Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Monday December 22, 2014
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC Technical > Built Motor Discussion

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 08-13-2007, 04:36 PM   #1
silversurfer307
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 151722
Join Date: Jun 2007
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Vehicle:
2005 sti
cgm

Default is the money worth 500+hp

ok well first off my hp goal in my sti is 500hp at the moment so im trying to price the engine build.i got a quote from Axis power racing and for a stage 5 shortblock it was $5850 dollars.This includesStage 5 Components:
- 2.5L USDM STi Semi-Closed Deck Case
- Axis Racing/Darton Ductile Iron Sleeves
- Custom Axis Racing Forged Crankshaft
- Polished & Balanced to 10,000 RPMS
- Axis Racing/ CP forged Pistons With Swain Tech Coatings

- Pauter 4340 Chrome-Moly Forged Rods
- Larger ARP head studs

- Cometic Head Gaskets
- 2.5 liter Final Displacement

- MAX 9000 RPM Rev Limit
The heads will include this pricing
Porting-$1500
AVCS camshafts-$1000
Dual spring valvetrain kit-$1500- This also comes with +1mm oversize valves now
so are these good prices i dont know its the first place i tried just trying to get a good idea.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
silversurfer307 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2007, 06:10 PM   #2
WebMasterP
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 121062
Join Date: Jul 2006
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Seattle, WA
Vehicle:
2006 STi [STU Trim]
World Rally Blue

Default

You probably don't need all that to make 500whp safely on an STI block.

Hell, you could probably get away with new forged pistons installed by an engine builder and have it run a long while with a good tune and a GT35.

Well, on race gas.
WebMasterP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2007, 06:24 PM   #3
Infamous1
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 133692
Join Date: Nov 2006
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: In So Cal tuning YOU!!! ;)
Vehicle:
2003 Chevy Z06
Black/Black

Default

^^^
Or pump+meth.
Infamous1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2007, 06:24 PM   #4
jays05
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 78165
Join Date: Dec 2004
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: SC
Vehicle:
05 STI 35r + e85

Default

I agree. Overkill for 500whp... 600whp on the other hand...
jays05 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2007, 07:31 PM   #5
silversurfer307
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 151722
Join Date: Jun 2007
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Vehicle:
2005 sti
cgm

Default

so what should i get to safely run 500hp daily
silversurfer307 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2007, 07:57 PM   #6
WebMasterP
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 121062
Join Date: Jul 2006
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Seattle, WA
Vehicle:
2006 STi [STU Trim]
World Rally Blue

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by silversurfer307 View Post
so what should i get to safely run 500hp daily
Do what Infamous1 said, run on 50/50 water/meth injection. People do that on daily drivers. I think a lot of people have reported having to fill the meth/water every 2 fill ups or something like that. It's not expensive either.
WebMasterP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2007, 08:05 PM   #7
illini_wrx
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 155844
Join Date: Aug 2007
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Arctic Circle
Default

You just have to be careful with water+meth never to run out and forget to refill it. Also, there are threads discussing how injecting too much water may have caused cylinder wash and oil starvation.

The most intriguing thing about a motor like that to me is the redline... match it up with a huge turbo and you'll not only be making 500whp, but you'll be doing it in a 4000rpm-wide usable range... that my friend, is ! So I say, go for it!

Also, have you considered what other mods you have to make to have reliable 500whp?? (i.e. transmission and driveline...)
illini_wrx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2007, 08:52 PM   #8
Drink
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 102682
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Woodberry, IN
Vehicle:
... ripper's
sister.

Default

What's your definition of reliable? 500 whp is a VERY grey area.
Drink is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2007, 09:12 PM   #9
PaulRex
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 12454
Join Date: Nov 2001
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Vermont
Vehicle:
10 Toyota Taco
K8 SV650SF

Default

Shouldnt a goal be to run a certain time at the dragstrip, or maybe beat up on corvettes on the roadcourse etc. But when people say their goal is xxxx amount of horsepower i dont get it??

OTOH that motor build up there is definatly overkill for 500whp, but it sound like a hell of a block. reliablity is kind of subjective is right.. but once your in that deep with your cars build your going to end up paying whatever it costs to keep it running anyway.
PaulRex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2007, 10:02 PM   #10
MJU1983
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 14364
Join Date: Jan 2002
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Saint Louis, MO
Vehicle:
2003 WRX, '06 Armada
05 Vette & 05 STi (sold)

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by silversurfer307 View Post
so what should i get to safely run 500hp daily
A new z06? Maybe a new M5 or M6?
MJU1983 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2007, 10:07 PM   #11
silversurfer307
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 151722
Join Date: Jun 2007
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Vehicle:
2005 sti
cgm

Default

ok well ill just say my goal is to be able to beat a new dodge viper and there is this twin turbo corvette where i live that i would love to beat.i realize i need other parts besides the motor.soo what would any of you recommened to be this fast.
silversurfer307 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2007, 10:58 PM   #12
PaulRex
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 12454
Join Date: Nov 2001
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Vermont
Vehicle:
10 Toyota Taco
K8 SV650SF

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by silversurfer307 View Post
ok well ill just say my goal is to be able to beat a new dodge viper and there is this twin turbo corvette where i live that i would love to beat.i realize i need other parts besides the motor.soo what would any of you recommened to be this fast.
there we go.. well beating a viper is doable but they can easily be brought unto the low 11s and 10s with mods.. and a twin turbo corvette.. damn i dunno. I had a friend with a supercharged corvette C5 with some minor motor work to handle the boost and it was insane. trap 130+ easily.. i wouldnt think a twin turbo vet is too far off from that

That motor build you posted sound like a good idea when you compare it to those kinds of cars

In the end spending money and time just to give it to some guy on the block sounds unrewarding to me but what do i know..
PaulRex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2007, 11:59 PM   #13
MJU1983
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 14364
Join Date: Jan 2002
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Saint Louis, MO
Vehicle:
2003 WRX, '06 Armada
05 Vette & 05 STi (sold)

Default

A lot of people tend to want to cut corners but fail to realize what they are asking the engine to do.

You want street driven reliability, daily driven, and 500hp out of 2.5 liters.

This is going to cost you, and cost you dearly I am afraid. If you step back and look at what you are asking, it certainly won't be "easy" or CHEAP to do by any means.

If you take the price of a brand new STi + the price of the modifications necessary to obtain these power levels safely, you might as well have bought the Dodge Viper that you are building a Subaru to beat.

Just my 2 cents.

-Mike
MJU1983 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2007, 12:01 AM   #14
MJU1983
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 14364
Join Date: Jan 2002
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Saint Louis, MO
Vehicle:
2003 WRX, '06 Armada
05 Vette & 05 STi (sold)

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulRex View Post
I had a friend with a supercharged corvette C5 with some minor motor work to handle the boost and it was insane. trap 130+ easily.. i wouldnt think a twin turbo vet is too far off from that
Long tubes (full exhaust), cam (g5x3 or eqv) + valvetrain, nitrous, drag radials....130-140 traps all day long.
MJU1983 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2007, 12:08 AM   #15
STimo
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 110273
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: OC, California
Vehicle:
450 whp 30R STI
11.3@123, 10's a commin'

Default

I can beat a new viper on pump gas with my 30R, so it's defiantely doable.. From a stop no problem, from a roll i'm usually ahead by around 1.5 cars, give or take a bit.. New z06 i can take too from a stop, from a roll it's pretty even, but the zo6 will usually pull by a half car or so once we are at 90+mph.. I've been running this setup on my stock motor for ~15K miles and not a problem so far (knock on wood).. If your goal is to just beat a stock viper that can easily be done with a 30R/35R setup.. If you wanna destroy one just add meth/race gas tune.. If i were you i';d run it on the stock block till it lets go, it's free mileage and it can last for a long time if you have a good tune.. a twin turbo vette on the other hand, isnt gonna happen.. Those things can make 1000whp all day..

EDIT: I only raced that viper twice and i forgot to mention that it was the convertible so im sure a hard top would be closer.

Last edited by STimo; 08-14-2007 at 10:37 PM.
STimo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2007, 12:16 AM   #16
Drink
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 102682
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Woodberry, IN
Vehicle:
... ripper's
sister.

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MJU1983 View Post
A lot of people tend to want to cut corners but fail to realize what they are asking the engine to do.

You want street driven reliability, daily driven, and 500hp out of 2.5 liters.

This is going to cost you, and cost you dearly I am afraid. If you step back and look at what you are asking, it certainly won't be "easy" or CHEAP to do by any means.

If you take the price of a brand new STi + the price of the modifications necessary to obtain these power levels safely, you might as well have bought the Dodge Viper that you are building a Subaru to beat.

Just my 2 cents.

-Mike

+12345

You are pushing serious power with little displacement. Even the best built motor will eventually fail.

If you are looking for a reliable, 10 second, straight-line car you might want to consider alternatives.
Drink is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2007, 12:22 AM   #17
burnin4
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 59764
Join Date: Apr 2004
Chapter/Region: South East
Vehicle:
10 sec STi
10 sec Z06

Default

stock motor+UR gt35r kit+meth/pump or c16 = 500whp.

you cant go wrong with an axis motor, but you'd really be surprised what the stocker can handle.
burnin4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2007, 12:34 AM   #18
MJU1983
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 14364
Join Date: Jan 2002
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Saint Louis, MO
Vehicle:
2003 WRX, '06 Armada
05 Vette & 05 STi (sold)

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by STimo View Post
I can beat a new viper on pump gas with my 30R, so it's defiantely doable.. From a stop no problem, from a roll i'm usually ahead by around 1.5 cars, give or take a bit.. New z06 i can take too from a stop, from a roll it's pretty even, but the zo6 will usually pull by a half car or so once we are at 90+mph.. I've been running this setup on my stock motor for ~15K miles and not a problem so far (knock on wood).. If your goal is to just beat a stock viper that can easily be done with a 30R/35R setup.. If you wanna destroy one just add meth/race gas tune.. If i were you i';d run it on the stock block till it lets go, it's free mileage and it can last for a long time if you have a good tune.. a twin turbo vette on the other hand, isnt gonna happen.. Those things can make 1000whp all day..
Beat it how? I dunno if I buy it man. How much HP/ Torque are you putting down with pump gas and a GT30? I mean the STi weighs damn near what the Vette & Viper do, and you have to consider all the power under the curve they are making. The gear ratios alone in the z06 (and viper) will leave you looking for 5th (in the 1/4 mile) while he is most likely only in 3rd. Also, unless they REALLY can't drive, their traps should be 125 or higher in the 1/4 mile and they will keep screaming all the way to top speed! lol
MJU1983 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2007, 01:04 AM   #19
burnin4
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 59764
Join Date: Apr 2004
Chapter/Region: South East
Vehicle:
10 sec STi
10 sec Z06

Default

fwiw, I murdered a gts viper from a roll. it would have been ugly from a dig. i was making 500whp on 93+meth, ur 35r kit, stock motor. I also have a good friend with the same setup, he pulled 2-3 cars on a c6 z06 from a roll (50-140mph), running c16 (550whp on topspeeds dynojet). the c6 z06 might have eventually caught him, they ran 3 times with the same results.
burnin4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2007, 01:13 AM   #20
dan avoN7
Top Scoob 002
 
Member#: 32771
Join Date: Feb 2003
Chapter/Region: BAIC
Location: Danville, CA
Vehicle:
03 Black WRX
04 White M3

Default

beating a new srt10 viper on pump gas is hard to believe, race gas for sure. My old gt3040r turbo @ 28psi on a sti 2.0 block pulled on a stock srt10 viper and back then i was making 387whp (very low reading dyno) My new Axis built 2.5 with a 35r on 110octane will destroy a stock viper from a roll. Car is now making 484whp on a same reading dyno, a stock srt10 viper puts down 380whp on this same dyno not too long ago
dan avoN7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2007, 05:03 AM   #21
jbones
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 149667
Join Date: May 2007
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: cali-L-A-
Vehicle:
2006 wrx
goal-build a 500+whp =)

Default

i say do it, im waiting to save my money up. to do my build. But ya i rather spend money into my subaru. But ya you going to need fatty turbo,fmic,injectors,exhaust,i would say ppg gears =) new clutch, some type of computer. alot of **** to safely do that. But i say its worth it
jbones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2007, 10:13 AM   #22
Homemade WRX
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 33782
Join Date: Mar 2003
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: 3MI Racing LLC
Vehicle:
96 bastard child
search FIRST, then PM!!!

Default

a piston/rod sti will make that power...sleeving is overkill until you decided you want more

what are you looking to do with the car? track days, auto-x or drag?
and I'm know you want to keep it a street car.
Homemade WRX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2007, 04:15 PM   #23
Devan M
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 83435
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Team Crawford Performance
Default

I heard that Cowsworth stoped selling sleeved blocks, anybody else heard this?
Devan M is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2007, 04:24 PM   #24
flycaster
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 60142
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Bend, OR
Vehicle:
2011 WRX
Grey

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Devan M View Post
...Cowsworth...
Was that intentional?
flycaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2007, 04:29 PM   #25
jays05
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 78165
Join Date: Dec 2004
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: SC
Vehicle:
05 STI 35r + e85

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Devan M View Post
I heard that Cowsworth stoped selling sleeved blocks, anybody else heard this?
I also read this. But why?
jays05 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Is the GT worth more than the L? ShaneW Legacy Forum 26 04-12-2011 11:54 PM
Alpine 9856 vs 9857, is the 9857 worth the extra $$$ mtbwagon Car Audio, Video & Security 34 01-08-2007 12:59 PM
is the juice worth the squeeze? The Tree Off-Topic 24 01-13-2006 04:13 AM
Is The Sti Worth The Extra 14,000 kevin2.5rs Factory 2.5L Turbo Powertrain (EJ Series Factory 2.5L Turbo) 33 08-24-2004 11:28 AM
Anyone notice the guy Happy - 500+HP Vigorous Texas Impreza Club Forum -- TXIC 10 11-26-2001 07:59 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:40 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2014 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2014, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.