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Old 09-02-2012, 10:58 AM   #1
Type2
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Default Any DIY rotated turbo with TMIC out there?

Ok - first off, I believe I've searched enough to warrant a new thread:

1. This subject looks like it was first broached HERE on NASIOC in 2005:

2. AMS came out with a kit in 2008:
a) NASIOC HERE
b) clubWRX.net HERE

3. IAG Performance also came out with a kit in 2008 - I don't see a price anywhere
a) HERE

4. P&L came out with a kit in 2008 - kit starts at $3,449
a) iwsti.com HERE

5. It was again discussed on iwsti.com in Feb of 2012 -- they mention P&L and ETS kits
a) HERE

6. It was discussed on NASIOC in Aug of 2012 -- a soon to be released kit by MPS was mentioned
a) HERE

7. The AMS kit HERE starts at $3,899 and goes up to $4,449 and it does NOT come with custom piping to get from TMIC to turbo.

8. I can't find the MPS kit by Googling. It may be out there, not sure.

9. The P&L kit is still being sold HERE for $3,449

All of these kits come with a turbo, look fantastic, well built but are extremely expensive (for me). I am wondering if I could do this myself and for much cheaper. I think I could source the rotated bits used in the classifieds, as well as a used GT30r or GT35r. Now, I'm definitely not an expert, but I think the biggest sticking points would be:
a) The turbo to Y pipe elbow
b) Intake with integrated MAF adapter

Does anyone have any experience or know exactly what I would need to do this? Am I over simplifying this? BTW, I drive a 2004 FXT. I am not interested in FMIC.

Thanks!
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Old 09-02-2012, 11:29 AM   #2
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It's a lot of work piecing a kit together, but it can be done. What kind of experience with this sort of stuff do you have? I ask because the full kits make this project pretty easy. Piecing it together will mean you need to be able to fabricate a few things along the way, as well as be able to have your car out of services for a much longer period of time.

Also, what type of TMIC would you be running?
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Old 09-02-2012, 11:34 AM   #3
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Type of TMIC and cars use are important questions. You are going to get more heat soak, which is why a lot of guys run meth with bigger turbo TMIC setups.

This is difficult for me to say, but if you are set on staying with a TMIC, stock location may be cheaper and more logical.
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Old 09-02-2012, 12:31 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gotsugg View Post
It's a lot of work piecing a kit together, but it can be done. What kind of experience with this sort of stuff do you have? I ask because the full kits make this project pretty easy. Piecing it together will mean you need to be able to fabricate a few things along the way, as well as be able to have your car out of services for a much longer period of time.

Also, what type of TMIC would you be running?
Not really any experience fabricating anything. I had a feeling I was over simplifying things. I didn't realize anything needed to be fabricated except the elbow from the turbo to the Y pipe. Are the rotated pipes different from other rotated pipes? Are the turbos in those kits different from regular rotated turbos?

Quote:
Originally Posted by aboothman View Post
Type of TMIC and cars use are important questions. You are going to get more heat soak, which is why a lot of guys run meth with bigger turbo TMIC setups.

This is difficult for me to say, but if you are set on staying with a TMIC, stock location may be cheaper and more logical.
I was planning on using my STi TMIC. I don't necessarily need a huge turbo, I was just looking at rotated b/c it seems easier to wrench on my engine, plus it looks like fitting the intake to the turbo is easier than using a regular inlet which gets quite cramped.

I was making the assumption that the only thing really different was the intake with integrated MAF adapter (which I was thinking about buying and not fabricating) and the turbo to Y pipe elbow.
I appreciate the feedback.
Thanks
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Old 09-02-2012, 03:47 PM   #5
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I had an sti tmic on a rotated perrin 30r kit. Wasn't that hard, bought the couplers off ebay. Think I needed a 45 degree bend coupler and a piece of aluminum to hook the stock ypipe to the bend and that was about it.
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Old 09-02-2012, 05:07 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by fr0st_wrx View Post
I had an sti tmic on a rotated perrin 30r kit. Wasn't that hard, bought the couplers off ebay. Think I needed a 45 degree bend coupler and a piece of aluminum to hook the stock ypipe to the bend and that was about it.
Do you have any pics of your old setup? Re: aluminum piece - how long and what diameter? What about the 45 degree bend coupler? Where did you source the intake w/ integrated MAF? Did you get it from Perrin? How did your setup run? Did you run EWG?

Thanks!
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Old 09-02-2012, 06:40 PM   #7
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This is a great thread because I'm am in the exact same host as the op. I even have an FXT as well.

I've done a fair bit of searching as I'm planing a turbo upgrade soon and would love to take advantage of the better priced turbos that work with rotated setups as well as ease to work on. But I also want to keep a tmic setup.

You can pick up a turbo xs kit of just the up and down pipe new for a fairly good price but I feel that setup might sit the turbo to high to plumb to a tmic. Perrin told me there to setup will work with tmic and you can buy just the up and dp. The also told me there new intake was made to be Maf based and has inlet to plumb you bpv back into so that takes car of that.

If you google "sti rotated adapter" a thread from itwsti will come up with a vender that makes a rotated adapter to a stock uppipe to help cut cost.

It would be great to see some pics of some pieced together setup of the tubing from the turbo to tmic.
I'd love to figure out a good plan and I would totally take the rotated route.
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Old 09-02-2012, 07:27 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilovecugars View Post
This is a great thread because I'm am in the exact same host as the op. I even have an FXT as well.

I've done a fair bit of searching as I'm planing a turbo upgrade soon and would love to take advantage of the better priced turbos that work with rotated setups as well as ease to work on. But I also want to keep a tmic setup.

You can pick up a turbo xs kit of just the up and down pipe new for a fairly good price but I feel that setup might sit the turbo to high to plumb to a tmic. Perrin told me there to setup will work with tmic and you can buy just the up and dp. The also told me there new intake was made to be Maf based and has inlet to plumb you bpv back into so that takes car of that.

If you google "sti rotated adapter" a thread from itwsti will come up with a vender that makes a rotated adapter to a stock uppipe to help cut cost.

It would be great to see some pics of some pieced together setup of the tubing from the turbo to tmic.
I'd love to figure out a good plan and I would totally take the rotated route.
How much was the Perrin setup -- the up pipe, down pipe and intake w/ MAF? Any links? If they say their setup will work with TMIC then I'm super interested. Although I am still unsure if these pipes are special in any way to a regular rotated pipe. Do you have any idea?

P.S. I don't have a stock up pipe but I checked out the iwsti.com thread HERE anyway. Pretty interesting. It's a couple years old - I wonder if he is still in business.

Thanks for the info and hopefully some people who have done this before will chime in with some pics. I'm surprised this option isn't discussed more often.

Thanks
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Old 09-02-2012, 08:01 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilovecugars View Post
If you google "sti rotated adapter" a thread from itwsti will come up with a vender that makes a rotated adapter to a stock uppipe to help cut cost.
Funny you mention this, just paypaled Dave his money earlier today! Im really excited to see it in person when it is finished. His craftsmanship seems to be top notch from all the pictures in the iwsti thread.




and a link to the thread : http://www.iwsti.com/forums/engine-p...-adaptors.html
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Old 09-02-2012, 09:14 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Type2 View Post
How much was the Perrin setup -- the up pipe, down pipe and intake w/ MAF? Any links? If they say their setup will work with TMIC then I'm super interested. Although I am still unsure if these pipes are special in any way to a regular rotated pipe. Do you have any idea?

P.S. I don't have a stock up pipe but I checked out the iwsti.com thread HERE anyway. Pretty interesting. It's a couple years old - I wonder if he is still in business.

Thanks for the info and hopefully some people who have done this before will chime in with some pics. I'm surprised this option isn't discussed more often.

Thanks
I don't think the Perrin site has just the pipes listed but I have been in contact with them. I believe just the up and down was $1299 and the inlet was $250 or around there. They did not claim it to be it to be bolt on for a tmic but said it wasn't very hard to do and that it had been done already with there newest version rotated kit. I would have to guess it keeps the turbo down lower making it easier to line up with the tmic y pipe.

The turbo xs kit looks quite nice and is alot better price at $800 but it seems to sit the turbo high. I may to some searching around and see if a tmic has been done with it.

Yes I was in contact with the guy on itwist about a month ago and he will still make them. I have heard his quality is very good. But you will need a custom down pipe I believe to line up with his adaptor. I have not seen many pictures of it setup in a car so I'm not sure how high it sits.

No problem with the info were in the same boat on this one it seems.
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Old 09-02-2012, 09:24 PM   #11
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If you look past the first page in the thread I posted there are a ton of installed pictures. I plan on having a local exhaust shop fab something up for the downpipe.
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Old 09-02-2012, 09:53 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fooliojesus View Post
Funny you mention this, just paypaled Dave his money earlier today! Im really excited to see it in person when it is finished. His craftsmanship seems to be top notch from all the pictures in the iwsti thread.




and a link to the thread : http://www.iwsti.com/forums/engine-p...-adaptors.html
That looks like a pretty nice inexpensive option. Also search for "Rotated" in the classifieds, there are several full kits there as well as a Perrin Rotated uppipe for $250.
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Old 09-02-2012, 10:57 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Fooliojesus View Post
If you look past the first page in the thread I posted there are a ton of installed pictures. I plan on having a local exhaust shop fab something up for the downpipe.
Do you you feel you would be best off to take a regular down pipe to an exhaust shop and get them to modify it to a rotated style or is it probly easier to start from scratch? I have some fab skills but I've never done any exhaust header work that really involved changing the original shape alot so I'm kinda out of my element here.
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Old 09-03-2012, 12:29 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilovecugars View Post
Do you you feel you would be best off to take a regular down pipe to an exhaust shop and get them to modify it to a rotated style or is it probly easier to start from scratch? I have some fab skills but I've never done any exhaust header work that really involved changing the original shape alot so I'm kinda out of my element here.

I was considering asking the shop if it would be easier to just chop off the top foot or so of my catted Cobb 3" downpipe and go from there. I'm going to have to make the decision once I have the adapter and turbo mocked up in my engine bay.
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Old 09-03-2012, 12:59 AM   #15
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Would Dave's adapter plate eliminate the necessity to purchase an entirely new rotated downpipe? Will it align up properly (i.e. not too high above the TMIC?). If so, that's a super cheap option and we may be on to something... What about EWG? I like how Perrin vents to the exhaust as opposed to atmosphere. I suppose I could run an IWG turbo... Really just looking for a cheap rotated setup using my TMIC to clean up the engine bay.
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Old 09-03-2012, 09:36 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Type2 View Post
Would Dave's adapter plate eliminate the necessity to purchase an entirely new rotated downpipe? Will it align up properly (i.e. not too high above the TMIC?). If so, that's a super cheap option and we may be on to something... What about EWG? I like how Perrin vents to the exhaust as opposed to atmosphere. I suppose I could run an IWG turbo... Really just looking for a cheap rotated setup using my TMIC to clean up the engine bay.

You will have to have some sort of rotated down pipe because the turbo now sits turned to an angle from the front of the car so inlet can be aimed towards the fender wall and not under the intake manifold. You will also want to get a down pipe with a different flange like a t3/t4 or v bands to get away from the stock mitsu style flange to take advantage of the more turbo options.

You can order the adaptor with a flange for ewg but you will then need to get receiving tubing fab into your down pipe to keep it from vent to atmosphere.

It would be great if some had a could rotated dp to bolt up to the adaptor and turbo and see if one worked well, it would save alot of time and guess work. But I don't think the adaptor is very popular for some reason (even tho it's a great idea) so it unlikely someone will do the test fitting.
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Old 09-03-2012, 09:38 AM   #17
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Contact Tigwerks (SN on here) He is a fabricator out here in CA that does really nice work, and I believe he has a sale on rotated piping right now if you want to piece it together.

There are several threads displaying his work.
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Old 09-03-2012, 09:45 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aboothman
Contact Tigwerks (SN on here) He is a fabricator out here in CA that does really nice work, and I believe he has a sale on rotated piping right now if you want to piece it together.

There are several threads displaying his work.
Awesome, thanks. Maybe he has a turn key solution for a reasonable price.
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Old 09-03-2012, 10:23 AM   #19
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^^ he has a very nice looking rotated kit and the price was right when I was looking at it.
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Old 09-03-2012, 11:53 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Type2 View Post
Do you have any pics of your old setup? Re: aluminum piece - how long and what diameter? What about the 45 degree bend coupler? Where did you source the intake w/ integrated MAF? Did you get it from Perrin? How did your setup run? Did you run EWG?

Thanks!
There may have been 2 aluminum pieces I forget, the way it was setup looks kinda like the way perrin adapts their fmic to rotated.. like a """\__

The aluminum piece was about 3 inches long 2in diameter(same as the compressor outlet to the ic),it was long enough to get 2 clamps on the ends for the silicone pieces. the 45 bend came with about 6inches on each side of the bend and I trimmed it to fit. I dont have any pictures but it was setup with maf on a cold air intake, purchased from KStech designed for the perrin kit. It had an EWG on it, but I never got it fully tuned with the tmic, got a base tune and ended up going fmic because the tuner didnt wanna tune the sti tmic. It has been done though and will work.

If youre going to do it Id get a larger tmic to do it with. Or at least a GR sti tmic.

Gl
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Old 09-03-2012, 12:03 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Type2 View Post
Would Dave's adapter plate eliminate the necessity to purchase an entirely new rotated downpipe? Will it align up properly (i.e. not too high above the TMIC?). If so, that's a super cheap option and we may be on to something... What about EWG? I like how Perrin vents to the exhaust as opposed to atmosphere. I suppose I could run an IWG turbo... Really just looking for a cheap rotated setup using my TMIC to clean up the engine bay.
You will definitely need a rotated down pipe fabbed up if you are going with the adapter. If you look closely at the IWSTI thread you will see that you can ask for an EWG provision as part of the adapter. Using an adapter is not for everyone though, I decided to use it because I was going to be doing some simple fabrication anyway. I'm also not positive the adater would get the turbo low enough for a tmic. The perrin up-pipe seems to keep the turbo the lowest. Here is a picture of the EWG adapter for reference:
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Old 09-03-2012, 01:53 PM   #22
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I think the method that fr0st_wrx did is the easiest, and less fab work: Perrin rotated up, Perrin rotated down, cold air intake and a couple adapters to get the compressed air to the TMIC. I'd really like to see some pics of the install to get an idea of how things fit.
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Old 09-04-2012, 12:27 AM   #23
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Kelly at Tigwerks can fab up anything you need adapter wise... And it will be similar in cost with better fitment than Perrin
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Old 09-04-2012, 11:19 AM   #24
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I went with the TurboXS rotated kit earlier this year with the intent of using their TMIC. Also couldn't find an example and was concerned about the height but figured I'd have to leave it an unknown until I got the turbo in. I now have a FMIC with the TMIC resting comfortably in a box.

I saw this kit mentioned earlier in the thread and I'm Just hoping I can save someone the trouble in case they're thinking of going this route - TMIC is not happening with the TurboXS kit.
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Old 09-04-2012, 06:45 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by Cleveralias View Post
I went with the TurboXS rotated kit earlier this year with the intent of using their TMIC. Also couldn't find an example and was concerned about the height but figured I'd have to leave it an unknown until I got the turbo in. I now have a FMIC with the TMIC resting comfortably in a box.

I saw this kit mentioned earlier in the thread and I'm Just hoping I can save someone the trouble in case they're thinking of going this route - TMIC is not happening with the TurboXS kit.
Damn! I really liked that kit but from studying pictures of it installed on cars and measuring on my own car it really didn't seem it was going to work.

Thanks for helping us rule one kit out.
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