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Old 11-22-2009, 07:31 AM   #1
cdnsigop
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Default Project Green Collar: 1998 Subaru Impreza L Wagon

I bought an impreza about a month ago, with the express intention of turbocharging it. I wanted a torquey street car, good for all weather. I have been turbocharging Honda's since I was sixteen. I do all my own work, including tuning. The only thing I dont do is welding, but Im learning...

So I started the turbo install last Thursday, and got it started Tuesday. 164,000 km on the chassis and engine. It has the stock 2.2. The car still has the original clutch, it does not slip. I have had this car for the last 1000 km. I did all the maintenance first; new front main seal, timing belt, spark plugs, wires, fuel filter, and synthetic 5w30 oil. Diff and tranny oil was good to go.

I am using the stock ecu, with a greddy emanage blue spliced into the harness; anti stall, ignition, and additional injection maps. For fuelling, I am using red top injectors from a 1998 Legacy 2.5, and a walbro 255 LPH high pressure pump. Since the turbo has been on, (About a week) I have been feeding her 94 octane Sunoco only.

Tuning: Emanage datalogging, plus an AEM wideband controller/gauge. The sensor is mounted in place of the factory front narrow band o2. I have wired the wideband o2 into the ecu harness, at the front o2 input. I have wired the stock front o2 heater circuit positive wire to the rear o2 heater circuit, so I dont get any codes, and dont have a 3rd o2 sensor dangling under the car. Using the 6th position on the rear of the aem uego, It simulates the stock narrowband o2
output, so the ecu can run normally in closed loop. And of course, a boost gauge. Oh, I am using a hydraulic speed control valve from Princess Auto for my boost controller. Cost: $8.50

Exhaust is a 2004 WRX from tailpipe to the downpipe discharge flange. New gaskets throughout, of course. Complete to the chirping at the tips of the tailpipe. I had an o2 bung welded after the cat, to mount the factory rear o2 sensor. It seems that the wrx of that year had the front o2 sensor mounted somewhere in the up pipe.... Where the factory rear o2 was mounted on the WRX, is where I have the aem wideband.

I am using the turbo, uppipe, and partial downpipe of an AVO 2.5 RS kit.
The turbo is a ball bearing garrett unit with an AVO modified compressor housing. Pretty sure its a GT25 and supposed to support 320 hp. Intercooler is a stock 2004 WRX piece, with a crushed BOV from the same car, venting to atmosphere (Didnt want to flip the TB). I made the IC fit my removing the wipers and cowling, and cutting a 1/2" strip of metal where the cowling clips into. A little bit of boot pressure, and the IC was in without cutting the TB or IC inlet/outlet. I am using Forge Motorsports silicone Y-pipe cut down slightly to meet up with the AVO turbo, and the same brand silicone TB - IC coupler. The intake consists of a 3" dry cone filter, maf adaptor, stock maf sensor, and a chopped down legacy 2.5 intake pipe. I made a catch can out of pcv pipe and fittings. All the breathers are hooked up to the can, then the can to the intake pipe in front of the turbo. Works like a champ. The downpipe was cut, then had a
partial 90 degree welded to it, with the 2004 WRX downpipe flange. Now I can use any aftermarket WRX catback..

I installed the emanage, gauges, fuel pump and injectors, and learned the support program before I ever installed the turbo.
Almost forgot: The boost controller dosnt affect the final boost much, so I see about 5-6 psi after a couple seconds in the boost, at WOT. What it does affect is initial boost, allowing an 11-12 PSI spike, tapering to the 5 6 psi I mentioned before. Because first gear is finished so quick, 11 psi is maintained throughout. 2nd, spike to 11-12, then falls to 6 at around 4800-redline. 3rd, 11 psi to 4000, then falls to 6 - redline... Same story in 4th.. The spike only lasts as long as it takes for the pressure to build at the wastegate. The valve Im using is simply an adjustable restrictor with a check valve built in. So, it restricts the flow of air to the wastegate, but allows the pressure built at the wastegate to be relieved back through the valve. Max voltage at the MAF sensor is 4.6v so far. It peaks at that, then tapers down to about 4.2v at redline. A/F's are around 11.5-12:1 at peak boost, then richens up to 10.5:1 towards redline. I am pulling timing starting at -1 degree at 4v MAF voltage, and tapering down to -8 degrees at 4.8v...

I baby the tranny on shifts, and dont floor the throttle till my foot is right off the clutch.. So far, no clutch slip at all, car just flat hauls ass. Huge torque spike when boost spikes, so the midrange power is stompin'.

Overall, I am really happy with this setup so far. That AVO turbo spools up so fast, and the 2.2 was torquey to begin with.. Now, especially with the boost spike, there is no need to downshift, reminds me of my SV1000. Just open and go. And the traction! Fist gear right handers are fun. I put on a perrin 22mm rear sway, and on the softest setting, it has almost totally removed the car's tendancy to understeer. With the new found power, it is possible to maintain a midrange power induced light drift on dry pavement in 2nd gear. Never was able to do that in the honda's!

Only two problems:
a) a glutenous thirst for premium fuel, especially the way I drive.
b) a tendancy to stall at idle a few seconds into a cold start, and the odd time after a WOT run, when idleing at a stoplight. I have adjusted the antistall maps extensively, even increased the idle speed. No go. In my obsessive quest for info on this forum and others, as well as google, I have seen one solution calling for a longer pipe between maf and turbo. I cant get my head around how this could work though. The MAF voltage is clamped at idle! Maybe someone could explain it..











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Last edited by cdnsigop; 01-28-2011 at 10:34 AM.
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Old 11-22-2009, 09:04 AM   #2
iluvdrt
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It sounds like maybe the map for the idle is too rich. That could be why it is dying. Are you using a wide band to tune with?
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Old 11-22-2009, 12:34 PM   #3
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Im using a wideband o2.

Yeah, warm idle is targetting stoich, between 13-15:1, with -1, 0 , 1 as the short term fuel trims. Usually the STFT stay at 0%.

When cold, the car will run for about 5 seconds then try to stall out, if the throttle is not blipped. Def not to rich on the cold start either...
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Old 11-22-2009, 07:33 PM   #4
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Where is it ideling (RPM wise). What is the timing at? Usually Subarus run a crazy amount of retarded timing. Is the MAF good, with no vacume leaks?
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Old 11-22-2009, 07:43 PM   #5
cdnsigop
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When warm, 700 RPM, just like stock, though I recently raised it to 800 RPM with the Idle adjust screw at the bottom of the TB. When cold, the normal cold rpm, between 1300 and 900 or so. Ill check the timing again, but it is unchanged from stock at idle. I think its 14 degrees? Im using a scangauge to monitor ignition timing and other ecu info (STFT, LTFT, RPM). MAF is good, tested! Its a suck through MAF setup, and idled perfect the day before the turbo went on...

I really appreciate the time you are taking to help me out, man
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Old 11-23-2009, 12:04 AM   #6
970subaru
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdnsigop View Post
Im using a wideband o2.

Yeah, warm idle is targetting stoich, between 13-15:1, with -1, 0 , 1 as the short term fuel trims. Usually the STFT stay at 0%.

When cold, the car will run for about 5 seconds then try to stall out, if the throttle is not blipped. Def not to rich on the cold start either...
perhaps you need to richen up the cold start a tad? think of it like a choke on a carb.
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Old 11-23-2009, 04:17 AM   #7
Kevin Thomas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdnsigop View Post
b) a tendancy to stall at idle a few seconds into a cold start, and the odd time after a WOT run, when idleing at a stoplight. I have adjusted the antistall maps extensively, even increased the idle speed. No go. In my obsessive quest for info on this forum and others, as well as google, I have seen one solution calling for a longer pipe between maf and turbo. I cant get my head around how this could work though. The MAF voltage is clamped at idle! Maybe someone could explain it..
Maybe this-->
Quote:
Originally Posted by subachad View Post
Recirculate your BOV. My car ran MUCH better with the recirculated BOV than with it to atmosphere.

Here's the thing... With my old down pipe, the car ran great with the BOV open. By adding a divorced style wastegate dump into the downpipe (see my getting more for less article) the car would no longer run well with the BOV open and here is why. Before, the BOV would actually suck air at idle. Once the new down pipe was installed, the BOV would blow at idle, which basically means I am boosting at idle with the TD04L and high flow down pipe. By recirculating the BOV it made the car quit stalling at idle and during cold starts. For some reason, the E-Manage was no longer able to cope with the open BOV... oh and I replaced the BOV with another one I had. Appearantly when running more than 7psi, you don't want the BOSCH BOV's to see all that boost, it rips the little diaphram inside. To fix this "t" off the vacuum line into the engine side of the MAF.

Chad
93 2.2T
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/newr...eply&p=7923988
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Old 11-23-2009, 09:42 AM   #8
cdnsigop
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Thanks for all the responses. As far as recirculating the BOV, I have tried it with the BOV disconnected alltogether, no change. I ended up crushing the BOV just to be sure. I am using the stock 04 BOV, not the plastic Bosch valve. And as far as richening up the cold start rpm, I have added voltage to the anti stall maps in the 900-1400 rpm range. It just dosn't work! It will idle fine, as if normal for the first 10- 20 seconds, then it wil drop vacuum some and die.

Kevin, didnt you end up lengthining the pipe between MAF and turbo? How did that work out?

Thanks for all the help!
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Old 11-23-2009, 12:49 PM   #9
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Here's a little update:

I seemed to have solved the cold stall issue. I set the emanage anti stall RPM up to 850 rpm, rather than the 1400 I had it going up to before. Now, under a cold start/idle situation, the ecu is seeing the full scope of the MAF voltage. No more cold stalling!!! Now I just got to sort out the warm idle at stoplight after WOT issue....

I also fixed the vibration coming from the IC against firewall. I 'clearanced' the firewall even more, and cut about a 1/3" off the intercooler discharge. Smooth running! Except for the damn rattle coming from the cargo area of the wagon! Damn it! It never ends, does it?
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Old 11-23-2009, 01:25 PM   #10
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sweet glad its working..I'm waiting on the AVO kit for the 2.5i should be a fun lil kit.
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Old 11-23-2009, 06:29 PM   #11
cdnsigop
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Im so impressed with the ej22... Such a torquey motor. Next year I will try to find some ej22t pistons to go in, shoot for 20 psi hehehe
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Old 11-23-2009, 08:50 PM   #12
Kevin Thomas
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cdnsigop,

I never had the cold start issues. I used to use (and still do), the stock fuel injectors. It has always seemed sufficient enough for 5psi of boost.

I did have problem with the engine stalling when the BOV blew to the atmosphere. I now know how to resolve that with an SAFC Decel function. Back then though, I had recirculated the BOV back into the intake. The problem then was that when the BOV purged, the part where it tied into the intake was at a 90 degree angle (Perpendicular). So as the air went back into the intake, some went towards the turbo and some went towards the Maf sensor (backwards). It disrupted the reading and caused the car to stall. The BOV tie-in was cut and re-welded back in play so that it was angled at 45 degrees, towards the turbo. This prevented the air from the BOV purge from heading back towards the maf. No more stalling! Happy driving ever sense.

Glad to read that some/most of your issues have been resolved. And if someone tells you that turboing your car can not be successful, I am still the only owner of my OBS since late 1996 (new). It has been turbocharged since 1998 (or was it 1999?). Have fun!

Currently, the OBS is not tied back into the intake and I am using the decel function of the SAFC Neo. It works fine but I have not been driving the car for over a year. Too lazy to fix a check engine 'speed sensor' indicator that comes on over 40mph.
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Old 11-23-2009, 08:54 PM   #13
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cdnsigop,

I never had the cold start issues. I used to use (and still do), the stock fuel injectors. It has always seemed sufficient enough for 5psi of boost.

I did have problem with the engine stalling when the BOV blew to the atmosphere. I now know how to resolve that with an SAFC Decel function. Back then though, I had recirculated the BOV back into the intake. The problem then was that when the BOV purged, the part where it tied into the intake was at a 90 degree angle (Perpendicular). So as the air went back into the intake, some went towards the turbo and some went towards the Maf sensor (backwards). It disrupted the reading and caused the car to stall. The BOV tie-in was cut and re-welded back in play so that it was angled at 45 degrees, towards the turbo. This prevented the air from the BOV purge from heading back towards the maf. No more stalling! Happy driving ever sense.

Currently, the OBS is not tied back into the intake and I am using the decel function of the SAFC Neo. It works fine but I have not been driving the car for over a year. Too lazy to fix a check engine 'speed sensor' indicator that comes on over 40mph.

Glad to read that some/most of your issues have been resolved. And if someone tells you that turboing your car can not be successful, I am still the only owner of my OBS since late 1996 (new). It has been turbocharged since 1998 (or was it 1999?). Have fun!
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Old 11-23-2009, 09:25 PM   #14
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Kevin;

Thanks for the input! I will probably keep my BOV vented to atmosphere since I have not done the TB flip...

The only reason turboing these N/A motors seems to get a bad rap is cause guys go ahead and dont tune properly and/or get greedy with boost. These EJ22's are tough engines, the weak link with boost would def be the pistons in my opinion. Not because they are not forged, but because the have too high of compression for lots of boost on pump gas. The last turbo Honda I did made 280 whp, and used the stock DOHC ZC block with eagle rods and Suzuki Vitara pistons. Comp. ratio was low 7s, but I was able to run 27 psi of boost on pump gas... If I can get a set of EJ22T pistons, and the yellow top STi's injectors, I will go for broke on my EJ22 block... Or maybe I will mod my stock grey top injectors, they are just lying around. I dont want much over 400cc if I can help it. The other idea I had was to use the ej25 heads from a 98 legacy to bring down compression... I have access to these heads real cheap!
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Old 11-28-2009, 10:18 AM   #15
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Just an update;

The warm stall at a stoplight almost never happens anymore, so I am happy with that. Thanks for all the response. To payback, I have wrote up a how to for the Perrin rear diff bushings that 'they' say cant fit our GC/GF chassis cars. Link: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...1408017&page=6

I have also installed the Prothane front control arm bushings (front and rear) and anti roll bar bushings. Link: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1809313

I have the complete Prothane kit, when I do the rear trailing arms, ill update. So far, pretty happy with the Prothane setup...




Last edited by cdnsigop; 12-01-2009 at 10:31 PM. Reason: Added pics
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Old 11-28-2009, 10:08 PM   #16
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Sounds great!
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Old 11-28-2009, 10:51 PM   #17
cdnsigop
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AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!

I got my Outback hood!!!

The story goes, I had taken the SV for one last ride before winter. It was so cold, no traction, so I took the bike home. I figured Id get a coffee from timmies.. So I get in the Subie, go for a little 'haulin, get my coffee... Then I see this 08 Impreza hatch, so I follow. Driven by some 70+ year old woman. She turns right, I keep going. not more than 2 seconds later, a GF Outback Impreza comes past me, in red, just like mine(Other than his two tone). I pull a heavy duty U turn, and start following him. 'Him' turns out to be a late 60s retired fellow who drives 40km/h through 50-60 zones. Took about 7-10 minutes to get to his destination, which isnt 7-10 minutes away. Turns out to be an apartment building, and he's heading for the underground parking! I was thinking crap! but he had a transponder or something, and the overhead door opened. I snuck through in the nick of time, he was driving so slow. He parked, and I sheepishly got out my car. I apologised for following him into his private parking, then proceeded to offer him $150 plus my hood for his scooped outback hood.
He declined, so I offered him $200 plus my hood. He then called his wife who was in the apartment for permission, who told him flat out 'no', and that he should talk to his mechanic. I thought that was it, but he said "We should probably go ahead anyhow" I was laughing so hard, but ended up driving him to my bank, in my freshly boosted GF. He was real impressed, needless to say. Long story short: I installed the hoods in the parking lot of his apartment building, took out the block plates from the main scoop and the passenger side one, and drove home. Awesome. Just need to fabricate some ducting to seal the 'cooler against the scoop...






Last edited by cdnsigop; 12-01-2009 at 10:37 PM. Reason: Added pics
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Old 12-01-2009, 08:51 PM   #18
cdnsigop
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So the Prothane trailing arm bushings werent nearly as difficult as the front lower control arms. I ended up drilling a bunch of holes in the rear bushing, at the hub, then pushed out the bushing. The front bushing on the trailing arm was also drilled through many times, all around the metal inner sleeve. That was done with the trailing arm off the car. I used a bandsaw to chop the Prothane replacement bushing for the front of the arm into 2, so I wouldnt have to press it in. Worked great! No slop in the suspension, handles better than ever..




Last edited by cdnsigop; 12-01-2009 at 10:34 PM. Reason: Added pics
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Old 12-01-2009, 10:46 PM   #19
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Pics FTW

Shifter bushings are in. I am using the stock shifter and linkage, with a new spring to return the shifter to the neutral position from the 1-2 gate. The bushings have noticeably improved the shifter action. I baby my tranny, but I still find quite a bit more feedback there. The Prothane kit included these bushings.
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Old 12-02-2009, 05:53 PM   #20
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low key and effective..nice sleeper! Im a fellow homebrew 2.2T owner.
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Old 12-02-2009, 06:07 PM   #21
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Ah, I was wondering if you had your pictures up, I like the setup!
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Old 12-02-2009, 07:06 PM   #22
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Looks nice! Keep up the good work.
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Old 01-13-2010, 12:57 AM   #23
cdnsigop
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So an Update...

Since my last instalment, I have swapped out the 1998 legacy 2.5 red top 270cc injectors for stock ej22 220cc grey top injectors modified to flow 390cc. I thought they would flow more than that, more like 440cc +, but in my emanage blue parameters, any more than a 390cc input causes the car to run lean at idle and cruise (Seeing STF's at +10-15 at idle and +20-37 during part throttle). With 390cc entered, I see perfect idling with 0 for the STF's, and part throttle is causing -10 - +10 STF's. For some reason though, 12 psi WOT to redline is making 10:1 and richer AFRs. To combat this excessive richness, I am removing 20-24% from the airflow map (MAF sensor) at 98-100% throttle across the rev range. I see ~11:1 - 11.7:1 AFRs at WOT now, right across the rev range.

I have also swapped out the 2003 WRX exhaust I was using, for a cat back true 3" id ebay exhaust. It is loud, but sounds awesome at WOT. No more bird chirping!!! I saw an excellent reduction in spool up time, and much better boost control. My homemade MBC now controls a perfect boost curve, spiking to as much as 14 psi before settling down to ~11-12psi to redline. I also saw a reduction in fuel consumption (believe it or not) and a much harder charge to redline...I said haul ass before, but it really does!

As far as overall tuning goes, aside from the fuel injection changes I’ve already detailed, data logging with the emanage shows a peak MAF voltage of 4.78v, starting at about 4.6v at ~3800 and reaching the peak just before 6200 RPM (Which is right around fuel cut on the 1998 EJ22). The max voltage the ecu sees from the MAF is about 3.63v, after the emanage has done its trickery. I am pulling 8 degrees of ignition timing at 4.7v MAF voltage; I may increase that, but so far so good.

Remember the idle issue? Its gone now, hasn’t resurfaced since before the injector change... Even with my Atmosphere venting WRX BPV.

Almost all my Subee knowledge came from this forum, COUNTLESS hours of research, and a few well placed PM's not mentioning any names (Thanks REDDEVIL, Kevin Thomas, Abest10, and Philsine!!)... This project is not done yet, always more to optimise, tweak, and upgrade.. I have a set of ej22t pistons in the mail to bring the compression down to around 8:1, then I can really turn up the boost! That will have to wait till spring though...Pics to follow!

Last edited by cdnsigop; 01-13-2010 at 07:18 AM.
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Old 01-13-2010, 01:47 AM   #24
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nice build.. i got a quick question. where is this spring for the shifter linkage to return the shifter into neutral? is it in the trans or accessable from outside? wondering if thats my slop or if i need to upgrade the linkage(kit to replace non-servicable bushings from kartboy) pm me if you have pics thanks

i'm also after an outback hood, but that was a coincedental way of getting one. LOL!
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Old 01-13-2010, 01:51 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turbo01gc8 View Post
nice build.. i got a quick question. where is this spring for the shifter linkage to return the shifter into neutral? is it in the trans or accessable from outside? wondering if thats my slop or if i need to upgrade the linkage(kit to replace non-servicable bushings from kartboy) pm me if you have pics thanks
Nice Jack... Do some research, on the 1998 EJ22 powered Impreza, 1-2 to N return spring is external. 5-R -N is internal. This kinda question goes in the tranny forum though, unless you like getting flamed...
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