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Old 12-13-2013, 01:49 AM   #1
vicious_fishes
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Default customers boosted GC - can't work out vac line routing. now with extra facepalm!

alright so i'm working on a customers turbocharged gc8. first one i've ever worked on and it's been absolutely raped by its previous owner. the stuff they did to it just beggars belief in its stupidity (e.g installing an aftermarket fpr and LEAVING THE STOCK ONE IN. so the aftermarket one is regulating the fuel pressure...of the return line)

anyways, it has an hks boost controller plumbed in with what appears to be the stock stuff still installed too O_o

and i foolishly didn't take a picture of all the routings before i unplugged them (and that's assuming they had things routed correctly, which they probably didn't).

here's a picture of what i'm left with:



anyone help me out with what should be going where?

Last edited by vicious_fishes; 02-10-2014 at 03:57 AM.
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Old 12-16-2013, 10:29 AM   #2
fastblueufo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vicious_fishes View Post
alright so i'm working on a customers turbocharged gc8. first one i've ever worked on and it's been absolutely raped by its previous owner. the stuff they did to it just beggars belief in its stupidity (e.g installing an aftermarket fpr and LEAVING THE STOCK ONE IN. so the aftermarket one is regulating the fuel pressure...of the return line)

anyways, it has an hks boost controller plumbed in with what appears to be the stock stuff still installed too O_o

and i foolishly didn't take a picture of all the routings before i unplugged them (and that's assuming they had things routed correctly, which they probably didn't).

here's a picture of what i'm left with:



anyone help me out with what should be going where?
Best advise is to yank out all the vac lines and redo them correctly. Not the way the previous routing was done.
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Old 12-16-2013, 04:55 PM   #3
bluemax189
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Originally Posted by fastblueufo View Post
Best advise is to yank out all the vac lines and redo them correctly. Not the way the previous routing was done.
^this. If its a customers car do it the right way and reroute from scratch.
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Old 12-19-2013, 11:33 AM   #4
mikeydrives1
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Grab a service manual and start from square 1. Thats a headache and a half right there.
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Old 12-20-2013, 08:27 AM   #5
vicious_fishes
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so you know how i said it was raped?

well i reconnected everything in the car (finally found a schematic from the service manual) after finding many things just... not.

and all of a sudden, it has a 30 second turbo timer?!

flick the key off and 30 seconds later the engine shuts down and the owner's all "gee it didn't do that before". YOU THINK?


1500 word report i wrote up on how f**ked up this car is. 1500.
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Old 12-20-2013, 08:29 AM   #6
mikeydrives1
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Wow, im sorry you had to take on this burden. Where was the timer hidden lol?
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Old 12-20-2013, 12:25 PM   #7
vicious_fishes
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oh maaate...

The original job:
Change head gasket (nothing else). Diagnosed by another person, I was simply asked to do the job.
Customer arrived with car & gasket, asked me to take a look at the drivers side door as well. Upon actually driving the car, many other problems became immediately apparent, not least of all the brakes working at about 1/3rd capacity.

New engine installed by previous owner approximately 50,000km ago (how does a car do a head gasket in 50,000km?). I was not informed of this until said engine was removed.
Receipt provided for new engine, customer informed me of a relatively recent oil change

the bloody kid also got a quote of another guy who runs his own shop (a friend of mine), came to me simply asking if i could do it for less than $1000 (which was obviously the quote he got off this buddy of mine, not that he told me this at the time) and i said yes. once i get the donk out he then starts TEXT MESSAGING THE OTHER GUY HE GOT THE ORIGINAL QUOTE FROM BUT DIDN'T GET TO DO THE WORK what i was doing and had found on the car etc. dear god i nearly f**king killed him. you can imagine EXACTLY how that looked to the first guy/friend of mine

cue me frantically on the phone to him once i found out what this f**king kid was doing, trying to explain the situation etc... thank god he's a good dude and understood entirely. his words were "ohh dude i know the kid, i know the car, say no more."

What happened then:
Upon pulling the engine and taking a decent look at the car, a significant number of major problems/faults were noticed. They were:

large (huge) front mount intercooler mounted, but not connected. stock turbo still on the car. i just... i don't even?
Aftermarket fuel pressure regulator mounted, but the factory piece remaining mounted. So the AFPR is regulating the pressure of the RETURN line, not the fuel rails.
more fins on top mount intercooler bent over flat than remain straight, resulting in virtually no airflow at all
HKS boost controller/turbo timer installed – unknown boost levels
Aftermarket 3 inch exhaust installed allowing free-er flow of the turbo turbine, but blocking the flow of the wastegate. This results in what I suspect is a perpetual state of enormous boost creep and probably what blew the first engine in such a short period of time.
No plastic under tray, combined with FMIC and A/C condenser means very very poor flow through the radiator.
No fender liners, meaning all dirt/dust/mud/rocks/water is being thrown up into the wires/fusebox/etc of the car every time it is driven. I couldn’t quite work out the reason for this until I saw the super low springs and massive +15 19 inch wheels installed with crappy chinese stretched tyres, when it became obvious that they’d been removed in order to run those wheels on the car.
Shift knob so loose I’m surprised it’s still attached/could be lifted off the shifter bare handed
First third of the clutch pedal throw completely unresponsive
Very little brake pads left, along with unknown mileage fluid – which is why the brakes hardly work (50% responsive at an overestimate) even without towing anything
Gearbox oil below minimum and unknown mileage, suspect 75,000km+
Unknown mileage on clutch fluid (as above)
Worn timing belt, in need of replacement (couldn't even find the marks to line up on the cam gears)
Significant number of bolts rusted/burred/seized/etc (probably about 20). I went through four drill bits drilling bolts/holes/etc out in order to remove pieces
Lack of magnetic drain oil plug
Engine oil low
Window motors very weak
Drivers side door out of alignment
Battery tiedown seized (just one of the many aforementioned bolts)
Battery wire connections (on wiring harness) worn/rusted to the point where I can’t get a pinch on the terminals. at all.
Oxygen sensor disconnected completely
turbo oil feed line cracked
intake manifold gaskets a mess
unknown routing of vacuum lines (as pictured)
there's other stuff i've missed but i can't think of it now.
edit: cam seals leaking, cam cover gaskets leaking, massive subwoofer installed with the 4gauge amp wire fuse SCREWED INTO THE WASHER FLUID BOTTLE

and this kid had been towing his 500kg of jet ski/trailer around with this car.

he took it to three different shops/car guys before me (good ones), one of which was the one that was paid to install all this BS on the car (even after advising the customer not to do it) all of which who told him not to touch it with a barge pole... and he still bought it. after i told him that his head gaskets looked mint/exactly like they should after only 50,000km he asked me to keep and give them to him...

so he could sell them.

Last edited by vicious_fishes; 12-26-2013 at 03:08 PM.
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Old 12-20-2013, 01:59 PM   #8
ProfessWRX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vicious_fishes View Post
oh maaate...

The original job:
Change head gasket (nothing else). Diagnosed by another person, I was simply asked to do the job.
Customer arrived with car & gasket, asked me to take a look at the drivers side door as well. Upon actually driving the car, many other problems became immediately apparent, not least of all the brakes working at about 1/3rd capacity.

New engine installed by previous owner approximately 50,000km ago (how does a car do a head gasket in 50,000km?). I was not informed of this until said engine was removed.
Receipt provided for new engine, customer informed me of a relatively recent oil change

the bloody kid also got a quote of another guy who runs his own shop (a friend of mine), came to me simply asking if i could do it for less than $1000 (which was obviously the quote he got off this buddy of mine, not that he told me this at the time) and i said yes. once i get the donk out he then starts TEXT MESSAGING THE OTHER GUY HE GOT THE ORIGINAL QUOTE FROM BUT DIDN'T GET TO DO THE WORK what i was doing and had found on the car etc. dear god i nearly f**king killed him. you can imagine EXACTLY how that looked to the first guy/friend of mine

cue me frantically on the phone to him once i found out what this f**king kid was doing, trying to explain the situation etc... thank god he's a good dude and understood entirely. his words were "ohh dude i know the kid, i know the car, say no more."

What happened then:
Upon pulling the engine and taking a decent look at the car, a significant number of major problems/faults were noticed. They were:

large (huge) front mount intercooler mounted, but not connected. stock turbo still on the car. i just... i don't even?
Aftermarket fuel pressure regulator mounted, but the factory piece remaining mounted. So the AFPR is regulating the pressure of the RETURN line, not the fuel rails.
more fins on top mount intercooler bent over flat than remain straight, resulting in virtually no airflow at all
HKS boost controller/turbo timer installed – unknown boost levels
Aftermarket 3 inch exhaust installed allowing free-er flow of the turbo turbine, but blocking the flow of the wastegate. This results in what I suspect is a perpetual state of enormous boost creep and probably what blew the first engine in such a short period of time.
No plastic under tray, combined with FMIC and A/C condenser means very very poor flow through the radiator.
No fender liners, meaning all dirt/dust/mud/rocks/water is being thrown up into the wires/fusebox/etc of the car every time it is driven. I couldn’t quite work out the reason for this until I saw the super low springs and massive +15 19 inch wheels installed with crappy chinese stretched tyres, when it became obvious that they’d been removed in order to run those wheels on the car.
Shift knob so loose I’m surprised it’s still attached/could be lifted off the shifter bare handed
First third of the clutch pedal throw completely unresponsive
Very little brake pads left, along with unknown mileage fluid – which is why the brakes hardly work (50% responsive at an overestimate) even without towing anything
Gearbox oil below minimum and unknown mileage, suspect 75,000km+
Unknown mileage on clutch fluid (as above)
Worn timing belt, in need of replacement (couldn't even find the marks to line up on the cam gears)
Significant number of bolts rusted/burred/seized/etc (probably about 20). I went through four drill bits drilling bolts/holes/etc out in order to remove pieces
Lack of magnetic drain oil plug
Engine oil low
Window motors very weak
Drivers side door out of alignment
Battery tiedown seized (just one of the many aforementioned bolts)
Battery wire connections (on wiring harness) worn/rusted to the point where I can’t get a pinch on the terminals. at all.
Oxygen sensor disconnected completely
turbo oil feed line cracked
intake manifold gaskets a mess
unknown routing of vacuum lines (as pictured)
there's other stuff i've missed but i can't think of it now.

and this kid had been towing his 500kg of jet ski/trailer around with this car.

he took it to three different shops/car guys before me (good ones), one of which was the one that was paid to install all this BS on the car (even after advising the customer not to do it) all of which who told him not to touch it with a barge pole... and he still bought it. after i told him that his head gaskets looked mint/exactly like they should after only 50,000km he asked me to keep and give them to him...

so he could sell them.
Jesus Harold Christ
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Old 12-21-2013, 07:08 AM   #9
Cathexis
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Show me the carfax.....

For someones sake in the future I hope somethings on there....
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Old 12-21-2013, 10:28 AM   #10
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ehh i'm down in aussieland guys. the kid only had so much cash and so i did as much work as i was willing to for the money he had. the kid was also determined to get it home so drove it home with the oil leaking down onto the exhaust manifold. i advised him to keep it here as my shed/workshop is on acreage... nope. he'd rather risk the exhaust manifold reaching the (that had a leak from the cam seal that was dripping onto it) oil's flashpoint and starting a fire in the engine bay

i was expecting to have a knockdown argument when his old man dropped him down to pick the car up but turns out his old man had told him not to buy it/had called the previous owner telling them the deal was off after getting the other guys reports on the car and then had a knock down argument with the kid about how this one was not better (despite 3 other guys/shops telling them it was a rolling deathtrap) because it had a BOV and an exhaust and rims and huge sti chinese knockoff wing and so on... and then the kid without his knowledge went behind his back with the cash and bought it anyway

Last edited by vicious_fishes; 12-21-2013 at 10:35 AM.
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Old 12-23-2013, 02:15 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vicious_fishes View Post
ehh i'm down in aussieland guys. the kid only had so much cash and so i did as much work as i was willing to for the money he had. the kid was also determined to get it home so drove it home with the oil leaking down onto the exhaust manifold. i advised him to keep it here as my shed/workshop is on acreage... nope. he'd rather risk the exhaust manifold reaching the (that had a leak from the cam seal that was dripping onto it) oil's flashpoint and starting a fire in the engine bay

i was expecting to have a knockdown argument when his old man dropped him down to pick the car up but turns out his old man had told him not to buy it/had called the previous owner telling them the deal was off after getting the other guys reports on the car and then had a knock down argument with the kid about how this one was not better (despite 3 other guys/shops telling them it was a rolling deathtrap) because it had a BOV and an exhaust and rims and huge sti chinese knockoff wing and so on... and then the kid without his knowledge went behind his back with the cash and bought it anyway
If that was my kid I would've beat the crap out of him, broke his leg then make him walk to your shop. lol, I remember being that stupid as a kid, ignoring all else cause you think the cool stuff is more important.
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Old 12-23-2013, 11:00 AM   #12
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Damn. Just damn.
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Old 12-24-2013, 03:24 AM   #13
vicious_fishes
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i don't

then again he's a special kind of moron. in every way. just a total deadbeat f**king spastic. and then you see his girlfriend who has her head screwed on properly and is studying for her future, was in one of my classes at uni, most gorgeous looking girl etc etc... and this dude was (he just lost this job) working part time washing cars at budget rental cars. i truly cannot explain it.
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Old 12-26-2013, 11:32 AM   #14
mikeydrives1
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Mother of god....
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Old 12-26-2013, 12:39 PM   #15
vicious_fishes
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when/if he eventually saves up enough cash to actually get it fixed i'll fill in the remaining chapters of the story for you guys

what's a bet i can't get him to spend the $50 hiring a trailer to tow it down to me and he drives it back down instead? he even had the audacity to start blaming me for everything being wrong. he got ****ty that he'd spent all his money fixing a headgasket that didn't even need doing, what was i supposed to say to him? i didn't diagnose it, he asked me to do the headgasket and so i did exactly what he wanted. not my fault that 500 other things were wrong with the car

i estimated another $2000 needs to be spent, we'll see how he goes.
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Old 12-26-2013, 02:01 PM   #16
mikeydrives1
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I give you allot of credit. If i came across something like this, i may just have a brain aneurysm and die right there on the spot from the headache. Thats a mountain-load of work.
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Old 12-26-2013, 02:13 PM   #17
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Wow... just wow.

If a car such as that had come into the dealership I work at, we would have just turned it away. There is a point of no return on some vehicles, and I think that one has made it to that point.
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Old 12-26-2013, 03:06 PM   #18
vicious_fishes
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Wow... just wow.

If a car such as that had come into the dealership I work at, we would have just turned it away. There is a point of no return on some vehicles, and I think that one has made it to that point.
hahahahaha well guess what? the dealership already had.

i personally couldn't care less, the more stuff wrong with it the more work i get (once he saves up enough). the car has enough rep around town to already be known as a total sheetbox before i even touched it so there's none of this "f**ked cars just keep coincidentally coming out of that guys place" to be had (or whatever equivalent).

it was pretty hilarious seeing the smug look on his old mans face when he dropped him down to pick it up though. i did actually manage to sort out the vac line routing! but i've never seen such a "told you so" moment in all my life.

we had a good 'ol chat (old dude was piiiiiiiissed off) once the kid left. i told him my professional opinion was to take out some insurance and then 24 hours later burn the thing to the ground

Last edited by vicious_fishes; 12-26-2013 at 03:19 PM.
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Old 01-09-2014, 04:27 AM   #19
vicious_fishes
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so after a lengthy conversation about how "the car revs high when i start it up" and me explaining that that's the automatic choke system/what it does when it's cold...


our latest conversation as he's just saved up enough money to maybe get it sellable (i.e me "fix" it):

"hey man for some reason now i can't even start it up. like the lights come on but it just won't go"

after a bit of me asking him whether it cranks over or not etc etc...


turns out he didn't have any fuel in it.

Last edited by vicious_fishes; 01-09-2014 at 04:41 AM.
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Old 01-09-2014, 08:39 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vicious_fishes View Post
so after a lengthy conversation about how "the car revs high when i start it up" and me explaining that that's the automatic choke system/what it does when it's cold...


our latest conversation as he's just saved up enough money to maybe get it sellable (i.e me "fix" it):

"hey man for some reason now i can't even start it up. like the lights come on but it just won't go"

after a bit of me asking him whether it cranks over or not etc etc...


turns out he didn't have any fuel in it.
OMG! I feel for you bro. This guy should never own another automobile again, tell him to sell car and buy a bike. Lol
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Old 01-15-2014, 01:59 AM   #21
vicious_fishes
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vicious_fishes View Post
so after a lengthy conversation about how "the car revs high when i start it up" and me explaining that that's the automatic choke system/what it does when it's cold...


our latest conversation as he's just saved up enough money to maybe get it sellable (i.e me "fix" it):

"hey man for some reason now i can't even start it up. like the lights come on but it just won't go"

after a bit of me asking him whether it cranks over or not etc etc...


turns out he didn't have any fuel in it.
sorry guys, i take all this back. he was actually trying to tell me that the car wouldn't crank over.

and it wouldn't crank over because... the battery was dead.


so yes, this kid thought lack of fuel in the tank would stop it cranking over if he turned the key. sigh.
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Old 02-10-2014, 03:54 AM   #22
vicious_fishes
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well folks, it's back!

it came in with a suspected leaking cam seal.

remember how i told you about all the various bolts being 15 years old/rusted beyond belief/shearing off left right & centre?

well... one (then i find out it's two) of the cam seal bolts sheared off. INSIDE the cylinder head. couldn't have just been the bolt head that comes off, nooo... it shears off about halfway down the thread inside the head. and this didn't happen while i was doing them up (though you'd expect the thread to just strip instead of the bolt snapping clean in half, right?), it happened while i was undoing it so i dunno if the previous shop that replaced the engine just used a gallon of loctite on it or something but... anyways.

GREAT


what wasn't nice was how uncooperative the bolts were. one happened whilst i had the engine out and on the stand doing the head gasket, which made things nice and easily accessible... but it still wasn't coming out. i even drilled into those suckers with an easy-out and couldn't get it to budge. they were NOT moving. eventually i snapped and just drilled the bastard out and replaced it with a bolt-and-nut type affair as pictured.

then the other one shears off whilst the engine is IN THE CAR.


chatting away to the kid, what do you want me to do etc etc, i can pull the engine AGAIN (for $$$) or i can drill the ****er out whilst it's on the car because in perhaps the only stroke of luck possible here, the drill lines up with the back of the head nicely. he has $0 more to spend so tells me to try the unreliable drill-it-out-on-the-car method.

alright, done.



cam gears back on, belt back on, fire it up... no leak! it's worked! praise the f**king lord!


i then put the covers, radiator, belts etc etc all back together, refill the coolant all that jazz... and the bloody thing starts leaking again. you have got to be kidding me.



SO chatting away to the kid so far as i can tell we've got two options: i pull the gear off again along with the piece that holds the seal in (can't think what it's called) and nail it with some kind of liquid sealant, let it dry and cross our fingers... or pull the engine and replace the head.

question: any other suggestions and/or do you think i'm wasting my time trying to seal it up with gasket sealant or whatever and it's not even worth trying?

i found more stuff wrong with the car i hadn't noticed before in my huge list either
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Old 01-09-2014, 08:09 AM   #23
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Thats funny. You have my sympathy.
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Old 01-09-2014, 11:10 AM   #24
mikeydrives1
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You cant fix stupid. WAlk away from this forester fire.
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Old 01-09-2014, 11:20 AM   #25
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You cant fix stupid. WAlk away from this forester fire.
yes but money
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