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Old 09-11-2002, 05:22 PM   #1
subysouth
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Smile Subaru rear brake redux

I thought I would try to consolidate info about Subaru rear disc brakes in one location for reference. This post will only cover rear disc brake system parts available as oem equipment on Subarus, either USDM or abroad. There are excellent rear brake systems available from aftermarket manufacturers including Wilwood, Brembo, etc. I will leave info on those systems to other posts. This info applies to Subaru rear disc set-ups from 1990 to current.


REAR CALIPER ATTACHMENT

All Subaru rear calipers ultimately bolt to a heavy-steel rear backing plate, which in turn is bolted to the rear knuckle. This backing plate has a thin steel dust shield, appropriately sized for the rotor, spot–welded around its perimeter.

1. Subaru single pot rear calipers are sliding type calipers, and utilize a caliper bracket to hold the pads and attach the caliper to the backing plate. This caliper bracket could also be viewed as an adapter, which adapts calipers to different sized rotors and vice versa. The single pot caliper attaches to the caliper bracket and the caliper bracket bolts to the backing plate via 5.75” spaced mounting holes. The single pot rear calipers can further be divided into either “older” or newer” style. The actual phasing from “older” to “newer” style caliper varied by model. For Imprezas and Foresters, this seemed to occur during MY98. For Legacys and OBs, the “newer” style calipers appeared on MY00 cars.


2. Subaru 2pot rear calipers(Sti and Brembo) do not use a separate caliper bracket, they bolt directly to the backing plate. The 2pot calipers bolt to the backing plate via 4.5” spaced mounting holes.


INTERNAL REAR HAND/PARKING BRAKE

All USDM Subarus with rear discs since 1990 have utilized an internal drum rear hand/parking brake of 170mm in diameter. The rear drive assembly used on the AWD versions of these cars is designated as R160.

Some recent, JDM and abroad, WRX-Sti and Impreza models have come equipped with a larger rear drive assembly designated as the R180. I am positive these assemblies have been available since 2001, but may have been available back to 1997. Along with this larger rear assembly, these cars came equipped with vented rotors of either 290 or 316 mm utilizing an internal rear drum hand/parking brake 190mm in diameter.


ROTORS

There were/are three rear rotors that have been installed on USDM Subarus since 1990

1. 266x10mm(170mm) solid rear rotor. Most widely used rear rotor. Found on numerous Subaru models from BC Legacys to current WRXs. This rotor is found equipped with a single pot caliper of either the “newer” or “older” style.

2. 266x18mm(170mm) vented rear rotors found on 1990-94 Legacy Turbos. This rotor is found equipped with a wide single pot caliper of the “older” style. The bolt spacing on the caliper seems to be unique to it.

3. 290x10mm(170mm) solid rear rotor. Found on all 2000+ Legacys equipped with rear discs. This rotor is found equipped with a single pot caliper of the “newer” style.

Other rear rotors used on JDM and abroad Subarus since 1990

1. 290x18mm(170mm) vented rear rotor. Found on 2000+ B4s and GT-Bs, et. al. This is also the vented rotor used with the Sti 2pot caliperon on 170mm hand brake equipped vehiicles.

2. 290x18mm(190mm) vented rear rotor. Found on at least 2001+ WRX-Sti(and maybe as far back as 98.) This rotor came equipped with the 2pot Sti rear caliper and the R180 rear assembly.

3. 316x20mm(190mm) vented rear rotor. Found on 2001+ WRX-Sti Limited, some type RAs, Prodrive, S202, etc. This is the F50 Brembo rear rotor and came equipped with the Brembo 2pot rear caliper and the R180 rear assembly.



UPGRADING THE REAR BRAKES

The first thing to do if you want to upgrade is to determine what you have already. Once you have determined that, you can follow the info below to figure what parts you need to get which upgrade. For my purposes I am considering the 266x10mm/single pot rear brake setup (“older” or “newer” style caliper,) the baseline from which to upgrade. If you have rear drums, do a quick search will get you the info needed to prepare for the rear discs options listed here.

1. Legacy Turbo vented rear brake upgrade. Gains: Moving up to a vented rotor of the same diameter yielding more heat dissipation. You will need to replace calipers, caliper brackets, pads and rotors. This upgrade is covered in great detail with pics on the northursalia.com website by our own and beloved North Ursalia.

2. “H6” upgrade (a misnomer, but nice and short.) Gains: Moving to a larger (290mm) solid rotor yielding moderately better heat dissipation and more angular advantage for the caliper. If you have the “older” style caliper you will need to replace calipers, caliper brackets, pads, and rotors. If you have the “newer” style caliper, you need only replace the caliper brackets and rotors (retaining your calipers and pads.) Regardless of the caliper you’ve got, you will also need to bend or remove the dust shield or replace the entire backing plate (probably not worth the effort.)

3. JDM B4/GT-B Upgrade. Gains: Moving to larger diameter and vented rotor (290x18mm) yielding the cumulative of the gains above. You will need to replace the calipers/caliper brackets/pads(from a 2000+ JDM or abroad B4 or GT-B,) and rotors. You will also need to bend or remove the dust shield or replace the entire backing plate (probably not worth the effort.) This may be a good upgrade for people with the “older” style calipers because they need to replace these parts already to get to either of the upgrades above. The part numbers needed for this upgrade may be found here: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...hreadid=234120

4. Subaru Sti Rear 2pot upgrade. Gains larger and vented rotor(290x18mm) and 2pot opposed piston rear calipers yielding all gains above plus excllent brake feel and uptake, and reduced caliper flex. You will need to replace calipers, pads, backing plates, and rotors(if you want to maintain your US R160 rear assembly.) If you want to go to the R180 rear assembly setup see below.

5. Sti Brembo 2pot upgrade. Gains huge vented rotor(316x20mm) and Brembo 2pot rear caliper yielding all gains above plus higher heat dissipation and Brembo quality brake feel. Because this is only available with a 190mm equipped rotor, you will need to replace calipers, pads, rotors, backing plates, hubs, knuckles, rear drive axles, rear diff and other front gears. This, I have to admit is theoretical, as no one I know of has pulled this off. It could be easier than this, but just a heads up of the worst case scenario.

This info has been collected by myself and others over a period of time. It has been gandered by experience, reading, annoying phone calls, interrogating pimps, and sooth-saying.

People that have contributed from these boards, either knowingly or otherwise: North Ursalia, DBASteve, 8Complex, Concillian, cardin555, johnfelstead, CKTAG, GarySheehan, monovich, mav1c, ciper and dsmawd.

I believe all this info to be correct, but I do miss things. There are also some gray areas listed above that could use defining. If you see something that is incorrect please feel free to keep it to yourself - j/k please post away. It was fatiguing searching around for all these bits of info, maybe we can get it all together in one thread.

subysouth
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Old 09-11-2002, 07:20 PM   #2
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Default Rear brake point of info (H6)

If you want to use the proper dust shields with the 'H6' upgrade, the shields will have to be removed from a Legacy plate and welded onto the WRX rear backing plate. The issue is the ABS sensor mount. Impreza's have the pickup going through the backing plate to 'see' the ABS plate outboard behind the rotor. Other Subies have their pickups inboard, not passing through the backing plate. (From the school of hard experience!)
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Old 09-11-2002, 09:35 PM   #3
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Can I cut and paste that wonderful consolidation of info on the Scoobymods site? Please

Peaty
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Old 09-11-2002, 11:00 PM   #4
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Default Brakes

OK, I'm going to kind of get off the subject here. I have done the convert from drum to disc brakes on the rear of my 96 Impreza Brighton. Cake! Now I foud that the braking is disperportionate front to rear, the fronts lock up, and the rears seem to have very limited aply. I was woundering if any on has done this mod and changed there proportioning valve with some sucsess in this area. I would like to use a proportioning valve from another Subaru if at all posable. If someone could help out with some info I would appreciate it. Thanks.
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Old 09-12-2002, 12:36 PM   #5
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Default Sure Peaty

Scoobymods has been a big help to me. Copy and paste away.

subysouth
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Old 09-12-2002, 01:52 PM   #6
Peaty
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Thumbs up

Thanks for sharing good stuff there for sure.

I've posted it here:

http://www.scoobymods.com/forums/sho...=&threadid=762

Regards,

Peaty,


www.scoobymods.com

PS I'm in the process of getting the H6 upgrade for my RS and will do the normal photo write up thing when I do it...
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Old 09-12-2002, 06:48 PM   #7
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Great writeup on the rear brakes.

my 2c -> I believe that the US Forester started life with the "newer" style rear calipers. The Forester came to the US as a 98 model in 1997. Mine is a MY98 manufactured in 05/97, so I believe it was one of the early ones. I did the "H6 upgrade" on my Forester and know that it has the newer calipers.


Thanks
TonyS.
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Old 10-19-2002, 07:59 PM   #8
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Help me clarify this a little bit, if you would please.

The 266x10mm(170mm) solid rear rotor is what is found on the MY02+ WRX, the BF Legacy, and atleast the MY99+ RS, correct? It also sounds like the WRX, RS, and BF Legacy share the same caliper too, is that correct? So, for a rear disc upgrade for my L Wagon I can use the BF Legacy, WRX, or MY99+ rear rotors and calipers since they are the same? Now, if I want to further upgrade my rear brakes, I can choose the 290x10mm(170mm) solid rear rotor and caliper found on all 2000+ Legacys.

Are the bearing specifications and hub/axle specifications the same in that any of the rotors and hubs will go right over any of the other axles; utilizing the same bearings and everything?

Do you happen to know what the previous STi models used for the rear discs?

Perhaps, can we do something like this for the front brakes as well? The goal would be to find the possible front/rear brake upgrades that yield what Subaru determined as proper brake bias.

Thanks,
-Jon
www.nothingserious.net
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Old 10-19-2002, 09:28 PM   #9
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Default If

you are swapping from drums to discs, I have never made that swap myself. Here is a link that should help:

http://wac.addr.com/auto/obs/disc/disc.html

I know the above can be a bit confusing because Subaru mixed and matched their rotors and calipers quite a bit. The 266x10mm solid ROTOR has been used on most of the rear disc equipped Subarus made since 1990. The single pot caliper used to squeeze this rotor has changed. The (1990 to 1999 Legacys and OBs) and (mid-1998 and older Imprezas and Foresters) seem to use the "older" style single pot caliper and bracket. Mid-1998+ Imprezas and Foresters and 2000+ Legacys and OBs use the "newer" style single pot caliper and bracket. It is the "newer" style caliper used with the 2000+ Legacy caliper bracket that yields the 290x10mm upgrade on WRXs, earlier Legacys, etc.

The older calipers are not compatible with the newer brackets and vice versa. So if you source the older calipers you cant use them for the 290x10mm(H6) upgrade.

Read this link for pics of older and newer style single pot rears. http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...hreadid=234120


subysouth

Last edited by subysouth; 10-19-2002 at 09:37 PM.
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Old 12-23-2002, 08:13 PM   #10
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Just to help others out, Im going to try and apply the "NEW" style caliper to the "OLD" style bracket.

Basically for those of you who are interested the pin that the old style caliper slides on is removable. It looks as if you could install the new style calipers into the old brackets without modification.

Also a dremmel works great and the shield.

The other thing is that brake lines are pretty much universal. The differences come with how the brake line attaches to the strut. My 1990 legacy wagon will have wrx brakes in the front with gc8 agx struts using WRX aftermarket steel lines, in the rear it will have WRX calipers with 2000+ legacy brackets and the large rotors also with the aftermarket steel lines.

stimpy: bias adjustments would have to be car specific. WRX calipers on an older legacy will give more front bias, even though the rear brakes are the same.

edit: Hmm, I guess forester and outback models could have longer lines...

Last edited by ciper; 12-23-2002 at 08:19 PM.
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Old 12-23-2002, 08:47 PM   #11
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Question

Maybe a bit of clarification is in order, or maybe I'm just a dumb shmuck.


It's been my understanding that the Legacy H6 rear brake upgrade entailed nothing more than swapping in new caliper brackets and the rotors (perhaps the dust shield stuff too, I'm not sure about that).

My basic point being that I wasn't aware new calipers were needed. Similarly to how the USDM GC 2.5RS' front calipers are the same as the USDM GD WRXs' are, only the WRX adopts new, bigger brackets to accomodate ~1" larger rotors, I have always been told that the rear calipers are the same among the three models, as well (GC Impreza, GD Impreza and Legacy H6).

Of course I could be wrong, or maybe people have just been upgrading the rotors and brackets and CALLING it an "H6" upgrade....

-Chris
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Old 12-23-2002, 08:54 PM   #12
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Quote:
swap in new caliper brackets and the rotors
Only true if you have the new caliper mount type.


Some of us need new calipers to gain the new type, or so I plan to prove perhaps we dont.

The reason is not so much the calipers. The NEW calipers use TWO bolts that hold the caliper, the caliper then slides on its own little "sleds."

The old more common style is ONE bolt with a sled then a smooth pin which the caliper slides on.

It looks like you can take the PIN out of your old bracket and stick it INTO the "H6" upgrade bracket and use the old caliper.

edit: some more info http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...hreadid=162522-http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...hreadid=213360

Last edited by ciper; 12-23-2002 at 09:42 PM.
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Old 12-23-2002, 11:26 PM   #13
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just some more fyi info.

The rear brakes or caliper piston size is the same for the early legacies only if you have a wagon. The wagons have the 1.5" diameter caliper pistons. The sedans have 1.374" diameter.

The turbo legacies have the 1.5" diameter caliper pistons in the rear, regardless of sedan or wagon.
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Old 12-24-2002, 09:23 AM   #14
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Default ciper

That would be great if you were to get the "older" style caliper to work in the "newer" caliper bracket. I have never tried it myself, the info I have that they are incompatible came from North Ursalia. IIRC he said the pin spacing was different. I know the pads are also different but thats again solved with the bracket. Meaning you definitely need new pads for the new bracket.

I think the reason that have run into this is that most of the people who have done it have had the newer style calipers already.

Quote:
My basic point being that I wasn't aware new calipers were needed. Similarly to how the USDM GC 2.5RS' front calipers are the same as the USDM GD WRXs' are, only the WRX adopts new, bigger brackets to accomodate ~1" larger rotors, I have always been told that the rear calipers are the same among the three models, as well (GC Impreza, GD Impreza and Legacy H6).
This is correct accept the GC Imprezas got the "newer" style calipers in mid 98 MY. All the earlier Imprezas and the BC/F and BD/G Legacys have the "older" style rear caliper


Let us know how it goes ciper.

I actually pulled the dust shield off with nothing more than gloved hands. Then cleaned away the spot welds with a grinder.

ss
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Old 12-24-2002, 04:13 PM   #15
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very cool

so the JDM B4/GT-B rear caliper is single piston but differnt than the first or second generations USDM calipers (to accodate the wider rotor)
and has a differnt bracket (also wider) but maintains the 5.75 bolt spacing like the USDM brackets

do you have part numbers for these?
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Old 12-24-2002, 04:22 PM   #16
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Default Re: Subaru rear brake redux

Quote:
Originally posted by subysouth

Other rear rotors used on JDM and abroad Subarus since 1990

1. 290x18mm(170mm) vented rear rotor. Found on 2000+ B4s and GT-Bs, et. al. This is also the vented rotor used with the Sti 2pot caliperon on 170mm hand brake equipped vehiicles.


subysouth
where can replacement rotors for the 2-pot calipers be found?
Possibly at a subaru dealership? any part numbers
Thanks!
Kian
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Old 12-29-2002, 09:47 AM   #17
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Default Re: Re: Subaru rear brake redux

Quote:
Originally posted by kaos200


where can replacement rotors for the 2-pot calipers be found?
Possibly at a subaru dealership? any part numbers
Thanks!
Kian
Right now in the US, Rallispec is one of the few places I know that has them. PN is 26700AE030 (thats a JDM number)

If you are looking for an alternative, the DBA part number is 653, available plain, slotted and x-drilled+slotted.

The cost on the oem and the DBAs are virtually identical.

ss
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Old 12-29-2002, 09:53 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jaxx
very cool

so the JDM B4/GT-B rear caliper is single piston but differnt than the first or second generations USDM calipers (to accodate the wider rotor)
and has a differnt bracket (also wider) but maintains the 5.75 bolt spacing like the USDM brackets

do you have part numbers for these?
Your statement is exactly correct. And the part numbers are:

26692AE020 R vented caliper
26692AE030 L vented caliper
26625AE010 brackets(need 2)
26696AE000 pad kit(need 1)
26700AE030 rotors(need 2)

cardin actually ran the prices out on these as well, the info is in this thread:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...hreadid=234120

ss
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Old 05-04-2009, 06:58 AM   #19
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Hey subysouth,

Thanks for all these informations, I have 1 question about my STI, its year 2000 JDM V7 Wagon, the caliper is 4-pots at front, 2 pots at the back, subaru OEM ones. I really love the big gold brembo calipers, I was wonder if I can fit V7, V8 or V9 brembo calipers into my STI? As I've been told the front should be no problem, but not sure the rear. Do I need to change all those stuff u've mention in the thread for 2pot Brembo upgrade? Thanks alot.

LJ
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Old 03-20-2010, 06:24 PM   #20
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Anyone know if Legacy rear knuckle/brake setup w. discs will swap out for an Impreza rear drum setup?
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Old 03-21-2010, 05:39 PM   #21
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What year Legacy were you looking to use? It will work, however I'd recommend sticking with the 90-99 Legacies as donor cars just to make sure it will work.
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