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Old 01-31-2010, 08:07 PM   #1
Tim-H
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Default California to Eliminate Free Parking In Attempt to Encourage Public Transportation

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There is too much of it, they say, and it encourages people to drive instead of taking the bus, walking or bicycling. A Senate proposal would prompt cities and businesses to reduce its availability.

State lawmakers are taking aim at what some of them see as a menace to California's environment: free parking.

There is too much of it, the legislators say, and it encourages people to drive instead of taking the bus, walking or riding a bike. All that motoring is contributing to traffic jams and pollution, according to state Sen. Alan Lowenthal (D-Long Beach), and on Thursday he won Senate approval of a proposal he hopes will prompt cities and businesses to reduce the availability of free parking.

"Free parking has significant social, economic and environmental costs," Lowenthal said. "It increases congestion and greenhouse gas emissions."

Republicans opposed the measure, saying the Legislature should not be meddling in how much people pay to park.

"If local governments want to entice people to shop or do business in a particular area, that is entirely their business. Not the state's," said Sen. Tom Harman (R-Huntington Beach).

The bill, supported by the Natural Resources Defense Council (NRDC) and the Sierra Club, provides financial incentives for cities and counties to stop providing free parking on the street and at government offices and to reduce the amount they require businesses to provide.

Cities that take such action could get more state money for parking garages and transit programs and bonus points in competing for state grants.

When a store provides free parking, the cost to maintain, clean, insure, secure and light the parking lot is passed on to shoppers in higher prices for goods, said Justin Horner, an analyst with the NRDC. Free street parking is paid for by the entire community in the form of higher taxes, he said.

Lowenthal said that when businesses pay for their employees' parking, more of them drive to work.

"It's nice that we've been treated to this luxury," Lowenthal said. "The problem with free parking is it's not free."
Los Angeles Times
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Old 01-31-2010, 08:39 PM   #2
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Last edited by Calamity Jesus; 02-01-2010 at 09:39 AM.
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Old 02-01-2010, 12:07 AM   #3
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Translation: California taxes populace to limit freedom and control behavior.
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Old 02-01-2010, 12:11 AM   #4
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Before worrying about the environment crap, California needs to worry about getting itself out of debt first, and create jobs for its people.
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Old 02-01-2010, 12:46 AM   #5
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I really need to move.
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Old 02-01-2010, 01:10 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by Ysidro View Post
Before worrying about the environment crap, California needs to worry about getting itself out of debt first, and create jobs for its people.
But it does two of those things. It wont stop people from driving, it will wring the citizens for more money, and it will employ more meter maids.
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Old 02-01-2010, 01:10 AM   #7
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Free parking is the best kind of parking. I'm waiting for the day Cali outlaws the car.
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Old 02-01-2010, 01:27 AM   #8
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Good gawd...I love this state, but I hate it at the same time
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Old 02-01-2010, 02:26 AM   #9
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"welcome to ca.... now bend over"
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Old 02-01-2010, 06:34 AM   #10
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"Free street parking is paid for by the entire community in the form of higher taxes, he said."

So who's gonna pay for all the new buses and bicycle lanes that will be needed?

Stupid f***ing California.
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Old 02-01-2010, 06:38 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim-H View Post
But it does two of those things. It wont stop people from driving, it will wring the citizens for more money, and it will employ more meter maids.
At least it is a voluntary tax. As such it is harder to get upset about.
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Old 02-01-2010, 07:48 AM   #12
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Voluntary, you are aware that most californians HAVE to drive to work because they cannot afford to live close to it. And when I lived in Cali, I never saw much public transportation. You cannot ask a person who lives in Huntington Beach to ride a bike to LA. By car its an hour commute depending on traffic. There are no busses that run that route.

I really think that we need to consider 'blackwater-ing the entire cali legislature' how can people be so stupid.
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Old 02-01-2010, 08:00 AM   #13
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Man, I always knew there's a reason I loved the East Coast so much more than the West Coast.
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Old 02-01-2010, 08:23 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCRAPPYDO View Post
Voluntary, you are aware that most californians HAVE to drive to work because they cannot afford to live close to it. And when I lived in Cali, I never saw much public transportation. You cannot ask a person who lives in Huntington Beach to ride a bike to LA. By car its an hour commute depending on traffic. There are no busses that run that route.

I really think that we need to consider 'blackwater-ing the entire cali legislature' how can people be so stupid.
Yes voluntary. You are aware that it is talking about public parking, not lots created by employers. So your argument makes no sense at all. You can still drive to work if your business isn't freeloading off the tax payers to provide parking for its employees.

How can people can be so stupid? There are numerous ways.

And beyond all that even in your dire and incorrect reading of the proposal it would still be voluntary. Just because someone doesn't like something doesn't mean it isn't voluntary. They can choose different jobs, the labor market could demand higher salaries to make up for it. They can do parking permits for people who live in the area, or work there. Lots of communities already do that when there is a problem of people parking. I hate paid parking, absolutely. That doesn't mean that when I do park and pay it isn't voluntary. It means something else overcame my aversion to it. None of that touches on whether this is a good idea. There are many downsides. There is the potential to hurt businesses by removing customers. This could lower the tax revenues by more than the parking makes up for. It is still a voluntary tax though.

Orbital the east is full of metered parking. The west has free parking all over so I don't know why you love the east coast, but I imagine it may be because you haven't been out west
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Old 02-01-2010, 08:27 AM   #15
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Reduce == Eliminate?

Okay, sensational headline much?

It's my understanding that commercial zoning regulations around LA currently require one parking spot per building occupant, which explains why so much of southern California is taken up by parking lots. If that ratio can be reduced, businesses wouldn't have to buy as much land...
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Old 02-01-2010, 10:23 AM   #16
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Not sensational at all.

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incentives for cities and counties to stop providing free parking on the street and at government offices
Sounds like trying to eliminate it to me. The reduction would be on the employers side like you said. People who park in employers parking would now have to pay for their own or their employer will have to pay for it.

If you think the taxes in the areas will go down you have to be delusional. The taxes will stay the same or increase.
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Old 02-01-2010, 10:35 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by jexeffectz View Post
Good gawd...I love this state, but I hate it at the same time
my sentiments exactly
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Old 02-01-2010, 12:29 PM   #18
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I agree with this 100%. If California was ever denied oil for 1 day even the entire state would burn to the ground. Oil isn't an everlasting commodity and there IS NO OTHER READILY AVAILABLE WAY TO CART ALL YOUR ASSES AROUND.
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Old 02-01-2010, 01:14 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sxotty View Post
Yes voluntary. You are aware that it is talking about public parking, not lots created by employers. So your argument makes no sense at all. You can still drive to work if your business isn't freeloading off the tax payers to provide parking for its employees.

...

And beyond all that even in your dire and incorrect reading of the proposal it would still be voluntary.
REALLY? Maybe you should take the 2 mins to read the article before ranting about people not reading it.

Quote:
Lowenthal said that when businesses pay for their employees' parking, more of them drive to work.
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Old 02-01-2010, 01:17 PM   #20
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Don't most stores that provide free parking to customers do so on commercial parking lots? Thus the maintenance and such would be up to the property owner, and not the city/state?
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Old 02-01-2010, 01:31 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim-H View Post
It wont stop people from driving, it will wring the citizens for more money, and it will employ more meter maids.
Not true. When the local council massively increased the cost of parking and eliminated free parking spaces where I lived in the UK, it certainly did reduce the amount of driving I did, as driving to the shops to buy something that only cost a few pounds made no sense when I'd have to pay a couple of pounds merely to park while I walked from the car park to the store to buy it.

Of course a couple of years later the council were complaining about the number of stores which were closing down due to lack of customers as people either drove to another town which didn't treat us like mobile cash cows, or bought more from web stores instead.

Brilliant plan, which almost certainly cost them more in lost income from the declining local economy than it made them in parking fees.
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Old 02-01-2010, 01:36 PM   #22
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LA is just one huge mess. When we go see my wifes family, I could never imagine trying to get around without a car. The billions of infrastructure improvements to make successful mass transit possible will be staggering. It is such a service oriented economy. I'm all for less cars on the road, especially in LA, but I'm not sure if this will work like they are hoping it will. Good luck with that $20,000,000,000 deficit this year.
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Old 02-01-2010, 01:47 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JC View Post
REALLY? Maybe you should take the 2 mins to read the article before ranting about people not reading it.
Maybe you should read the proposal. I already said if businesses pay for their employees to park more will drive. What is your point? They pay for a lot, or they pay for the parking in public spots. Either way this proposal is irrelevant.

What is relevant is exactly what I said. And which was emphasized again by movieman. There are consequences to such a policy.
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Old 02-01-2010, 02:38 PM   #24
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based on the last 3 news stories to come out of CA that I read, I'm never moving to CA
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Old 02-01-2010, 04:29 PM   #25
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a bottle of milk $1.95
parking $5.00
spending an hr on the bus and paying $6.95 for a bottle of milk... priceless because you live in CA.
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