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Old 06-02-2012, 02:10 PM   #1
caschmidt
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Member#: 194453
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: central NH
Vehicle:
2001 Legacy 2.5 GT
Winestone Pearl

Default 2001 Legacy 4EAT to 5MT manual swap

So I will try to make this as detailed as possible... I swapped my 2001 Legacy GT from the 4EAT to a 5 speed manual. The transmission I got was from a 2002 Impreza 2.5 TS from Vermont that had been hit in the side and totaled. I ripped the trans and pedal assembly out myself just to see how it came apart so it would be easier putting back together. This thing was RUSTY! Amazing how much a car can rust in 10 years. Anyway it took me pretty much the whole morning and into the early afternoon to take the trans, pedal assy, driveshaft, shifter assy, and master cylinder out. The rear differential was WAY too rusty to take out. I jumped on the cheater bar on those bolts and it would not budge. Fortunately, I grabbed a rear 3.90 rear diff from a legacy in the junkyard a few months back and discovered that the ratios were the same. That was pretty much all I needed from the donor car. While my Legacy was off the road, I figured I would take care of a few things. The timing belt was due in a couple thousand miles, so while the engine was out, it would have been stupid not to. I bought a set of Bilsteins from Japan. Also, I decided to rust proof a bunch of things seeing as how I live in New Hampshire ...


Here is the list of all of the parts I needed and purchased and how much it ruined my bank account:

  • -$400 5-speed manual Transmission, Pedal Assembly, Rear Differential, Master/slave cylinder, clutch lines, Transmission crossmember
  • - 330 Bilstein shocks and struts from Japan (used, with shipping)
  • - 15 Shifter linkages- these are model specific. The ones from the Impreza would not fit in the Legacy body. Had a hell of a time finding some that hadn't been hacked off by the junkyard workers that rip out the engines and transmissions. Thankfully they sold them cheap they run $300+ at the dealer.
  • - 25 driveshaft- I originally was planning to swap my 98 wagon, so I got a driveshaft from the 2nd generation legacy. Turns out it fits on the 3rd gen too.
  • - 286 Brand new clutch and lightweight flywheel kit. Flywheel weighs 12.5 lbs
  • - 196 Timing belt water pump kit including all the pulleys and tensioner
  • - 26 thermostat/seal
  • - 8 exhaust manifold gaskets
  • - 8 donut gasket between cat and midpipe
  • - 17 trans and diff fluid. Got cheap stuff at first to make sure everything worked. Will put higher quality fluid in in a few thousand miles
  • - 63 POR15- This is very high quality rust preventative paint. Bought a gallon with my landlord and split the cost.

I did not need cv axles, fortunately they were all the same length. One for the rear was a different part number however. I think because the manuals have power split 50/50 front to rear and the automatics do not, the rear axle in the manual may have a higher torque/hp rating, not sure just a guess. It still fits right into the diff.

Total I spent just under $1,400. I highly recommend getting new engine mounts and trans mount and shifter bushings (as long as it needs them, while everything is apart). I made the mistake of not doing so, so my trans mount is very deteriorated along with the rear bushing that holds in the shifter assy.




Day 1:

Most of the day I spend clearing the garage and preparing everything. Got the car up on jack stands. Took out the old shocks and struts. I spent ~$800 on a whole set of new KYBs with H&R springs. I loved the way it sat, but the ride was far too stiff. That was 20k miles ago, and figured I'd change them while it was apart. Which is why I bought the Bilsteins, so I could still get some money for my old shocks and springs.

Took off the whole exhaust and the shield just below the drivedshaft.

I also swapped out the rear differential. Unbolted the driveshaft from the diff. Got the 2 bolts on the back using a very long cheater bar and dropped the whole thing with the small frame holding it in. I did not have to disassemble anything else in the rear suspension. I dropped the diff with a jack, slowly step by step while prying out the cv axles AFTER draining the fluid in the diff. I cleaned off the diff that had been sitting in the basement and jacked it in while inserting the axles. That was enough for one day....





Day 2:

Spend the day taking apart all the plastic bits in the wheel wells along with the fuel filler neck (notorious rust spot). Cleaned off all of the dirt and grime on the underside and in the wheel wells. Put one coat of the POR15 paint on the rear wheel wells. This was very time consuming. Day 2 over.




Day 3 & 4:

Drained the coolant, took out the radiator and eventually got everything taken off the engine so that it was ready to be pulled. Unhooked the auto shifter assy. Drained the trans fluid and removed the driveshaft. Got the left axle bolt free and took out that axle so that the trans would come out a little more freely. Got the engine hoist and lifted the engine and trans as one unit while taking out the other cv axle. This was quite the pain in the arse. The 4EAT is so massive it just barely fit through the space between the firewall and the front subframe. The engine had to go up more and the rear of the trans had to come down. After quite a bit of wrestling and rocking it finally came free. Had to keep a drain pan under the back of the trans, fluid will pour out...








Day 5:

Cleaned and prepped more of the underside. Pretty much spend the whole day painting. Did two coats on the underside and the wheel wells. Also disassembled the auto shifter assy inside.

Started tackling the pedal assy as well. This took a lot of wrestling. Getting the auto brake out is not hard, but getting the other one in was very difficult. The brake and clutch are on the same assembly, the gas pedal is separate and is the same part on the auto and the manual, although it does need to be unbolted to fit the clutch/brake assy behind it. I also realized that the brake light switch is different on the manual, but that was just a matter of swapping the one over from the auto brake pedal. I also popped out the rubber plug that goes in the holes where the master cylinder comes through the firewall.








Day 6:

Today was a very busy day. My friends came up from PA and helped tremendously. First, we got the bolts off of the torque converter. These bolts are ridiculously soft and very easy to round off. They are also fairly hard to get to. It is wise to remove the bolts holding the torque converter to the flex plate first to assure the TC stays on the transmission. I learned that the hard way on my other subaru and spent over an hour trying to fit the TC back into its place in the trans. After my landlord got those bolts free, the engine and trans could then be separated.

After they were separated, we then took the flex plate off. The bolts that hold on the flywheel (where the flex pate bolts to on the auto) are longer than the bolts that hold on the flex plate. I bought an old 2.2 liter engine a few months back that had a clutch on it, so I disassembled that and used those bolts to hold on my flywheel. The new clutch was assembled and the 5MT was bolted back to the engine. Also replaced the timing belt, water pump, tenisioner, and idler pulleys while the engine was out of the car. I had never done it before so I was very hesitant, but my landlord helped me out, yet again, and finished all of that.


After i knew all of the POR15 rust paint was dry and solid, I put in the bilsteins and got most of the suspension back together. In the mean time my buddy took all the good bits of all of the shifter assemblies that I got and made one good one. Again, I should have bought new bushings while it was apart...







Amazingly we had the engine and trans back in the car by the end of the 6th day. There was still a lot of hooking up to do but it was in the car.




Day 7:

Got everything on the engine where it needs to be. Attached the shifter assy in the car. The bushing in the back that holds the shifter in place went missing for several hours.... Almost put a stop to the project. Finally it turned up. On the underside of the body behind the space where the shifter goes through were two plastic plugs that covered threaded bolt holes. I popped those out and found 2 bolts that threaded into there (bonus bolts from other projects). You can kind of see the rusty bracket on the bottom of the pic. Thats on the back side.



The transmission subframe pretty much just bolted in. Although at first we did not have all of the pieces. I got a subframe from a junkyard thinking that it may have been different on the legacy and impreza. So I thought I had the subframe bolted in but there's a piece in the front that spans almost the width between the control arms. There was another set of plastic plugs that covered threads in the body right next to the bolt that holds the control arm onto the body. I popped those out and used the subframe that I originally got from the impreza. Again I found two big bolts from other projects that fit those holes. Turns out the one out of the legacy that I got from the junkyard had that piece missing. The impreza and the legacy one are interchangeable. I used the impreza one reluctantly, it is very rusty. Will probably need to find one in better shape in the future. I do not have a picture of it...

As for the wiring on the starter, we basically hotwired it. Ran a wire directly from the ignition to the starter. This got around the start interrupt that does not allow the car to start if its in R or D. So we heard it run briefly which was very nice to hear. Then I turned it off and the key would not come out of the ignition. On the automatics it holds the key in unless its in P. We took off the cover under the ignition and found the little solenoid that moves back to let the key out. My landlord plugged that pin that sticks down with the end of a zip tie to stop it from locking.

By the end of the day it was ready to be put on its wheels and tested And she moved! Backed out of the garage and took her for a test drive. The first noise we noticed was the lower boot on the shift linkage rubbing against the driveshaft. I just poked some more holes in the boot to stretch it out of the way. Mechanically so far everything is working smoothly. What a relief.

Now there's the issue of the 8 Check Engine Light codes. And the speedometer. I did not want to drive it much without the speedo working. Didnt want to rack up too many unknown miles. After a LOT of trial and error with the speedo I finally got it to work. The automatic has 3 Vehicle Speed Sensors, one for the torque converter, one front and one rear sensors. I think it has those two because the auto splits power 50/50 when the front wheels slip.

This is the link I used for the ECM pinout:

http://www.northursalia.com/modifica...ng/wiring.html

With the 3 pins on the ECU:

http://www.northursalia.com/modifica...g/2001ecu1.jpg
http://www.northursalia.com/modifica...g/2001ecu2.jpg
http://www.northursalia.com/modifica...g/2001ecu3.jpg


for the VSS there are 3 wires coming out of the trans. One is power going to the sensor, one is ground and the other is the signal. Black and Red is the ground, just found a ground on the firewall that was close. As of right now its still in 'test mode...' I have wires looped around the outside of the car to test it. The VSS needs 5 volts to power it. I found that by sliding a wire in to one of the pins on the ECU. I found out the one that powers the fuel tank pressure sensor power supply has 5 volts after looking at a pinout of the ECU (B136 pin 15). So I found some spare wire and tested all my voltage with a multimeter. As for the signal, I used B135 pin 24 and hooked up the wire with both ends of the original wire (goes to the speedo and the ECU). Speedo works! still need to find 5 volts under the hood and find the signal wire that goes through the firewall, but at least I know which wires go where...

After I got the speedometer working I took it to work the next day. I hadn't driven it too much with no speedo. Took it to work and back once before and drove around town a little bit, so I drove it maybe 60 or 70 miles. On the way home from work it started holding the throttle. If I was in gear it would hold the throttle a little bit, not enough to make it accelerate but definitely noticeable. It would hold it for maybe 6 or 8 seconds then fuel cut. It forced me to ride the clutch when upshifting. very very annoying. I had the battery disconnected all night and tried again in the morning. This time it idles at 3k rpm. Just hangs there. So far my CELs are a bunch of trans error codes and the heated o2 sensor circuit. Its pouring all day so it will be a while until I can figure this out.

I grounded the pin that supposedly tells the computer that the ECU that the car is manual. B135 pin 4 pink wire. That did not seem to do anything though. it still gives me AT error codes. I grabbed a computer from an 00 legacy 5MT and for some reason it will not run with that computer. It cranks and cranks then suddenly stops. but will not actually start. tried reading codes on that computer but it does not throw any. Im wondering if it has something to do with MAP sensor vs. MAF. Mine is a MAP but I know that changed from year to year.

I dont know what to do at this point. Once it dries up outside Ill check all of my o2 sensor wires and plugs. make sure its all correct. Other that that Im pretty stumped. If anyone has any input it would be greatly appreciated. Feel free to ask me any questions if anything is not clear. Im not the best at explaining things....
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Old 06-05-2012, 09:17 AM   #2
PHATsuby
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to stock is a project too

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The reason the 5mt ECU won't work is because it has different trigger info. The crank teeth on a 5mt BE is the same as a wrx actually, so if you want it to work with that ecu you will need to change the crankshaft sprocket and the camshaft sprocket I believe as well. Your car is a 6 tooth crank and 7 tooth cam, the 5mt is something like a 40 tooth crank and 2 tooth cam I believe.

What I did I think was just kept my TCU plugged in, one plug was plugged in and the other was not(don't recall which one). I constantly had a CEL though but I could drive the car fine.

What sucks is you already had the motor out to do the timing belt...but if I were to do it over I'd prob want to swap those parts and run a 5mt ecu.

Hope that helps some.

Ben
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Old 06-06-2012, 08:17 AM   #3
caschmidt
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Winestone Pearl

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That makes sense.... That definitely explains why the 5MT ECU didn't work. Thank you for that info. It sucks I'll have to take the belt off again but I guess it's not urgent. Its running fine now..

So I (my brother) discovered the problem with the high idle. Turns out when I spliced into the speedometer circuit it must've told the car that the cruise control was on. So the last time I used the cruise it was on the highway at around 3k rpm. So I just unhooked the cable that goes to the throttle body. Problem temporarily solved
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Old 06-06-2012, 12:43 PM   #4
spencerlinn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PHATsuby View Post
The reason the 5mt ECU won't work is because it has different trigger info. The crank teeth on a 5mt BE is the same as a wrx actually, so if you want it to work with that ecu you will need to change the crankshaft sprocket and the camshaft sprocket I believe as well. Your car is a 6 tooth crank and 7 tooth cam, the 5mt is something like a 40 tooth crank and 2 tooth cam I believe.

What I did I think was just kept my TCU plugged in, one plug was plugged in and the other was not(don't recall which one). I constantly had a CEL though but I could drive the car fine.

What sucks is you already had the motor out to do the timing belt...but if I were to do it over I'd prob want to swap those parts and run a 5mt ecu.

Hope that helps some.

Ben
Ben, how on earth did you know that? I've been scouring the entire service manual library and have yet to come across anything that definitively says whether the programming in the two ECU's is different, let alone different triggers and other hardware. I've found plenty of references to the "ground a pin, now it's manual" trick on the internet, but none have been confirmed on the third gen, just second, and my service manuals don't mention a pin that serves that function. I do have a T30 with Subaru Select Monitor 3 and a TTL interface cable which supposedly will work for coding but not diagnostics. Do you suspect it's possible to change the "coding" on the ECU without changing the "programming"? I'm used to BMWs, which consider coding to be things like "am I a manual?", "What lights are DRLs?" and programming is the lower-level stuff like "what triggers do I use" and "what's my fuel map?", so I'm hoping there might be a way to code what we need into the ECU.

Thanks,

Doktor Spencebot
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Old 06-06-2012, 06:40 PM   #5
PHATsuby
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to stock is a project too

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Quote:
Originally Posted by spencerlinn View Post
Ben, how on earth did you know that? I've been scouring the entire service manual library and have yet to come across anything that definitively says whether the programming in the two ECU's is different, let alone different triggers and other hardware. I've found plenty of references to the "ground a pin, now it's manual" trick on the internet, but none have been confirmed on the third gen, just second, and my service manuals don't mention a pin that serves that function. I do have a T30 with Subaru Select Monitor 3 and a TTL interface cable which supposedly will work for coding but not diagnostics. Do you suspect it's possible to change the "coding" on the ECU without changing the "programming"? I'm used to BMWs, which consider coding to be things like "am I a manual?", "What lights are DRLs?" and programming is the lower-level stuff like "what triggers do I use" and "what's my fuel map?", so I'm hoping there might be a way to code what we need into the ECU.

Thanks,

Doktor Spencebot
Well, I am a "Scooby Guru" afterall lol. No, unfortunately I had to deal with this first hand when I turbo'd my car and was running an Autronic ECU. I was basically copying a friend who had a manual BE and we assumed they were the same. After 3 months of the car sitting because it would not run and having gone over my wiring to make sure it was correct multiple times someone suggested I change it to the "old" trigger configuration since I was using the manual BE trigger info. Switched one setting and it fired right up. You can see the differences if you look at the exploded engine view it should show two crank sprockets, or under the fuel injection section it will show the waveform of the crank and cam and has both I believe.

There is no grounding pin for the BE unfortunately so that will not work, or at least I am 99% sure it won't as I looked for it a while ago as well and it doesn't exist on the wiring diagrams. Your only real option may be open source tuning if anyone has done a BE and you can flash the different ROMs but your easiest and certain solution is to swap the trigger wheels and run the 5mt ECU.

Hope that helps.

Ben
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Old 06-11-2012, 12:19 AM   #6
srt-4killa
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nice pics and details
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Old 06-11-2012, 01:39 AM   #7
ballitch
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Wrx Tranny,slowr than ish

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Quote:
Originally Posted by PHATsuby View Post
Well, I am a "Scooby Guru" afterall lol. No, unfortunately I had to deal with this first hand when I turbo'd my car and was running an Autronic ECU. I was basically copying a friend who had a manual BE and we assumed they were the same. After 3 months of the car sitting because it would not run and having gone over my wiring to make sure it was correct multiple times someone suggested I change it to the "old" trigger configuration since I was using the manual BE trigger info. Switched one setting and it fired right up. You can see the differences if you look at the exploded engine view it should show two crank sprockets, or under the fuel injection section it will show the waveform of the crank and cam and has both I believe.

There is no grounding pin for the BE unfortunately so that will not work, or at least I am 99% sure it won't as I looked for it a while ago as well and it doesn't exist on the wiring diagrams. Your only real option may be open source tuning if anyone has done a BE and you can flash the different ROMs but your easiest and certain solution is to swap the trigger wheels and run the 5mt ECU.

Hope that helps.

Ben
Sub'd so I can no longer give false info for others doing M/T swaps on 3rd gen's......


~Josh~
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Old 06-21-2012, 12:17 AM   #8
caschmidt
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Winestone Pearl

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So I've discovered that the 5MT from the factory has a different crank sprocket, but the cam sprocket seems to be the same. I'm still working on how to make the car think it's got a manual. It still stalls occasionally after its warm, after I start it up again. Goes away after a while and doesn't give me any issues once I start driving it. Really don't feel like taking off the timing belt again... And my ABS is still non-existent
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Old 06-23-2012, 09:59 PM   #9
spencerlinn
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Default 5MT Swap Electrical Update

So, did some more digging around with electrical issues resulting from the swap. Found quite a lot of strange things that I wouldn't have suspected from a Japanese car... Almost seems like Subaru made this exact project deliberately difficult – just for fun.

So here are the things that caschmidt and I noticed:

The cam timing sprocket, as Ben noted, was different. I had one ordered at the local dealer for a whopping $20. It certainly was much more intricate in design (read: more pulses/rev) than the automatic version. The FSM also shows the ignition system using these different versions, and strangely, the automatic (with it's simpler crank sprocket) also shows input from a cam timing sprocket. The FSM only shows the crank sprocket on the manual, as if the manual doesn't use a cam sprocket and that's possibly why the crank sprocket is more complex.

Despite this, two or three manual 2nd gen imprezas in a local wreckers yard had the simpler crank sprocket???!!!?

Also, found a strange reference to a pin on the ECU which supposedly is an AT/MT Identification pin – pull-up type, like that seen on the 2nd gens, ground the pin (which is internally held logic-high) and the ECU acts manual. Made sure the resistance to 5V logic high wasn't more than 1kΩ, it wasn't, so we grounded it. ECU immediately acted totally different. Didn't seem to stall or bog at startup, however caschmidt noticed that revs hung in-between shifts - as if the ECU were holding the IAC open... Also tried connecting and disconnecting this pin while engine was running, and each time the ECU responded by very clearly changing idle, as if it were clearing adaptations and finding idle again, although either way it never stalled and seemed to idle smoother with the pin grounded. None of this makes sense since everything I've heard point to the 3rd gen NOT using the same ECU for manual/auto. I've found plenty of differences - namely the ignition timing Ben mentioned, as well as the idle air controller, which is a simple solenoid on the auto, and a very German-like stepper motor on the manual. While I agree with Ben, that there probably isn't a "AT/MT Identification" pin on the BE ECU, I couldn't help but try as I mentioned. The pin referenced on the document I found was Connector B135 Pin 25. This pin doesn't appear to even be listed on the FSM I have for the car. It certainly does something, and it's definitely an input as the resistance is 2.01kΩ.

While I think that running a 5MT ECU is the best option, there's just too much that's different. Idle air controller, sprockets, and a bunch of other random stuff I can't think of right now. Is it worth swapping the ECU if it means re-wiring lots of the engine electrics? This goes along with the ABS. The pump uses the same motor, but it's evidently got a different control module in the pump housing. If we get a new manual ABS pump, will it need re-wired or will the wires in place work? My assumption is no, since the speed signal is probably coming from the TCU in the auto and from the ECU/IKE in the manual.

Another question for any "Scooby Gurus" or others would be: What's a good option for a PC interface for module coding/re-programming? I've got a huge stash of interfaces for my Bimmers – from the old ADS interface to newer KKL and even D-CAN interfaces. Coupled with INPA/DIS/SSS it's an unbeatable and wonderfully powerful tool for this sort of work on a BMW. So many jobs have gone from teeth-pulling to piece-of-cake with a little software and the right interface. I'm still interested in using Subaru Select Monitor for some coding, but information on the interface to use is very sparse. The only thing I can find is that coding requires a dead-simple 5V TTL interface but reading DTCs requires a more complicated (similar to K-line?) interface... Does this mean I need two interfaces and have to switch them when coding and then reading DTCs? Much appreciation to anyone who can point caschmidt or myself in the right direction with regards to a computer interface for this "factory software".

Last edited by spencerlinn; 06-23-2012 at 10:48 PM.
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Old 06-30-2012, 03:28 PM   #10
PHATsuby
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The manual uses a cam sprocket it is only a 2 tooth cam trigger vs. 7 for the auto like I have previously said. I can show you the PDF from the service manual if you want but maybe that doesn't matter at this point since you are trying to figure out what to do.

I believe to retain ABS all you need to do is keep the one plug on the TCU plugged in that ties to ABS and it will keep working(mine did).

Ben
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Old 07-13-2012, 01:11 PM   #11
lockmedic
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I ran into this issue when swapping a 2002 EJ251 from an outback with auto trans into a 2001 Outback with manual trans. Don't know if the auto/manual is the issue or if it's a year thing. Intake was different too. . idle air was managed differently.

In my case, cam and crank sprockets were different.
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Old 10-02-2012, 01:05 PM   #12
caschmidt
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UPDATE:

The rear diff was leaking out of the right side, and for some reason the axle from the manual appeared to be longer on the right side. Long story short, I ruined the corroded diff trying to change the seals. Got a new (used) diff and eventually replaced the right axle with one I had lying around from the junkyard. So far no more diff leaks. I've put more than 9,000 miles on it so far.

I also figured out the abs. I tried plugging in the TCM and It idled high (2k rpm) but the abs worked (light off). So I randomly realized I could try plugging in one of the two plugs on the TCM. Tried one and the abs still didn't work(light on) and it idled high still. Tried the other plug and the abs works! And it doesn't idle high. Problem solved.


Also, we found the pin to tell the car it's a manual. Now I only have 2 CELs, o2 sensor (unrelated to swap) and starter circuit low voltage. But I have another annoying problem. When I let off the throttle (when I'm changing gears for example) it holds the throttle for a second or two after I let off, and I'll have to wait to engage the next gear. It's really annoying. If anybody has any input it would be appreciated...Still haven't wired up the NSS. Could be an issue with that, or it could be the intake, just don't know exactly what needs to be replaced. Will post if I figure anything out.

Last edited by caschmidt; 10-02-2012 at 07:50 PM.
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Old 10-05-2012, 11:46 PM   #13
NWsubylove
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I have a 2002 legacy L automatic transmission and was also wanting a wrx manual tranny swap. would i be basically doing the same? still getting the hang of my own mechanics so any input would be great. Thanks
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Old 10-06-2012, 09:19 AM   #14
caschmidt
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Yeah it's the same exact swap. Wiring on the Trans is exactly the same. Only thing that's different is gear ratios. WRX is 3.54 final and the trans is like 1.1:1 or something
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Old 11-14-2012, 05:42 PM   #15
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Update: I FINALLY figured out my weird rev holding issue. I was looking at the service manual and found the neutral position signal at B135 pin no 26. For the auto, if it had 12 volts it's in gear, 0 if in neutral. The manual was the opposite for some reason. I snipped the wire an grounded it, but it still held the revs after I let off the throttle. I then let the wire float and problem solved! It no longer holds the revs!
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Old 11-15-2012, 12:27 PM   #16
caschmidt
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So my rev holding issue has been solved, the computer thinks its a manual so I have no more Trans obd codes, and I did not have to replace the crank sprocket. For the most part this project is finished. Just have my starter circuit Low voltage problem. Not urgent, I'll rewire it eventually.
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Old 11-17-2012, 01:27 PM   #17
PHATsuby
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to stock is a project too

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what pin is supposedly the ecu identifier pin to switch from auto to manual and how did you find it?

Congrats on getting it sorted.

Ben
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Old 11-19-2012, 03:26 PM   #18
caschmidt
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Im like 99% sure it was B135 pin 25. There was no pin there to begin with, so we had to make one that fits in there and ground it. My buddy Spencer was working feverishly trying to find this supposed pin. He was the one that found it and ground it. Which by the way, this pin is NOT listed on the wiring diagrams for the ECU that I listed above, nor was it in the diagrams in my service manuals. It was listed elsewhere in the service manuals which made it nearly impossible to figure out.

Last edited by caschmidt; 11-19-2012 at 03:36 PM.
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Old 12-22-2013, 07:50 AM   #19
schrek1991
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Not to revive an old thread but by floating the neutral position switch would I not have to hot wire the starter then, because it wouldn think it was in R or D
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Old 02-09-2014, 08:48 AM   #20
rossco2k8
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Hi all.

First post on here and looking for some help. I have a 98 bh5 gtb that has been converted from auto to manual. The car is strangely running great the onlynissue is I have no speedo.
Its clear someone has been at this before. I have a 2wire vss in the gesr box one side has 5v and the other about 9 with the ignition on.
I have tried to research this but am struggling to understand. Can anyone plase clarify
Thanks in advance
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Old 02-10-2014, 04:53 PM   #21
caschmidt
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One must be the power supply, and one must be the signal that the computer/gauge cluster needs. With the two-wire speed sensors, I believe they use the trans as a ground (the sensor itself should be metal). The three-wire ones have power supply, signal, and ground.
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