigantly different

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v651/iwakuniwrx/ruriko.jpg

But then, you would be paying more money to insure your Legacy since the headlights are more vulnerable.

OT: I don't really care about the front bumper's design of my Legacy, but I wish they would have put a black plastic diffuser (think NSX) under there 'cause the bottom of mine is scratched to kingdom come... :(


']That, of course, is nonsense. Subaru SELLS headlight assemblies, not PAYS for them. Subaru actually makes more money when you (or your insurance company) have to buy headlight assemblies.

']That, of course, is nonsense. Subaru SELLS headlight assemblies, not PAYS for them. Subaru actually makes more money when you (or your insurance company) have to buy headlight assemblies.
Always quick with the bad attitude! Way to go, Jon. I could almost see the spittle hitting the monitor.

IIHS crash test data is based on the dollar value of the parts damaged in a front-end collision. The size of the 5mph bumpers has everything to do with insurance companies and how much headlight assemblies cost.

The insurance industry's stranglehold over the US auto industry is the reason why the US Legacy has ugly front bumpers. I guarantee you it has nothing to do with occupant safety, or the rest of the world would have gotten the same bumpers. It's all about the money.

Jon's statement above, of course, is nonsense. ;) :p :D

Jon, why are you so angry all the time? Did the other boys not play nice with you in school growing up and now you feel the need to take it out on everyone else around you? Or were you a middle shild and now you feel neglected? ;) :p :banana:

:confused: It's the insurance companies that don't want to pay for the headlight assemblies, not Subaru. And of course the more the insurance companies have to shell out for accident repairs, the more we all pay for insurance. As far as I am concerned, I would rather have lower premiums than a slightly more esthetic bumper. (Not sure why anyone is getting so excited anyway; it's just a bumper.)

The Legacy is the only vehicle with unique bumpers for the US market. IMHO the longer US bumpers ruin the profile of the front end of the car. The thing that makes the JDM legacy so appealing is the snub, sporty look of the front end.

Agreed 100%.

:confused: It's the insurance companies that don't want to pay for the headlight assemblies, not Subaru.Exactly my point. The insurance companies have put themselves (through their very powerful lobby) into a position to dictate such requirements to automakers.

Exactly my point. The insurance companies have put themselves (through their very powerful lobby) into a position to dictate such requirements to automakers.
They also dictate their own rates and hidden rating systems, all the while knowing that if they come up short at year's end, they can lobby the feds for grant money to cover any losses. It's rediculous how far up everyone's asses they can be.

Unfortunately, I think bad attitudes are contagious among the most frequent posters of this forum....

Always quick with the bad attitude! Way to go, Jon. I could almost see the spittle hitting the monitor.

IIHS crash test data is based on the dollar value of the parts damaged in a front-end collision. The size of the 5mph bumpers has everything to do with insurance companies and how much headlight assemblies cost.

The insurance industry's stranglehold over the US auto industry is the reason why the US Legacy has ugly front bumpers. I guarantee you it has nothing to do with occupant safety, or the rest of the world would have gotten the same bumpers. It's all about the money.

Jon's statement above, of course, is nonsense. ;) :p :D

Exactly my point. The insurance companies have put themselves (through their very powerful lobby) into a position to dictate such requirements to automakers.
How do they "dictate" such things? By influencing federal standards? I don't see why they would bother, since they can (and do) charge higher premiums for cars that are more easily damaged in crashes.

I'm old enough to remember when headlights were big standardized rectangular or round bulbs that could be replaced for $10 if a stone cracked one. Now headlights look nicer, but cost hundreds to replace. Not sure that's an improvement ...

PS I also remember steel bumpers that could take a fairly hard collision without having to be replaced.

Unfortunately, I think bad attitudes are contagious among the most frequent posters of this forum....

What the ---- are you talking about, moron?

:p :p :p

PS I also remember steel bumpers that could take a fairly hard collision without having to be replaced. My wife rear-ended an old Mercedes with a bumper like that and there was no damage except a little loose trim.

IIHS crash test data is based on the dollar value of the parts damaged in a front-end collision. The size of the 5mph bumpers has everything to do with insurance companies and how much headlight assemblies cost.

The insurance industry's stranglehold over the US auto industry is the reason why the US Legacy has ugly front bumpers.Headlight assembly cost doesn't depend on how well or poorly a car model performs in a bumper test. Manufacturers only care about satisfying Canada's 8 kph bumper tests and the US's 2.5 mph bumper tests, where a pasing mark is achieved when nothing other than the bumper/mount is damaged.

Most premium car manufacturers and buyers probably don't give a rat's ass about IIHS bumper test results, which is why ALL of the following models recieved the LOWEST possible IIHS bumper rating:
ACURA RL 1996-2004 models
BMW 5 SERIES 1997-2003 models
CADILLAC CTS 2003-05 models
INFINITI Q45 2003-05 models
JAGUAR X-TYPE 2002-05
LEXUS IS 300 2002-05 models
LINCOLN TOWN CAR 2003-05 models
MERCEDES C CLASS 2001-05 models
MERCEDES E CLASS 2003-05 models
SAAB 9-5 2002-05 models
VOLVO S60 2001-05 models
VOLVO S80 2001-05 models

I don't ever recall reading in these forums any expression of concern about the fact that the current Impreza received IIHS's next-to-lowest bumper rating, likely because nobody knows or cares.

Having bigger bumpers in North America than in the rest of the world doesn't save Subaru any money. The opposite is probably true in that our bigger bumpers cost a lot extra to develop. The real reason behind larger/uglier Subaru bumpers for the North American market is almost certainly Canada's bumper regulations, not the IIHS.

Here are the photos of what appear to be Legacy STIs and their parts that I had found on varied Japanese sites. Hope we get something like this.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y14/Nawambo/LegacySTIs.bmp

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y14/Nawambo/LegacySTIs.jpg

No that is not a Legacy STi. That is a Legacy, tricked out with the WR Edition paint scheme, and parts from STi's Legacy catalog. You can buy all of those parts for your USDM Legacy, but the paint you're on your own for. :D

As of right now, a Legacy STi in the form that everyone is hoping for doesn't exist anywhere in the world. Some prototype might be testing somewhere but trust me, if Japan doesn't have it, there's no way that the USDM would be getting it first. Yes, we got the 2.5L Impreza STi, but there was still horsepower parity with the JDM, which enjoyed hot-rod Imprezas for years before we did over here.

I don't think that anyone is saying that there WON'T be a high-powered Legacy STi, although given the disappointing sales of the GT, you'd be hard-pressed, if you were someone at Subaru, to understand the perceived desirability of a higher-powered, significantly more expensive Legacy STi.

Kevin

']Headlight assembly cost doesn't depend on how well or poorly a car model performs in a bumper test. Manufacturers only care about satisfying Canada's 8 kph bumper tests and the US's 2.5 mph bumper tests, where a pasing mark is achieved when nothing other than the bumper/mount is damaged.

Most premium car manufacturers and buyers probably don't give a rat's ass about IIHS bumper test results, which is why ALL of the following models recieved the LOWEST possible IIHS bumper rating:
ACURA RL 1996-2004 models
BMW 5 SERIES 1997-2003 models
CADILLAC CTS 2003-05 models
INFINITI Q45 2003-05 models
JAGUAR X-TYPE 2002-05
LEXUS IS 300 2002-05 models
LINCOLN TOWN CAR 2003-05 models
MERCEDES C CLASS 2001-05 models
MERCEDES E CLASS 2003-05 models
SAAB 9-5 2002-05 models
VOLVO S60 2001-05 models
VOLVO S80 2001-05 models

I don't ever recall reading in these forums any expression of concern about the fact that the current Impreza received IIHS's next-to-lowest bumper rating, likely because nobody knows or cares.

Having bigger bumpers in North America than in the rest of the world doesn't save Subaru any money. The opposite is probably true in that our bigger bumpers cost a lot extra to develop. The real reason behind larger/uglier Subaru bumpers for the North American market is almost certainly Canada's bumper regulations, not the IIHS.

Listen to the man, for he speaks the truth.

Kevin