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Old 10-31-2008, 09:26 PM   #1
Dutchman
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Unhappy 2006 wrx Cobb Stg2

Stock intake, cobb AP version 1 with stg 2 OTS map, helix catted downpipe. Mustang dyno (~sea level) shows 197 hp [@4800] & 250 tq [@3000]. Is this about right ?
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Old 10-31-2008, 09:45 PM   #2
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kinda low IMO
check out Cobbs mustang #'s

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Old 11-01-2008, 02:04 AM   #3
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Your car was on a different dyno. If you REALLY think there's a problem, post up the graph so we can see if something's not right. What does a stock 2.5WRX dyno at on THAT dyno?


You're killing yourself trying to compare numbers.
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Old 11-01-2008, 02:07 AM   #4
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Depends on the dyno. Kito's Mustang dyno in Seattle reads low, and so could yours. My stock #'s were 177hp/200tq and my VF39'd numbers were 225hp/250tq, whereas a stock STi on their dyno pulls about 230/230.

So with the VF39 I pulled about +50hp/+50tq, which is a decent gain, knowing my stock #'s on the same dyno. Did you do a baseline pull? If not, ask your tuner if he has stock #'s for an 06 rex or for an Sti. It's all relative.
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Old 11-01-2008, 02:25 AM   #5
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The drag strip tells all!

Do you have any track numbers stock? If so, that, and seat of the pants feel from stock to stage 2 is pretty noticable...also might add the catted downpipe is choking you up some as well.

Trey
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Old 11-01-2008, 02:32 AM   #6
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Also just realized you don't have a cat back exhaust listed...if your running the oe parts there, your not getting everything from the fairly rich stage 2 off the shelf map. My 05 2 litre rex ran 13.2-13.6 @ 100 or so, weather dependant with the stage 2 cobb high wastegate map with an APS catless turbo back, drop in K&N filter, perrin turbo inlet and aps upipe on 93 octane.

hope these things lessen your anguish...as far as dyno numbers, my car was tuned for its first turbo upgrade (evo3 16g) on a unknown at the time low reading dynodynamics dyno...I left there making a measly 260 whp and 233 wtq...later that year with the same tune, I was running low 12s! So like I said, dynos mean nothing unless your comparing the exact same car with different mods in like weather conditions.

ttyl

Trey
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Old 11-02-2008, 12:17 AM   #7
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Arrow **Update

***Update - Car felt better on the way home last night in colder temps. Popped the hood today to find that the shop did not re-install my turbo heat shield after installing the helix downpipe - I'm guessing it should fit [i didnt have a chance to try myself]... Now this leads me to the question, could the reason why the dyno #'s were a little low be due to the fact that the cars was idling for quite a few mintues and then run 2 times on the mustang dyno [60+F outside temp] with all of that turbo heat up against the intercooler..? Thoughts [possible heatsoak causing the computer to pull timing].?
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Old 11-02-2008, 12:17 PM   #8
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no, it's probably do to the fact that you don't have a CBE. The stock intake and the catted DP (though worlds better than the OEM DP) don't help the airflow with your stock CBE. believe it or not, i tuned stg II one after the other with a kid who had the same car, and the only differences were that he had a short ram and an STi TMIC, and he made about 10+ hp and TQ at the wheels on me. all of these things come into play.


but these other guys are right too. don't get SO caught up over numbers, wait until you actually test it at the 1/4 strip or something. dyno's aren't the best comparison for what the car actually puts down on the street.

Last edited by FreNetiC STi; 11-02-2008 at 12:27 PM.
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Old 11-02-2008, 05:00 PM   #9
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does seem alittle low but the mustang dyno is the heartbreaker dyno. but they are the most accurate... you could go throw it on a dynojet somewhere and get high numbers if it would make your happier but you know the real power of your car on a mustang
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Old 11-02-2008, 05:03 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blacksails192 View Post
but you know the real power of your car on a drag strip

fixed

though you are correct, the mustang is the truest reading dyno i guess. as far as dyno's go.

not to jack his thread, but out of curiosity, what did you make on your 20g? what dyno?




BTW- you're two posts away from becoming a specialist i was seeing if you started a thread about your tune.
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Old 11-02-2008, 05:06 PM   #11
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Why didn't your shop do a baseline pull?
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Old 11-02-2008, 05:12 PM   #12
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my car made 327whp and 348wtq at 20psi on a mustang dyno...
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Old 11-02-2008, 06:03 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blacksails192 View Post
my car made 327whp and 348wtq at 20psi on a mustang dyno...
lol, I don't want to bash in anyway I just don't see how this will help him since you have a different engine, turbo, and different mustang dyno.
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Old 11-02-2008, 06:32 PM   #14
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Quote:
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lol, I don't want to bash in anyway I just don't see how this will help him since you have a different engine, turbo, and different mustang dyno.

he has already received his answers, blacksails was answering my question, you did read above your post right?
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Old 11-02-2008, 06:27 PM   #15
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it was to answer Skunky Butt08's question... im not trying to thread jack
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Old 11-02-2008, 06:28 PM   #16
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if he wants more numbers he can get a protune or more mods
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Old 11-02-2008, 07:06 PM   #17
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Have you asked your tuner yet what a stock rex or STi makes?
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Old 11-02-2008, 07:14 PM   #18
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Quote:
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Have you asked your tuner yet what a stock rex or STi makes?
you know what? i think we're going about this all wrong. i don't think he got tuned at all. the way it seems (based on what he said) is that the shop installed his DP for him and he flashed a stg II map instead of a stg I map, and the shop dyno'd him w/o a tune, solely on the ots stg II map. is this correct?

maybe i'm just the only retard in this thread who didn't realize that


if that's the case, i don't think anything sounds too far off.
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Old 11-02-2008, 07:10 PM   #19
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^^yeah, i figured he'd of mentioned that by now.

he's got full tq at 3k, which is where mine is too, and i made 315 on a dynojet. but the 197 seems really low, even for a mustang dyno. i made 245/315. once again, getting into comparing numbers can be useless sometimes, but just throwing it out there.
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Old 11-02-2008, 07:14 PM   #20
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It's an OTS map with a stock catback. There is a lot left on the table. Under the circumstances, it's right where I would expect it to be.
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Old 11-02-2008, 07:16 PM   #21
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^^exactly, i was under the impression that he was tuned with it.
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Old 11-02-2008, 08:45 PM   #22
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Car has 59k mi -- stock intake w/ dirty air filter, helix catted downpipe & SPT cbe. We flashed stg. II OTS map v1.01, then disc'd battery to install new spark plugs, then hit the dyno without heatshield [verified on AP that base map was still stg2]- I was originally thinking heat soak caused low hp #'s. Also, I dont have a boost gauge and their dyno cant check boost so we have no idea.. Car drove ok today and is def smoother and torquier, just doesnt seem much faster than stock. Tuner said that he has done stg 2 wrx's and seen ~230/250 on same dyno - i was at 197/250 - torque is there but not hp. Any last thoughts?
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Old 11-02-2008, 08:48 PM   #23
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hmm, that's strange, because tuners usually can't pull much more whp out of the OTS stg II maps on our 2.5l wrx's, so that still seems low. the wtq still seems a little low as well, but since it's hitting at 3k that's about right. how the hell does their dyno not read boost? especially if he tunes on that dyno?


when i flashed stg II there was a significant difference, much quicker and torquier, and much more fun. then with the tune it was a world of difference. just get it tuned man. the OTS maps are garbage anyway.


all in all, sounds about right for a STG II OTS map. but there's no way you should be making the same TQ numbers as a tuned stg II wrx. i made 65wtq over the OTS map, and 15 whp, so something is still fishy here.
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Old 11-02-2008, 08:59 PM   #24
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Just to clarify - shop where i got this done has seen OTS cobb stg2 wrx's hit 230/250+. Either way I was at the 197/250 - so are we ruling out the idea of heat soak causing the ecu to pull timing and bring my hp #'s down on the 2 pulls? At this point, I may just take the car to another tuner that can protune the car and diagnose any and all issues - hopefully I dont grenade anything if I drive the car hard.

The car was strong to begine with and i regret not baselining it - now if the car was ~ 195+/225+ stock [assumption], how the hell could i only pick up a few hp with the downpipe and stg2 map? Boost issue? -
AFR= 11.0 and hit 13.0 at peak power

Last edited by Dutchman; 11-02-2008 at 09:09 PM. Reason: more info
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Old 11-02-2008, 10:21 PM   #25
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Quote:
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Just to clarify - shop where i got this done has seen OTS cobb stg2 wrx's hit 230/250+. Either way I was at the 197/250 - so are we ruling out the idea of heat soak causing the ecu to pull timing and bring my hp #'s down on the 2 pulls? At this point, I may just take the car to another tuner that can protune the car and diagnose any and all issues - hopefully I dont grenade anything if I drive the car hard.

The car was strong to begine with and i regret not baselining it - now if the car was ~ 195+/225+ stock [assumption], how the hell could i only pick up a few hp with the downpipe and stg2 map? Boost issue? -
AFR= 11.0 and hit 13.0 at peak power
Has the shop shown you any reputable proof of these numbers? Graphs? Didn't you get a graph?

Let's say that you dynoed on Kito's Mustang dyno, like I did, and got 177hp/200tq. Then 195/250 after tuning would be almost exactly in line with Cobb's Stage 2 maps.

Don't "hope" you don't grenade your engine." If there is any doubt in your mind, is it worth several thousand dollars out of your pocket?

If you're going to retune for more hp, you might as well find a cheap VF39 and put it on in the process, as all your supporting mods are in place. I guarantee you'll feel a difference then. Doesn't seem like Stage 2 does much for you.
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