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Old 03-12-2002, 08:29 PM   #1
mart242
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Member#: 16314
Join Date: Mar 2002
Chapter/Region: E. Canada
Location: Ottawa, ON
Default Thinking of buying RS in Ottawa...

Hey guys,

I'm seriously considering buying an RS and currently live in Ottawa. I test drived a WRX last year but felt it wasn't worth 35k$ as I don't care too much about the turbo (I've got a sportbike for the summer so I get my acceleration rush there!). So the RS seems like a good fit for me at 27k$.

Based on what I've seen on this forum, Ottawa's dealers are crooks... So I'm thinking about maybe buying in Montreal. Do you know if I would save a lot by doing this?

Also, what do you think of the permaplate stuff? Paintguard, Soundguard, Rustguard... Is it worth it? I think it's another scam by Westboro to get more money... But if they make a big difference, I might go for it.

Finally, any idea about the invoice price on a 5 spd Sedan RS? How much should I knock off MSRP? (I'll take the fogs and keyless options).

Thanks!
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Old 03-12-2002, 09:15 PM   #2
SubaruStu
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Member#: 8972
Join Date: Aug 2001
Chapter/Region: E. Canada
Location: Ottawa
Vehicle:
2003 WRX Wagon
Silver

Default

From what I remeber, it is a PITA for the licencing of the car. A
couple of guys I used to work with (who ere from Montreal and
worked in Ottawa) did it. You have to get temporary permits etc.
It was a hassle. I doubt that Montreal dealers are going to give
a significantly better price but it is always worth trying.

A lot of Ottawa people like Lachute Subaru-Suzuki for their service
but I don't think anyone has posted on buying there. They are
close enough to Hawkesbury that they could licence a car directly
in Ontario an save some hassle.

My 2.


Stu
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Old 03-12-2002, 09:25 PM   #3
mart242
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Join Date: Mar 2002
Chapter/Region: E. Canada
Location: Ottawa, ON
Default

About the price difference between Montreal and Ottawa... Here's an example.

Last year I wanted to buy a Honda Sportbike (CBR1100XX). MSRP was 14,300$. Gave a call to a Montreal dealer recommended by a friend, the guy told me "We'll work something out if you're serious. Ball park would be 12,500$".

So I go to the Ottawa Honda dealer, ask for his price, he won't go lower than 12,500$. I tell him I'll get a better deal in Montreal and buy there. He says that's impossible.

I was at the Montreal dealer the next day. Told him "how much you want?". He said 11,600$. A 900$ profit for me. I can't go lower than that.". I bought it right away.

Really great dealer. Let me know if you need a Honda motorcycle!
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Old 03-12-2002, 09:58 PM   #4
warpdrive
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Location: Ontario
Vehicle:
2002 WRX wagon Silvr
10th Anniversary Miata

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Invoice price is $24,675 (I copied this from a post on another forum...don't remember where so don't ask for proof)

A good price in Toronto for the WRX is something like $1500.00 off (may have changed by now) as of last year. That's about a 6% profit. Going from that, you'd save about $800 off an RS.

cars4u.com lists a $723.00 discount off the RS right now which coincides with my numbers.

RS's are actually probably harder to get since dealers seem to want to order more WRX's in general.
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Old 03-12-2002, 10:11 PM   #5
rilles
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Member#: 14332
Join Date: Jan 2002
Chapter/Region: E. Canada
Location: Waterloo
Vehicle:
2003 RS
blue

Wink

Something that I used for my purchase.
Find the USA invoice and MRSP price, use that info to work out the dealer markup. You can then use that markup to figure out CDN dealer invoice. Or just pay CarFax for the info.
Then work in say 5% (of invoice) or at least $1000 profit for the dealer. Go in, be nice, don't waste his time, show him your calculations and if doesn't go for it, thank him for his time and leave - go somewhere else (or go back later - different sales person) - end of the month thing is a myth far as I know.
If he agrees to the price, then talk about options.
Goto http://www.subaruparts.com - find your options, convert to canadian, figure in installation cost and that will give you a ballpark number.

Don't let the dealer sucker in extra costs such as admin/ advertising fees/ whatever (good luck).

If the sales person does the waiting game talking to his sales manger (he already knows the skinny), reverse it on him and go off and look at cars in the showroom - pick out flaws - look not very impressed with the flaws - wait until he has to come find you.

Look like your serious about the car, but not eager - that Mazda Protege5 you saw last week dosn't have AWD but its a lot cheaper and comes in a cool shade of yellow you've always dreamed of driving.

If everyone in your area won't budge in price, try joining the Toronto Subaru Club - and get a quote from the dealer who is a club sponser - it may be worth the drive to Toronto.

Richard
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Old 03-12-2002, 11:15 PM   #6
mart242
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Join Date: Mar 2002
Chapter/Region: E. Canada
Location: Ottawa, ON
Default

Thanks for all the help guys...

What's killing me is that I'm trading in my current car (99 Golf) so I have to get a good trade in value and good price for the RS.

I guess I could sell the Golf myself but that's too much of a hassle and honestly, I'm afraid everything will break on it since the warranty has expired 26,000km ago.

The trick about the Protege 5 is good. I was planning to go see it tomorrow, but you can be sure I'll bring back the brochure back to subaru...

That brings another question to my mind... The Protege5 seems to offer a lot more bang for the buck compared to the RS. Beside AWD, what does the RS offer more for the 7,000$ difference??
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Old 03-13-2002, 06:50 AM   #7
Skeandhu
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Member#: 1056
Join Date: Mar 2000
Chapter/Region: E. Canada
Location: Ottawa, ON, Canada
Default

My GF just bought a Protege5, and I'm actually quite impressed by it!!!

The only turn-offs for me are the lack of AWD (that's a big seller for me) and it needs a bit more juice.

The brakes are fantastic, interior is very nice (and remarkably similar to the WRX... though the steering wheel on the Mazda is nicer! ), the handling is impressive (but I didn't push it), and the Mazda is definately prettier.

There's only ~$2500 difference btwn the RS and the P5 if you add the moonroof and A/C options on the Mazda.

Also, I found that Olgilvie isn't too bad of a dealership for sales (only deal with Tom McCullough - dunno if I spelled that right) and parts, but I'll still go to Lachute for service.
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Old 03-13-2002, 07:52 AM   #8
Jayson_K
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Join Date: Oct 2001
Vehicle:
02 RS
platinum silver

Default

I wouldn't say the Ottawa dealers are crooks, they just most likely won't budge from MSRP. It can't hurt to phone Montreal/Toronto dealers and at least ask if they will go below sticker price (if you don't mind treavelling).
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Old 03-13-2002, 10:16 AM   #9
d00f
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Member#: 6000
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Vehicle:
2000 GC8 STi V4 swap
BRP

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I wouldn't express any confidence in either of the 2 Ottawa stealerships. After the load of BS Ogilvie gave me about my wheel flying off if I didn't replace a bearing that may possibly need replacement in a few 1000km I couldn't recommend them. Westboro from my experience is the lesser of the two evils but I'd say go see Rejean at Lachute. I'm quite sure they can make it easy for you to buy the car and license it in Ontario. I could be mistaken but I think I've heard of them delivering cars to your doorstep in Ottawa.

-Michael
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Old 03-13-2002, 10:37 AM   #10
RallyOttawa
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Member#: 14303
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Seattle, WA
Vehicle:
1999 Impreza RS 2.5
Black

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I had a pleasant experience dealing with Westboro, and Marco has always been helpful and fair with me. Keep in mind that a WRX in Ottawa is a hot commodity.. what with all the Nortellians snapping them up when they first came out. They didn't negotiate for anything, so it kinda ruined it for the rest of us.

That being said, the easier they are to sell in the city, the less they have to drop the prices...

No offense to Nortellian WRX owners
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Old 03-13-2002, 11:19 AM   #11
goobie
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Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: White Rock BC, Canada
Vehicle:
2006 WRX Wagon
WRB

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Quote:
I wouldn't say the Ottawa dealers are crooks
If you witnessed the BS I had to deal with yesterday, you may have a change of opinion.
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Old 03-13-2002, 12:07 PM   #12
mturmel
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Member#: 2473
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Orleans/Ottawa, Canada
Vehicle:
2002 WRX
World Rally Blue

Default

Hey,
how about trying Gatineau Subaru, it's close ? I bought my rex there, excellent service so far. I sent my friend there for an OBS, he got a VERY good deal and he had done a lot of shopping around. If you want, I can call ahead and talk to the owner and have you deal with her directly. I'll be there March 21, getting some STi goodies installed.

Lemme know,

Matt
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Old 03-13-2002, 01:18 PM   #13
Kal
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Member#: 12307
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Vehicle:
2002 TS
Blue

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I picked up my TS in Richmond Hill for $1200 cheaper from what I could get from the two crooks in Ottawa. Plus, back in Aug the wait for TS was about 3 months here in Ottawa, whereas with this guy I was in my car within 4 wks. If you don't mind the drive its worth it.
Pm me if you want the name of the guy, he was great.

Kal
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Old 03-13-2002, 03:01 PM   #14
Patrice
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Member#: 321
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Gatineau, Quebec, Canada
Vehicle:
99 TS
Red

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Kal, i got 300$ lower then you at Gatineau Subaru.
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Old 03-13-2002, 10:54 PM   #15
warpdrive
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Location: Ontario
Vehicle:
2002 WRX wagon Silvr
10th Anniversary Miata

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Quote:
Originally posted by Patrice
Kal, i got 300$ lower then you at Gatineau Subaru.
I don't think you can compare your '99 to a '02 TS.
2002 TS's were notoriously hard to get late last year. And the profit margin on them is slim on the '02 model. The invoice price is only $1400.00 less than MSRP.

Gatineau Subaru wouldn't even give me $0.01 off a WRX even though I told them I could get the WRX at $1500.00 off if I drove to Toronto.
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Old 03-14-2002, 12:43 PM   #16
p_seg
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Member#: 398
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Hull,Canada
Vehicle:
2004 STi
World Rally Blue

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You should try Subaru Ste-Agathe.

I saved more than $3000 compare to Gatineau and
Ottawa dealers.

1-800-463-1600
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Old 03-14-2002, 02:48 PM   #17
Kal
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Location: Ottawa, Canada
Vehicle:
2002 TS
Blue

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The guy in Toronto ( Rich. Hill) knew exactly how pleasent & full of themselves the Ottawa dealers are..........without asking fro service he recommended the Gatineau dealer.
Mind you I had no need to visit him yet.
The car is SWEET!

Kal

The oil change is a breeze.......
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Old 03-19-2002, 04:11 PM   #18
mart242
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Member#: 16314
Join Date: Mar 2002
Chapter/Region: E. Canada
Location: Ottawa, ON
Default I finally bought from Westboro

After your recommendations...

I went to Ogilvie, dealer said he could get me an RS: the blue in the showroom or a silver coming in a month. That's the only two he had and will have. No pressure at all from the salesman (Tom), he was nice and everything. He did not deal too much on the price however. Then, I wanted to see what kind of price I would get from Subaru Gatineau since it had been recommended by a few people here.

I went there and the salesman was a total assh*** and did not seem like someone who wanted to sell a car... So I left. I wasn't impressed at all by them and don't think that I will ever go back there. Sure, it was because of the attitude of the salesperson, but I'll still ban that dealer from my shopping list because of that. I guess a few of you have done that with Ogilvie and Westboro. Too bad for them!

I then gave a call to Subaru Ste-Agathe but they had no RS in stock and were not getting any more...

The next day, I went to Westboro and I ended up buying there. They gave me a really good price for my trade-in and we agreed on a fair price for the RS. Sure, I haven't had a good deal like most of you had two months ago (1000$ and more off MSRP), but the RS are almost impossible to find these days!. No pressure at all from them and they were all nice and wanted to sell me a car.

So far, I like Westboro and Ogilvie. I guess I'll have to see what kind of aftersale service I'll get from there.... but it can be worse that the attitude of the &^%#%$ salesman at Subaru Gatineau...

A word of advice, if you're planning on buying an RS, do it fast, the dealers are running out of RS. Only 10 dealers in Ontario had a 5spd RS in stock, and I got one of these...

My car is coming from Toronto and I should be getting it next week. Silver RS (My choices were either silver or blue, and they found a silver).
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Old 03-19-2002, 04:30 PM   #19
mturmel
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Member#: 2473
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Orleans/Ottawa, Canada
Vehicle:
2002 WRX
World Rally Blue

Default

Sorry about your experience at Subaru Gatineau...

This is exactly what happened to me at both Westboro and Ogilvie even though I drove in with a 1998 talon Tsi, and as you said I'm not the only one...

I'm still talking to the techs at Westboro, since it's not their fault some of their vendors are a#$hole ...

Hope you won't kill them like that for one vendor, which I'm surprised you had hard time with since I know them all. As I was told you came at a bad time when ther was only this vendor on the floor as the owner was out for dinner.

I have nothing but praise for their service dept as they have the best Subaru tech in Canada...

Anyway, good luck with Westboro.

Matt

Last edited by mturmel; 03-19-2002 at 10:18 PM.
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Old 03-19-2002, 10:10 PM   #20
den31
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Question Gatineau Subaru

Mart242 I am the owner of the Gatineau Subaru dealership...I do not understand why you wrote those nasty words... I personnally called you myself to see how your visit went and I apologized because you seemed to be offended by my sales rep. I spoke to him myself and, according to him you and your friend were very impolite and rude...He has an excellent track record for customer service and it was not his fault he was not authorized to reduce prices. Normally either I or my assistant are in the store to give the best possible price. Matt specifically told you to see me...That day one of my employee's father died and we were understaffed...I waited till seven pm for your visit before finally leaving to eat my first meal of the day... This business is our baby and we pride ourselves in giving good & honest service...sorry you caught us on a bad day... Good luck with Westboro...By the waydid you check out their door rate???
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Old 03-19-2002, 10:48 PM   #21
PatTheRat
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Member#: 12975
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Ottawa, Ontario CA
Vehicle:
2002 Impreza 2.5RS
Silver Metallic

Default

Hey Mart242,

I bought an RS from Ogilvy and all in all had a good experience. I too dealt with Tom McCullough, he was straight forward and friendly. (although he needed some prodding to return my phone calls while awaiting delivery)

Anyway, my experience with them so far has been good in regards to service, and their main parts guy, his name is Guido, is super cool. I chatted with him at length about Subies and the like, turns out he does some custom parts from time to time. Mostly aesthethic parts like fog light covers and such. But a good guy nonetheless.

All the best once you get your new RS, silver is a great choice!

See you on the streets of Ottawa...
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Old 03-19-2002, 10:54 PM   #22
mart242
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Location: Ottawa, ON
Default

Let's not start a flame war...

All I wrote was that I had been disappointed by the attitude of the salesperson at Subaru Gatineau and because of that I bought somewhere else. What your salesperson says is another story. If I drove 45 minutes to go to your dealership and stayed in the store for only 2 minutes. There had to be a reason why I stayed there for only two minutes, I did not waste 90 minutes of my time to make a roundtrip to your dealership to insult and be rude with your salesperson! But yes, I was pissed off that he was so useless and did not seem to care about me, the customer.

Some people had really bad experiences with Ogilvie and Westboro. They mentionned it here. That's fine. I did not like my experience at Gatineau Subaru, I mentionned it here. That's fine. I did not say "do not buy at Gatineau Subaru" or something like that. All I said was that I did not like the useless salesperson had to deal with and for that reason I did not buy there.


Now don't worry, I don't think you'll loose any customers because of me. But at least, the people who read this thread will know that no dealer is perfect. All I'm saying is don't base your dealer decision to buy somewhere only on the opinion of other members of this board. You've got to visit them / deal with them to make your own decision about if a dealer is good or not for you. And yes, sometimes, you might catch them on a bad day. Unfortunately, the first impression is the one you will always remember.

But keep in mind that your service was much better than the one for furniture at Brault & Martineau... Which is banned from my shopping list forever!
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Old 03-19-2002, 10:57 PM   #23
mturmel
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Location: Orleans/Ottawa, Canada
Vehicle:
2002 WRX
World Rally Blue

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And let there be peace....



Matt
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