i need to see some actual water injection systems on 2002-2005 wrx's.

i have read many posts that it is very benificial to have the water injection systems.. and i also have checked out many systems.. from aquamist.. to coolingmist systems..

my needs are to see where they are injecting the water or alcohol.. before the innercooler? or just after the innercooler? and if it is after the inner cooler, are you actually tapping a hole in the innercooler?

i don't want to tap or make new holes in the stock for i might not like the water injection with a cobb stage 2 map.. and revert back to my orginal set up..

well if anybody is doing the cobb stage 2 map and water injection.. i would love to hear from you..

thanks.


phamster...

usually in the intake manifold from what I have seen

Some people do drill a hole and tap the intercooler right at the outlet. I have two nozzles and I installed them in the coupling between the intercooler and the throttlebody. I was feeling lazy and didn't want to actually drill holes in the intercooler.

The most common is to mount the spray nozzle in the outlet of the intercooler or in the intercooler hose just infront of the throttle body.

http://wrxhackers.com/alchystuff/

Larry

The most common is to mount the spray nozzle in the outlet of the intercooler or in the intercooler hose just infront of the throttle body.

http://wrxhackers.com/alchystuff/

Larry


thanks guys.. this place is good good good with info and sharing of knowledge..

much appreciated..


i don't think i want to drill holes.. but i will install in the hose area..

thanks..

phamster

If you want, write me again and we can talk about taping the intercooler. Give me your e-mail and i can send pics of my injection point.

its pretty funny i did a search on water injection about 2 weeks ago and made a new thread looking for info and now i see a new WI thread everyday. i love it. the more the better; more shared knowledge. back on topic i will probably tap my intercooler or find someone to tap mine for me. (no sexual pun intended)

SMC Alky Injection (http://smcenterprises.com/subaru.htm)

SMC is what I'll end up going with...

Not sure why anyone else hasn't mentioned this. The water injection won't help your setup at all. You have a preset map and when you add the water injection it will hurt your performance unless you tune for it. So unless you change your engine management, look elsewhere for power.

Not sure why anyone else hasn't mentioned this. The water injection won't help your setup at all. You have a preset map and when you add the water injection it will hurt your performance unless you tune for it. So unless you change your engine management, look elsewhere for power.


I was thinking the exact same thing. Water is a non combustable and will actually decrease power. However, it is great for what it does, deter knock/detonation. In general, water injection will be a great benefit for low octane/high boost applications as long as u have the proper tune. I'm sure that if u contact cobb, the stg 2 (or any map used before h2o injection) would run horribly without a new tune. My advice is to get a tuner or change engine management immediately.

oh and phamster, dont forget its intercoolar ... not innercooler :D

thanks to the folks here with the quick response..

i will have Jorge from project wrx tune my car when he gets the "pro tuner" package from Cobb..

so i understand the water injection would run with less power, but i will get different maps soon..so i could boost higher than ever before water injection..

funny about the innercooler vs intercooler.. i know "just the kentucky in me..".


oh for the people who have put a injector in the hose between the intercooler and the intake, how did you get a good seal on the silicon hose? didn't it crack or leak at all? what hardware did you use to hold the injector in there so it is solid and trouble free? i have the perrin 5 ply so maybe i will try it to.. tapping is still the second option..

phamster

....most get good results injecting a water/alcohol(usually methy) mix....70/30....to 50/50 is usually a good mix for street setups....and some use 2-stage setups with 2 tanks and inject alcohol starting at low boost to enhance octane and add the water at high(er) boost for extra det resistance when pushing a lot of timing.

...beware runing out of your 'juice' on your 'juice' map......it will be a quick way to a new motor....:eek:

One of the vendors makes a slicone hose with a metal insert for w/i applications, and it fits between the intercooler and the throttle body.

One of the vendors makes a slicone hose with a metal insert for w/i applications, and it fits between the intercooler and the throttle body.


who makes and where can i buy?

...............


oh and phamster, dont forget its intercoolar ... not innercooler :D


and that is intercooler...not intercoolar ... nor innercooler

hahaha.....and too think i let you work on my car, j/k....brian, everything is good still


back on topic, nothing else to see here

I was thinking the exact same thing. Water is a non combustable and will actually decrease power. However, it is great for what it does, deter knock/detonation. In general, water injection will be a great benefit for low octane/high boost applications as long as u have the proper tune. I'm sure that if u contact cobb, the stg 2 (or any map used before h2o injection) would run horribly without a new tune. My advice is to get a tuner or change engine management immediately.

oh and phamster, dont forget its intercoolar ... not innercooler :D

I was road tuned by Kingpin without the water injection on, he was driving. Once he turned the water injection on, after two pulls, timing was increased and we both felt it. He even said it himself. He stated the stock ECU can alter timing by as much as 6 degress.

Furthermore, you can run 91 octane gas if you are confident that the system will not fail. Even furthermore, the steam cleans the combustion chamber, removing carbon deposits. Blah, blah, blah...

One of the vendors makes a slicone hose with a metal insert for w/i applications, and it fits between the intercooler and the throttle body.

My WI nozzle was a 1/8" NPT thread. So I tapped out a nut to accept the nozzle. I put the nut and a washer on the inside of the silicone hose. I pushed the nozzle through the hose and screwed it into the nut. I then mounted the WI fittings on the other side with another washer to clamp down onto the hose. Worked flawlessly.

I can take a pic tonight to show you.

This setup never leaked or had a single issue.

The reason for the coupler in the middle is because the nozzle has a filter and the filter resides in the space provided by the coupler.

Yes, I know you are supposed to use paste and not tape for sealant.

I need to use a stainless nut on the inside. There is no washer on the inside due to the curvature of the hose.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/wcbjr/largeWI0001.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/wcbjr/largeWI0002.jpg

Here's a picture of a "professional" installation in a 2005 EJ20 which uses a separate water injector for
each cylinder (they call it "direct water injection"). Each injector is mounted in the "knee" of an intake manifold runner:
http://www.swrt.com/cpimages/689463.jpg

And since this is a DIY project... NEXT.

This setup never leaked or had a single issue.

The reason for the coupler in the middle is because the nozzle has a filter and the filter resides in the space provided by the coupler.

Yes, I know you are supposed to use paste and not tape for sealant.

I need to use a stainless nut on the inside. There is no washer on the inside due to the curvature of the hose.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/wcbjr/largeWI0001.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/wcbjr/largeWI0002.jpg

...you could bend/roll/cut/trim the washer a bit.....and some loctite would seem to be manditory for that app. ;)

I definately used loctite on my injectors. Major damage would occur if that crap came apart.


I LOVE denatured alky!

...you could bend/roll/cut/trim the washer a bit.....and some loctite would seem to be manditory for that app. ;)

Yeah, I used some Loctite. Sorry for the omission.

This setup never leaked or had a single issue.

The reason for the coupler in the middle is because the nozzle has a filter and the filter resides in the space provided by the coupler.

Yes, I know you are supposed to use paste and not tape for sealant.

I need to use a stainless nut on the inside. There is no washer on the inside due to the curvature of the hose.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/wcbjr/largeWI0001.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/wcbjr/largeWI0002.jpg


nice work there bud..

i can't wait for this weekend to start the install.. i will use your info and COPY.. but maybe use a small washer and of course the sealant..

hopefully i can get up to jorge and get that costume tune for my car so i can really feel the affect of the water injection system...

anyways.. you guys have been great and super helpful as always..

phamster out.

Can you buy a sensor to put in ur tank to tell u when u're low? I think that would be a great, safe idea.

Can you buy a sensor to put in ur tank to tell u when u're low? I think that would be a great, safe idea.
I have one mounted in a 3 gallon plastic Blitz gas can. Works pretty well. It's very sensitive however, kinda annoying once you hit the level. Keeps flashing during turns, brakes, etc.

Just cut a hole in the side of the can, epoxy in the sensor, run the wires (plus power) to an LED up in the dash. Viola.

Can you buy a sensor to put in ur tank to tell u when u're low? I think that would be a great, safe idea.

smc's kit has one integrated...

Has anyone thought of using the 12L trunk mounted spec-c water tank? Sure the spec-c uses it for an IC spray and not water injection, but I think it would work out really well. Also on the STi gauge cluster there is a "I/C Spray Low" light which is wired into a sensor in the tank. I'm sure someone more creative than I am could do something with that. Anyway, was reading your thread and though I would chime in... Here's a pic

http://homepage1.nifty.com/moto_555/impreza/images/DSCF1623.JPG

I just checked out that injection system from SMC, it states 18psi for stage 2 cars....I am wondering if they are reffering to Cobb stage 2? I was under the impression that the stock turbo was inefficient beyond 16 psi. Does anybody know of posted results with a stage 2 setup with this running the extra boost (dyno)? Also, it would be great if we could get a thread going (maybe a sticky) of vendors/shops who have the pro tuner and their locations....I live in Canada and would have to plan a little vacation to get my car tuned.

I have one mounted in a 3 gallon plastic Blitz gas can. Works pretty well. It's very sensitive however, kinda annoying once you hit the level. Keeps flashing during turns, brakes, etc.

Just cut a hole in the side of the can, epoxy in the sensor, run the wires (plus power) to an LED up in the dash. Viola.



...ya need a baffle in the tank

I just checked out that injection system from SMC, it states 18psi for stage 2 cars....I am wondering if they are reffering to Cobb stage 2? I was under the impression that the stock turbo was inefficient beyond 16 psi. Does anybody know of posted results with a stage 2 setup with this running the extra boost (dyno)? Also, it would be great if we could get a thread going (maybe a sticky) of vendors/shops who have the pro tuner and their locations....I live in Canada and would have to plan a little vacation to get my car tuned.

Different rules apply for water injection, including the amount of boost you can run, IIRC.

...ya need a baffle in the tank

I mounted the gauge high enough never to need a baffle. With a 3 gallon tank, I was never anywhere near low enough to get air into the lines.

With a smaller tank, definitely.


edit: doh, misunderstood your post.

I just checked out that injection system from SMC, it states 18psi for stage 2 cars....I am wondering if they are reffering to Cobb stage 2? I was under the impression that the stock turbo was inefficient beyond 16 psi. Does anybody know of posted results with a stage 2 setup with this running the extra boost (dyno)? Also, it would be great if we could get a thread going (maybe a sticky) of vendors/shops who have the pro tuner and their locations....I live in Canada and would have to plan a little vacation to get my car tuned.

The stock turbo becomes inefficient past 17 psi, because it starts to just blow hotter air which is less beneficial. The water/alky injection cools the charge so 18 psi can be run with an intake charge that is cooler than say a car running 16 psi without WI.

I just checked out that injection system from SMC, it states 18psi for stage 2 cars....I am wondering if they are reffering to Cobb stage 2? I was under the impression that the stock turbo was inefficient beyond 16 psi. Does anybody know of posted results with a stage 2 setup with this running the extra boost (dyno)? Also, it would be great if we could get a thread going (maybe a sticky) of vendors/shops who have the pro tuner and their locations....I live in Canada and would have to plan a little vacation to get my car tuned.

Alky/meth can extend the range of any turbo a little. Super cools the intake, and reduces the EGTs, allowing a little more boost.