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Old 07-11-2007, 11:57 AM   #51
ride5000
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sjs0433 View Post
That's what I thought the reason was for the 04+ not liking the manual boost controller but I wasn't too sure.
has anyone used a mbc with an ewg before? Would it actually work as well or not? I'm really curious to read this over and get a fully understanding of how ken's mbc/ebc works b/c right now I'm still a little confused.
So does the vacuum source hit the mbc first or the gm solenoid first?
the pressure hits BOTH first.

they're in parallel.

whichever one allows pressure to flow to the wastegate first is the one "controlling" the boost.
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Old 07-11-2007, 12:09 PM   #52
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ok. I kinda understand that but I'm still a little confused. So if you want to run 20psi you set the manual boost controller for 20psi? and keep the duty cycle of the gm solenoid as high as it will go to basically just keep it open and let the mbc limit the boost to 20psi? and because the mbc is at 20psi it will let anything below that flow through just fine and use the gm solenoid to regulate boost? So I guess with the way you have it setup the gm solenoid does most of the regulating and its only under wot that the mbc really takes affect? This sounds like an awesome idea, I'm just trying to understand how it all works.
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Old 07-11-2007, 12:15 PM   #53
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In my hybrid setup, the boost line with the restrictor pill cracked and was leaking. But because of the hybrid setup the MBC was still able to keep boost in check

But I got lazy and rather than replacing the line I went to full MBC, which PTFB on the automatic works perfect. Much more enjoyable to drive the automatic WRXs this way, now if I could convince my g/f to let me swap in a manual transmission....
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Old 07-11-2007, 12:50 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Master2192 View Post
In my hybrid setup, the boost line with the restrictor pill cracked and was leaking. But because of the hybrid setup the MBC was still able to keep boost in check

But I got lazy and rather than replacing the line I went to full MBC, which PTFB on the automatic works perfect. Much more enjoyable to drive the automatic WRXs this way, now if I could convince my g/f to let me swap in a manual transmission....
Or trade her and the auto for a manual
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Old 07-11-2007, 03:02 PM   #55
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I already have had my car protuned. 04wrx with vf34 running cobb AP. I'm using the factory boost controller with gm solenoid on my car. One thing I'm not overly fond of is boost response. I know with the vf34 it could be faster than what I've got. Its not slow but I'm confident it could be faster. I also know I don't have any leaks anywhere. Could I get a manual boost controller and hook it up just like you've got it and have it work out or am I going to run into problems? I also have an ewg is that makes a difference.
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:32 PM   #56
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So I guess with the way you have it setup the gm solenoid does most of the regulating and its only under wot that the mbc really takes affect?
exactly.

part throttle, solenoid duty is <100%, therefore it allows some pressure signal to traverse through it and reach the actuator where it opens the wastegate and limits boost.

full throttle, solenoid duty is 100%, and can be for all intents and purposes, ignored. the only pressure signal the actuator sees is that which passes through the MBC.

now, can you turn the MBC down so that it's wide open, all the time? sure. you just get actuator spring tension boost levels (aka "wastegate boost").

just think of the MBC as a simple max boost clamp that you can adjust independently of the EBC. it will never allow boost to go above whatever its set at. (of course boost is ALWAYS uncontrollable under actuator spring tension, regardless of method.)
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Old 07-11-2007, 04:49 PM   #57
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Cool. This actually does sound like a good idea. I'd like to give it a shot.
couple questions:
does having an ewg change anything?
also I'm currently protuned with my setup I've got now. using gm solenoid for boost control. Would adding this other one in line screw with that? I'm assuming everything would be straight except for 100% throttle and that would just need to be adjusted so the mbc would be used instead?
I guess it wouldn't hurt to try this setup and then get the car retuned.
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Old 07-11-2007, 05:02 PM   #58
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I'm going to do this today, but I'm going to use enginuity to map it so that above 80% throttle the MBC is in charge. I currently run 21psi with meth on my 20G and will just set my boost targets to 23psi above 80% throttle so that the ecu doesn't think it's overboosting and then I can make quick changes to my WOT boost from 20-23psi. Thanks for the writeup ride!
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Old 09-19-2007, 02:58 PM   #59
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::edit:: Looks like I'm better off not going this route right now.

Last edited by wrxfactor; 09-19-2007 at 03:04 PM.
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Old 09-19-2007, 05:30 PM   #60
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::edit:: Looks like I'm better off not going this route right now.
why?
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Old 09-19-2007, 10:24 PM   #61
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I have an external wastegate with welded flapper and GM BCS, switching to the use of the GM BCS and MBC would require a retune of my WGDC, and I don't own a laptop or Tactrix cable, and my tuner is 8 hours away.
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Old 09-20-2007, 10:10 AM   #62
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Very interesting. I have always been a firm advocate of the MBC but in conjuction with the BCS it does well. Who'd a thunk
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Old 09-20-2007, 01:21 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by wrxfactor View Post
I have an external wastegate with welded flapper and GM BCS, switching to the use of the GM BCS and MBC would require a retune of my WGDC, and I don't own a laptop or Tactrix cable, and my tuner is 8 hours away.
you can always talk to a local tuner around here to help you.....whos your tuner?

i know Junior at ICS will offer to help you tune it yourself. I talked to him before, and Dave @ ESP in Sterling,MA is actually very good with the gm bcs my boost is solid as hell with it, Matt @ DSG although i am not on good terms with he is still part of the developement on the open source software and i would say many people are happy with his tunes!, Mike at TDC can tun open source, and Chris @ XX will do it as well. You have TONS of local options and I am sure if you asked them and told them your situation that you just need to have the WGDC reworked because of the MBC/BCS system your switching to they may charge you for an hour of work or maybe even just have you send them the map and adjust it. Most guys have cables, i know esp does and matt at dsg does....not sure on the others....i have a cable if you need to borrow.....

also another good local NESIC member thats very good with Enginuity/Open ECU stuff is Jeremy, aka Blkscooby. pm him here or go to his personal page he just setup and email him.....

http://home.comcast.net/~tauperformance/index.html

just trying to help out and give you some local options.....i know there a few other local members that may be willing to help....bren wrx and weldinghank i know do a lot of work with open ecu stuff themselves.....
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Old 09-20-2007, 03:43 PM   #64
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Black STI, thanks for all the suggestions. Matt at DSG tuned the car and I'm extremely happy with how it runs, this was just something to contemplate as for some reason, around 8psi, 3rd gear, v7 JDM STi 6-speed, the wastegate is starting to open. Now that I switched from interrupt to using both ports on the wastegate, it isn't opening so early. I let off the go pedal around 12ish psi anyways, but I'm at school near Buffalo, NY, quite the drive from home.

Since I have it doing what I want now anyways, I'll look into it closer and discuss it with Matt after I graduate in December. I'm probably moving away from EWG VF39 to EWG 20G/Green or IWG 20G/Green, not terribly sure yet.

- Chris
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Old 10-22-2007, 01:30 AM   #65
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Just did this on my car and it is sweet. No more out of control spikes during part throttle. Even with the 1820, as the rpms rose about the boost threshold I really had to focus on getting the car to stay smooth by using the throttle, now its just hold at desired throttle position and smooth. May need some more refinement but so far I like it.
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Old 10-25-2007, 02:29 PM   #66
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Quick question. Im using closed loop boost control and I have my 100% column set to all 500s so my Hallman can take over. Would the boost gain affect the spool up or would it not matter?
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Old 10-25-2007, 04:38 PM   #67
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it's not gonna matter, from my experience, although i gave up on CLB a while ago.
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Old 10-25-2007, 06:23 PM   #68
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I've found that the faster i can get my WGDC to 100%, the faster my spool is. that means putting higher numbers in the 2 right columns of th dynamics burst/continuous tables. I LOVE THIS SETUP. my 16g reaches 22psi just shy of 3500RPMs.
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Old 10-25-2007, 08:03 PM   #69
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in the special constants menu of the utec parameters you can set "wastegate closed below MAP" from 0 (off) to 10psig. this will effectively run 100% dc regardless of what the boost map is set to.

unfortunately not available in the oem ecu... maybe someday!
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Old 10-25-2007, 08:19 PM   #70
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This is a good idea. You could even use the OEM solenoid on the 32 bit cars. I might have to try it, set the MBC at 13 PSI and use the OE for the rest. That way all you have to do is replace the line that has the restrictor pill with an MBC.
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Old 10-25-2007, 08:23 PM   #71
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Quote:
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This is a good idea.
Wrong.

It's a great idea.

Been using it for well over a year now, works amazingly well.

ride5k is my hero.
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Old 10-25-2007, 08:36 PM   #72
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Wrong.

It's a great idea.

Been using it for well over a year now, works amazingly well.

ride5k is my hero.
Lol. I loved the response of the MBCs when I put them on cars (I ran one on my first WRX). I just don't like the fact that you have to change your boost when the temp is cold vs warm. In Texas it can go up to 90 in the day and 45-50 at night.
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Old 10-25-2007, 09:55 PM   #73
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Thats another nice thing about the hybrid setup. Let the ECU use the comp tables to reduce the WGDC from 100% at WOT if you want to run less boost when its hot, for example. If the WGDC thru the BCS is less than 100%, you may not get the MBC to come into play.
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Old 10-31-2007, 10:46 AM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blkscooby View Post
Thats another nice thing about the hybrid setup. Let the ECU use the comp tables to reduce the WGDC from 100% at WOT if you want to run less boost when its hot, for example. If the WGDC thru the BCS is less than 100%, you may not get the MBC to come into play.
What?

If the MBC comes before the BCS (in the line where the stock restrictor pill is located), the MBC acts like a replacement WG spring, but better. Set the MBC for like say 14 psi in 70 degree weather and let the factory BCS (or aftermarket) take care of bleeding off the rest. Why would you be running 100% WGDC? You would only have to run like 20% or something like that depending on what PSI you set your MBC to and your boost targets (more WGDC if you have a 16 bit ECU though). You will have to adjust your WGDC compensation table to match your MBC setting. It would take some dialing in in different weather, but once dialed in, it would work great.

EDIT: Oh. my idea is different from Ken's. Ken runs his in parallel. My idea was to just use an MBC to replace the restrictor pill hose, in effect cutting any pressure that the BCS and WG actuator sees until a certain PSI is reached set by the MBC. Basically the MBC is an adjustable restrictor pill, but better the way I would set it up.
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Old 11-06-2007, 05:22 PM   #75
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this might be a stupid question, but I went to the parts store to pick up a couple of T's and some vacuum hose, they didnt have any T's all they had were Y's which looks the same, do they work the same?
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