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Old 08-23-2007, 06:40 AM   #1
bloopsta26
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Default Looking for 600+awhp!

OKay, so im looking to make 600+awhp....here is what im lookin at price range about 14k....here is my list and id like some guru help/info....

Ultimate racing gt40r kit
Ultimate racing 1250cc injector kit
Brian Crowler 2.7L stroker kit (cams,retainner,springs/valves,rods,crank,pistons,)
Darton sleeves
Twin plate clutch
ported heads/intake manifold
custom intake
custom blow thru maf
tgv deletes
arp head studs
radiator/plugs/timming belt/pulley
rebuilt trans...
maybe a 100shot

This is my list of what im looking at getting, once i sell my setup i should have about 16k$ to spend...i have a few questions if i could get some help/advice...

1. Should i go with duel walbros? as i am using 1 right now. if so how does dual work?
2. Will my invidia g200 exhaust/ perrin fmic work okay?
3. Would flipping and porting my intake manifold help me out?
4. What header should i use?
5. would going to complete stand alone help? like aem/hydra?


I know i might seem like dumb questions. But i want to do this right. This car will not be my dd soo no worries i want to kind of take it to a drag car setup....soo with 16k$ where should i start....please help me out and dont be rude i just need some awesome subie guru advice..thanks guys

Brandon
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Last edited by bloopsta26; 08-23-2007 at 06:47 AM. Reason: info
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Old 08-23-2007, 06:52 AM   #2
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1.) Dual walbros
2.) Any TBE exhaust will do fine but definately get rid of any cats and I suggest installing some sort of cut out after the DP. I dont know the size of a Perrin FMIC but I would say get the biggest that you can
3.) Definately reverse intake manifold and port match it to your TGV's and anything else
4.)Dont know the answer as I like my boxer rumble
5.)I believe going to a stand alone will help with injectors that size. I hear the Hydra is quite nice and that is what the local is running with his insane 40r set up.
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Old 08-23-2007, 07:01 AM   #3
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aight awesome...is there any little things that im going to need that will help....?
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Old 08-23-2007, 07:48 AM   #4
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what else can i do....any other help?
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Old 08-23-2007, 08:27 AM   #5
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the aem ems isn't out at the moment for the DBW cars (ie STi) although that would be the ideal engine management to run if you can find a capable tuner. as far as manifolds full-race is still working on a 40r setup and it will be a while till they're done, i'm assuming you want 600+ on race gas? Even so, you may want bigger injectors, not sure if your gonna run out or not. A tilton carbon-carbon clutch would be the way to go but if not I would run a standard carbon tripple disc like an exedy, spec, etc. Honestly you may be pushing your 16k cap trying to do this, at 600awhp you need to start looking at your axels, and built sti transmissions are far from cheap, at the very least 5k+. As far as fuel pump, you may want to run an external with custom lines at that point, right now I myself am trying to figure out exactly what I'm doing for my 40r setup. Your perrin fmic may actually be big enough, those cores are pretty large, your just going to need to do custom I/C piping. Flipping the manifold will make the car a bit more responsive although there is some skepticism about that, if you don't care to keep the a/c I would see no reason not to, there's just a decent amount of work involved in doing that.

Randy
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Old 08-23-2007, 09:52 AM   #6
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honestly? Truth? I think you will find you are WAY WAY WAY short on cash for this if that is what you have to spend on the whole project.

Last edited by jigga; 08-23-2007 at 10:02 AM.
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Old 08-23-2007, 09:59 AM   #7
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I wonder if a built H6 might be affordable with a $16k budget???
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Old 08-23-2007, 10:04 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jays05 View Post
I wonder if a built H6 might be affordable with a $16k budget???
I think Axis built such a motor not long ago, and mentioned something about it costing 25K to build...
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Old 08-23-2007, 10:11 AM   #9
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Axis Racing Stage 5 short block
Axis Racing P&P heads, oversized valves and cams
Full-Race GT35R twinscroll turbo kit
Ultimate Racing 1000cc or 1600cc fuel rail kit
Buschur Racing dual fuel pump kit
Hydra EMS
Exedy triple plate clutch

That's a short list of the big items you will need. That will easily eat your $16k up.
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Old 08-23-2007, 10:20 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SloRice View Post
Axis Racing Stage 5 short block
Axis Racing P&P heads, oversized valves and cams
Full-Race GT35R twinscroll turbo kit
Ultimate Racing 1000cc or 1600cc fuel rail kit
Buschur Racing dual fuel pump kit
Hydra EMS
Exedy triple plate clutch
I agree exactly what SloRice said. Also if your gonna drag the car, get a PPG Dog Box gearset.
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Old 08-23-2007, 04:07 PM   #11
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thanks guys.

So you guys would go with an axis motor over a stroker kit? and why a gt35r over a gt40r?

Also im not looking to have everything completely done with this money...its a base start to where i wanna be....
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Old 08-23-2007, 05:00 PM   #12
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The only way you are going to be able to make that kind of power is if you rev the motor out to 8k+ RPM. You will not be able to do that with a stroker kit.

The 40R is still somewhat unproven. The 4088 is a turd turbo that is not worth anything for high boost. The 4094 looks great on paper, but I've heard it spools like a 42R with way less power....might was well get the 42R then. The 35R will make 600whp if the appropriate accompanying mods are done.
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Old 08-23-2007, 05:11 PM   #13
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Cosworth Pistons + Rods
Cosworth Heads + Cams
GT37R
1000cc injectors + Fuel Rails
Utec
Exedy Clutch
DR725 FMIC

Check Out Scuba Steves setup. He is capable of 600+ and he runs 10's.
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Old 08-23-2007, 06:16 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SloRice View Post
The only way you are going to be able to make that kind of power is if you rev the motor out to 8k+ RPM. You will not be able to do that with a stroker kit.

The 40R is still somewhat unproven. The 4088 is a turd turbo that is not worth anything for high boost. The 4094 looks great on paper, but I've heard it spools like a 42R with way less power....might was well get the 42R then. The 35R will make 600whp if the appropriate accompanying mods are done.
I wouldn't put down the 40r so quickly, it's still unproven in the subie market but does fairly well elsewhere, and we are just starting to see them used on the ej series engines. Hell, i think there are less than a dozen subies running 40r's on the forums, if not in the country, I remember people were even skeptical of the 35r's a while back.

The OP still hasn't said if he wanted 600awhp on pump gas, race gas, blend, meth, etc , that would make all the difference in what kind of compression ratio he wanted the motor to be along with what turbo he would be using.

Along with Axis, I would look at AR Fabrication, they have good experience building higher reving motors and also like to use higher compression pistions to help give a more responsive motor, especially when looking at turbo's this large. You may even consider destroking the motor to raise your redline.

Also, at the moment I believe Buschur stopped selling his modded fuel pumps so it may be hard finding one of those, may just have to mod a pump yourself.

Someone mentioned an exedy tripple plate, if this car is going to be driven around more than just on the track I would consider a clutch that AR Fabrication worked on with clutch masters, it's a single 6 puck that is supposed to be extremely drivable and also handle a good amount of power.

As far as the H6 motor is concerned, I would see a lot of time/money in wiring that motor up alone, not to mention the actual build, I could easily see why the bill would be in the $25k range.

Randy
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Old 08-23-2007, 08:13 PM   #15
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man o man, I do not envey the road you are desiring to travel....as I have been there, still trying to get there, and I'm absolutely misearable.

I would highly recomend keeping everything simple, and "replace as you go." I would start out with an UR 35r kit, stock block/heads/cams, and run race gas. You will easily make low/mid 500's on a "reliable" setup. The bang for the buck is untouchable, and the diff between 550 and 600 is negligible. Save your money on building a monster setup, stay simple and buy a few drums of c16.

do you have any other specific goals other than 600whp? like qtr mile et's/mph, bragging rights, etc. there might be an easier fight to pick then the dreaded "monster build."

Quote:
Originally Posted by SloRice View Post
Axis Racing Stage 5 short block
Axis Racing P&P heads, oversized valves and cams
Full-Race GT35R twinscroll turbo kit
Ultimate Racing 1000cc or 1600cc fuel rail kit
Buschur Racing dual fuel pump kit
Hydra EMS
Exedy triple plate clutch

That's a short list of the big items you will need. That will easily eat your $16k up.
I have the very same setup, except a UR 35r kit. the exedy triple is a drivetrain killer, quickly led to the demise of my stock axles, cv joints, and syncros. I have been waiting 8 months to turn the key on this project, almost there just waiting for TopSpeed to tune this weekend.

good luck!

Last edited by burnin4; 08-23-2007 at 09:17 PM.
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Old 08-23-2007, 08:54 PM   #16
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dont forget the ppg 16k+5k=no more money haha
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Old 08-23-2007, 09:38 PM   #17
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okay so here are my goals....

1. id like to see 600+ on race gas...
2. make 10's all day...
3. make it some what "reliable" ...but not a dd car

So by keeping it "simple" how would i go about it and not be so tight on money. Im using a perrin gt30r kit right now...but not sure i like it.
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Old 08-23-2007, 10:05 PM   #18
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I dont think you can go wrong with a UR35R kit. you'd really be surprised how much fun that turbo is on the stock block+race gas. It is reasonable to expect 550whp (depending on the dyno) and contain enough potential to run 10's.....that doesnt mean it will happen.

I have personally trapped 101mph+ in the 8th and 129mph in the qtr on a 550whp UR35r setup. you have to make a drastic investment into a setup to see results that are marginally better imo. several new weak links start to rear teh ugly head once you try to go beyond those levels, fueling issues, clutch, axles, driveability, and reliability.

do you want a garage monster that has tons of whoop azz, but only runs 6 months out of the year, or do you want a tamed yet angry creature (stock sti+35r+supporting mods) that has enough umph to walk a stock C6Z06/viper from a roll?

I'm not trying to talk you out of a 16k monster build, they are quit rewarding (hopefully ), but I'd take this project in steps, cause you might decide you are pretty happy without selling the farm.
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Old 08-23-2007, 10:10 PM   #19
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I'd do a 40R on a built motor with a dog box and dss axles all around...fuel system is the fun part.
I'm working on a dual fuel rail set up right now for my own build. It's going hand in hand with a new manifold. I'm also doing triple 255's in tank.
running my primary injectors on a reasonable street sized injector and factory fpr and a single 255...then two of the 255's feed a turbosmart fpr and runs my big injectors...they all collect to one return line to the tank.
Should have no issues with street driving as it is mearly factory fuel system for driving around town...pending where you have your secondary injectors to come on.
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Old 08-23-2007, 10:27 PM   #20
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You may wanna look at what Georgie Performance have been doing and follow that road - running 10's and with a "moderate" amount of modifications. Plus, being an excellent driver at the track certainly helps.
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Old 08-24-2007, 03:41 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by burnin4 View Post
the exedy triple is a drivetrain killer, quickly led to the demise of my stock axles, cv joints, and syncros.
not to mention, the cops just LOVE the sound of it as it chatters away when you roll up beside them at the traffic lights
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Old 08-24-2007, 06:45 AM   #22
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youll be closer to 35k all said and done
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Old 08-24-2007, 08:19 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Homemade WRX View Post
I'd do a 40R on a built motor with a dog box and dss axles all around...fuel system is the fun part.
I'm working on a dual fuel rail set up right now for my own build. It's going hand in hand with a new manifold. I'm also doing triple 255's in tank.
running my primary injectors on a reasonable street sized injector and factory fpr and a single 255...then two of the 255's feed a turbosmart fpr and runs my big injectors...they all collect to one return line to the tank.
Should have no issues with street driving as it is mearly factory fuel system for driving around town...pending where you have your secondary injectors to come on.
not to hi-jack the thread, but I'm curious, what EMS are you using? I was considering the hydra but when talking to Phil, he was not all too anxious about using an aux injector setup, which is one of the reasons i'm waiting on the AEM EMS to be released for the DBW cars.

That being said, for the original poster, I've been told that people have gotten 1600cc injectors to idle, but when running a built motor with a nice cam, it would probably be much more drivable if you could run a fuel system much closer to stock (ie 800cc injectors or smaller) and then have an aux set of 1000cc injectors, or maybe even larger, kick in at some point.
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Old 08-24-2007, 08:35 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saintluciascooby View Post
youll be closer to 35k all said and done
You could get it done for less than $35 but $16 isn't going to cut it.
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Old 08-24-2007, 09:12 AM   #25
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I agree with burnin4. Him and I appear to be on the same road together and it is a road that sucks to travel.

The OP said he already has the Perrin rotated kit. Why not just buy the 35R and bolt it on to the kit. That’s what I did. I was making 390whp with the 30R, bolted the 35R and made 510whp. This is on a low reading dyno. Take my car to a Dynojet and I would have made 550whp+. All I had done to the motor were CP pistons and ARP head studs. The Perrin kit works. Yes, it has some flaws, but it does work.

Drop the 35R on your current setup, tune it and run like that for a while, you make 500whp and go low/mid 11’s on it. If you’re still not happy, then decide what to do.

But you will have to invest money into other issues……drivetrain, fuelling, etc.
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