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Old 06-19-2012, 11:14 PM   #51
TDagen
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Maybe it is the fuel pump? I'd swap the fpr with a known working one if possible.
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Old 06-19-2012, 11:34 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TDagen View Post
Maybe it is the fuel pump? I'd swap the fpr with a known working one if possible.
We originally had a walbro 255 in there, saw the pressure drop so we swapped in a jays racing 342lph pump and saw no change. Have also swapped out FPRs with a known working one off of my friends WRX.
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Old 06-20-2012, 12:16 AM   #53
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The pressure drop just means the pump can't keep up. Change to a new pump or a dual setup. Stop chasing your own tail just because you assume this pump from a friend is good. In general, try not to assume anything is working properly until you rule it out conclusively.

It sounds like you need to get your car to a good tuner who can go over the setup, make some necessary changes and spend some time to get it running properly. Your friends might know some things, but properly setting up and tuning a setup like this is not easy especially if you haven't done so before. Hell, just keeping a car idling consistently and not stalling with the ID2000's requires a couple tricks that most amateur tuners will not know about.

-- Ed
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Old 06-20-2012, 12:23 AM   #54
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If the pump couldn't keep up wouldn't we have seen a change going from a 255lph to a 342lph that has now been rewired?

the pressure drops and holds identically before and after the fuel pump changes.

That doesn't make sense to me if the pump is not keeping up, I think we would have seen some kind of pressure change with the larger pump.

edit: the pump we put in was brand new.
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Old 06-20-2012, 12:53 AM   #55
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What wire gauge was used for power to the pump? Make sure ground is good also. Where are you pulling vacuum from for the fpr. Try to avoid t'ing off the vacuum line from the bov.
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Old 06-20-2012, 01:20 AM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C J

That won't effect the fuel pressure issues that the rewire was suggested to fix.
Hey didn't you say you had a hydra or was that someone else?

And from here I'd make sure the fuel filter isn't bunked up with trash, next would be getting rid of that pump!!

You might not have enough volume but you should def be able to get more fuel pressure of you want it. Also if your using a fpr the spring inside it could be broke, giving you issues as well.
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Old 06-20-2012, 01:22 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C J
If the pump couldn't keep up wouldn't we have seen a change going from a 255lph to a 342lph that has now been rewired?

the pressure drops and holds identically before and after the fuel pump changes.

That doesn't make sense to me if the pump is not keeping up, I think we would have seen some kind of pressure change with the larger pump.

edit: the pump we put in was brand new.
I agree there should be a pressure change. Even if it's just a little
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Old 06-20-2012, 02:10 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stretchedk7 View Post
Hey didn't you say you had a hydra or was that someone else?

And from here I'd make sure the fuel filter isn't bunked up with trash, next would be getting rid of that pump!!

You might not have enough volume but you should def be able to get more fuel pressure of you want it. Also if your using a fpr the spring inside it could be broke, giving you issues as well.
As of right now there is no fuel filter on the car, but it looked pretty clean. No difference.

We swapped the FPR from my car to his car with absolutely no change in pressure. Actually, his FPR is on my car now.

It is on the stock ECU. Tuning with opensource.
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Old 06-20-2012, 02:58 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C J View Post
Just got a text from my friend who has my car back home, he rewired the fuel pump after reading this thread and now is seeing 13.6v at WOT but no change in fuel pressure...



Next step?
Have they tried the bigger pump with the hardwire in place? Was a larger ground added as well? What size wire did they go with?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul View Post
Move the maf like most people said. Its not hard or that expensive.
I never liked the placement of the MAF as with the BB turbo, you could hear it still spinning when the throttle shut. With VTA, it just makes it that much harder. I wouldn't mind trying a blow-thru setup. A MAF bung/adapter would have to be welded in and likely would want to move the BOV before the MAF.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Equilibrium Tuning View Post
The pressure drop just means the pump can't keep up. Change to a new pump or a dual setup. Stop chasing your own tail just because you assume this pump from a friend is good. In general, try not to assume anything is working properly until you rule it out conclusively.

It sounds like you need to get your car to a good tuner who can go over the setup, make some necessary changes and spend some time to get it running properly. Your friends might know some things, but properly setting up and tuning a setup like this is not easy especially if you haven't done so before. Hell, just keeping a car idling consistently and not stalling with the ID2000's requires a couple tricks that most amateur tuners will not know about.

-- Ed
Without the MAF plugged in, I could get the 2200's to idle like a stock car. You could barely see a difference between A/C on and off, and it would drop down to idle just fine. Once the MAF was plugged in, it went to hell.

The ID2200's are nice in the fact that I could get a controlled enough spray that I could stay out of hitting minimum IDC. I was unable to do that with the Five-O 1,200cc side feed injectors. They'd drastically bounce from rich to lean at low IDC and most of the time the computer was commanding as low as it could for IDC with the latency doing all the work. Drop the latency to get the commanded IDC up, and they ran like poo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by C J View Post
If the pump couldn't keep up wouldn't we have seen a change going from a 255lph to a 342lph that has now been rewired?

the pressure drops and holds identically before and after the fuel pump changes.

That doesn't make sense to me if the pump is not keeping up, I think we would have seen some kind of pressure change with the larger pump.

edit: the pump we put in was brand new.
You should see some type of pressure change, but it could have been very incremental if the factory wiring was restricting it. The big pumps require a lot of power to be BIG pumps.
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Old 06-20-2012, 08:19 AM   #60
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Well I think at this point, if I were you I'd try one more big pump. Any one of the normal Subaru ones- like walbro 416 an I'd run at least ten gauge power to it.

Then I'd get the maf into the fender and in a good spot and that should solve your problems.

Fwiw when I had my maf in the fender I originally used the ultimate racing maf housing. In short it sucked, the design and inside smoothness of it wasn't anything compared to the ks tech. Both looked the same at least close but they were worlds apart.

Gl
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Old 06-20-2012, 08:55 AM   #61
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The intake is definitely in my future but they show back ordered. As far as the fuel pump...anybody out there make a double pumper kit like they have for the Evos?
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Old 06-20-2012, 09:00 AM   #62
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I know u are having fueling issues, but that maf is bothering the crap out of me. The hotside piping is also hitting the intake...With how sensitive the maf is, that will surely cause problems.

Last edited by CatfaceType-R; 06-20-2012 at 09:06 AM.
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Old 06-20-2012, 10:15 AM   #63
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Yes you can build or buy a double pumper setup but these days even on e85 you can make 500 whp on a single pump you just wont be able to go much beyond that.
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Old 06-20-2012, 10:51 AM   #64
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Originally Posted by soon2bblackongold View Post
I know u are having fueling issues, but that maf is bothering the crap out of me. The hotside piping is also hitting the intake...With how sensitive the maf is, that will surely cause problems.
It might just be that way in the picture but they aren't hitting. I will double check next time im around the car to see that there are no vibrations on that intake tube.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stretchedk7 View Post
Yes you can build or buy a double pumper setup but these days even on e85 you can make 500 whp on a single pump you just wont be able to go much beyond that.
I'll have to look into it. I already have two walbros and now a jays racing pump so that's why I was asking about a double pumper kit. I will still look into the bigger walbro pumps. I am just having a hard time believing its out of pump when there was zero change between the two pumps I've already had in there.
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Old 06-20-2012, 12:05 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stretchedk7 View Post
Yes you can build or buy a double pumper setup but these days even on e85 you can make 500 whp on a single pump you just wont be able to go much beyond that.
how do you know?

Quote:
Originally Posted by C J View Post
It might just be that way in the picture but they aren't hitting. I will double check next time im around the car to see that there are no vibrations on that intake tube.



I'll have to look into it. I already have two walbros and now a jays racing pump so that's why I was asking about a double pumper kit. I will still look into the bigger walbro pumps. I am just having a hard time believing its out of pump when there was zero change between the two pumps I've already had in there.
I think you should install the walbro 255lph back and mod it. See if it helps.... just so you don't have to buy another pump and find out that the issue is something else.

Also have you check the o-ring on the MAF sensor? that o-ring tears up really easily.

GL
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Old 06-20-2012, 03:27 PM   #66
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Haven't seen anyone mention the 02 sensor yet. I have an 06 Sti and I'm on my 5th 02 sensor.
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Old 06-20-2012, 07:02 PM   #67
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Front o2?
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Old 06-20-2012, 07:07 PM   #68
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Yes sir.

But I agree with what everyone else has already said. Maf is too close to turbo. Anytime u are transitioning throttle the maf in that position is gonna be off.

Blow thru speed density or just straight speed density are solutions but if it's the front 02 u will still have issues unless u disable closed loop.

Last edited by Phatron; 06-20-2012 at 07:13 PM.
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Old 06-20-2012, 07:37 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
I think you should install the walbro 255lph back and mod it. See if it helps.... just so you don't have to buy another pump and find out that the issue is something else.

Also have you check the o-ring on the MAF sensor? that o-ring tears up really easily.

GL
You think I should ditch the bigger pump and put the 255 back in? When you say mod it what do you mean?

Checked the MAF o ring quite a few times and it appears to be ok.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatron View Post
Yes sir.

But I agree with what everyone else has already said. Maf is too close to turbo. Anytime u are transitioning throttle the maf in that position is gonna be off.

Blow thru speed density or just straight speed density are solutions but if it's the front 02 u will still have issues unless u disable closed loop.
What are some symptoms of the front o2 failing?

Maybe someday I would like to switch over and go SD but right now I would like to just get it running on the MAF. Hopefully once we move the MAF down into the fender it will fix any MAF problems.
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Old 06-20-2012, 07:54 PM   #70
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Bad 02 = afr is off everywhere and your gas mileage sucks. If the car is drivable it usually starts presenting itself as a hesitation while cruising as the afr just starts bouncing up and down
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Old 06-20-2012, 08:01 PM   #71
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hmm. might be worth changing then. I have drove the car a little bit and I do feel hesitation or a "miss" under a constant throttle cruising.
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Old 06-20-2012, 08:18 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by C J View Post
You think I should ditch the bigger pump and put the 255 back in? When you say mod it what do you mean?

Checked the MAF o ring quite a few times and it appears to be ok.



What are some symptoms of the front o2 failing?

Maybe someday I would like to switch over and go SD but right now I would like to just get it running on the MAF. Hopefully once we move the MAF down into the fender it will fix any MAF problems.
By modding the pump I mean crushing the pressure relief valve. It would be like trying a third pump since it will flow more than a stock 255lph; I would do this just to rule out the pump without having to buying a new pump.
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Old 06-20-2012, 08:40 PM   #73
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Well just got a text saying my friend rewired the pump again and now is seeing 59-60psi fuel pressure on 22psi of boost.

Sounds about right?
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Old 06-20-2012, 08:43 PM   #74
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It depends what your base pressure is set at. 1psi of fuel pressure per pound of boost.
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Old 06-20-2012, 08:45 PM   #75
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base fuel pressure is stock which I see around 38psi with vacuum. So it all adds up in my mind.
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