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Old 06-19-2012, 12:03 PM   #26
Equilibrium Tuning
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What spring is in your BOV? If its opening at idle you won't be able to tune properly with that setup. If you're going to stick with a draw-through MAF, get a recirculating BOV. Or just switch to blow-through and Cobb's Hybrid SD tuning.

-- Ed
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Old 06-19-2012, 12:04 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lancelucas View Post
You probably never even maxxed out the 255 if you are still on factory wiring...

Sure, adding a 2x sized pump likely helped, but doesn't change that the factory wiring delivers reduced voltage than battery and is amperage limited.
My walbro 255lph was leaning out up top at 500whp, I wasn't able to run richer than 12.0 AFR at redline
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Old 06-19-2012, 12:05 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Equilibrium Tuning View Post
What spring is in your BOV? If its opening at idle you won't be able to tune properly with that setup. If you're going to stick with a draw-through MAF, get a recirculating BOV. Or just switch to blow-through and Cobb's Hybrid SD tuning.

-- Ed
Don't even need Cobb, Opensource hybrid SD is pretty damn good too!
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Old 06-19-2012, 12:21 PM   #29
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The maf placement on the Treadstone is kinda ****ty, but not that big of a deal.

Rewire?

If you send me your ROM, I can try and help you out with the stalling

jrtuned@gmail.com

Last edited by Junior2JZ; 06-19-2012 at 12:25 PM. Reason: read the injectors wrong
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Old 06-19-2012, 01:48 PM   #30
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In my opinion, That car will never run correctly with the maf in that intake pipe. It can be made to run but not up to my standards for Drivability, response, mileage and power.

As for the 255, Its no where near enough fuel for the ID2000 and a GT35R on E85. Rewiring off a relay with will help for sure but the main limiting factor is the fuel lines and rails. Once the lines are -6 up and back, The flood gates will open and you will have plenty of fuel.

C
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Old 06-19-2012, 02:25 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Equilibrium Tuning View Post
What spring is in your BOV? If its opening at idle you won't be able to tune properly with that setup. If you're going to stick with a draw-through MAF, get a recirculating BOV. Or just switch to blow-through and Cobb's Hybrid SD tuning.

-- Ed
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clark Turner View Post
In my opinion, That car will never run correctly with the maf in that intake pipe. It can be made to run but not up to my standards for Drivability, response, mileage and power.

As for the 255, Its no where near enough fuel for the ID2000 and a GT35R on E85. Rewiring off a relay with will help for sure but the main limiting factor is the fuel lines and rails. Once the lines are -6 up and back, The flood gates will open and you will have plenty of fuel.

C
The BOV was staying open at idle so we changed the spring out, this was when we first finished the setup. It stays shut at idle now.

There is no doubt in my mind that a blow through/SD setup would do wonders for the car. But at the same time, we are not trying anything that hasn't been done everyday the last 5 years. It's a rotated turbo kit Subaru. Only thing different about it is that it's a stock block car. I don't see a reason it shouldn't at least idle and run halfway decent on the current setup.
If anything, I think the car needs to be left with P&L so that Junior can spend some hands on time with it. It needs to be examined by more than just an Excel file from RomRaider.
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Old 06-19-2012, 02:32 PM   #32
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^^^^^

Take a poll of people with the Treadstone kit running conventional MAF fueling to see how many have the problems you see. Maybe it is the MAF placement.
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Old 06-19-2012, 02:55 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yamahaSHO View Post
Are you talking about the little drum looking things next to the strut tower? Those aren't check valves.
No, the stock fuel pump has the check valve on it....and I believe walbro's also have this "built in" check valve. If you don't have one, it could be the cause for the pressure drops.

Here is a link of what I'm talking about:

http://ken-gilbert.com/wrx/STi_Manua...l%20System.pdf

Look at pages 11 and 12
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Old 06-19-2012, 03:15 PM   #34
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Just my opinion but maf placement is crucial. I had many issues an finally went sd and bam all better. Super nice to have a linear tune based on a nice map sensor that can read high enough for whatever your doing.
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Old 06-19-2012, 05:53 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eliezerrosario View Post
No, the stock fuel pump has the check valve on it....and I believe walbro's also have this "built in" check valve. If you don't have one, it could be the cause for the pressure drops.

Here is a link of what I'm talking about:

http://ken-gilbert.com/wrx/STi_Manua...l%20System.pdf

Look at pages 11 and 12


There's only 10 pages when I load it.

The check valve is in the pump itself and you're likely not getting it out and shouldnd be a restriction.
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Old 06-19-2012, 07:00 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Junior2JZ View Post
The maf placement on the Treadstone is kinda ****ty, but not that big of a deal.

Rewire?

If you send me your ROM, I can try and help you out with the stalling

jrtuned@gmail.com
Junior my laptop with roms/logs is back in Nebraska with my car but I will try and have my friend send you a ROM just to see what you think. You believe the MAF location is something that can easily be worked around? I guess I am surprised to see so many different opinions on the MAF location while most say it is something that cannot be worked with you seem to think it's not a big deal which I guess I like to hear

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clark Turner View Post
In my opinion, That car will never run correctly with the maf in that intake pipe. It can be made to run but not up to my standards for Drivability, response, mileage and power.

As for the 255, Its no where near enough fuel for the ID2000 and a GT35R on E85. Rewiring off a relay with will help for sure but the main limiting factor is the fuel lines and rails. Once the lines are -6 up and back, The flood gates will open and you will have plenty of fuel.

C
Clark I appreciate your response but am curious as to why the MAF location in your opinion will be so limiting? I see most rotated kits with draw through MAFs very similar to mine. Also it seems there is a huge split on those who promote blow through versus draw through, have you had bad luck with draw through in general? Also if I was to remain draw through MAF, where would be an ideal place to relocate the MAF to?

As far as fueling is concerned it seems that you are the only one saying the lines/rails are the limiting factor...while I would love to step up to an AN6 supply/return I am hoping to get the car going as it sits now. For power levels between 450-500whp it doesn't seem that lines/rails are always required. Correct me if I am wrong but would you not see higher pressure if the lines were the limiting factor between the pump and the point at which I am testing pressure?
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Old 06-19-2012, 07:06 PM   #37
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I appreciate everyone's input up until this point it seems that all agree unanimously I should/could benefit from rewiring the fuel pump so I am going to give that a try as soon as I get back to the car. I am surprised to see so many people recommending changing fuel pumps, I have friends in the DSM community who recommended a Jays Racing pump and one of them happened to have a pump laying around so we tried it out. 340lph should be sufficient for 450-500whp should it not?
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Old 06-19-2012, 07:12 PM   #38
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The maf is to close to the turbo. Even after you pull to a stop that turbo is spinning 30K rpm. If you want to run maf, then you are going to need an 83mm maf pipe and it needs to be in the fender far from the turbo.

As for the pump. All of that depends on how much power the car makes once you fix it. But here on the dyno that has no correction factor added in with full loaders, A walbro only gets you 400 whp. A dw340 gets you 450 to 500 range and past that, you need lines and a relay with direct power feed. At 500 to 550 you need TWO pumps or a walbro 400 or walbro 460, lines, direct power feed and ID2000s. to run 600whp.

I would start listening to these guys and get the car fixed. You already posted you wasted 4 months. Now is not the time to start questioning what these people are telling you

C
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Old 06-19-2012, 07:12 PM   #39
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Draw thru is fine but need maf in fender and in good maf housing. Mine idled great with the ks tech 83mm maf housing and in fender.

Went aem and speed density now but back then cobb and draw thru was solid.
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Old 06-19-2012, 07:13 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clark Turner
The maf is to close to the turbo. Even after you pull to a stop that turbo is spinning 30K rpm. If you want to run maf, then you are going to need an 83mm maf pipe and it needs to be in the fender far from the turbo.

As for the pump. All of that depends on how much power the car makes once you fix it. But here on the dyno that has no correction factor added in with full loaders, A walbro only gets you 400 whp. A dw340 gets you 450 to 500 range and past that, you need lines and a relay with direct power feed. At 500 to 550 you need TWO pumps or a walbro 400 or walbro 460, lines, direct power feed and ID2000s. to run 600whp.

I would start listening to these guys and get the car fixed. You already posted you wasted 4 months. Now is not the time to start questioning what these people are telling you

C
Exactly...!
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Old 06-19-2012, 07:19 PM   #41
Equilibrium Tuning
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stretchedk7 View Post
Draw thru is fine but need maf in fender and in good maf housing. Mine idled great with the ks tech 83mm maf housing and in fender.

Went aem and speed density now but back then cobb and draw thru was solid.
It doesn't work so well with an atmospheric BOV as in this car. This is especially the case with very large injectors as they are more sensitive to inaccurate air flow metering and fueling.

I see this issue a lot with Tial BOV's and most people end up running too stiff of a spring in them to keep the BOV closed at idle. This of course results in excessive compressor surge. A properly set up Tial BOV will usually be slightly open at idle... which of course will not work at all with a draw-through MAF.

-- Ed
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Old 06-19-2012, 07:28 PM   #42
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I def shimmed my tial bov but it still vented and I had no issues. I could see it affecting life span.

Idle and everything was perfect. Drivability was crazy good. Better than stock location was for me.
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Old 06-19-2012, 07:30 PM   #43
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Turbo lifespan I mean. Mine didn't surge much if any turbo wise though. I had maf burried in fender.
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Old 06-19-2012, 08:19 PM   #44
C J
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Originally Posted by Clark Turner View Post

I would start listening to these guys and get the car fixed. You already posted you wasted 4 months. Now is not the time to start questioning what these people are telling you

C
I hope you didn't take it that way!

My questions were only posed to try and gain some knowledge for myself.
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Old 06-19-2012, 08:35 PM   #45
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^^ all I can say is I wish someone had made suggestions for me when I had all these problems!! I was stressed
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Old 06-19-2012, 08:38 PM   #46
C J
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Originally Posted by stretchedk7 View Post
^^ all I can say is I wish someone had made suggestions for me when I had all these problems!! I was stressed
Yeah I have been trying to figure it out for the last few months with the help of my friends and we are finally just to the point we don't know what to try next. I really want to try and get it going without buying anymore parts since it has been an expensive few months

A fuel pump rewire is definitely in the cars future and possibly one of the KStech intakes once we get the fuel pressure figured out.
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Old 06-19-2012, 08:56 PM   #47
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Just got a text from my friend who has my car back home, he rewired the fuel pump after reading this thread and now is seeing 13.6v at WOT but no change in fuel pressure...



Next step?
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Old 06-19-2012, 09:50 PM   #48
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Move the maf like most people said. Its not hard or that expensive.
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Old 06-19-2012, 09:55 PM   #49
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Move the maf like most people said. Its not hard or that expensive.
That won't effect the fuel pressure issues that the rewire was suggested to fix.
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Old 06-19-2012, 10:09 PM   #50
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Make sure that the pump you have in the car is a known good fuel pump and it is installed correctly. Even new pumps out of the box can be bad. Check the diaphram on the fpr. make sure it is operating correctly. Sounds like it is a fuel delivery issue from the information you set forth.
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