So I sold my Cobb engine management. It was good but I have been hearing so many good things about Ecutek and the results from dynotuning. Headed down to KTR Performance. They have a very impressive facility. They are a huge classic sports car maintenance and racing garage. As well as being the local dealer for GIAC, Ecutek, VF Engineering and many others. They also are an offical Noble dealer. You can see one below. They use a dyno dynamics dyno which reads very low but is the most precise dyno out there. To put it in perspective, Franz, the guy who tuned my car has an Evo that dynos 320 on it, he dynoed 410 on a dynojet. My baseline being stock ECU with turboback was 168 whp. He managed to get 218.5 whp after a couple hours of tuning.

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y192/wizzman/KTR/1.jpg

Laugh all you want at the actual #, but remember this is 50 whp OVER my stock wrx with turboback. He said he could make the peak even higher but pulling it down a bit makes for a much more linear and driveable power curve. All I can say is WOW! The power is amazing and even more impressive is how smooth the delivery is. I have absolutely no regrets about all the trouble I went through to make this switch. This tune is considerably more powerful and far more smooth than Cobb's stage II map. I will never use an off the shelf map again. Cobb stage II was nice but I am just in awe right now about the amount of power and smoothness in which it is delivered. Franz was a very very knowledgeable guy and I would go no where else to have my car tuned after this visit. Next up probably next year is the VF34 turbo whcih makes some nice #s (270-280 whp) on this dyno with an Ecutek tune. Here are some pics from the day:

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y192/wizzman/KTR/3.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y192/wizzman/KTR/4.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y192/wizzman/KTR/7.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y192/wizzman/KTR/8.jpg

Here is a page with many of the charts from this dyno to put my power in perspective:
http://www.ktrperformance.com/services/Dyno_Graphs/graph_main.htm

Very nice, I took my Saabaru to Franz to get tuned and was super impressed to.

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-7/775147/DynoChart2.jpg

This is with STi IC, Uppipe, TBE. Did you have any other mods or is that just with the TBE?

TBE only.

I plan to do VF34 with an STi tmic next year.

Solid numbers. That showroom is awesome! I dig the Noble.

Nice graph! Before you go over to the dark side to a VF34, consider more bolts ons first. Your torque curve peaks at ~4000 RPM. My Deadbolt stock turbo peaks at ~3000 RPM. More torque down low is MUCH more satisfying for a daily driver than a VF34. We all have our own opinions on this subject, but consider it.

Nice graph! Before you go over to the dark side to a VF34, consider more bolts ons first. Your torque curve peaks at ~4000 RPM. My Deadbolt stock turbo peaks at ~3000 RPM. More torque down low is MUCH more satisfying for a daily driver than a VF34. We all have our own opinions on this subject, but consider it.
What other boltons?

I plan to piece together the following by next summer:

Vf34 turbo
sti injectors
fuel pump
sti tmic
and maybe a silicone turbo inlet pipe

I would install them all at once and go for a tune the next day

This link (http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9791778) will give you an idea of what you could do. Might not seem super compared to some aftermarket turbo HP numbers, but the torque curve is what pisses people off. ;)

Nice graph! Before you go over to the dark side to a VF34, consider more bolts ons first. Your torque curve peaks at ~4000 RPM. My Deadbolt stock turbo peaks at ~3000 RPM. More torque down low is MUCH more satisfying for a daily driver than a VF34. We all have our own opinions on this subject, but consider it.

dont knock it before you try it stock turbo whore :lol:

15.8 psi CATTED vf34 stock tmic, no extra bolt ons :alien:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v412/brenwrx/WRX/Brendansvf34dyno.jpg

Hi, I agree that the Dyno Dynamics is the best of the best as far as dynos go.

I would strongly suggest you consider the following turbos first, I have used all of them on my WRX.

1. APS SR-30 - faster spool and longer hold than a VF-30/34 and more torque.
2. 18G with TD05H hot side - more torque than the VF-30 but it doesn't hold power quite as well.

both of the above turbos shine on a two liter engine and you'll be very happy with either - the SR-30 has a broader powerband and will be better for freeway running.

The 18G has super torque at the start and if you like to just launch and go, you'll run out of breath up top, but it's a wild ride.

Good Luck.

Nice numbers wizzman ... :banana: ... Heading to the track any time soon? ...

The 18G has super torque at the start and if you like to just launch and go, you'll run out of breath up top, but it's a wild ride.

Good Luck.

I don't think the 2.0 will make the 18g run out of breath. Maybe the 2.5 tho

nice smooth tune. stay away from off the shelf maps in a box

stay away from off the shelf maps in a box
I don't know if I'd go that far ... ;)

I don't know if I'd go that far ... ;)

been there..done that. Off the shelf are great starting points, but a custom tune specific for your vehicle is the way to go IMO.

not hating, but you got the short end.

you couldve gotten a pro-tune and you wouldve gotten the same results as your ecutek tune. probably wouldve cost you less money as well.

also, a car that dynos 320 on this dyno (assuming its properly calibrated) is not going to dyno 410 on a dynojet (assuming its properly calibrated). thats a load of bs.

also, a car that dynos 320 on this dyno (assuming its properly calibrated) is not going to dyno 410 on a dynojet (assuming its properly calibrated). thats a load of bs.

actually, Franz told me his car dyno'd like this:

334.9 whp on Dyno Dynamics... KTR Performance (MA)
410.2 whp on Land and Sea... F1 DYNO (ME)
363.8 whp on Mustang Dyno... Enhanced Street Performance (MA)

all of these done within a few days of each other...

and before:

298 whp Dyno Dynamics... KTR Performance (MA)
337 whp DynoJet... Pruven Performance (CT)

and...

265 whp Dyno Dynamics... KTR Performance (MA)
293 whp DynoJet... Xotic (PA)

he said that he has seen very similair percentage differences between these dynos from multiple cars that have been to each of them... he also told me that the difference can be partially noted not only because of the machines, but operator error, location and 'power' of fans, how exhaust fumes are delt with and the environment which the "fresh" air is pulled from... as well as the usual: tire, wheel, gear oil, engine oil, alignment, general 'rotating assembly' maintainance (or lack of)

:devil: actually, Franz told me his car dyno'd like this:

334.9 whp on Dyno Dynamics... KTR Performance (MA)
410.2 whp on Land and Sea... F1 DYNO (ME)
363.8 whp on Mustang Dyno... Enhanced Street Performance (MA)

all of these done within a few days of each other...

and before:

298 whp Dyno Dynamics... KTR Performance (MA)
337 whp DynoJet... Pruven Performance (CT)

and...

265 whp Dyno Dynamics... KTR Performance (MA)
293 whp DynoJet... Xotic (PA)

he said that he has seen very similair percentage differences between these dynos from multiple cars that have been to each of them... he also told me that the difference can be partially noted not only because of the machines, but operator error, location and 'power' of fans, how exhaust fumes are delt with and the environment which the "fresh" air is pulled from... as well as the usual: tire, wheel, gear oil, engine oil, alignment, general 'rotating assembly' maintainance (or lack of)


Either way your car made some good numbers you might be able to pull low 13's with that much power.... Take it too the track :devil:

actually, Franz told me his car dyno'd like this:

334.9 whp on Dyno Dynamics... KTR Performance (MA)
410.2 whp on Land and Sea... F1 DYNO (ME)
363.8 whp on Mustang Dyno... Enhanced Street Performance (MA)

all of these done within a few days of each other...

and before:

298 whp Dyno Dynamics... KTR Performance (MA)
337 whp DynoJet... Pruven Performance (CT)

and...

265 whp Dyno Dynamics... KTR Performance (MA)
293 whp DynoJet... Xotic (PA)

he said that he has seen very similair percentage differences between these dynos from multiple cars that have been to each of them... he also told me that the difference can be partially noted not only because of the machines, but operator error, location and 'power' of fans, how exhaust fumes are delt with and the environment which the "fresh" air is pulled from... as well as the usual: tire, wheel, gear oil, engine oil, alignment, general 'rotating assembly' maintainance (or lack of)
see, now with the proper information (yours) this makes perfect sense. the f1 dyno is notorious for being really inflated...but the DD -> dynojet listed here (the comparison offered up earlier) is correct from what ive seen.

been there..done that. Off the shelf are great starting points, but a custom tune specific for your vehicle is the way to go IMO.
I fully agree with you that a custom tune will own every day of the week ... I simply disagreed with staying away from "Off the shelf maps" all together ... My "Off the shelf" cobb maps were perfect for what they are as far as I'm concerned ... Granted my Protune is better, but that's to be expected since you're optimizing your car to it's specific likes/dislikes, and it's no longer meant for the masses :D ...

Off the shelf is not dangerous in anyway, infact its the extra margin of safety built into the off the shelf that generally results in less power than custom.

Off the shelf is not dangerous in anyway, infact its the extra margin of safety built into the off the shelf that generally results in less power than custom.

What makes you think it cant go the other way? I have seen some dangerous off the shelf maps..

What makes you think it cant go the other way? I have seen some dangerous off the shelf maps..

I remember at one dyno session I saw 3 Cobb cars det on the dyno so bad the shop stop and pulled the car off the Dyno..

Assuming that the tuner is reliable and the car is in good running order. Also I would leery of running any hardware that was not part of the software's specific tuning.

dont knock it before you try it stock turbo whore :lol:

15.8 psi CATTED vf34 stock tmic, no extra bolt ons :alien:



Now you know we can't compare dyno chart to dyno chart. I just wish I was up in Mass so you could drive teh wagon. :( I seriously think you'd change your story as I've driven VF-34 cars and though impressive, I've also humbled them.

Wizzman,

Take a look @ this thread:-

Updated Momentum EJ5-40T Results (http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=828403)

http://www.pdxtuning.com/nasioc/VF35vsEJ540T.gif

Now you know we can't compare dyno chart to dyno chart. I just wish I was up in Mass so you could drive teh wagon. :( I seriously think you'd change your story as I've driven VF-34 cars and though impressive, I've also humbled them.

i beleive you man, i loved my stock turbo while ive had it, but once tuned and ported, the vf34 isnt THAT far off, while leaving me tons of top end power.


RiftWRX - i was at xx tuning and heard you made a stage 2 fmic spool the same as tmic? is that possible on a vf34 setup? im very interested

Nice numbers wizzman ... :banana: ... Heading to the track any time soon? ...
I only live about 15 mins away. I may head over this Wednesday. I never go on Fridays.
not hating, but you got the short end.

you couldve gotten a pro-tune and you wouldve gotten the same results as your ecutek tune. probably wouldve cost you less money as well.

Maybe you didn't read. There is no local tuner that has a very reliable history near me other than KTR. Sure a paid a bit more but those two things are important to me if I am going to be relying on a tuner for my tune: local and a very strong customer satisfaction level. KTR cannot be matched right now when these two things are considered.
:devil:
Either way your car made some good numbers you might be able to pull low 13's with that much power.... Take it too the track :devil:
I am not sure what to expect. I ran a 14.3 with a 2.0 60' on just a Cobb stage I map. I would be very happy with some mid 13s. We will see :)

How does the car feel now compared to with the Cobb?

How does the car feel now compared to with the Cobb?
Well, I sold the Cobb 2 weeks before I got the Ecutek tune so by the time I had the tune done I was kind of used to the stock ECU again. I can say that even though I did not drive them back to back, the Ecutek tune is significantly more powerful than the Cobb stage II off the shelf map. Also it is ALOT more smooth than the Cobb. It feels like it came from the factory that way.

RiftWRX - i was at xx tuning and heard you made a stage 2 fmic spool the same as tmic? is that possible on a vf34 setup? im very interested

He did! :D

http://www.projectwrx.com/albums/album26/aas.jpg

As far as cost is concerned, isn't Cobb $600 for the AP + $400 for the pro tuner software and then the cost of tuning on top of that?

I piad less $1000 altogether to get my car tuned by KTR.

^^^ You're pretty much right on ... $595 for the AP/$395 for the Street Tuner software (Protuner is different, that's the version the tuner shops get ... Price on tuning will vary from shop to shop, but $300-$400 for a good tune is a good ballpark) ... The problem though, is that selling the AP is going to get you less money back, maybe $500 so you're out a $100 ... On top of which you lose all the functionality that the AP provides ... Multiple maps, Live boost, Code reading/clear capabilities yadda yadda ... Honestly though it really just comes down to what "You" specifically are happy with ... Having an AP is no better then any other system/tune if you're constantly worried about stuff ... You have to go with what works for you and gives you that feeling of security and safety ...

Hi, I agree that the Dyno Dynamics is the best of the best as far as dynos go.

I would strongly suggest you consider the following turbos first, I have used all of them on my WRX.

1. APS SR-30 - faster spool and longer hold than a VF-30/34 and more torque.
2. 18G with TD05H hot side - more torque than the VF-30 but it doesn't hold power quite as well.

both of the above turbos shine on a two liter engine and you'll be very happy with either - the SR-30 has a broader powerband and will be better for freeway running.

The 18G has super torque at the start and if you like to just launch and go, you'll run out of breath up top, but it's a wild ride.

Good Luck.

hi...mind explain more on the "doesnt hold power quite well" on td05H 18g.... cos i'm thinking of changing to td05H from my current vf34 ;) thks

^^^ You're pretty much right on ... $595 for the AP/$395 for the Street Tuner software (Protuner is different, that's the version the tuner shops get ... Price on tuning will vary from shop to shop, but $300-$400 for a good tune is a good ballpark) ... The problem though, is that selling the AP is going to get you less money back, maybe $500 so you're out a $100 ... On top of which you lose all the functionality that the AP provides ... Multiple maps, Live boost, Code reading/clear capabilities yadda yadda ... Honestly though it really just comes down to what "You" specifically are happy with ... Having an AP is no better then any other system/tune if you're constantly worried about stuff ... You have to go with what works for you and gives you that feeling of security and safety ...
Got AP for 585 shipped. Sold for 520. Not a huge loss for me. I do miss the Code reader and will probably pick up a scan tool so I can read and clear any codes.