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Old 09-20-2010, 10:27 PM   #801
cueball89
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Originally Posted by Superorb View Post
Thanks! So I'd be fine with the Black or Wagon springs as they appear to have pretty similar rates and almost the same lowering (I already have the rear spacer). I'd be pretty happy with ~14" F/R. Anyone know off hand what Sti takeoff springs on a wagon lower? (that's what I'm on now)
Emphasis on "should" I went from take off springs to rce wagon springs. I can't remember what my ride heights were. If I could get a spring that had sti take off ride heights with rce stiffness I'd buy it in a heartbeat.

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Originally Posted by labcoat View Post
This is what I look like after some more settling.

R-
Still looks good.
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Old 09-20-2010, 10:30 PM   #802
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Originally Posted by cueball89 View Post
Emphasis on "should" I went from take off springs to rce wagon springs. I can't remember what my ride heights were. If I could get a spring that had sti take off ride heights with rce stiffness I'd buy it in a heartbeat.



Still looks good.
Thanks

I thought thats what RCE Blacks were supposed to do on maybe just a few mm lower.

R-
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Old 09-20-2010, 11:13 PM   #803
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Originally Posted by labcoat View Post
Thanks

I thought thats what RCE Blacks were supposed to do on maybe just a few mm lower.

R-
Blacks are I believe 10mm lower than STi takeoffs, so figure 20mm drop on a WRX? The Wagon springs are 30mm drop I believe. I've been waiting for a set of Blacks in the FS section for months now but they're rare.
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Old 09-22-2010, 08:55 PM   #804
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Default RCE Springs ride heights and rates (hopefully)

Alright, so I've been trying to figure out the ride heights of each type of RCE spring on a wagon as I am researching for my suspension setup. I've looked at way too many wagon suspension threads and RCE springs thread. I gathered all the tidbits of info I could find from here and there, RCE's website and some PMs with labcoat and I think I was able to figure it all out. This, generally speaking, are the ride heights with no spacers:

stock ride height = 15.25/14.25in = 387/362mm
Wagon ride height = 14.00/13.75in = 356/349mm => 31/13mm drop = 18mm diff.
Black ride height = 13.80/13.50in = 351/343mm => 36/19mm drop = 17mm diff.
Yellow ride height = 13.50/13.13in = 343/333mm => 44/29mm drop = 15mm diff.

Spacers (for reference)
3/8” = .375in = 9.5mm ~ 10mm
” = .25in = 6.35mm ~ 6mm

Here's how I calculated the numbers:
1) stock and wagon heights were straight from Myle's wagon springs gauge thread:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...hlight=gauging

2) Labcoat has yellow springs on his car, 13.5in all around with 3/8" rear spacer, that's how I got the yellow ride height

3) RCE's website posts the drop of both blacks and yellows on an 04-07 STi, I just took the difference, added them to the yellow ride height to figure the black ride height

4) I also decided to figure out the difference between the F&R drops so the bigger the difference, the more even or level the car will be. As you can see, the wagon springs were made to be the most level because they were made for wagons and the blacks and yellows were for the 04-07 STi sedans.

Got it, check, I know - what about the differences in using different top hats, strut housing, etc.? If someone can figure that out, that would be great but I'll just consider those differences negligible.

And I also wanted to get all of the spring rates for reference:
Stock (06-07 wagon)= 163/132lbs/in = 2.9K/2.4K
Wagon = 278/259lbs/in = 4.9K/4.6K
Black = 285/269lbs/in = 5.1K/4.8K
Yellow = 295/275lbs/in = 5.3K/4.9K

Based off of these numbers, I think I will go with the blacks and no spacers now. Superorb made me think about the spacers and issues they might cause from just having another part in the system. At least for now, the blacks and no spacers.

If I am off with my numbers, please let me know. This should help wagon folks out who want RCE springs but don't know which to get.
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Old 09-22-2010, 09:07 PM   #805
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^^ You can use the saggy butt spacer without worry, I'm using a set now with no problems. There's honestly no way to screw it up.

I was pretty sure the RCE Blacks were less drop compared to the Wagon springs and the Yellow springs were more drop than the wagon springs. Are the mm drops you listed for these springs on a Wagon?
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Old 09-22-2010, 10:08 PM   #806
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kenliu84

The only reason to not use spacers is if you don't want to use you rear strut bar and a 3/8" spacer. The rear studs wont being long enough.

The fix is hammer or press them out and use a nut and bolt kit on the up side the nut and bolt will be stronger.

Ry-
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Old 09-22-2010, 10:08 PM   #807
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Originally Posted by Superorb View Post
^^ You can use the saggy butt spacer without worry, I'm using a set now with no problems. There's honestly no way to screw it up.

I was pretty sure the RCE Blacks were less drop compared to the Wagon springs and the Yellow springs were more drop than the wagon springs. Are the mm drops you listed for these springs on a Wagon?
I calculated everything as if they were on a wagon.

The wagon springs setup was easy to get, I got it from RCE's thread as I linked above. The yellows setup was taken from labcoat, who posted his numbers in another thread and we've been communicating via PMs.

For the blacks, I calculated the difference of the posted drop numbers on RCE's website and added the difference to labcoat's numbers. That's how I got the black setup numbers, I did not get them from someone who was actually running blacks. So I guess it is theoretical.
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Old 09-22-2010, 10:22 PM   #808
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Originally Posted by labcoat View Post
kenliu84

The only reason to not use spacers is if you don't want to use you rear strut bar and a 3/8" spacer. The rear studs wont being long enough.

The fix is hammer or press them out and use a nut and bolt kit on the up side the nut and bolt will be stronger.

Ry-
Hey Ry, thanks for pointing that out, I didn't even think of that. How did your Group N's look, the nuts? Easy to press out or would the mount be significantly messed up if I do use a press?

Hey, you know that metal "cover" in the rear? What if that was removed and the tophat was showing? Would that cover being removed provide enough thread on the bolts for the rear brace?

Last edited by kenliu84; 09-23-2010 at 12:12 AM.
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Old 09-22-2010, 10:42 PM   #809
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kenliu84 View Post
Alright, so I've been trying to figure out the ride heights of each type of RCE spring on a wagon as I am researching for my suspension setup.
Excellent write up. I just posted this in the other RCE/Wagon thread, but since I realized it may be more relevant here:
http://www.clubwrx.net/forums/suspen...k-springs.html
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Old 09-22-2010, 11:56 PM   #810
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Originally Posted by ArthurDent View Post
Excellent write up. I just posted this in the other RCE/Wagon thread, but since I realized it may be more relevant here:
http://www.clubwrx.net/forums/suspen...k-springs.html
thanks, I'm sure it'll help others in the future as well. BUT, they'll have to dig in this thread when the pages start building up, LOL
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Old 09-23-2010, 07:01 AM   #811
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Originally Posted by kenliu84 View Post
Hey Ry, thanks for pointing that out, I didn't even think of that. How did your Group N's look, the nuts? Easy to press out or would the mount be significantly messed up if I do use a press?


Ok I used a vice and a socket and a cheater pipe on the the Vice handle. So when you are done getting the studs out you put the bolt in like the stud came out then the saggy butt on then the nut holds it all in place. I was unsure about this assembly but it went together just fine and I have had no problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kenliu84 View Post
Hey, you know that metal "cover" in the rear? What if that was removed and the tophat was showing? Would that cover being removed provide enough thread on the bolts for the rear brace?
No it is very thin basically a dust cover.

R-
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Old 09-23-2010, 07:08 AM   #812
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Originally Posted by ArthurDent View Post
Excellent write up. I just posted this in the other RCE/Wagon thread, but since I realized it may be more relevant here:
http://www.clubwrx.net/forums/suspen...k-springs.html
This looks good I like the raked look so I link a small spacer in the rear would look good but not needed at all.

R-
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Old 10-05-2010, 12:21 PM   #813
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Originally Posted by labcoat View Post
This looks good I like the raked look so I link a small spacer in the rear would look good but not needed at all.

R-

labcoat - are you getting any rubbing at all at the 13.5"? do you load much in your wagon?

I just pulled the trigger on some rce's/dspecs from TiC, trying to decide if I want to put in the 1/4" spacers or not.

For me it isn't so much about look, just the future potential for rubbing (I've got 225/45/17's on the 'original' P7's +53, and 225/50/16 Pilot Sport A/S on the stockers for winter)

With the 1/4 spacers, I'll be at an even 14" both front/rear.

How much does evening out the car alter the geometry/handling?

I ordered the 1/4" spacers, but I'm 50/50 on if I want to install them or not.
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Old 10-05-2010, 01:14 PM   #814
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I have only had rubbing hitting a bad Hwy seam at 60-70mph hard and the rubbing was noticeable but not OMG. that was with a light load form a road trip.

I have a 8" sub and some tools in the back that is it for load most of the time.

I can what being even will do handling wise it will likely change your corner weights but is it enough to count, I don't know
R-
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Old 10-05-2010, 01:26 PM   #815
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Originally Posted by ezil71 View Post
I just pulled the trigger on some rce's/dspecs from TiC, trying to decide if I want to put in the 1/4" spacers or not.
Which springs?
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Old 10-05-2010, 02:09 PM   #816
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Originally Posted by Superorb View Post
Which springs?

RCE Wagons on the TiC setup (dspecs) with the com c mounts

Should give 14" front and 13.75" rear from what I understand.

With my current blown struts, my rear is at 14" and my front is at 15.5", so I may opt for 14" front and 14" rear just to be safe (unless that screws up how the car handles too much)
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Old 10-05-2010, 02:21 PM   #817
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I don't thinks its going to be very noticabe lto your handeling to use the the spacer and be even.

R-
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Old 10-05-2010, 02:51 PM   #818
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w/ the wagon springs I wouldn't use any spacer- not needed (like sedan springs)

the only reason I can think to add rear spacers w/ wagon springs is if you typically are carrying a lot of rearward weight
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Old 10-05-2010, 02:56 PM   #819
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hey evil, if you want to make it even f&r from hub to fender, then you'll need the 1/4" spacer. Plus, you'll be on the safer side once you start loading the rear
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Old 10-05-2010, 04:50 PM   #820
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Originally Posted by BIGSKYWRX View Post
w/ the wagon springs I wouldn't use any spacer- not needed (like sedan springs)

the only reason I can think to add rear spacers w/ wagon springs is if you typically are carrying a lot of rearward weight

right, I haul about 30-50 lbs of gear most of the time, so I may just be on the safe side and use them.

Can anyone who has had the RCE wagons on d specs for a while comment on how much they have settled over time?

Any binding issues?
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Old 10-05-2010, 06:43 PM   #821
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it's not overly difficult to add spacers at a later date- I say try w/o first, if becomes an issue you can always add a spacer

I think the stance of the RCE wagon springs is perfect as is- not too high, not too low- kind of a goldilocks deal
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Old 10-07-2010, 04:03 PM   #822
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Originally Posted by ezil71 View Post
right, I haul about 30-50 lbs of gear most of the time, so I may just be on the safe side and use them.

Can anyone who has had the RCE wagons on d specs for a while comment on how much they have settled over time?

Any binding issues?
Most people don't like gap difference, if you are one of them, use the 1/4" spacer.
30-50 lbs doesn't effect the ride height from my experience.
As for settling, there's pretty much none. Right after the install, it will sit a little higher, then it will be at height after you go to the grocery store to restock beer and back.
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Old 10-27-2010, 12:36 PM   #823
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Originally Posted by ezil71 View Post
RCE Wagons on the TiC setup (dspecs) with the com c mounts

Should give 14" front and 13.75" rear from what I understand.

With my current blown struts, my rear is at 14" and my front is at 15.5", so I may opt for 14" front and 14" rear just to be safe (unless that screws up how the car handles too much)

So I just got my setup, the TiC with dspecs and RCE wagon springs.

My issue is that I'm at 14.5 f and 13.5 rear, and I was expecting the above numbers (14 and 13.75)

I spoke with Clint and he is checking on the serial numbers for me to make sure nothing was swapped f/r, and thinks maybe I'm on the bumpstops in front.

My question is - did those of you on rce wagons get new front bumpstops with them, and if so, how much shorter were they than stock?

I'm guessing that perhaps that might be the issue.

Also - is it right that in looking at the rear coils with the suspension loaded, there should be 4-5 coils touching? the front doesn't have any touching and are fairly spaced out.

Thanks - Ed
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Old 10-27-2010, 01:05 PM   #824
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In the interest of helping, are you sure of your terminology? I ask because to me it doesn't make sense. Bumpstops are the rubber pieces around the strut shaft that keep the strut from bottoming out internally, causing damage. At rest, it does nothing. If you are in fact on the bumpstops at rest, that would mean the struts are almost completely compressed. IE, no travel.

Travis
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Old 10-27-2010, 01:24 PM   #825
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my stock bumps up front were ~3" ish tall the are cut down to like an ~1" IIRC

T_Racer69 I disagree with you assessment modern bump stops are some times in contact or near contact t stock hide hight.

ezil71 is the ride overly harsh up front?

R-
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