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Old 01-29-2008, 02:39 PM   #1
AVANTI R5
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Default Car Smoking Ban Moving Through Washington State Legislature

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A bill banning smoking in vehicles where children are present is reportedly making its way through the Legislature in the Washington State, according to PistonHeads.


The law would cover pipes, cigars and cigarettes. Whether the law will apply to convertibles is under discussion. Police could only ticket the offense if pulled over for another driving violation. There’s no word yet on the amount of the fine.
Under provision, once the bill is passed, a six-month reprieve would be given for police to issue warnings and to educate drivers.


The bills are, reportedly, to have been proposed by Senator Chris Marr, D-Spokane and Representative Shay Schual-Berke, D-Normandy Park.


California and Arkansas already have a similar bill in place. Washington State has also banned, along with other states, smoking in public buildings.


Reasonable law or another government infringement on personal space?
http://news.windingroad.com/governme...e-legislature/
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Old 01-29-2008, 03:03 PM   #2
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Police could only ticket the offense if pulled over for another driving violation. There’s no word yet on the amount of the fine.
That's how seatbelt laws started. Biggest line of bull**** ever.

Tom
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Old 02-02-2008, 12:15 PM   #3
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That's how seatbelt laws started. Biggest line of bull**** ever.

Tom
+1
That's how it always starts. Then they tug at the heart strings of the emotional types that are more than willing to give up freedoms to make themselves feel good and show that they care.

I DESPISE smoking after suffering my parents smoking around me continually growing up--that is why I don't smoke. But the government is the last place that needs to tell me how to raise my kids--let alone the myriad other things that are none of its business.

Like many others have said, there have been studies that show that ETS has no significant impact on health.
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Old 01-29-2008, 03:20 PM   #4
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Why don't these bastards just come out and say it?

We want to ban smoking completely.

First it was "segregate smokers from non-smokers in private businesses", then it was "don't allow smoking inside most private businesses", then it was "don't allow people to smoke within 15 feet of a public building's entrance (because of the 3 seconds it could annoy people walking by), and now this.

When are smokers going to get a lobby together? You know after they get done with that group they're going to come after businesses that sell alcohol too. Your driver's license will get stamped when you have children and liquor stores will have to scan it and refuse to sell to you for concern of what it'll do to affect the child. After that it'll be fatty foods. Police will start pulling over anyone with children in a car that just came out of a drive thru.

You know what'd help alleviate the problem is removing the child guards on rear windows. If kids could open the back windows without restrictions they could get alot more fresh air into the car.

<end furious sarcasm>
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Old 01-29-2008, 03:39 PM   #5
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We want to ban smoking completely.
I'm all for this. Either that, or ban smokers from having any type of health insurance that's shared with non-smokers. Daddy's tired of paying $260/month in heath insurance premiums.
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Old 01-29-2008, 03:51 PM   #6
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I have a question. Is cell-phone use banned in this state while driving also ? If not, it's a waste of effort. People have been smoking and driving since the car was invented. If the desired effect here is safety, then cell-phone use should be banned !

How many accidents have you seen where smoking was the cause of the accident ? Very few. If they are doing this for any reason other than safety, then it's an infringement of our rights !

And just for the record, I smoke, but I don't smoke in my STi.
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Old 01-30-2008, 03:11 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by Okeyd57 View Post
I have a question. Is cell-phone use banned in this state while driving also ? If not, it's a waste of effort. People have been smoking and driving since the car was invented. If the desired effect here is safety, then cell-phone use should be banned !

How many accidents have you seen where smoking was the cause of the accident ? Very few. If they are doing this for any reason other than safety, then it's an infringement of our rights !

And just for the record, I smoke, but I don't smoke in my STi.
Yes, it's banned. As is texting.

Personally, I'm all for this. Anything that makes it harder for people to smoke, and ESPECIALLY makes it harder for them to inflict second-hand smoke on their kids. It's a disgusting habit with no redeeming value whatsoever. I mean, with pot at least you get...you know...something. Besides lung cancer and nasty breath.
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Old 01-29-2008, 06:38 PM   #8
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I'm all for this. Either that, or ban smokers from having any type of health insurance that's shared with non-smokers. Daddy's tired of paying $260/month in heath insurance premiums.
I Wish I was only paying 260/month for health insurance, thats cheap.

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I'm all for entirely banning the sale, use, possession of tobacco products. It is for the benefit of even smokers themselves.
Think our economy is in the ****ter enough as it is, banning tobacco would really **** it up.
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Old 01-29-2008, 07:21 PM   #9
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I'm all for this. Either that, or ban smokers from having any type of health insurance that's shared with non-smokers. Daddy's tired of paying $260/month in heath insurance premiums.
Oh yea, but paying extra to cover large families and people who eat poor diets is fair? What next? Ban McDonalds? Give me a break.

Did everyone see this only applies to cars with kids in them? I think its reasonable.
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Old 02-03-2008, 12:33 AM   #10
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I'm all for this. Either that, or ban smokers from having any type of health insurance that's shared with non-smokers. Daddy's tired of paying $260/month in heath insurance premiums.

Me too. They should be more concerned with everyone being fat as hell. Now everyone has heart disease and teh dia-beetis.

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Old 01-30-2008, 11:23 AM   #11
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After that it'll be fatty foods. Police will start pulling over anyone with children in a car that just came out of a drive thru.
Don't fool yourself, this crap is already being set up.

Did you know Obama wants to (if elected president) send home report cards to parents if their children don't fit within a specified weight for their height?
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Old 01-30-2008, 11:24 AM   #12
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Don't fool yourself, this crap is already being set up.

Did you know Obama wants to (if elected president) send home report cards to parents if their children don't fit within a specified weight for their height?
The parents are already apathetic to it anyways, so what good will that do?

--kC
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Old 01-30-2008, 11:26 AM   #13
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The parents are already apathetic to it anyways, so what good will that do?

--kC
Apathy is no reason to excuse a government that wants to tell us how to live our lives and what is healthy and not healthy.
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Old 01-30-2008, 01:33 PM   #14
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Apathy is no reason to excuse a government that wants to tell us how to live our lives and what is healthy and not healthy.
That and also that their is no real way to just look at some magical chart and compare that to a weight of a kid and really scientifically say he/she is unhealthy. The BMI index is a joke and most people are obese or overweight according to that scale. Some people just still can't get it through their heads that some people are just bigger then others. Long as they eat right and get exercise they should be alright, no matter what they look like.
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Old 01-31-2008, 02:01 AM   #15
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Why don't these bastards just come out and say it?

We want to ban smoking completely.

First it was "segregate smokers from non-smokers in private businesses", then it was "don't allow smoking inside most private businesses", then it was "don't allow people to smoke within 15 feet of a public building's entrance (because of the 3 seconds it could annoy people walking by), and now this.

When are smokers going to get a lobby together? You know after they get done with that group they're going to come after businesses that sell alcohol too. Your driver's license will get stamped when you have children and liquor stores will have to scan it and refuse to sell to you for concern of what it'll do to affect the child. After that it'll be fatty foods. Police will start pulling over anyone with children in a car that just came out of a drive thru.

You know what'd help alleviate the problem is removing the child guards on rear windows. If kids could open the back windows without restrictions they could get alot more fresh air into the car.

<end furious sarcasm>
Cool, have fun killing your kids!

Its a slippery slope I know. But I'm not offended by this. It's close quarters.
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Old 01-29-2008, 03:55 PM   #16
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I am all for cell phones being banned in cars, too.
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Old 01-29-2008, 03:57 PM   #17
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This is kind of retarded and a persons vehicle is their property/personal space. But the part of me that agrees with it is because I feel it's distracting much like talking on a cell phone while driving, but it seems the motives behind this bill are not that.

I grew up with my dad who smoked 5 packs of cigs a day (and he still does) for 18 years of my life. I have zero health problems, so I don't see how someone in a car with a person who smokes one or two cigs is going to instantly give them cancer and boil their insides out of their eye sockets.

Smoking is stupid, and the ban should be for the same reason as why the cell phone ban was put in place, not to protect the innocent children.
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Old 01-29-2008, 04:23 PM   #18
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I grew up with my dad who smoked 5 packs of cigs a day (and he still does) for 18 years of my life. I have zero health problems, so I don't see how someone in a car with a person who smokes one or two cigs is going to instantly give them cancer and boil their insides out of their eye sockets. :rolleyes
+1.. and my mother, not my father.

BTW: As of 1/1/08.. my mother quit.
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Old 02-03-2008, 01:18 AM   #19
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I grew up with my dad who smoked 5 packs of cigs a day (and he still does) for 18 years of my life. I have zero health problems, so I don't see how someone in a car with a person who smokes one or two cigs is going to instantly give them cancer and boil their insides out of their eye sockets.
Smokers seem to have this "f-everyone else" attitude that really pisses me off. I don't give a crap if someone wants to smoke but I shouldn't have to walk through it or be subjected to it to get into a building. If smoking is so harmless, then perhaps I should be allowed to take a piss outside a building as people are walking by; hell, if I get a little on you as you pass by, you aren't going to be hurt by it, so no big deal, right?

By the way, you're only 24. When you're 50 or 60 and still have no smoking related health problems, then you can brag about it. Terminal or more serious smoking related health problems take time to develop. If you don't believe 2nd hand smoke is bad for you, then you might as well cook with lead pots.
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Old 02-03-2008, 09:51 PM   #20
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Smokers seem to have this "f-everyone else" attitude that really pisses me off. I don't give a crap if someone wants to smoke but I shouldn't have to walk through it or be subjected to it to get into a building. If smoking is so harmless, then perhaps I should be allowed to take a piss outside a building as people are walking by; hell, if I get a little on you as you pass by, you aren't going to be hurt by it, so no big deal, right?
How do you not have the 'f-everyone else' attitude? You want smokers to stop smoking so YOU don't have to smell. Well hey guess what, I don't want to smell your crap when your in a public restroom, but I have to. I don't want to hear some lady jabber into her phone when I ride the metro, but I have to. I don't want to smell some guys cologne when we pass by, but I have to. I don't want to hear some baby crying when I ride in an airplane, but I have to. Do you notice something here, its 'I'. Have we become such sissies that we must legislate everyones actions? What ever happened to being inconvenienced for others sake? When is it going to end, when we all act in a certain code so no one is bothered or upset. If that is the end then you can count me out.

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By the way, you're only 24. When you're 50 or 60 and still have no smoking related health problems, then you can brag about it. Terminal or more serious smoking related health problems take time to develop. If you don't believe 2nd hand smoke is bad for you, then you might as well cook with lead pots.
Please if your going to just make those assumptions then I might as well say the guy who worked 60 years in a bar around second hand smoke is fine, so everyone else is going to be.
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Old 02-04-2008, 12:19 PM   #21
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How do you not have the 'f-everyone else' attitude? You want smokers to stop smoking so YOU don't have to smell. Well hey guess what, I don't want to smell your crap when your in a public restroom, but I have to.

I don't want to hear some lady jabber into her phone when I ride the metro, but I have to. I don't want to smell some guys cologne when we pass by, but I have to. I don't want to hear some baby crying when I ride in an airplane, but I have to.
Man, that is some weirdass logic you've got there.

Let's break it down:

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Originally Posted by Nico Flax View Post
You want smokers to stop smoking so YOU don't have to smell. Well hey guess what, I don't want to smell your crap when your in a public restroom, but I have to.
Don't use a public restroom then. I don't like the smell either and I won't use one until Jabba is done laying waste to the toilet. So, ask yourself this, do you smell like crap after leaving a public restroom? No, you don't. Does the smell of crap hurt you or irritate your eyes if you wear contacts? No, it doesn't.

Furthermore, bodily functions are not optional, smoking is. Regardless of whether you are addicted or not, that's a (stupid) choice you made - crapping is not optional; EVERYONE has to crap.

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I don't want to hear some lady jabber into her phone when I ride the metro, but I have to.
It doesn't hurt you though and her talking also doesn't follow you around for the rest of the day (unless you're married to her.) Sure, it might inconvenience you, but it doesn't have a lasting effect.

Sit in a room with smokers for 5 minutes, then leave, and you'll smell worse than a homeless person for the rest of the day.

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I don't want to hear some baby crying when I ride in an airplane, but I have to.
Once again, a baby crying does not HURT you. I've never been on a plane where a baby crying causes my contacts to get all itchy, my clothes to smell, or any other harm. Do I like it when someone brings a baby into a movie theatre to watch the 11pm showing of BloodBath 12? Hell no, but it is only an inconvenience, and is not harmful in anyway.

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I don't want to smell some guys cologne when we pass by, but I have to.
This is the only one I agree with. We have people in the office that are actually allergic to colognes and perfumes. Some older women splash on perfume like they're trying to cover up a rotting toe or something. It's disgusting.

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Originally Posted by Nico Flax View Post
Do you notice something here, its 'I'. Have we become such sissies that we must legislate everyones actions? What ever happened to being inconvenienced for others sake? When is it going to end, when we all act in a certain code so no one is bothered or upset. If that is the end then you can count me out.
A baby crying on a plane is annoying but usually unavoidable and is understandable. A good person will realise that and won't mind being "inconvenienced". Using a public restroom is your choice and you know that going into that area will likely subject you to the smell of whatever Bubba ate the night before. Disgusting, sure, but not harmful and everyone has to crap or piss at one point. We all share that as a species. The lady talking on her cellphone might be annoying but you can more easily ignore that than someone smoking next to you.

In all your examples, the "inconvenience" ends when I leave the area. I honestly don't car

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Please if your going to just make those assumptions then I might as well say the guy who worked 60 years in a bar around second hand smoke is fine, so everyone else is going to be.
We know, based on scientific evidence, that second hand smoke is harmful. We also know that walking or riding beside traffic in the downtown core is bad for you too. People react differently to toxins. It is proven, by case studies, that people, who haven't smoked a day in their lives, have sucuumbed to smoking-related illnesses from living with a smoker. I'm sure there are people that don't develop cancer or other issues, but that should be MY choice not a smoker's.

The same argument could be made against streetracing. Sure, most of the time streetracing doesn't result in death and destruction but we have laws against it because there is a reasonable potential for an accident. If you kill yourself while streetracing on a public road, that's fine, but the problem is you'll likely take an unwilling participant with you. The person you kill streetracing likely didn't have a choice in the matter. Give me the choice to avoid a smoker and I will, but when it is forced on me that is wrong. Breathing and going to work is not optional, smoking is.

If they had designated smoking areas or bars in Ontario, I would avoid them. When you have a pack of 15 smokers huddled infront of the entrance to a building, that is wrong. If I'm supposed to put up with that inconvenience, maybe I should just relieve myself on those smokers before going into the building. If I'm supposed to put up with them inconveniencing me (illegally mind you), they shouldn't have a problem with smelling like urine all day because I couldn't hold it, right?

I will not be inconvenienced and potentially harmed just to appease a person's disgusting addiction.

By the way this comment is just shocking:

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Originally Posted by Nico Flax View Post
What ever happened to being inconvenienced for others sake?
Whatever happened to being considerate and NOT inconveniencing others?
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Old 02-04-2008, 01:05 PM   #22
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Let's break it down:

Whatever happened to being considerate and NOT inconveniencing others?
^- That whole post was well-stated.

Funny thing, I live in a city where smoking is illegal in any public building (malls, bars, and restaurants, for example). It's fricking awesome! They have those little room in airports for smokers, where they can all go - and even some of the smokers can't bear to walk into those places, haha.

Ian
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Old 02-04-2008, 01:23 PM   #23
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Don't use a public restroom then. I don't like the smell either and I won't use one until Jabba is done laying waste to the toilet. So, ask yourself this, do you smell like crap after leaving a public restroom? No, you don't. Does the smell of crap hurt you or irritate your eyes if you wear contacts? No, it doesn't. Furthermore, bodily functions are not optional, smoking is. Regardless of whether you are addicted or not, that's a (stupid) choice you made - crapping is not optional; EVERYONE has to crap.
Bodily functions are some what optional, people don't pee while they are riding the bus, they hold it. Now I'm not saying that people should hold until they get home, but for example sake. I will give you the smell aspect but hurt your eyes? Smokers are already smoking outside, what are they blowing it in your face? A lot of these non-smoking lobbyist act like they are walking through fields of smoke. What is it like 1 or 2 seconds that you walk through, not even a smoke layer, but air that smells like smoke. Your already separated in restaurants, most of the time though it's a completely non smoking restaurants these days though. Now they can't even do it outside. Why are we trying to legislate how people act?

I will say this though, people's farts can make me through up, I have a weak stomach. But I don't expect them to be hassled or have to pass gas outside. Once again just because 'I' have a problem, or can't hold my stomach, doesn't mean farts should be outlawed.

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It doesn't hurt you though and her talking also doesn't follow you around for the rest of the day (unless you're married to her.) Sure, it might inconvenience you, but it doesn't have a lasting effect. Sit in a room with smokers for 5 minutes, then leave, and you'll smell worse than a homeless person for the rest of the day.
Alright it may not follow me around for the rest of the day. But I tell you what does hurt me, the cell phone's radiation. I mean I can come up with so many boggie men for anything, just so that I don't have to deal with it, and that is what non-smokers are trying to do. Now I don't believe the studies linking cell phones to lower sperm count, or to brain tumors, etc. But I could... and then I could say how harmful it is to have one next to me. You see how this works, and how some people try to push others to be like them. Once again though nobody is telling you to sit inside a smoking room, nobody is forcing you to, you would be doing it on your own will. Plus from my understanding most places are non-smoking now. At least around where I live, so I don't know what more you could ask for. I don't go into a restaurant and complain when I smell like food. It's there, I know it's there, I go there by choice, and choose that.

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Once again, a baby crying does not HURT you. I've never been on a plane where a baby crying causes my contacts to get all itchy, my clothes to smell, or any other harm. Do I like it when someone brings a baby into a movie theatre to watch the 11pm showing of BloodBath 12? Hell no, but it is only an inconvenience, and is not harmful in anyway.
Maybe it hurts my ears, maybe it gives me stress, and stress can have negative effects on your body. I'm just trying to show you how pretty much anything can be perceived to have a negative affect on a person.

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This is the only one I agree with. We have people in the office that are actually allergic to colognes and perfumes. Some older women splash on perfume like they're trying to cover up a rotting toe or something. It's disgusting.
Now I can't believe you agree to this. Because I would never try and stop someone from wearing a fragrance. I don't even know how someone can be allergic to it that badly.

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Originally Posted by Digitalfiend View Post
A baby crying on a plane is annoying but usually unavoidable and is understandable. A good person will realise that and won't mind being "inconvenienced". Using a public restroom is your choice and you know that going into that area will likely subject you to the smell of whatever Bubba ate the night before. Disgusting, sure, but not harmful and everyone has to crap or piss at one point. We all share that as a species. The lady talking on her cellphone might be annoying but you can more easily ignore that than someone smoking next to you.
Well I think this is where the argument is stemming from, because around here almost everything is non-smoking.

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We know, based on scientific evidence, that second hand smoke is harmful. We also know that walking or riding beside traffic in the downtown core is bad for you too. People react differently to toxins. It is proven, by case studies, that people, who haven't smoked a day in their lives, have sucuumbed to smoking-related illnesses from living with a smoker. I'm sure there are people that don't develop cancer or other issues, but that should be MY choice not a smoker's.
But you see that is the problem, we don't know. And now all the science has be screwed with and screwed by politicos and people with agendas that getting a clear answer is close to impossible.

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Give me the choice to avoid a smoker and I will, but when it is forced on me that is wrong. Breathing and going to work is not optional, smoking is.
Alright I can agree with you there, that you should and have all the legal right to avoid smoke. I think the mix up is in other areas, as I'm thinking about smoking when you go out to eat or to a bar, and not on the ride to work. As I said before, everything is non-smoking here.

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Originally Posted by Digitalfiend View Post
If they had designated smoking areas or bars in Ontario, I would avoid them. When you have a pack of 15 smokers huddled infront of the entrance to a building, that is wrong. If I'm supposed to put up with that inconvenience, maybe I should just relieve myself on those smokers before going into the building. If I'm supposed to put up with them inconveniencing me (illegally mind you), they shouldn't have a problem with smelling like urine all day because I couldn't hold it, right? I will not be inconvenienced and potentially harmed just to appease a person's disgusting addiction.
I don't see how that is wrong, they want to smoke, and you don't have to go to that bar.

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By the way this comment is just shocking:
Whatever happened to being considerate and NOT inconveniencing others?
It's called thinking of the group, but I will agree both smokers and non-smokers are only thinking of themselves.When you go to a bar or restaurant and it smells of smoke, then don't go in, and if enough people do what you did, it will either go out of business or it will become a non-smoking place. And if there are people smoking outside then still avoid it, until they tell their customers they don't want them smoking outside. That is how it is suppose to work. If it's public transportation, or some public service then I will agree it should be non-smoking.
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Old 01-29-2008, 04:00 PM   #24
lawn boy
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****ing RETARDED!!!

THANKS big brother, but i'll make my own decisions
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Old 01-29-2008, 04:21 PM   #25
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****ing RETARDED!!!

THANKS big brother, but i'll make my own decisions
my sentiments exactly. While I wish people would stop smoking, its not the goverments right to ban it. Eventually I hope smokers will just be socially outcast and eventually itll become similar to using heroine or cocaine or something. People do it, but its extremely frowned upon by society because its a bad for them and everyone around them, but not becuase the government says so.
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