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Old 02-10-2012, 03:51 AM   #1
xbiker321
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Default Dyno Tune: 2006 STi 2.5L gt3076r makes 490hp 530tq

Event: dyno pull
Location: MAC Autosport. Parker, CO
Ambient Temp: 74*F
Elevation: 5,869 ft
Weather: sunny
Tires: Falcon Azines 235/40r17

Car: 2006 Subaru STi
Tuner: Nick @ MAC
Dyno Info: Dynojet
Transmission: 6speed
Peak HP at RPM: 489.14hp
Peak Torque at RPM: 527.90tq
Target Boost: 26psi @ peek and tapers off to 24psi
Fuel: e85
Engine/Power Modifications: GT3076R .63AR, CP Forged Pistons & Rings, Cosworth Bearings, Element Tuning Forged Rods, AEM v2, 1000 ID's, Aeromotive 340lph rewired to my Optima Red Top that is in the trunk, HKS FPR, Brand New Fuel Filter, Greddy EVO2 exhaust, Perrin catless downpipe, Perrin rotated kit up pipe, STi headers.
Suspension Modifications: Tein Super Flex Coilovers w/ EDFC, Perrin 23mm rear sway.


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Last edited by xbiker321; 02-12-2012 at 04:08 AM.
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Old 02-10-2012, 08:15 AM   #2
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Looks like a beast! What intercooler you running?
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Old 02-10-2012, 08:47 AM   #3
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Wow very nice. 2700 to 4500 must be breath taking.
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Old 02-10-2012, 11:18 AM   #4
bilt2run
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Uncorrect was 376/406? still impressive at your alltitude..folks need to remmember that dynos have a correction factor for NA engines, since turbo motors do NOT get effected by alltitude as much.
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Old 02-10-2012, 05:12 PM   #5
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Are you sure you only have 1000's? That's a lot of power to not be maxing those out.

Edit: Never mind I didn't see that it was corrected.
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Old 02-10-2012, 06:18 PM   #6
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ID 1000's were at 91% I believe. So not maxed out
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Old 02-10-2012, 06:35 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bilt2run View Post
Uncorrect was 376/406?...
Could you help me out with the math on that? I see an SAE correction factor of 1.23.

Dang, that's a lot of boost at 6K elevation - in terms of turbo efficiency, that's the same as running close to 29 psi at sea-level. You must have one honking big I/C on that car. There's very little hit to spool up too, impressive.
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Old 02-10-2012, 06:47 PM   #8
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Could you help me out with the math on that? I see an SAE correction factor of 1.23.

Dang, that's a lot of boost at 6K elevation - in terms of turbo efficiency, that's the same as running close to 29 psi at sea-level. You must have one honking big I/C on that car. There's very little hit to spool up too, impressive.
My error..I did the math and 23% would be 398/429 uncorrected. Even more impressive for that elevation. I suppose that compressor was maxed out at that boost...
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Old 02-10-2012, 08:36 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bilt2run View Post
Uncorrect was 376/406? still impressive at your alltitude..folks need to remmember that dynos have a correction factor for NA engines, since turbo motors do NOT get effected by alltitude as much.


Really? Because an engine with a turbo charger still functions the same way as a natural aspirated engine. Less dense air with less oxygen content is still going to have the same affects on the engine.
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Old 02-10-2012, 09:34 PM   #10
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Really? Because an engine with a turbo charger still functions the same way as a natural aspirated engine. Less dense air with less oxygen content is still going to have the same affects on the engine.
you are wrong..google turbo vs NA at alltitude correction and you will learn what enginers learned during WWII and what most drag racers learn on ther own as I have...
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Old 02-10-2012, 09:48 PM   #11
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don't think i would have tapered the boost (unless the A/R was forcing it?). not a fan of power dropoff.

spool is WOW though
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Old 02-10-2012, 10:44 PM   #12
xbiker321
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don't think i would have tapered the boost (unless the A/R was forcing it?). not a fan of power dropoff.

spool is WOW though
Yeah I'm not sure what was causing that, just seemed like it couldn't hold the boost, wastegate or something. It's tuned really safe though.

It does stink that I live at 6,000ft and then when we have cruises through the mountains it's like 9-10k ft above sea level. I'm just excited with that fast spool and torque. I'm haulin ass when my friends with their 35r's are still spooling up, lol.
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Old 02-11-2012, 12:01 AM   #13
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My error...
No worries, just wanted to make sure I wasn't fubar'd on the math. The GT3076 has a pretty big efficiency envelope, to be sure. I ran the same setup at 4K elevation, except with meth injection. I stopped at 25 psi, and tapered to 21.

As I suspect is even more the case with OP's car, it was quick above 3.5K. Not insane, but close.
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Old 02-11-2012, 12:07 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by xbiker321 View Post
Yeah I'm not sure what was causing that, just seemed like it couldn't hold the boost, wastegate or something.,,
I don't know if the GT3076 can hold 26 psi at 7K rpm at your altitude - it can only spin so fast, and that really isn't much of a taper at all. And, if it could, your tuner probably backed it down because he saw indications during the tune that it was getting too hot.

Last edited by flycaster; 02-11-2012 at 12:12 AM.
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Old 02-11-2012, 12:23 AM   #15
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just make sure you dont drive down to sea level or your cars gonna blow up
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Old 02-11-2012, 12:31 AM   #16
Phatron
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Originally Posted by bilt2run View Post
you are wrong..google turbo vs NA at alltitude correction and you will learn what enginers learned during WWII and what most drag racers learn on ther own as I have...
the NHRA says to use half corrections for turbo cars.

but its not about altitude anyway.....its density altitude that matters.

You can be at 5000 ft at 0* and have a density altitude of 500 ft or you could be at 3000 ft and its 120* and have a density altitude of 6000 ft.

so just using an altitude correction is wrong anyways....

The fact that this guy is running id1000's at 24psi on a gt30 is proof in itself that he isnt flowing anywhere near the air as people at sea level. i've maxed out id1000's on e85 with an hta68 at 20psi at sea level....on a 2L
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Old 02-11-2012, 04:25 PM   #17
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All true. Just for kicks, I ran his numbers first through one of my aviation calculators, and then here: http://wahiduddin.net/calc/calc_hp.htm

The numbers agreed in both cases: a Density Altitude of ~7.7K, and Relative Density of 79.3%. In other words, a N/A car will make 79.3% of standard day, sea-level power. Additionally, the Tuner's Calculator suggests an SAE correction of ~1.237, so Mac really didn't pump up the number on the dyno. Again, that's an N/A correction. (note, you have to plug numbers for DP and/or RH - they don't matter anywhere near as much as PA and Temp.) So, assuming Phatron's number of 50%, that should give a "true" correction factor of ~1.119. That gives the OP a wheel power of 437/471. No matter how you slice it, that's a buttload of power at a DA of 7.7K' elevation. (for those of you who do the calcs, you'll notice that the corrected air pressure that day was pretty high; ~ 30.39)

Phatron, does the NHRA say that the "half correction" is a constant? Second, looking at the 50% correction factor power numbers, in your experience how does those line up with E85, with his injectors at 91% DC's at 7K rpm and 24 psi?
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Old 02-11-2012, 04:33 PM   #18
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I haven't looked at them in years. It's just a straight altitude correction, not DA. And it has an * and the note just says "use half corrections for FI cars"
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Old 02-11-2012, 10:45 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatron View Post

The fact that this guy is running id1000's at 24psi on a gt30 is proof in itself that he isnt flowing anywhere near the air as people at sea level. i've maxed out id1000's on e85 with an hta68 at 20psi at sea level....on a 2L

Why?

If you maxed out id1ks with a hta68 then you had a fuel delivery problem outside of the injectors. Everyone is quick to blame injectors, 90% of the time its a fuel pumps/pressure/voltage that isn't working up to the task.
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Old 02-11-2012, 10:50 PM   #20
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can id1000's if setup properly with a rewire and chit and a bump in fuel pressure with a big ass pump flow a ton of fuel....sure.

can id1000's without a rewire and at stock FP....no.

so far you're the only person i've seen thats been able to run a gt35 on e85 with 1300's.....can it be done if setup a certain way....apparently. is that the way 99% of people have their cars? no. and most other shops have at least 1600's running 90+ idc's on a gt35 dual pumps

if im so far off why dont you post some logs of a gt30 at 24psi on id1000's on e85.....

i even have pump gas 20g's on id1000's at 20psi at 75% idc.....

you can always "not blame the injector" cause the injectors can flow a chit load if you turn the FP up with a proper pump

mikes dw1300's with his gt35 go over 100% at 16psi at redline...on a 340 and stock FP

since theres no FPR listed...im assuming this car is on a stock FPR.....so imo if this car goes to sea level he's gonna overboost and/or lean out like a mofo. maybe we can get him to take a drive and test it

Last edited by Phatron; 02-11-2012 at 11:24 PM.
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Old 02-11-2012, 11:20 PM   #21
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is that the way 99% of people have their cars? no.
A lot of people set their cars up pretty poorly though, and just from reading threads in the built motor forum and here it seems that many neglect the fuel system. Not saying you don't know what you're doing, but surely if you were able to have someone build their fuel system a bit more robustly you'd be able to get away with less injector rather than using the injectors to compensate.
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Old 02-11-2012, 11:26 PM   #22
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^^ as i said....i dont see a FPR listed....so have the dude drive down the mountain and log a pull with IDCs....simple test.

if you throw id1000's in a walbro, aero340, dw300 car at stock fp they scale like 850-880cc injectors.....and you aint running a gt30 at high boost on e85 on 850cc's.......vf turbos max 750's on e85 for gods sake
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Old 02-12-2012, 12:06 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatron View Post
can id1000's if setup properly with a rewire and chit and a bump in fuel pressure with a big ass pump flow a ton of fuel....sure.

can id1000's without a rewire and at stock FP....no.

so far you're the only person i've seen thats been able to run a gt35 on e85 with 1300's.....can it be done if setup a certain way....apparently. is that the way 99% of people have their cars? no. and most other shops have at least 1600's running 90+ idc's on a gt35 dual pumps

if im so far off why dont you post some logs of a gt30 at 24psi on id1000's on e85.....

i even have pump gas 20g's on id1000's at 20psi at 75% idc.....

you can always "not blame the injector" cause the injectors can flow a chit load if you turn the FP up with a proper pump

mikes dw1300's with his gt35 go over 100% at 16psi at redline...on a 340 and stock FP

since theres no FPR listed...im assuming this car is on a stock FPR.....so imo if this car goes to sea level he's gonna overboost and/or lean out like a mofo. maybe we can get him to take a drive and test it

id1ks, 3076, stock motor, walbro400, P&L fuel system...


I'm to tired to start looking through all my logs.. so that is just a quick one. I can find you more if you like though.. .. If you look at THE REAL RUSSIAN MISSILE THREAD you find a 140+mph full weight STI with 1600s and a proper fuel system. . If you look at the e85 thread you will find other FASTER examples of 1600s and e85 I have tuned with IDC logs, id2ks and 1 walbro trapping 138mph.. 1300dw's 1 walbro trapping 134-135mph etc.. I guess I'm the only one though ..
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Old 02-12-2012, 12:11 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by Pinned View Post
A lot of people set their cars up pretty poorly though, and just from reading threads in the built motor forum and here it seems that many neglect the fuel system. Not saying you don't know what you're doing, but surely if you were able to have someone build their fuel system a bit more robustly you'd be able to get away with less injector rather than using the injectors to compensate.
EXACTLY

IMO half the blown up cars around here are from ghetto fuel setups and band-aid tuning to go with it.

FWIW I am not bashing Ron saying that either. Just an observation
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Old 02-12-2012, 12:19 AM   #25
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^^ and the graph u posted is for a car with a "fuel system"....whats that entail? FPR? lines? increased fuel pressure?

i dont claim to know everything....im just speaking of the cars i've done with in tank pumps and stock FP.....and i've even tried increasing the FP on intank pumps and had no luck....it just made them crap out faster.

I think the key, as you've pointed out before, is the wiring.....getting the proper amps to the fuel pump.

Which i totally believe. as the ID1000's scaling as 850-880cc injectors on the stock chit seems to show a drastic drop in fuel pressure at high rpm.

so if this car has the wiring mod, thats great and it could explain it. but i believe its a stock FPR, stock fuel pressure car and the only reason it can run that boost is because its at altitude.

the owner should chime in tomorrow and let us know.

and for all the "fast" setups on smaller injectors....you'll find twice as many with larger injectors and higher idc's. "proper" fuel setup can mean lots of different things to lots of different people. some people just say "jack up the amps to the pump" and "jack up the fuel pressure" where as others say "dont do that or you're gonna overheat the pump".....idk whats right. i just know id1000's on stock FP wont support a gt30 on high boost at sea level.
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