Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Monday July 28, 2014
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC General > Proven Power Bragging

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-06-2012, 06:39 PM   #1
thisisntjared
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 177891
Join Date: Apr 2008
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: south jersey
Vehicle:
06 wrx wagon
child seat/tow hitch cgm

Default Procom Race Systems 20gxt on 2006 wrx

Dyno: Tune Time Performance's Mustang AWD 500
Tuner: Lou Lieberman from Procom Race Systems
Wheel HP: 307 in 4th gear, 294 in 3rd
Wheel TQ: 302 in 4th gear, 281 in 3rd
Ambient Temp: ~70-75 F
Elevation: < 200ft
Baseline for stock STI: 205 whp
Car Info
2006 WRX Limited
Engine Management: EcuFlash
Turbo: Blouch 20gxt
Intercooler: oem sti
Boost: ~16psi
Fuel: 93 octane
Fuel pump: Walbro 255
Injectors: 750cc Deatschworks
Intake/Inlet: oem
Headers/uppipe: oem
Downpipe: Perrin 3in
CBE: oem sti
Other Power Mods: Hallman Manual Boost Controller, other than that its all factory wrx from the throttle body up to the turbo.

I am extremely happy with the results considering I get to keep my factory intake and exhaust so the car is extremely quiet and to quote Lou, "unassuming". This is exaclty how I need it regardless of the end results. What does not show on the dyno is the the daily driving aspects of the car are much more manageable with the 20g and the tune than with the stock turbo and cobb stage 2 ots tune, so again this yet another advantage for the sake of my wife.

The dyno results deserve some explanation. During the first run that yielded 307whp (4th gear), the car pulled some timing around 5500rpm so Lou let off the throttle. Determining that the car was doing 100+mph type work with less than 30mph of air through the intercooler, it was decided to run again in 3rd gear, providing the 294whp number but showing a clean power curve. Lou then recommended an intercooler upgrade, again.

4th gear:

3rd:
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.

Last edited by thisisntjared; 10-29-2012 at 10:36 PM.
thisisntjared is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 08:43 PM   #2
dumpstercrusher
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 134940
Join Date: Dec 2006
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Glen Burnie, MD
Vehicle:
2006 Impreza WRX TR
vf39 ewg tuned ppg gears

Default

are u gonna turn the boost up?
dumpstercrusher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 09:38 PM   #3
thisisntjared
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 177891
Join Date: Apr 2008
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: south jersey
Vehicle:
06 wrx wagon
child seat/tow hitch cgm

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dumpstercrusher View Post
are u gonna turn the boost up?
after a installing a new intercooler
thisisntjared is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2012, 09:37 PM   #4
JoeTX
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 83069
Join Date: Mar 2005
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: Fort Worth, TX
Vehicle:
2007 STi 302/350
UGM Wingless

Default

there are many threads that show the stock STi intercooler is better than many aftermarket ones. limiting boost to 16 with a 20G seems very conservative but you still gained 100whp over a stock STi on that dyno which must be a kick in the butt dyno. it seems laggy though. do whatever you need to do but crank that boost up. you paid for a 20G so use it.

It was most interesting to see the comparison between the 3 and 4th gear pulls. good luck.
JoeTX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2012, 01:30 AM   #5
907Bum
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 183634
Join Date: Jul 2008
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: At the "B"
Vehicle:
02 wrx/ 92 ss
Booze fueled :)

Default

Didn't we just do the aftermarket vs sti intercooler debate?



High filter value on the dyno. The pull starts at both a high rpm and has a dip onto boost...
907Bum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2012, 01:00 PM   #6
thisisntjared
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 177891
Join Date: Apr 2008
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: south jersey
Vehicle:
06 wrx wagon
child seat/tow hitch cgm

Default

to be honest i am not sure where i am on intercooler upgrades... something must be done eventually though...
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeTX View Post
it seems laggy though.
i expected a delay in the boost because i am still using an oem sti 2.5in cat back along with the factory airbox and turbo inlet
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeTX View Post
you paid for a 20G so use it.
at the time, it was only $60-$70 more than the 18gxt so i figure i would just get the 20g for the long term...
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeTX View Post
It was most interesting to see the comparison between the 3 and 4th gear pulls. good luck.
i should scan and post both dyno sheets for a full picture...
Quote:
Originally Posted by 907Bum View Post
Didn't we just do the aftermarket vs sti intercooler debate?.
link? any empirical evidence? i am have seen a few threads but am VERY curious if i missed any compelling arguments in the aftermarket vs sti intercooler debate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 907Bum View Post
High filter value on the dyno. The pull starts at both a high rpm and has a dip onto boost...
in regards to the filter value, i gave no mind to it as this was the first time i ever had a car on a dyno for power. it is true that there is a dip onto boost, full boost hit at 3700 rpm. Lou said its expected for it to run rich for a bit as the boost first comes on.

Last edited by thisisntjared; 10-09-2012 at 01:50 PM.
thisisntjared is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2012, 09:22 AM   #7
thisisntjared
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 177891
Join Date: Apr 2008
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: south jersey
Vehicle:
06 wrx wagon
child seat/tow hitch cgm

Default

uploaded scanned dynographs
thisisntjared is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2012, 09:25 AM   #8
mtarr07
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 246990
Join Date: May 2010
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: NOVA
Vehicle:
2010 Wrx

Default

Honestly, I think this is great. Could you have gone 18gxt, more mods, and then in turn increase the power and how soon it comes on? Yes. BUT, with this setup you have piece of mind (reliability), got what you wanted (decent power and still very quiet), and still have a fun car. Props to you!
mtarr07 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2012, 09:28 AM   #9
Procom Race Systems
Former Vendor
 
Member#: 315449
Join Date: Apr 2012
Default

Figured I'd chime in and clear up somethings. 16psi is very low for a 20G and the answer for this is simple...we made 100whp over a stock STi. Keeping the stock airbox and catback exhaust! The car is daily driven, fast, smooth power delivery, and will give him no problems (i.e. trans breakages). I think thats the goal here.

As for the dip in power at peak boost, it's an anomaly in some ECU's. Some cars will dip rich at peak boost. It's just something that happens with not all, but some cars. You can combat the issue by ramping up timing in that area, but to be honest, the car is unbelievably smooth on the street so we left it as such, and left some room for error in the map. (i.e. bad gas, etc) I'm not one to tune until you cant tune anymore. Tuning has been made to seem like this form of "black magic", it's not. It does take a lot of knowledge, but I usually just let the car make the power. I'm not the type to force it out. This leads to a better performing car that will LAST! I can make 450whp on this turbo, I'm sure, but when he calls me and says the car is broken, I haven't done anyone any favors!

The filter rate is simply to give everyone those pretty curves. Any chassis dyno is going to show some "noise" and it shows up as those small humps in the curve. It's simply cleaned up for a more mainstream look. At the end of the day the peak power and curve is the same. No harm, no foul.

As for the intercooler debate, I'm not going to hijack the thread on this subject. IMO it's not only intercooler efficiency we need to look at in this case, but it's surrounding air temps. On a dyno with a fan on the intercooler we can make the air temp whatever we like, but driving around a city at 25mph (i.e. this guy) and then going WOT down a side street will spell disaster for any TMIC. What really needs to be looked at is added heat sheilding in an effort to keep exhaust heat away from the intercooler. We will be developing a TIMC intercooler set-up over the next few months that will showcase this theory.

In closing, thanks Jared for the kind words! I hope to see you in the shop again very soon. This car will more then likely be the tester for out TMIC set-up. Enjoy the car and beat the piss out of it, because you can!
Procom Race Systems is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2012, 03:45 PM   #10
batteryman
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 209986
Join Date: Apr 2009
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Portland
Vehicle:
2006 WRX Wagon
Aspen White

Default

^ very well said. Sometimes I think some people forget others may like a safer tune so their engine/ tranny will last.

Also agree with you about the intercooler. I have talked to one shop that said a TMIC may not start cooling effectively until you get up to about 40mph

Last edited by batteryman; 10-10-2012 at 04:07 PM.
batteryman is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2012, 07:42 PM   #11
2011boostdwrx
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 263470
Join Date: Nov 2010
Default

Very interesting I am going from my HTA68 to a Kamak 20 GTX STS with all supporting mods and a 6 spd swap on my 11. I was making over 350 WHP with the HTA and Meth, so it will be intresting to see what happens with my new motor and the new 20G. That said I also swaped out my UEL for an EL of the same make. So spool will be intresting and I am FMIC.
2011boostdwrx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2012, 02:17 PM   #12
thisisntjared
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 177891
Join Date: Apr 2008
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: south jersey
Vehicle:
06 wrx wagon
child seat/tow hitch cgm

Default

Any time Lou!

I did forget to mention my need for the reliability of this setup. When I first contacted Lou, I mentioned that my goals for reliability and daily-drive-with-wife-and-child-ability(must be quiet) would exceed the priority of the goal for 300whp.

With the constraints provided, I was surprised to see the first run hit 307whp even after letting off early.

I should also mention that Lou advocated keeping the setup as simple as possible. I did not make cost a priority as I was prepared to continue saving if the budget needed to be expanded. In addressing reliability, Lou also kept this setup more affordable by minimizing extras.
Quote:
Originally Posted by batteryman View Post
Also agree with you about the intercooler. I have talked to one shop that said a TMIC may not start cooling effectively until you get up to about 40mph
i would love to see more info on this. this would mean that a tmic would not start cooling effectively on a good portion of auto-x courses. it would also mean i should strongly consider a front mount and scoopless hood from an impreza.

Last edited by thisisntjared; 10-11-2012 at 02:33 PM.
thisisntjared is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2012, 02:24 PM   #13
Dave D.
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 130990
Join Date: Nov 2006
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Menzel Lake, WA
Vehicle:
06 Red Ltd.Wagon
I need a new tuner!

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2011boostdwrx View Post
Very interesting I am going from my HTA68 to a Kamak 20 GTX STS with all supporting mods and a 6 spd swap on my 11. I was making over 350 WHP with the HTA and Meth, so it will be intresting to see what happens with my new motor and the new 20G. That said I also swaped out my UEL for an EL of the same make. So spool will be intresting and I am FMIC.
I'll be interested in your results. I have a 6-speed going in soon, and eventually will go bigger, now that the motor and tranny can handle the power. Thinking about a 20xgt at this point, but your comparison will be useful.
Dave D. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2012, 02:34 PM   #14
thisisntjared
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 177891
Join Date: Apr 2008
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: south jersey
Vehicle:
06 wrx wagon
child seat/tow hitch cgm

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave D. View Post
I'll be interested in your results. I have a 6-speed going in soon, and eventually will go bigger, now that the motor and tranny can handle the power. Thinking about a 20xgt at this point, but your comparison will be useful.
your setup had me considering the hta68 for quite a while, then i decided that the psi it takes for it to shine was really on the upper end of where i wanted to go. i am curious to see 2011boostdwrx's results too, but a little bit more to validate the decision i made even though they are different 20gs

Last edited by thisisntjared; 10-11-2012 at 02:54 PM.
thisisntjared is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2012, 11:46 PM   #15
2011boostdwrx
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 263470
Join Date: Nov 2010
Default

The Turbo will be in on Monday, the SB should be in next week. Akuma should be building the SB next week. I akso added an ELH, Turbo Blanket, so I am hoping for some nice spool. The HTA was at 23 PSI w/Meth at over 35o WHP. We were going to push to 24-26 PSI, so like 10 WHP/ we were looking at like 370+, then the cylinder liner went on the dyno.

Lets see what happens with the 20GTX, looking for at least 400 whp I hope. But, once all put together I am looking at 1000 miles breakin, so I dont know if you will see anything for at least another month number wise.
2011boostdwrx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2013, 04:25 PM   #16
Nickarub
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 230509
Join Date: Nov 2009
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: Houston
Vehicle:
06 vf39 wrx
ugm

Default

I just bought a 20g xt and will have the same setup with low boost. I will have tons of headroooom
Nickarub is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2013, 07:43 PM   #17
thisisntjared
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 177891
Join Date: Apr 2008
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: south jersey
Vehicle:
06 wrx wagon
child seat/tow hitch cgm

Default

3000 miles later and i am already calculating what it would take to push more...
thisisntjared is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2013, 08:20 PM   #18
Nickarub
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 230509
Join Date: Nov 2009
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: Houston
Vehicle:
06 vf39 wrx
ugm

Default

Still on stock tranny?
Nickarub is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2013, 08:34 PM   #19
thisisntjared
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 177891
Join Date: Apr 2008
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: south jersey
Vehicle:
06 wrx wagon
child seat/tow hitch cgm

Default

Stock tranny, stock clutch, stock long block, stock intake
thisisntjared is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2013, 08:46 PM   #20
Nickarub
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 230509
Join Date: Nov 2009
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: Houston
Vehicle:
06 vf39 wrx
ugm

Default

That makes me feel better about my 5mt. You running stock size wheel and tires?
Nickarub is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2013, 09:14 AM   #21
thisisntjared
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 177891
Join Date: Apr 2008
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: south jersey
Vehicle:
06 wrx wagon
child seat/tow hitch cgm

Default

Stock wheels. 215/45/17 dunlop sport signature all seasons
thisisntjared is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2013, 10:54 PM   #22
some dude
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 100300
Join Date: Nov 2005
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: MIC|-|IG/\N
Vehicle:
06 WRX
CGM

Default

How many miles on the car?
some dude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2013, 08:45 AM   #23
thisisntjared
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 177891
Join Date: Apr 2008
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: south jersey
Vehicle:
06 wrx wagon
child seat/tow hitch cgm

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by some dude View Post
How many miles on the car?
Sorry I missed this! actually turned 70,000 on the dyno. At 77k now
thisisntjared is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2013, 08:27 PM   #24
johnstc
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 339777
Join Date: Dec 2012
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Vehicle:
2007 WRX
OBP

Default

This is just what I wanted to see. Have an 07 with same mileage. Also am located in central jersey. Was planning on hitting Lou up for a tune once things got more serious with my car! Have heard tons of good in regards to him and Procom.
johnstc is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:51 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2014 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2014, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.