Has anyone gone Cobb stage 2 with their 2006? I think I remember a thread but couldn't find it searching.

Impressions? Are the 320+ torque numbers right!?

I'm considering going stage 2, but a part of me says go vf39 and sti tmic! But I don't want to do too heavy of modications. Needs to be pretty easily reverted back to stock when the time comes.

Get Cobb's stage2, be happy.

You'll love it...

I am also thinking about the cobb stage 2 for my 06 TR! It sounds like a blast in the making! :)

Two STi guys telling me just cobb 2 haha ;)

Hey whats up, I would def. recomend going to stg 2, cars pulls very hard, I have not gotten a dyno yet, but thinking of getting a protune soon. so far the only downfall I see is I can't seem to keep my foot off the throttle and I am going through gas alot faster these days.

Yep, sounds like this is my first mod for sure, thanks! :)

Hey whats up, I would def. recomend going to stg 2, cars pulls very hard, I have not gotten a dyno yet, but thinking of getting a protune soon. so far the only downfall I see is I can't seem to keep my foot off the throttle and I am going through gas alot faster these days.

Is it night and day over stock? What kind of 0-60 estimate?

yeah you can def. tell a diff in the car from stock to stg 2, I am running a helix catless DP and greddy evo catback, not sure for 0-60 I got a blitz performance meter and it has a 0-50, so far I have gotten 4.3, but thats been all in the rain and cars keeps lossing traction in 1st and beginning of 2nd. stock I got an average of 5.0-5.2 on the 0-50 sprints. hope that helps

The beauty of the Accessport is that if you later on go get a vf39 or some other turbo, or any other upgrade, you can get it custom tuned.

So I say go for stage 2 right now and when some evo rolls you up, go get protuned ;)

Has anyone gone Cobb stage 2 with their 2006? I think I remember a thread but couldn't find it searching.

Impressions? Are the 320+ torque numbers right!?

I'm considering going stage 2, but a part of me says go vf39 and sti tmic! But I don't want to do too heavy of modications. Needs to be pretty easily reverted back to stock when the time comes.

I've got a Cobb Stage 2 setup on mine. Cobb street TBE, Cobb catback, & (of course) Accessport. Running their standard Stage 2 93 octane map.

It is a BIG performance improvement. It feels way stronger, runs smoother than stock, and the turbo spools up even faster. Cobb claims 0-60 in something like 4.6, vs. 5.5 for a stock 06 WRX. I don't have a timeslip to prove it, but I wouldn't be surprised if that is in the ballpark.

Be advised that the Cobb catback is quite a bit louder than stock. It doesn't sound like a ricer moron's fart-can, but has a very deep and aggressive sound.

I have the Stage 2 Flash, but I would be looking to upgrade to the VF39 turbo....as they are dirt cheap and would really provide more enjoyment at the top end...

I am installing my nitrous setup today as we speak and am looking to upgrade to the VF39 until I can afford the GT30/GT35 setup....

Let us know how that N20 setup goes!


sean10mm: It's hard to make a EJ series engine sound like rice unless you get equal-lenth headers.... even then it doesn't sound that bad. Heck, even if you put a dump pipe right off the turbo and the car will sound mean as hell.

wrx owners who have had a stage 2 on their older models wrx's and now have an new 06 wrx with stage 2 , how much different is it power wise from the previous models. Im coming from an 03 wrx stage 2 13.4 QT so im kinda excited to see what the difference is, because as a previous owner of the previous 2.0 this car has more potential with the same setup. gimme some info

wrx owners who have had a stage 2 on their older models wrx's and now have an new 06 wrx with stage 2 , how much different is it power wise from the previous models. Im coming from an 03 wrx stage 2 13.4 QT so im kinda excited to see what the difference is, because as a previous owner of the previous 2.0 this car has more potential with the same setup. gimme some info

You'll have the same HP (a better low end though). But low end isn't helping you when you're at 4.5-7k. Should be a dead heat. Same HP, more torque, taller gearing, more weight.

As far as power on teh stock turbo, you don't have more potential in the 2.5l. Hence, the identical HP of teh 2.0l and 2.5l. Maxed out turbo is the limiting factor. The car will be real world faster due to the low end, but, in the high end, there shouldn't be a difference...

02 stage 2 vs a 06 being a dead heat?!?!?!

Dont believe that, the 06 owns imo. Of course I'm partial, and I'm just a post on the internet that should be read with a grain of salt.

Numbers dont lie,

You'll be getting the same 285 hp as from the 02's but more than a stock sti's torque. Does that answer your question?

02 stage 2 vs a 06 being a dead heat?!?!?!

Dont believe that, the 06 owns imo.

How's that???

Same HP, 06 weighs more, 06 has taller gearing...

Low end torque doesn't mean a more lot in terms of max acceleration. If anything, it would be lucky to overcome the gearing/weight...

The 02-5 has a BETTER power/weight ratio!!!!

How much heavier?

Havent heard that.

I think it would take about 200 pounds or more to over come what the 06 has more of on the dyno.

02 stage 2 vs a 06 being a dead heat?!?!?!

Dont believe that, the 06 owns imo. Of course I'm partial, and I'm just a post on the internet that should be read with a grain of salt.

Numbers dont lie,

You'll be getting the same 285 hp as from the 02's but more than a stock sti's torque. Does that answer your question?

And why do you think torque is helping you running in the upper RPMS????

It doesn't

Not saying I wouldn't rather have an 06, or that is isn't outstanding..I'm just saying...

HP is basically the rate at which torque is applied. If both cars are laying down 225 whp, they are actually putting down the same amount of torque, as a function of time (which is what matters). Generally speaking, in ideal conditions, HP is what determines acceleration, not torque, especially the HP curve (which even on a 2.0l is pretty flat after 4k). Now sure, no one drives "ideally", so torque helps getting the car launched, or if you fall off the power curve, so the 06 will have an advantage. But again, its robably just enough to offset the gearing and weight.

As far as math is concerned though, HP deteremines acceleration, not torque. There are a lot of nice resources online that explain why that is. But basically, torque and power are the SAME THING, except HP takes into account TIME. Torque is useless if you can't get it to the gound. HP simply tells you how much, and how fast you can apply torque to the wheels. Identical HP = identical torque (as a function of time) gettign to teh ground.

In ideal conditions, a 200 HP car with 1 ft-lb of torque would accelerate the same as a 200 HP car with 200 ft-lbs or torque. (Granted their HP curves would have to be the same, which in the case of an 2.0 v. 2.5l, their upper end power curves are very close)

I dont think, I know.

I think we are on very different pages here.

Will more torque get the car moving faster? I think so.

With roughly 40 extra foot pounds, and the same HP, I think you can get going down the track faster.

if it is a dead heat the 06 will get the ET, and the 02 willl get the trap speed. But we all know which one wins, right?

I still dont belive the two cars against eachother would be a huge difference (if your miss-interperating my use of the word own.) Maybe it's worth a vote on which is faster. I think the numbers speak for themselves.

BTW: Whats the weight difference again?

I dont think, I know.

I think we are on very different pages here.

Will more torque get the car moving faster? I think so.

With roughly 40 extra foot pounds, and the same HP, I think you can get going down the track faster.

if it is a dead heat the 06 will get the ET, and the 02 willl get the trap speed. But we all know which one wins, right?

I still dont belive the two cars against eachother would be a huge difference (if your miss-interperating my use of the word own.) Maybe it's worth a vote on which is faster. I think the numbers speak for themselves.

BTW: Whats the weight difference again?

IIRC its about 100 -150 lbs.

Take a read...at low RPMs, sure torque matters, but in the high end, where 90% of teh race is, it doesn't. You can't argue with 9th grade physics....

http://www.yawpower.com/tqvshp.html

I wish I could read it all asap.so basically you dont think the 06's extra torque can overcome the weight difference, where as I do.

EDIT: I think it's easy for anyone to forget how closely related torque and horsepower are.

i have a stage 2 06 wrx....TQ numbers are true, but from a 35mph roll to 110 it barely pulls on a stage 2 05 WRX....my friends.

i think from a dead stop i could take him, but i havent got the balls to launch my car yet

Hey whats up, I would def. recomend going to stg 2, cars pulls very hard, I have not gotten a dyno yet, but thinking of getting a protune soon. so far the only downfall I see is I can't seem to keep my foot off the throttle and I am going through gas alot faster these days.

I can't wait for my ECUTEK tune (just waiting for the cobb catted dp to come in before making the appt.). There is a tuner about an hour from me so that's why I chose ECUTEK over cobb but I figure the gains to be about the same. Your cobb stage 2 '06s must be monsters especially regarding torque.

Rick B.

Lets just say you'll have to lower the car to feel safe. imo

I wish I could read it all asap.so basically you dont think the 06's extra torque can overcome the weight difference, where as I do.

EDIT: I think it's easy for anyone to forget how closely related torque and horsepower are.

No what I'm saying is that....HP is the rate at which torque is applied. So, it makes ZERO difference if you have more (static) torque at 6k, because BOTH CARS ARE PUTTING DOWN THE SAME AMOUNT!!!!

In your power band, torque does not effect acceleration, that is 9th grade physics. Most people don't truely understand how torque and HP relate to one another.

I have no question that out of the hole, off a low RPM corner, or on a roll below 4k, the 06 will have an advantage. But when both cars are operating in their power peaks, the only number that matters is how much/how fast that torque is getting put to the ground, and that is HP.

You took physics in 9th grade? Not me...

Well, those few posts were fun, been a while since I did that here. ttyl REX8. :)

I'd post my opinion but that would be repeating. And, I'd ask a question but it'd be highjacking.

You took physics in 9th grade? Not me...

Well, those few posts were fun, been a while since I did that here. ttyl REX8. :)

I'd post my opinion but that would be repeating. And, I'd ask a question but it'd be highjacking.

:lol: Maybe it was 10th grade...they all blur together now...

Take care, enjoy your 06 (I'm jealous)!

my post is a perfect example of your theory....05 wrx stage 2 puts 285hp and 275tq, 06 wrx puts 285 hp and 330tq....but from a roll its all equal...i get a sudden lil adv. but after 4000rpm i stay neck neck with a stage 2 WRX, maybe a fender ahead.

my post is a perfect example of your theory....05 wrx stage 2 puts 285hp and 275tq, 06 wrx puts 285 hp and 330tq....but from a roll its all equal...i get a sudden lil adv. but after 4000rpm i stay neck neck with a stage 2 WRX, maybe a fender ahead.

Its not exactly my theory, its been around for...oh, several hundred years...:lol:

But yes, out of the powerband, an 06 is making more EVERYTHING. Making it a beast in real world, daily driving speed. I was just saying, that once up in the power, theoretically speaking, there is nothing that should prevent an older stage II from being a darn good match for the new stage II.

And most drivers aren't perfect either. A slow/missed shift thats devastating for a 2.0l, in a 2.5l, isn't nearly as bad.

heeh yeah...i know what u mean...and i think that the 06 being a bit heavier doesnt help that much...but needless to say stage 2 vs. stage 2 its a drivers race...now once u do a turbo swap in a 2.5....u starting to see differece

maybe this will help... he is sayin that horsepower is the rate of torque applied over time.. using the lovely google unit conversion tool..


1 horsepower = 550 (foot * pounds force) / second


but lets say we have a 200hp car:

200 horsepower = 110 000 (foot * pounds force) / second

one with the 200 lb-ft of torque..
200 horsepower = 110 000 (200 foot * pounds force) / second

and one with the 1 lb-ft of torque
200 horsepower = 110 000 (1 foot * pounds force) / second

balancing out these equations and solving for seconds results in the 200 lb-ft car to have
seconds= 110,000 tq/hp

and the 1lb-ft car to have
seconds=550 tq/hp

so i am failing to see how the car with 1 lb ft will be the same speed

ecutek and catless tbe is your best bet.

one with the 200 lb-ft of torque..
200 horsepower = 110 000 (200 foot * pounds force) / second

and one with the 1 lb-ft of torque
200 horsepower = 110 000 (1 foot * pounds force) / second



These two statements are NOT equal!!!

if 200 hp= 110000*200

then...

200 hp (can not) = 110000*1 !!!!

You're failing to consider RPMS, gearing, etc...

In order for the cars to make the same HP, the RATE of delivery is different. There is only one way a car with less torque can deliver the same HP as a car with more torque, and that is....ding ding, how fast that torque is being delivered to the ground.

TORQUE IN LBS./FT. = (WEIGHT IN LBS. X LEVER ARM LENGTH IN FEET.)

1 HP = 550 LBS./FT./SEC.

1 HP = 33,000 LBS./FT./MIN.

HP = (TORQUE X RPM) / 5252

TORQUE = (HP X 5252) / RPM

TORQUE AT THE REAR WHEELS = (ENGINE TORQUE X TRANSMISSION GEAR RATIO X RING AND PINION RATIO)

ACCELERATIVE THRUST = (TORQUE AT THE REAR WHEELS / TIRE RADIUS IN FT.)

(and torque at the rear wheels is determined by what? HP and RPM)

RATE OF ACCELERATION = (ACCELERATIVE THRUST / TOTAL VEHICLE WEIGHT.)

http://www.yawpower.com/tqvshp.html Take a read, it makes it fairly simple.

Basically, static torque means NOTHING. What matters is the torque that goes to the ground. And torque that goes to the ground is called what????

HORSEPOWER!!!!

In general, most people do not understand what HP and torque mean, especially relative to one another. This is a very large misconception.

You would NEVER model a cars acceleration without using this:

HP = (TORQUE X RPM) / 5252

TORQUE IS ONLY AS GOOD (as far as acceleration goes) AS THE HP CREATED FROM IT. That is basic physics.

It does not matter how much torque your engine has. It matters how much is going to the ground in the form of HP. Your simple equation fails to take numerous factors into consideration.

Can someone point me to a soundclip of Cobb's TBE on an 06? I'd like to hear how loud 'loud' really is...thanks!

Horsepower is a work unit measurement. IMO, most good load-based chassis dynos will only measure torque then calculate horsepower from that measurement using an RPM pick-up.

Can someone point me to a soundclip of Cobb's TBE on an 06? I'd like to hear how loud 'loud' really is...thanks!

is there a clip already?!!! me wants it!

those equations arent equal if youre assuming seconds = 1.. its still a variable.. seconds will change with respect to all the factors of the car, such as gearing and whatnot.. correct?

Any other opinions on the Cobb stage 2 from people with 06 WRX's running Cobb stage 2, not pre 06 speculators. I am hearing great numbers with a Protune. It seems the stock TD 04 and the intercooler are holding back strong HP numbers.

Any other opinions on the Cobb stage 2 from people with 06 WRX's running Cobb stage 2, not pre 06 speculators. I am hearing great numbers with a Protune. It seems the stock TD 04 and the intercooler are holding back strong HP numbers.

I'm kind of at "stage 2" but with EcuTek. My car is an auto and was recently dynoed at 22Xwhp/25Xwtq.

Rick B.

You took physics in 9th grade? Not me...

Well, those few posts were fun, been a while since I did that here. ttyl REX8. :)

I'd post my opinion but that would be repeating. And, I'd ask a question but it'd be highjacking.
Read the link he posted, and this one too:

http://vettenet.org/torquehp.html

He's right. Considering hp is simply a function of torque and rpm, why doesn't the stage 2 06 make any more power? It's because the torque curve falls off up top, which is exactly where you're going to be when pushing the car. The fact that it makes gobs of torque down low is only going to come into play for a brief period from a dig.

But damn, all that torque is great for daily driving.

<------ 06 owner

EDIT: own3d by timing. Didn't see the 3rd page, or the date, lol.

I like this thread, a good discusion without product superiority arguments.

I've seen a bunch of sound clips on streetfire.net, Any 2.5 liter will sound the same.

TORQUE IS ONLY AS GOOD (as far as acceleration goes) AS THE HP CREATED FROM IT. That is basic physics.

It does not matter how much torque your engine has. It matters how much is going to the ground in the form of HP. Your simple equation fails to take numerous factors into consideration. Have your ass handed to you by a 6000+ pound pickup that only makes 350 horsepower and tell me again how torque doesn't matter :).

Dave

Have your ass handed to you by a 6000+ pound pickup that only makes 350 horsepower and tell me again how torque doesn't matter :).

Dave

ummm.

a 3 ton 350hp pickup is not going to "hand me my ass," i assure you.

to accelerate requires power, plain and simple.

I dont think, I know.

really now?

i'm trying to figure out exactly what it is you know.

Have your ass handed to you by a 6000+ pound pickup that only makes 350 horsepower and tell me again how torque doesn't matter :).

Dave

Thats because the pickup is making MORE POWER THAN YOU ARE in the lower RPMS (power created by the TORQUE). Continue the race into the higher revs, you'll get it back.

Of course TORQUE helps...why??? Because torque IS what makes power!

But make no mistake. Its the POWER created by the static torque that is kicking your BUTT, not torque itself.

Torque alone is a meaningless static number. It only matters how fast and how much of that torque gets put into getting your car down the road. And what is torque applied over time??? Oh, right, thats HORSEPOWER!

Most of you guys don't really even know what torque is. Torque by itself has nothing to do with movement at all. Until you can understand basic mechanics/physics, I'll stop chiming in on this thread.

Just try to think of it like this. Torque is only as useful as the HP created from it.

the difference between before accessport and after is incredible i was amazed at the horsepower increase its sick

Now that we have all had our lesson on HP vs. TQ, or HP + TQ and we all understand what the two values mean, is there anyone else with a stage 2.
Anybody get a PROTUNE on a stage 2 yet.

I have plans to go stage 2 with a protune from PDX. They're booked until March so it may not be for a while.

the 06 is prettier and it looks faster! and we also have better seats better engine, better wheels, we look more like sti's, we have better breaks, more torque, more potential and we are faster stock to stock and this is alll for the same price!
so 05 stage 2 vs 06 stage 2 the 06 is prettier! :lol: :banana:

why people keep saying breaks? It's brakes ;)

Think there is a typo in their website. Correct term would be 33,000 lbs-ft/min and not 33,000 lbs/ft/min.

http://www.yawpower.com/tqvshp.html

Watt found that on average, a horse could lift 330-lbs of coal 100-ft in one minute. He then stated that the power available from one horse was equal to (330-lbs. times 100-ft.) or 33,000-lbs./ft./min.

One interesting fact is that below 5252 rpm, torque is always greater than HP. Above 5252 rpm, HP is always greater than torque.

Horsepower = (Torque X RPM) / 5252

the 06 is prettier and it looks faster! and we also have better seats better engine, better wheels, we look more like sti's, we have better breaks, more torque, more potential and we are faster stock to stock and this is alll for the same price!
so 05 stage 2 vs 06 stage 2 the 06 is prettier! :lol: :banana:

You DEFINATELY don't have better seats than 02-03. STi guys yank out their HUGE chairs(now made for "U.S." sizes) just to but in 02-03 WRX seats. They are still the best chairs hands down in a Suby for anyone under 200 lbs. That was the biggest complaint starting in 04... They took the narrow(er) seats away!

But everything else, sure. You have the rest of it.

You like that you look more like an STi???

http://www.yawpower.com/tqvshp.html



^^^ That would be a good article to read for everyone who is still under the impression that torque has anything to do with acceleration, except as means of creating power.

One of the easiest to follow write-ups yet...I'll give it 2 dancing bananas...

:banana: :banana:

I hear that PDX's shelf maps are a lot more aggressive than Cobb's. I am waiting to hear from PDX tomorrow as they had a dyno day this weekend and were expecting some new 06 WRX maps to play with.
Anyone get a protune or a PDX map yet. I've only seen one protune dyno sheet with Stage 2 on 93, 245 WHP, 310TQ. That seems like a pretty good number for a stock turbo.

I have PDX map on my 02 WRX...

I've had my 06 stage 2 for about a month now and its so much more fun to drive than my 04 stage 2.

Around town the 06 stg2 is so much more responsive than my 04 stg2 ever was. But on the freeway and in the higher rpms the my old 04 stg2 had more life to it.

I'm not to say the 06 stg2 is a snail on the freeway...but it doesn't hit you as hard as the 2.0 would. The 2.0 loves to rev and makes most of its power up high.

All this said...I love my 06 stg2 and wouldn't trade it for the 04, never ever.

TQ this and HP that.....I don't claim to have the answer but I can say the 06 kicks bootay and you will not be disappointed. :banana:

P.S. It was once said that a torquey car is a fun car. This I think is true. :p

Peace

What kinda of boost are you stage 2 people maxing out at? I heard one or 2 people talking about boost creep / boost spiking being a more prevelant problem on the 06's on account of the larger displacement.

What kinda of boost are you stage 2 people maxing out at? I heard one or 2 people talking about boost creep / boost spiking being a more prevelant problem on the 06's on account of the larger displacement.

target boost is around 15 psi. Yes some people experience boost creep and boost spiking. Usually spiking is a quick adjustment of the wastegate actuator arm. Boost creep can be cured by porting the wastegate and some form of engine managment.

I have the Cobb TBE w/ high flow cat. I would get around 16 psi and I guess the ECU learned now it will hit 15ish psi, which is right where I want it. I get no boost creep.

If I would have gotten boost creep I probably would have just gotten a new turbo. I hate taking parts off and working them and putting them back on.