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Old 09-13-2012, 01:10 PM   #26
fastblueufo
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First question, who tuned your car and was it tuned on an electric bcs? You stated that you added an mbc to turn up the boost. Did you run its own dedicated boost lines? Or, did you install it in the existing lines that run through the bcs?

If you installed it in line with the bcs then you won't be able to use the mbc unless you change some tables to keep the bcs closed.
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Old 09-13-2012, 01:18 PM   #27
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Id try a diff Wg spring. I run the same turbo and a 44mm ewg and hit 25 all day. Just work yOur way down the line of solutions starting with the cheapest. Also are you running a tial Wg. Make sure the vaccum hose is on the correct port.
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Old 09-13-2012, 01:25 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fastblueufo View Post
First question, who tuned your car and was it tuned on an electric bcs? You stated that you added an mbc to turn up the boost. Did you run its own dedicated boost lines? Or, did you install it in the existing lines that run through the bcs?

If you installed it in line with the bcs then you won't be able to use the mbc unless you change some tables to keep the bcs closed.
I tuned the car, no ebc used and the wastegate/MBC have there own dedicated lines. The boost reference I'm using is coming from just after the turbo (can only see boost, no vacuum). Is this correct?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rdecker20 View Post
Id try a diff Wg spring. I run the same turbo and a 44mm ewg and hit 25 all day. Just work yOur way down the line of solutions starting with the cheapest. Also are you running a tial Wg. Make sure the vaccum hose is on the correct port.
It's an internal wastegate. So my only solution would be to change up the wastegate actuator with one that can hold 22psi from ATP.
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Old 09-13-2012, 01:30 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdecker20 View Post
Id try a diff Wg spring. I run the same turbo and a 44mm ewg and hit 25 all day. Just work yOur way down the line of solutions starting with the cheapest. Also are you running a tial Wg. Make sure the vaccum hose is on the correct port.
the title says INTERNAL WASTEGATE...so i am pretty sure he is on the wastegate that came with the turbo from ATP. he really shouldn't have any problems hitting 22psi on the 14psi internal wastegate.
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Old 09-13-2012, 01:35 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OC_Nooby View Post
I tuned the car, no ebc used and the wastegate/MBC have there own dedicated lines. The boost reference I'm using is coming from just after the turbo (can only see boost, no vacuum). Is this correct?
for a manual boost controller, you would run one line from the compressor pressure nipple to the boost controller's inlet. then you would run another line from the outlet of the boost controller to the wastegate actuator nipple. that is it...
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Old 09-13-2012, 01:43 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amalgrover View Post
for a manual boost controller, you would run one line from the compressor pressure nipple to the boost controller's inlet. then you would run another line from the outlet of the boost controller to the wastegate actuator nipple. that is it...
That's how I have it.

Unless I have the worlds biggest boost leak. I'll go get this checked again I guess.
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Old 09-13-2012, 01:56 PM   #32
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the few times i have seen the issue you are describing it has been one of two things...

the wastegate stuck open, and actuating it by hand fixed it

...or...

the boost controller was messed up, was replaced, and was good to go


...since you said you have tried 2 different boost controllers, i would think the problem is not in the boost controller. so either something is wrong with the wastegate, or you have a decent sized boost leak. remember, a boost leak is going to automatically be a vacuum leak at idle, and while sometimes the leaks will not show up until the motor is in boost, alot of times they are present 100% of the time. this means that you could take a can of carb cleaner, and with the engine running spray around the vacuum lines, intake manifold, intercooler, etc. and see if the idle changes. if it changes when you spray somewhere, you found your leak. this doesn't always work, but it does work alot of the time.
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Old 09-13-2012, 02:22 PM   #33
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I'm honestly leaning toward the wastegate being the issue. I have smoked the intake and previously found leaks up to my injectors. Fixed them, went back and had zero leaks.

It's weird, you would hear a lot of people with ATP stock location turbos complain if they had the same issue.

Last edited by OC_Nooby; 09-13-2012 at 02:50 PM.
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Old 09-13-2012, 07:12 PM   #34
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I'm removing my inlet and installing an AMR 3" hard inlet. Can only help + I have it laying around. Will inspect inlet once I pull it off.
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Old 09-13-2012, 07:51 PM   #35
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Do you still have the STI TMIC on there? I've never used one on this size of turbo, but it seems to me that could be restricting you some. A 3076 at 22 psi is a lot of air to flow through there.

You should have your gauge reading manifold pressure, not boost pressure after the turbo.

With your setup, with no leaks and a solid BPV, the way I see it, there is either a restriction somewhere or the wastegate sping isn't enough.
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Old 09-13-2012, 09:05 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlazeRex View Post
Do you still have the STI TMIC on there? I've never used one on this size of turbo, but it seems to me that could be restricting you some. A 3076 at 22 psi is a lot of air to flow through there.

You should have your gauge reading manifold pressure, not boost pressure after the turbo.

With your setup, with no leaks and a solid BPV, the way I see it, there is either a restriction somewhere or the wastegate sping isn't enough.
Yes I still have the STI TMIC.

Boost gauge is hooked up to a manifold source
Wastegate is hooked up to a boost source
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Old 09-17-2012, 01:07 AM   #37
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My gt3076r will only hit 22psi as well, but thats because my tuner put a failsafe max of 22psi on my tune

It's been a few days, did you figure this out?
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Old 09-24-2012, 05:58 PM   #38
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OK boys, I don't know what to make out of it....

I unhooked my boost source to the wastegate. One would assume that once you unhook this you should get a crap ton of boost. Well guess what, it pegs at 22psi ahahhahah. So then I decided to wire the flap shut (maybe the back pressure was opening the wastegate), nope still 22psi.

I unhooked it and left the flap open for ****s and giggles, 2-4psi max.

Now I'm thinking the the wastegate flap is not sealing. This makes sense as I'm always boosting a lot later and can't surpass 22psi.

Has anyone seen this before. I'm just that lucky? FML.
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Old 09-24-2012, 06:07 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OC_Nooby View Post
OK boys, I don't know what to make out of it....

I unhooked my boost source to the wastegate. One would assume that once you unhook this you should get a crap ton of boost. Well guess what, it pegs at 22psi ahahhahah. So then I decided to wire the flap shut (maybe the back pressure was opening the wastegate), nope still 22psi.

I unhooked it and left the flap open for ****s and giggles, 2-4psi max.

Now I'm thinking the the wastegate flap is not sealing. This makes sense as I'm always boosting a lot later and can't surpass 22psi.

Has anyone seen this before. I'm just that lucky? FML.

i already posted a couple weeks ago telling you that i have seen this exact issue before, and that based on your troubleshooting and descriptions, it sounded like it was the wastegate not sealing all the way. i quoted/highlighted it below for reference.


Quote:
Originally Posted by amalgrover View Post
the few times i have seen the issue you are describing it has been one of two things...

the wastegate stuck open, and actuating it by hand fixed it

...or...

the boost controller was messed up, was replaced, and was good to go


...since you said you have tried 2 different boost controllers, i would think the problem is not in the boost controller. so either something is wrong with the wastegate, or you have a decent sized boost leak. remember, a boost leak is going to automatically be a vacuum leak at idle, and while sometimes the leaks will not show up until the motor is in boost, alot of times they are present 100% of the time. this means that you could take a can of carb cleaner, and with the engine running spray around the vacuum lines, intake manifold, intercooler, etc. and see if the idle changes. if it changes when you spray somewhere, you found your leak. this doesn't always work, but it does work alot of the time.

you are going to need to either:

a. actuate the wastegate flapper by hand by grabbing the arm and forcing it open and closed to see if you can get it to fully close like i said to do in the highlighted post above

...or...

b. remove your downpipe to further inspect the wastegate
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Old 09-24-2012, 06:11 PM   #40
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I actuated the flapper by hand, I also tightened it 2 more turns to make sure it was tight. I have to remove the dp to see how it seals.
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Old 09-24-2012, 06:41 PM   #41
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Talking to ATP they say my inlet being 2.5" plus the step down adapter they supplied 3" to 2.5" is causing me the problem.

I honestly don't think its that restrictive..... Thoughts?
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Old 09-24-2012, 06:51 PM   #42
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it may be, but i honestly doubt that is the case because your boost went to the exact same thing when you removed all boost control whatsoever. even with the stock inlet on a baby vf, with the boost control completely removed you can easily spike to over 25psi in 3rd. i think that would be a factor as to why you can't target really high boost, but 22psi should be a cake-walk with the wastegate flapper wired shut.


my guess is still a boost leak or the wastegate is stuck open some...who knows though...definitely keep us posted. i am curious to see what your findings are.
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Old 09-24-2012, 07:01 PM   #43
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I'll be taking the dp off within the week to check it out...so depressing.
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Old 09-25-2012, 06:36 AM   #44
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What MAP sensor are you using? I ask because the stock MAP sensor maxes out around 22 or 23 psi.

I have an ATP 3076, with IWG, Hallman MBC, and an AEM 3.5-bar MAP sensor, and I have been running 22psi for months. I had it tuned for 25psi for a little while, and I didn't have any trouble getting there.

I get about the same boost taper that you do - boost drops about 1.5psi between 4000 RPM and 7000 RPM. I've been told that an EWG would fix that, but it doesn't really bother me.

I am running the IWG actuator that came with the turbo. If I remember right, I get 12psi with the MBC turned all the way out (min boost). But it's been a long time since I actually checked.
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Old 09-25-2012, 06:59 AM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sexyyrex View Post
...No one should be loading a larger turbo car, on pump gas, in 5th gear, not at speed, its a recipe for disaster. My guess if your car is reading full boost, not at speed, that your boost gauge is broken. Verify with a datalog...but if you'd been loading the car, again, not at speed, chances are you'll need more then just a new boost gauge.
Why does that scenario worry you so much?

My setup hits 20psi at about 3300 in 5th gear, at about 65mph. It's not a disaster, it's just a waste of time. 5th gear sucks for acceleration, and it takes a few seconds to build 20psi at such low RPM.

In 6th, if I floor it at 2500 RPM, it takes almost 10 seconds to reach 20psi, 3000 RPM, and 80mph (they all happen at once). I've only done that once (in the name of science) but it was almost two years ago and the motor still works just fine.

It's certainly a lot more satisfying to shift down, but high boost in high gears really shouldn't blow up your car.
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Old 09-25-2012, 09:20 AM   #46
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i think alot of people see detonation issues in the higher gears is because a vast majority of tuners do not accurately estimate or actually do 5th or 6th gear pulls while tuning to compensate for the higher load values (and boost if not using a MBC) seen in these gears. i think that is generally why alot of people consider it a no-no...
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:09 AM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NSFW View Post
What MAP sensor are you using? I ask because the stock MAP sensor maxes out around 22 or 23 psi.

I have an ATP 3076, with IWG, Hallman MBC, and an AEM 3.5-bar MAP sensor, and I have been running 22psi for months. I had it tuned for 25psi for a little while, and I didn't have any trouble getting there.

I get about the same boost taper that you do - boost drops about 1.5psi between 4000 RPM and 7000 RPM. I've been told that an EWG would fix that, but it doesn't really bother me.

I am running the IWG actuator that came with the turbo. If I remember right, I get 12psi with the MBC turned all the way out (min boost). But it's been a long time since I actually checked.
Its not my map sensor. My boost gauge reads 22 psi as well as my netbook with the actuator wired shut. ATP is really leaning on the inlet not being a 3"

What inlet do you have NSFW?
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Old 09-25-2012, 12:54 PM   #48
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I have a 2.5" inlet on my Blouch 20G XTR and I can hit 28psi peak, no problem. That's not your issue.
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Old 09-25-2012, 01:12 PM   #49
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like i said, i have guys running stock inlets, intake boxes, filters, etc. on baby vf turbos without any issues hitting over 22psi. so i highly doubt that is your issue...
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Old 09-25-2012, 02:09 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amalgrover View Post
like i said, i have guys running stock inlets, intake boxes, filters, etc. on baby vf turbos without any issues hitting over 22psi. so i highly doubt that is your issue...
No I understand and believe you. When NSFW posted he said he had the same setup so I thought id ask. I always do like re-reconfirmations ha!
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