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Old 11-08-2011, 08:59 AM   #126
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Only if you suck at driving.


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Old 11-08-2011, 10:08 AM   #127
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Only if you suck at driving.
Which would be 95% of the driving public.. so..
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Old 11-08-2011, 11:43 AM   #128
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So the other 5 % of us should be screwed because of that?

Great thinking, Keep lowering the bar...
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Old 11-08-2011, 11:52 AM   #129
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So the other 5 % of us should be screwed because of that?

Great thinking, Keep lowering the bar...
Uh... if one of the 95% backs up over your kid because he doesn't have a back-up sensor, does that still screw you over?

Safety sensors are for more than just the benefit of the person driving - hopefully it helps the 95% avoid accidents with the "perfect" 5%.

Oh sh--... this sounds like it might be degenerating into a Political debate about government safety legislation and civil liberties and I'm up against Scrappydo...
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Old 11-11-2011, 07:11 PM   #130
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Got to sit in one today at the Autoshow.

I have to say, I was sadly not very impressed. Didn't like the interior layout, the visibility was an issue (but not that bad excluding the huge blind spot).

I was more impressed with the Accent and the Kia Rio, just as good of interiors but more usability and better visibility with similar motors.
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Old 11-11-2011, 07:17 PM   #131
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Which would be 95% of the driving public.. so..
I'm pretty sure 95% of the driving public will say that the other 95% of the driving public are bad drivers.

Kind of like how 95% of girls think they are hotter than the other 95% of girls.
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Old 11-11-2011, 07:32 PM   #132
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Uh... if one of the 95% backs up over your kid because he doesn't have a back-up sensor, does that still screw you over?

Safety sensors are for more than just the benefit of the person driving - hopefully it helps the 95% avoid accidents with the "perfect" 5%.

Oh sh--... this sounds like it might be degenerating into a Political debate about government safety legislation and civil liberties and I'm up against Scrappydo...
I'd rather take reactive approach to crimes and accidents than an active approach which, indeed, lowers the bar. How about make drivers tests actually difficult instead and say "**** you" to the most common means of transportation?

Less traffic, maintenance costs, old people hazards, accidents. More public transportation use etc... I can see endless benefits by making our society only support skilled people (except for the very few unskilled laborers we need).
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Old 11-11-2011, 11:07 PM   #133
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Originally Posted by WRXHillClimb

I'd rather take reactive approach to crimes and accidents than an active approach which, indeed, lowers the bar. How about make drivers tests actually difficult instead and say "**** you" to the most common means of transportation?

Less traffic, maintenance costs, old people hazards, accidents. More public transportation use etc... I can see endless benefits by making our society only support skilled people (except for the very few unskilled laborers we need).
I partially agree. Definitely need tougher drivers license tests. Finland has it down.
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Old 11-14-2011, 09:19 AM   #134
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Originally Posted by Kostamojen View Post
Got to sit in one today at the Autoshow.

I have to say, I was sadly not very impressed. Didn't like the interior layout, the visibility was an issue (but not that bad excluding the huge blind spot).

I was more impressed with the Accent and the Kia Rio, just as good of interiors but more usability and better visibility with similar motors.
Our Kia dealership got the new Rios in finally and I'm looking forward to seeing them in person. I going to keep dreaming that if the Veloster gets a turbo that maybe it will trickle its way into the Rio family as well.
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Old 11-14-2011, 09:25 AM   #135
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Uh... if one of the 95% backs up over your kid because he doesn't have a back-up sensor, does that still screw you over?

Safety sensors are for more than just the benefit of the person driving - hopefully it helps the 95% avoid accidents with the "perfect" 5%.

Oh sh--... this sounds like it might be degenerating into a Political debate about government safety legislation and civil liberties and I'm up against Scrappydo...
You need not worry, I almost always lose political arguments, I just hide that fact with denial, and off topic rants. Just ask Balantz and Shik.

But to address your first paragraph, I plan to teach my kid not to play behind a parked car, and especially not behind a parked RUNNING CAR.

I take responsibility for my kids safety. He will learn to look out for dumb people.
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Old 11-14-2011, 09:32 AM   #136
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Our Kia dealership got the new Rios in finally and I'm looking forward to seeing them in person. I going to keep dreaming that if the Veloster gets a turbo that maybe it will trickle its way into the Rio family as well.
I doubt they'll put a turbo into a vehicle consider a entry level car. if anything, they put it into a Forte or maybe the Soul.
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Old 11-15-2011, 12:54 PM   #137
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I take responsibility for my kids safety. He will learn to look out for dumb people.
You cannot escape the will of dumb people! THEY WILL FIND A WAY TO KILL YOUR KID AND NOT GET CHARGED WITH MURDER!

Seriously, though - I'm totally with you on this one.

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Old 03-24-2012, 08:52 AM   #138
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Clarkson on the Hyundai Veloster

James May claims that he knows when he is driving a car with character and panache because a fizzing sensation engulfs the root of his penis.

Unfortunately, because my groin is unmoved by inanimate objects, I have to rely on other means to determine whether a car has flair and zing and all the little things that somehow elevate it from something you need to something you want.

I don't know what these ‘means' are. I have not the vaguest clue how I know the Fiat Panda has character and the Toyota Avensis does not. There is not one single tangible reason why I love the Ferrari 458 Italia but only respect the McLaren MP4-12C. Both cars do the same thing and make the same noise, but one makes your heart sing and the other doesn't.
It's even more peculiar with the Range Rover Evoque and the Land Rover Freelander. Both come from the same people and are designed to do the same job, but one is a tool that will not stir James's tool into action. And one is a tool that will.

We see this not just with cars, but with other machines as well. Why, for instance, do I find the Boeing 777 boring, but get all bouncy when I note that I'm boarding a 747? They are both the same. But they are not. It's a similar story with telephones. Blackberrys cause me to fall into a deep sleep. iPhones don't. The list goes on. People will make a pointless journey in a train if it's being pulled by a steam locomotive. I will buy anything made by Bang & Olufsen. And even though it's crap, I love the AK-47 so much that I'd rather fight for the Russian army than ours. Just so I could have one.

I suppose it's the same with women. You meet thousands and thousands, and there are many whom you respect and like. Then one day, you meet a girl who has lungs and ears just like all the others, but you fall in love. Often, this will be accompanied by a fizzing sensation in the root of your penis.

All of this brings me neatly on to the Hyundai i40, which is a medium-sized saloon car from a giant Korean corporation. It was designed to match the Toyota Avensis and the Volkswagen Passat, and it does so in every way. Which means it's right up there with your dishwasher and your tumble dryer and your boiler as a household product that should - and hopefully will - give many years of faithful service.

Many people who are not interested in cars bought smaller Hyundais under Peter Mandelson's idiotic scrappage scheme, and I'm sure that - to a man and woman - they're all delighted with their new purchase. It's much easier to drive and much less likely to go wrong than the rusty bag of bolts they sent to the knacker's yard.

I have no problem with any of this. I quite understand that many, many people see the car as a necessary evil. An expense they can do without. A white good. That's fine. I won't pour scorn on them any more than I would expect Jeremy Paxman to pour scorn on me for buying my trout from a supermarket rather than standing in freezing river water and catching one.
I quite understand that many people see the cars as a necessary evil. An expense they can do without. A white good.
So, yes. If you are reading this in a dentist's waiting room, only because the woman opposite has Hello and the only alternative is a knitting magazine, then buy a Hyundai. Or wait a couple of years and buy a Geely Beauty Leopard, or a JAC J7 from the Chinese. Because it'll be just as reliable and even cheaper.

However, I can't see anyone buying Hyundai's newest car - the Veloster.
Because, if you are not interested in cars, you will wonder why it has two doors on one side and only one on the other. And why it has scoops on the bonnet, and why it costs £17,995 when for two-thirds of that you can buy a Hyundai i10, which is easier to park and uses less fuel.

And if you are interested in cars, you will hate it on a cellular level, because this is a car that's trying to be something it isn't - interesting.
The brochure talks about ‘sporty acceleration' and a ‘true racing driver experience', but that's like calling me slim and handsome. It's b*ll*cks. This is one of the dreariest cars I've ever driven.

Dreary doesn't really matter in a hatchback or a saloon, but it emphatically does matter in a car like this. We all know the Capri was a Cortina in a posh frock, but we put up with the humdrum underpinnings because it looked so good. We would even pay more.

It was the same with the old Hyundai Coupe. That wasn't much cop to drive, but it looked a bit like a Ferrari, if you were far away and it was misty, and, because of that, it was fine.

Then you have the Mitsubishi Evo. That looks terrible, but we'll pay the extra and put up with the yawnmatic styling because it's a hoot to drive, because it has character and flair and zing and all the other things that make James's penis quiver.

The Veloster does none of these things. The styling doesn't work at all. It's silly. And because of the split rear screen, you can't see what's behind you. Don't get me started on the doors, either. No, actually, do get me started. What were they thinking of? I realise that a child can't get out into the traffic, and that's nice, but when you're in a car park, or at home, having to shuffle over the seats to get out is a bloody nuisance.

You get the impression that if this car worked in an office, it would have a sign on its desk saying ‘You don't have to be mad to work here...' signifying to everyone that it is the most boring person in the building.

But it's the drive that's worse, because there is not a single thing that leaps out and holds your attention. The engine is an engine. The gearbox is a gearbox. The steering is electric, but not in a good way, and the touchscreen ‘media centre' mentioned in the brochure is a radio.

I was stuck behind a Peugeot on a drive up the Fosse Way last night, and, even though there were many long straights with nothing coming the other way, I simply couldn't be bothered to overtake.

Hyundai has made this car using all of the lessons it's learned over the years about long warranties and good quality. But what the company doesn't understand is that when you make a car that's supposed to be interesting, it needs to be interesting.

It needs to make a sporty noise, or look good, or corner well. It needs to have a feel, a certain unquantifiable something that sets it apart from the herd. An invisible beckoning finger. A come-hither look in its headlights. It needs to feel like it was made by an enthusiast, someone who likes cars, someone who understands the mechanics of James's sausage. Because, if it doesn't, what you end up with is a Veloster. An accountant in a clown suit.
http://www.topgear.com/uk/jeremy-cla...rch-2012-03-22
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Old 03-28-2012, 11:47 PM   #139
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Saw my first Veloster on the road yesterday. Being delivered to the service bay on the back of a flatbad. haha
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Old 03-29-2012, 10:44 AM   #140
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I'm considering a replacement for my WRX and I'd like to get something a bit more fuel efficient and the Veloster was on my list of cars (which include the new Impreza, Skyactiv 3, Lexus CT200h, & Prius c... maybe.) I'm not considering a TDI because my buddy's '10 Jetta has violent shakes coming from the engine every so often and I'm wary of VAG products due to issues my family previously encountered.

I test drove a DCT equipped Veloster because the dealership didn't have a manual. They said I'd have to "special order" a manual because they're not selling.

Objectively, the standard feature list easily surpasses everything that I'm looking at, has excellent EPA mpgs, and is second to the Lexus in interior quality. I liked the interior, but I'd need time to get used to the button overload. It was also quiet, not much road noise intrudes into the cabin. The rear seats will likely be useless for an adult, I'm 5'9 and my head was grazing the glass as I sat upright. Subjectively, however, I was not particularly enamored with the way it drove. I can get used to the rear view but the blind spots made my attempts to pass much more deliberate. For a car weighing ~2700 lbs, it felt alot heavier and bigger than my WRX. It simply didn't feel tossable. The steering had good heft but it still lacked feedback and it was weird the wheel wouldn't naturally wind back after a turn. Overall, the car felt planted but the steering remains my biggest gripe. So far, it's still a solid contender.

Last edited by noodleface; 03-29-2012 at 03:04 PM.
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Old 03-29-2012, 12:18 PM   #141
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I've gotten used to that aspect of the steering. Actually never really noticed it.
That rear suspension will drive you nuts, though.
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Old 03-29-2012, 12:32 PM   #142
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The steering had good heft but it still lacked feedback and it was weird the wheel wouldn't naturally wind back after a turn.
That's an alignment issue (borked caster setting or really bad toe setting). I'd talk with the dealership about checking the alignment and letting you have another test drive. It might feel far more tossable with a proper alignment as well.


Xan, have you aligned yours yet? Noticed any tire wear? I know Subaru loved to deliver STI's with a ton of front toe-in which made them turn like pigs.

noodleface, have you actually done the math to determine how many miles it will cost you to make up for buying another new car? Even with $4/gal fuel I bet it will take you many years to get ahead again.. during which you could have been driving a WRX rather than a wheezy economy car.
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Old 03-29-2012, 01:33 PM   #143
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That's an alignment issue (borked caster setting or really bad toe setting). I'd talk with the dealership about checking the alignment and letting you have another test drive. It might feel far more tossable with a proper alignment as well.


Xan, have you aligned yours yet? Noticed any tire wear? I know Subaru loved to deliver STI's with a ton of front toe-in which made them turn like pigs.

noodleface, have you actually done the math to determine how many miles it will cost you to make up for buying another new car? Even with $4/gal fuel I bet it will take you many years to get ahead again.. during which you could have been driving a WRX rather than a wheezy economy car.
Thanks for the heads-up. I won't write off the Veloster due to the steering issue but that's good to know about a proper alignment potentially alleviating the issue.

I consulted the gas savings comparison tool on fueleconomy.gov and it looks like I'd save anywhere from $1200 (Impreza) - $2200 (Prius c) on gas alone and roughly $400 in insurance costs yearly. My commute is ~80 miles each day with 75% highway/25% city.

I've also been quoted in the $16k-$19k for my trade in and I'm paying the differences in cash so I'd likely break even sooner rather than later. I think at the worse, 4 years at the latest assuming I get the least value for my trade and the least fuel efficient car with gas prices staying around $4.

Don't get me wrong, this won't be a light decision by any stretch, I'm still reluctant to let go of my WRX. It's not perfect but it suits my needs, fuel economy aside, almost to a T.

Last edited by noodleface; 03-29-2012 at 03:05 PM.
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Old 03-29-2012, 01:39 PM   #144
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Originally Posted by Calamity Jesus

That's an alignment issue (borked caster setting or really bad toe setting). I'd talk with the dealership about checking the alignment and letting you have another test drive. It might feel far more tossable with a proper alignment as well.

Xan, have you aligned yours yet? Noticed any tire wear? I know Subaru loved to deliver STI's with a ton of front toe-in which made them turn like pigs.
I haven't. I had it looked at to see if it needed an alignment, the shop said no, that was enough for me.
There isn't any problematic tire wear - the tires are just ****. The tirerack reviews are like five pages of "the worst tires I've ever had" and "needed to be replaced after 14,000 miles." I'm actually looking forward to putting something better on here. I think good tires will really make it come alive.
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Old 03-29-2012, 04:36 PM   #145
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They said I'd have to "special order" a manual because they're not selling.
That's interesting since you can't order a Hyundai.
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Old 03-29-2012, 10:05 PM   #146
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Ive seen quite a few of these around already.
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Old 03-30-2012, 02:57 AM   #147
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That's interesting since you can't order a Hyundai.
Yep. Find a new dealer.
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Old 04-17-2012, 04:03 AM   #148
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There's two red ones, they look nice but are tiny! I might test drive a turbo when they come just to give it a chance?
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Old 04-18-2012, 12:19 AM   #149
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An accountant in a clown suit, huh? Ouch.

Sounds like this car might be a lot like the Kia Forte. Lots of potential, great on paper, but less than the sum of it's parts.
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Old 04-19-2012, 04:44 PM   #150
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An accountant in a clown suit, huh? Ouch.

Sounds like this car might be a lot like the Kia Forte. Lots of potential, great on paper, but less than the sum of it's parts.
What it really is is the 4-banger Tiburon. A style exercise on a basic car. An Accent in funky clothes.

Now, we will see when the Turbo comes out if it becomes a driver's car.
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