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Old 10-04-2012, 07:47 PM   #101
Big-E
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Regarding the on-board display that tells you what your supposed mileage is, has anyone indulged in perusing the Owner's Manual about this?

I would like to know what the Owner's Manual says about the calculated average mileage. I bet that there is a disclaimer in there that effectively says that the figure you see is average to give you an idea and not a spot-on actual figure that you can wholly rely on.

I do laugh though when people start to say "how do I get better mileage out of my WRX or STI?" Well honestly, you bought the wrong car if that's what you seek.

I do cringe and feel afraid to be on the roads when people start to say "that I 'hyper-mile' by disengaging the drivetrain or I shut the car off completely and coast downhill". Just wait when you're in an unexpected and/or panic situation and guess what? the car is in neutral or off and you can't do a damn thing except to further the problem. Saving fuel at this point is a small item. Being an idiot is a much, much larger item.

Back to the mileage reader: it's a marketing tool and gets a lot of response in this day of higher per-gallon gasoline prices.
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Old 10-04-2012, 09:23 PM   #102
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I was disappointed in it as I could have sworn it would be run off the OBDII information. However, according to my Scangauge (which does run off the OBDII info), the mileage varies over a range of at least 2 mpg around actual (sometimes higher, sometimes lower).

It's a gimmick, just like the claim of 36 mpg highway.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Big-E View Post
Regarding the on-board display that tells you what your supposed mileage is, has anyone indulged in perusing the Owner's Manual about this?

I would like to know what the Owner's Manual says about the calculated average mileage. I bet that there is a disclaimer in there that effectively says that the figure you see is average to give you an idea and not a spot-on actual figure that you can wholly rely on.

I do laugh though when people start to say "how do I get better mileage out of my WRX or STI?" Well honestly, you bought the wrong car if that's what you seek.

I do cringe and feel afraid to be on the roads when people start to say "that I 'hyper-mile' by disengaging the drivetrain or I shut the car off completely and coast downhill". Just wait when you're in an unexpected and/or panic situation and guess what? the car is in neutral or off and you can't do a damn thing except to further the problem. Saving fuel at this point is a small item. Being an idiot is a much, much larger item.

Back to the mileage reader: it's a marketing tool and gets a lot of response in this day of higher per-gallon gasoline prices.
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Old 10-04-2012, 10:18 PM   #103
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the mileage reader is off. but so is a lot of other things. your odometer is off too and so is the time. your time is increasing faster than time itself and your car is traveling a lot less than what it is telling you. if you take out your gps(phone, or hand held) it will tell you that the impreza is off by about 2-5 percent, depending on the car. and the mileage read out is usually off buy 5-10%. if you factor in the correct mileage, then the MPG read out is not "that" far off. still incorrect.
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Old 10-05-2012, 08:21 PM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ans2k View Post
the mileage reader is off. but so is a lot of other things. your odometer is off too and so is the time. your time is increasing faster than time itself and your car is traveling a lot less than what it is telling you. if you take out your gps(phone, or hand held) it will tell you that the impreza is off by about 2-5 percent, depending on the car. and the mileage read out is usually off buy 5-10%. if you factor in the correct mileage, then the MPG read out is not "that" far off. still incorrect.

I agree the speedo is off ay freeway speeds by about 2 MPH faster than you are actually going. I passed 2 radar signs and it's always the same. Driving 70 MPH the sign reads 68 MPH. I think the MPG is close too. I have calculated the mileage several times after filling up and it's very close. But I don't get anywhere near 36 MPG even going down hill. The advertised MPG must be for a car averaging 45 MPH and wind aided with a 20 MPH wind at it's back.
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Old 10-13-2012, 12:06 AM   #105
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2012 prem MT. Im so disappointed when the car gauge says 28.5 mpg at 35 average mph but when calculated at the pump it is ALWAYS 2.5 mpg less so 26.1ish . You are lucky to get 29mpg at 80-85 cruising.

I never understood how rolling in neutral at 25 mph gets 99.9 mpg and rolling at 55 also gets 99.9mpg.
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Old 10-14-2012, 11:15 AM   #106
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Default Imprezza fuel economy

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Originally Posted by Knotsure View Post
A suggestion on measuring fuel economy. I'm not sure w/ the 2012 but on my 2009 and 2010 subaru's there is about 2 gallons of fuel left when the low fuel light goes on. Maybe check the owners manual to see if that's the case with yours? Also- note mileage, number of gallons added for at least 6 weeks to get a measure. I wouldn't count on what the car display reads. Too many variables. Good old paper, pencil and 'rithmatic I think gives you a better measure. Also how my in-laws are tracking theirs since it's important to them.
We use the old 'rithmatic method too. On a recent trip from MA. to Baltimore, MD. We got 32.5 and did not fill up till Baltimore/Severin/Bass Pro Shop, a few miles beyond downtown Baltimore.
The low fuel light had been on for a few miles. Rarely do we ever let it get that low. At that point its a good time to toss a little fuel cleaner/water remover in the almost empty tank.

Most of our around the country side/city mileage is 27-28mpg.. MJEFF
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Old 10-15-2012, 11:10 AM   #107
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Originally Posted by RememberMeJoeB View Post
2012 prem MT. Im so disappointed when the car gauge says 28.5 mpg at 35 average mph but when calculated at the pump it is ALWAYS 2.5 mpg less so 26.1ish . You are lucky to get 29mpg at 80-85 cruising.

I never understood how rolling in neutral at 25 mph gets 99.9 mpg and rolling at 55 also gets 99.9mpg.
You shouldn't roll in neutral at any speed. You can cause problems when you reengage the transmission.
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Old 10-15-2012, 02:48 PM   #108
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Default Subaru Impreza economy

On My first tank the computer recorded a 35 mpg with a calculated mpg of 32.5. All tanks since then have gone steadily down with the computer saying 33 to 32 and calculated being about 30. My last two tanks the computer has struggled to read 30 mpg and calculated mpg of 28. I am at a loss to explain this and am very disappointed in this slide into mediocrity. I suspected my mileage was not going to live up to expectations when on a long highway trip I could do not better then 33 at 70 mph. I know mileage drops off significantly after 65. My driving style has not changed and I try to implement some hypermilers techniques when possible. I have not taken this to a dealer yet and I suspect they will say everything is fine.
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Old 10-16-2012, 07:30 PM   #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by badliutenant View Post
On My first tank the computer recorded a 35 mpg with a calculated mpg of 32.5. All tanks since then have gone steadily down with the computer saying 33 to 32 and calculated being about 30. My last two tanks the computer has struggled to read 30 mpg and calculated mpg of 28. I am at a loss to explain this and am very disappointed in this slide into mediocrity. I suspected my mileage was not going to live up to expectations when on a long highway trip I could do not better then 33 at 70 mph. I know mileage drops off significantly after 65. My driving style has not changed and I try to implement some hypermilers techniques when possible. I have not taken this to a dealer yet and I suspect they will say everything is fine.
You are still well within the specified averages for fuel economy.

If you are doing mostly city driving, you are getting on the higher end of the scale. If it is highway, you are in the middle of the scale.
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Old 10-16-2012, 07:30 PM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RexyGirl View Post
You are still well within the specified averages for fuel economy.

If you are doing mostly city driving, you are getting on the higher end of the scale. If it is highway, you are in the middle of the scale.
Also, have you reset the trip to reset the MPG?
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Old 10-17-2012, 08:48 AM   #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RememberMeJoeB View Post
2012 prem MT. Im so disappointed when the car gauge says 28.5 mpg at 35 average mph but when calculated at the pump it is ALWAYS 2.5 mpg less so 26.1ish . You are lucky to get 29mpg at 80-85 cruising.

I never understood how rolling in neutral at 25 mph gets 99.9 mpg and rolling at 55 also gets 99.9mpg.
The computer is saying 99.9 mpg indicating no fuel consumption while rolling in neutral, it does not matter what the speed is.

However, you are using fuel while rolling in neutral, to maintain engine idle.

Keep the car in gear, rolling in gear (for example, down a long hill) does not require fuel to flow through the injectors.

Last edited by Zeeper; 10-21-2012 at 12:55 PM.
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Old 10-17-2012, 08:51 AM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by badliutenant View Post
On My first tank the computer recorded a 35 mpg with a calculated mpg of 32.5. All tanks since then have gone steadily down with the computer saying 33 to 32 and calculated being about 30. My last two tanks the computer has struggled to read 30 mpg and calculated mpg of 28. I am at a loss to explain this and am very disappointed in this slide into mediocrity. I suspected my mileage was not going to live up to expectations when on a long highway trip I could do not better then 33 at 70 mph. I know mileage drops off significantly after 65. My driving style has not changed and I try to implement some hypermilers techniques when possible. I have not taken this to a dealer yet and I suspect they will say everything is fine.
It is fine, look at the EPA window sticker that was on the car when it was sold, and remind us what the number in the middle of your sticker reads -- it will be the number under the following text "Combined Fuel Economy This Vehicle"

If you are on your third tank of gas you are also complaining about MPG while you are still breaking in the engine. You need to break the engine in before you can get reliable information about the overall MPG your car will yield.
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Old 10-19-2012, 08:04 PM   #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeeper View Post
It is fine, look at the EPA window sticker that was on the car when it was sold, and remind us what the number in the middle of your sticker reads -- it will be the number under the following text "Combined Fuel Economy This Vehicle"

If you are on your third tank of gas you are also complaining about MPG while you are still breaking in the engine. You need to break the engine in before you can get reliable information about the overall MPG your car will yield.
I now have 5,000 miles on my 2012 Sport premium 5 door w/auto transmission and took it on a fishing trip 3 days ago. All highway miles and the best I can get is 31 MPG averaging 65MPH. I get 25-28 around town and drive like an old man. I ordered my car so no window sticker came with the car but I thought it should get better than 31 to 33 MPG on the highway. Especially since I use cruise control 80 to 90% of the time.
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Old 10-21-2012, 12:29 PM   #114
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Originally Posted by 2012subisport View Post
I now have 5,000 miles on my 2012 Sport premium 5 door w/auto transmission and took it on a fishing trip 3 days ago. All highway miles and the best I can get is 31 MPG averaging 65MPH. I get 25-28 around town and drive like an old man. I ordered my car so no window sticker came with the car but I thought it should get better than 31 to 33 MPG on the highway. Especially since I use cruise control 80 to 90% of the time.
I believe the combined fuel economy number that was printed on your sticker is 30mpg.

36mpg is the expected Highway number. If you drive so your average speed is 65mph that indicates you are driving faster than 65mph much of the time, because your average includes when you first started driving at 0mph.

If you want to prove to yourself that your car is capable of achieving the EPA numbers (hint, if 30mpg is the expected Combined Fuel Economy number you are already achieving the expected MPG) do this test:

1) Find a stretch of highway.
2) accelerate up to 65mph.
3) set your cruise control.
4) reset one of your Trip Meters (A or B).
5) drive 10 miles.
6) look at the Average MPG figure after 10 miles.

If you do this test and do not see at least 38-42 mpg I would be surprised.
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Old 10-21-2012, 07:13 PM   #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2012subisport View Post
I now have 5,000 miles on my 2012 Sport premium 5 door w/auto transmission and took it on a fishing trip 3 days ago. All highway miles and the best I can get is 31 MPG averaging 65MPH. I get 25-28 around town and drive like an old man. I ordered my car so no window sticker came with the car but I thought it should get better than 31 to 33 MPG on the highway. Especially since I use cruise control 80 to 90% of the time.
I don't drive slow around town which makes up 99.9% of my driving and with 4k on the clock and 1 oil change I can only get 22.8 around town. I'm convinced I will never see 27mpg city. Remember the range for fuel economy printed on the window sticker is city= 22-32 and highway= 29-43.
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Old 10-21-2012, 10:15 PM   #116
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Well, I did a 1586 (within 1%) two way highway mile trip this weekend, and checked my mpg with my Scangauge. The good news is that although the initial mpg was off by various numbers up to 2.5 mpg (but sometimes less than 1) it eventually came in to the Scangauge reading during the tank (asymptotically, for you other geek engineers like me). It seems there is some incongruity with the initial mathematical procedure. I had to set the Scangauge to the mpg indicator rather than reality though. That meant it was set 4.3% higher than actual, so will have to get that adjusted next time in to the shop though.

The bad news is that the average speed was between 70 and 75 mph, and the actual mileage was 26.7 mpg. Based on past experience of over 200 kmiles, my 2004 Corolla, purchased new, would have made 34 +/- 2 mpg. The Corolla (5sp) was 2008 renormed at 36 mpg highway, also.

Looks like Subaru optimized the engine and gearing to maximize mpg during the EPA test cycle, and ignored reality...
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Old 10-22-2012, 08:06 AM   #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevehnm View Post
Well, I did a 1586 (within 1%) two way highway mile trip this weekend, and checked my mpg with my Scangauge. The good news is that although the initial mpg was off by various numbers up to 2.5 mpg (but sometimes less than 1) it eventually came in to the Scangauge reading during the tank (asymptotically, for you other geek engineers like me). It seems there is some incongruity with the initial mathematical procedure. I had to set the Scangauge to the mpg indicator rather than reality though. That meant it was set 4.3% higher than actual, so will have to get that adjusted next time in to the shop though.

The bad news is that the average speed was between 70 and 75 mph, and the actual mileage was 26.7 mpg. Based on past experience of over 200 kmiles, my 2004 Corolla, purchased new, would have made 34 +/- 2 mpg. The Corolla (5sp) was 2008 renormed at 36 mpg highway, also.

Looks like Subaru optimized the engine and gearing to maximize mpg during the EPA test cycle, and ignored reality...
http://www.mpgforspeed.com

If you put 36mpg as the HWY number in the MPG for Speed calculator and look at the numbers shown, 27.7 shows up at 75mph. Pretty close to what you are achieving.

You can achieve the EPA numbers, but not if your average speed is 70mph+

Is your complaint that the EPA numbers for the Impreza are misleading, or that your driving style does not achieve them?

Last edited by Zeeper; 10-22-2012 at 10:41 AM.
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Old 10-22-2012, 08:17 AM   #118
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crazy variables that affect mpg (not an exhaustive list)
wind
tires
tire pressure
fuel
weather
terrain
driver
engine filter
a/c
weight
car aerodynamics
type of oil
type of trans fluid
police pursuit
............................................
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Old 10-22-2012, 11:21 PM   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeeper View Post
http://www.mpgforspeed.com

If you put 36mpg as the HWY number in the MPG for Speed calculator and look at the numbers shown, 27.7 shows up at 75mph. Pretty close to what you are achieving.

You can achieve the EPA numbers, but not if your average speed is 70mph+

Is your complaint that the EPA numbers for the Impreza are misleading, or that your driving style does not achieve them?
That mpg site is lame. As aeoporta said, there are many things that affect mpg - not the least of which is aerodynamics, which disproves your mpg site all by itself.

I get over my EPA numbers at 80 mph on a flat two way run with no wind in my Corolla. (With Amsoil and Tufoil though...)
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Old 10-23-2012, 07:36 AM   #120
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The MPG site isn't "my" mpg site, and it pretty much pegged the mileage you achieved at the speed you were going, within 1mpg.

Funny how that happened.

I'll deduct from that you don't like the site because it confirms your higher speed driving is killing your MPG's. Don't kill the messenger.

I can only see that this thread would be valid if the Impreza was not meeting the Fuel Economy numbers printed on the Window Sticker, numbers derived from certified EPA testing.

If you look at your Window Sticker that came with your new car, you would realize that your car is capable of achieving the numbers on the label.

You can further confirm this by going to Fuelly and looking at the accumulated data from many drivers -- The average driver is hitting the estimated Combined Fuel Economy.

How many people are complaining without knowing what the Window Sticker actually shows, and what those numbers mean (including the Expected Range For Most Drivers numbers under those big bold numbers).

Why are you comparing it to other manufactures cars? That isn't how the EPA numbers are derived, and the numbers on your sticker are accurate for your car!

So why is this discussion in the Warranty Complaint thread?

Last edited by Zeeper; 10-23-2012 at 07:44 AM.
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Old 10-23-2012, 10:57 AM   #121
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No, not average speed on the digital dash readout. Average speed on the highway! I don't use average speed on the digital readout.

I will try your test and post my MPG.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeeper View Post
I believe the combined fuel economy number that was printed on your sticker is 30mpg.

36mpg is the expected Highway number. If you drive so your average speed is 65mph that indicates you are driving faster than 65mph much of the time, because your average includes when you first started driving at 0mph.

If you want to prove to yourself that your car is capable of achieving the EPA numbers (hint, if 30mpg is the expected Combined Fuel Economy number you are already achieving the expected MPG) do this test:

1) Find a stretch of highway.
2) accelerate up to 65mph.
3) set your cruise control.
4) reset one of your Trip Meters (A or B).
5) drive 10 miles.
6) look at the Average MPG figure after 10 miles.

If you do this test and do not see at least 38-42 mpg I would be surprised.

Last edited by 2012subisport; 10-23-2012 at 11:02 AM.
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Old 10-23-2012, 06:45 PM   #122
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Here has been my mileage on my 2011 OBS since I have had it. Just under 18k miles

https://www.dropbox.com/s/o6jvtydh76...2016.43.31.png

Mileage is better in the warmer months, worse in colder. Sweet spot for mileage for me is about 55mph. Anything over and I will slowly decrease in fuel economy

Regardless, better than what my 1990 Celica got, which was about 25mpg and was lighter, smaller profile, smaller engine, and front wheel drive

I am happy with what I am seeing

I prob do 50/50 hw and city

Last edited by dukebound85; 10-23-2012 at 06:51 PM.
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Old 10-25-2012, 12:06 AM   #123
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Not exactly related to the OP, but my dad has a 2012 4cyl outback, and he's getting 30mpg on highway.

In my 2010 WRX in SoCal. I just got 33mpg last week over a 120 mile span driving 65mph on the freeway 90% and in town 10%. Pretty good for a car that is rated 19/25 iirc. In actuality, I have 23.1 on my one tripmeter that has 6k miles on it.

And yes, I had a 2007 Honda Civic Hybrid. I used to deliver pizzas in it in a hilly area of town with lots of traffic signals. Trying hard, I got 33mpg, or 40-42mpg on the freeway going 70mph.
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Old 10-25-2012, 01:38 AM   #124
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeeper View Post
The MPG site isn't "my" mpg site, and it pretty much pegged the mileage you achieved at the speed you were going, within 1mpg.

Funny how that happened.

I'll deduct from that you don't like the site because it confirms your higher speed driving is killing your MPG's. Don't kill the messenger.

Why are you comparing it to other manufactures cars? That isn't how the EPA numbers are derived, and the numbers on your sticker are accurate for your car!

So why is this discussion in the Warranty Complaint thread?
When I test drove a '12 Impreza I reset the readout on the freeway and it said I got over 35 mpg at 75 mph (two way average, flat road). I used that information in my decision to buy the car. Little did I know that information was ... incorrect.

It was a little below my old Corolla that was rated (2008 renorming) the same 36 mpg highway, but I figured I could live with it.

Same EPA, same tests, should be the same mpg. Your question of why am I comparing it to another manufacturer's car is puzzling. I am not sure why you don't get that 2 should equal 2 - or in this case 36 should equal 36. 36 does not equal 27.

Most cars are not actually tested by the EPA, the EPA just uses numbers submitted by the manufacturer. I would like to know if the Impreza was actually tested by the EPA. Is there an online list somewhere of what they have actually tested?

Last edited by stevehnm; 10-25-2012 at 07:24 AM.
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Old 10-25-2012, 07:25 AM   #125
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Originally Posted by stevehnm View Post
When I test drove a '12 Impreza I reset the readout on the freeway and it said I got over 35 mpg at 75 mph (two way average, flat road). I used that information in my decision to buy the car. Little did I know that information was ... incorrect.

It was a little below my old Corolla that was rated (2008 renorming) the same 36 mpg highway, but I figured I could live with it.

Same EPA, same tests, should be the same mpg. Your question of why am I comparing it to another manufacturer's car is puzzling. I am not sure why you don't get that 2 should equal 2 - or in this case 36 should equal 36. 36 does not equal 27.

They say some cars are not actually tested by the EPA, but the EPA just uses numbers submitted by the manufacturer. I would like to know if the Impreza was actually tested by the EPA.
Not all cars are tested by the EPA, but the EPA does certify the tests. Subaru is not gaming the system.

This is from my window sticker, your window sticker was either on the car or given to you when you picked it up.

Bold print is directly quoted off the sticker (5 speed Sport has the lowest Fuel Economy of all of the 2012 Impreza vehicles):

CITY MPG 25 Expected Range for most drivers 20 to 30 MPG

HIGHWAY MPG 33 Expected Range for most drivers 27 to 39 MPG

Combined Fuel Economy This Vehicle 28


Now I can compare that to the window sticker on a 2012 Hyundai Elantra, but it does not tell me anything about what I should expect from my Subaru.

You need to drive slower if you want to achieve the higher numbers on the window sticker.

Experience from the Impreza forum also indicates that if you drive short distances, where the engine does not have a chance to warm up, especially in colder weather, you will be seeing the lower end of the City range.

People seeing 20mpg aren't pleased, but they were not misled. It's on the sticker, as mandated by the EPA, so that you won't be misled.

The window sticker is accurate for this car. You can like or dislike the fact that your driving style does not give you the higher end of the range, but it does not make the EPA numbers wrong for the Impreza.

Looking at the data on Fuelly (not the best, but the best we have), out of 195 cars reporting, the average driver is within 1 mpg of achieving the Combined Fuel Economy as printed on the sticker. Keep in mind this was a new car model, so that number includes lower MPG during break in.

In any case, this is not a warranty issue. You would need a much greater discrepancy before you can file a Class Action Lawsuit against Subaru for misrepresenting the MPG's -- The last one I saw that made it through the courts was this one:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...n_1310686.html

Last edited by Zeeper; 10-25-2012 at 07:32 AM.
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