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Old 10-09-2012, 12:30 PM   #101
Sublime40
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summer tires or not the amount of speed to split the car in half must have been way to fast
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Old 10-09-2012, 01:44 PM   #102
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STi part out on Long Island? I'll take the rear half of the chassis.
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Old 10-09-2012, 01:45 PM   #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaddMax View Post
Here's a novel idea. If the roads are covered in ice or you know the conditions will be such soon, don't drive. Same goes for impending snow storms. Don't drive when they're going to hit and avoid driving until the snow crews have worked the streets a bit. It's not like it's surprise when these events happen as you know about it days in advance. Hardly any of us have jobs where we MUST be there, no matter the conditions. Most employers would rather keep their employees safe and to work late rather than hurt or dead.
I work at a hospital sparky, there is no such thing as a "snow day". We are required to show up, because the patients can't exactly get up and leave no matter what the weather is like.

And you stated quite frankly that winter tires make no difference on ice. That is patently false, just accept you were wrong and move on. Your example of black ice can happen whether there is snow on the ground or not, as a matter of fact it usually happens after the snow has melted during the day and re-froze at night. No town or county I know of around here bothers to go back out and salt those spots unless it happens to be snowing again. I guess everyone in the northeast should stay home until April right? And you are right about one thing, you can't beat physics. If hit it at 55mph you're in trouble. But most people encounter ice just trying to get out of their housing development or at a stop light, where winter tires will help out a LOT. It usually means the difference between sliding through an intersection or not. There have been plenty of times where the vehicle in front of me kept on sliding where I stopped easy because of winter tires and their lack of them.

Seriously man, stop posting bad info or...

Stop failing at the interwebz.

Last edited by s2ktosti; 10-10-2012 at 09:23 AM.
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Old 10-09-2012, 01:49 PM   #104
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^^^ exactly my company sends out memos and says, make sure you get up early and get to work on time
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Old 10-09-2012, 02:03 PM   #105
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Originally Posted by Sublime40 View Post
^^^ exactly my company sends out memos and says, make sure you get up early and get to work on time
"If you're not early, you're late."

I live by that.

--kC
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Old 10-09-2012, 02:25 PM   #106
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Regardless of what tires and how much of a "sports car" he has, who in their right mind leaves a group of 17/18 year old highschool kids free to be running around at 3:30 in the morning?

This sounds like a case of mommy and daddy substituting stuff for actual parenting. I know I would have probably gotten in trouble in Highschool if I was out that late and I had a Corolla. The rule though was that the car had to be home by midnight period. I was free to be out later, but the car had to be in the garage at that point.

There is no legitimate reason I can imagine for that many highschool students to be out at that time in any car. Add to that a car capable of going fast fully loaded with people, suboptimum driving conditions, and an inexperienced driver. Well I think we call all agree the lucky part is that nobody outside the car itself was injured or killed.
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Old 10-09-2012, 02:26 PM   #107
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If you read all the posts, some will blame tires, some the car, some the parents and others age, but they all really lead to the one real source of the problem: the driver. I think the important thing here is that this just be a wake up call to everyone to be careful out on the streets, and if you're going to go race on the streets or speed excessively (which no one should be doing) do it alone and not with others in the car.
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Old 10-09-2012, 02:43 PM   #108
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I can't feel bad for the kid, I assume the parents bought him a brand new 2012 WRX STI, He was driving while drinking without a license, yeah darwins theory of evolution at its finest.
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Old 10-09-2012, 02:49 PM   #109
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Originally Posted by Abschatten View Post
I can't feel bad for the kid, I assume the parents bought him a brand new 2012 WRX STI, He was driving while drinking without a license, yeah darwins theory of evolution at its finest.
Eh, the kid who was driving lived. It was the passengers who died, darwin failed.
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Old 10-09-2012, 02:51 PM   #110
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Originally Posted by unequal View Post
If you read all the posts, some will blame tires, some the car, some the parents and others age, but they all really lead to the one real source of the problem: the driver. I think the important thing here is that this just be a wake up call to everyone to be careful out on the streets, and if you're going to go race on the streets or speed excessively (which no one should be doing) do it alone and not with others in the car.
Don't race on the streets period. - Excessive speed kills.

The driver will lie and try to minimize his fault. The parents will defend him. The insurance company will pay the other families. If his parents have money they will get sued. Meanwhile your kid is dead because some punk thinks he is a racecar driver.

Wait a couple of weeks there will be more accidents related to summer tires and newbies. It happens every year, luckily most are just wheel damage from hitting curbs.
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Old 10-09-2012, 03:05 PM   #111
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Originally Posted by Abschatten View Post
I can't feel bad for the kid, I assume the parents bought him a brand new 2012 WRX STI, He was driving while drinking without a license, yeah darwins theory of evolution at its finest.
Who said he was drinking? Do you know something the rest of us don't?

He last name was "Beer".

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Old 10-09-2012, 03:06 PM   #112
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Don't race on the streets period. - Excessive speed kills.
Wrong. I've never died doing 100. Or 150. Or 200.

Sudden decelleration kills.

--kC
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Old 10-09-2012, 03:12 PM   #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KC

Wrong. I've never died doing 100. Or 150. Or 200.

Sudden decelleration kills.

--kC
Excessive speed on the streets as he said can kill. Not enough time to react to unforeseen circumstances. In the end it comes down to lack of responsibility from various parties. Kids inside not asking to slow down. Him not slowing down. Parents buying for him, etc.
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Old 10-09-2012, 03:15 PM   #114
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According to the article in the Ny Post they were smoking weed. The car was equipped with a "black box" and Subaru is helping the cops find out exactly how fast they were going. We shall see.
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Old 10-09-2012, 03:22 PM   #115
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Originally Posted by s2ktosti View Post
I work at a hospital sparky, there is no such thing as a "snow day". We are required to show up, because the patients can't exactly get up and leave no matter what the weather is like.
Hence the reason why I didn't say "everyone", Sparky. Are you saying doctors and nurses never call in sick Barring my ER nurse friend, I can't think of a single friend or family member that MUST be at work during a snow storm or ice storm.

Quote:
Your example of black ice can happen whether there is snow on the ground or not, as a matter of fact it usually happens after the snow has melted during the day and re-froze at night.
Black ice must work differently in the NE. Black ice in the Midwest generally forms from freezing drizzle and on bridges which freeze before other road surfaces do. This generally happens when it's in the 33-34 degree range and raining/misting. Winter tires won't save you when you enter a bridge at any speed and need to turn. Keep dreaming.

Quote:
Seriously man, stop posting bad info or...

Stop failing at the interwebz.
Not all of us live in areas that see enough snow to necessiate the need for winter/snow tires. That's a fact. Seriously man, if you want to debate this topic further, I'll be happy to do it in a seperate thread
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Old 10-09-2012, 03:34 PM   #116
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Originally Posted by Rampager2000 View Post

People shouldn't be pinning this on age, though. How many videos are there on Youtube of guys in muscle cars/exotics that hit the gas around a turn and wrecked their lambo or something of the sort? Plenty. Like has been said, it's all about mindset. I feel this matters less about age and more about examples that have been given. Some 50 year olds just seem to have not grown up enough to be able to handle the cars.

I'm 18 and I honestly feel more responsible in my car than most elderly folks in the area with ratrods and all. They're constantly driving like ********, starting ****, road rage, going fast all the time.. You name it.



Exactly my point.
I bet he thought the same thing. "I'm 17 and a good driver for my age", and then stupid just kicked in one night. It's unfortunate, and I think most of us have done stupid things and thankfully survived.

I did stupid things and I always thought I was a good driver, and I was, but still no where near as good of a driver as I am now. The difference is now I'm way more aware of how vulnerable I am, and how many things can go wrong not in my control, and don't do stupid things anymore.

Age had something to do with it, and his fast car had something to do with it. That you can't see this, proves you're still too young to understand.
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Old 10-09-2012, 03:41 PM   #117
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Originally Posted by REX8 View Post

They'd probably be just as dead doing 85 in the Taurus, vs. 92 in the STi (or whatever the acceleration difference may have been).

C/N Here's the issue:

Sticky tires and a relatively buttoned-down suspension allow you to take a corner at, say 95 MPH, vs. say, 90 MPH in a more pedestrian car. Yet, your average idiot will tell you an STi can corner -insert stupidly high number here- compared to lesser cars. And they'll want to show their friends all of that "potential"

.
First issue, you think an STI can outhandle a Taurus by just a few mph?
(EDIT - I saw you post some test that said the difference was only 10% of STI outhanlding the Taurus. I need to go for a test drive in a new Taurus. My dad has an Altima, I'd say they are sort of similar, and I can't see it being such a minor difference. I'm certain I would have ended up off the road/track in any other car than my WRX, and I've driven plenty of cars.) You really believe this number?

Second, good luck getting your pedestrian car up to 90mph. I think Fred Flintstone burned stone a few times, but never got up to 90mph

Last edited by LostAndFound; 10-09-2012 at 03:49 PM.
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Old 10-09-2012, 03:48 PM   #118
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not going to get caught up in the typical nasioc bs about young drivers or whatever but how fast do you have to go to split an STi in half? I've seen people flip em or have a tree fall on them and blah blah blah and no splittage, and those were GDs not brand new ones with a bunch of chassis improvements....goodness
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Old 10-09-2012, 04:20 PM   #119
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Terrible story. I would not be surprised if the driver was charged with a crime in this, and his family will likely be sued by the victims' families as well.
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Old 10-09-2012, 04:31 PM   #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Donutz
not going to get caught up in the typical nasioc bs about young drivers or whatever but how fast do you have to go to split an STi in half? I've seen people flip em or have a tree fall on them and blah blah blah and no splittage, and those were GDs not brand new ones with a bunch of chassis improvements....goodness
Triple digits fo sho
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Old 10-09-2012, 04:51 PM   #121
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Originally Posted by LostAndFound View Post
First issue, you think an STI can outhandle a Taurus by just a few mph?
(EDIT - I saw you post some test that said the difference was only 10% of STI outhanlding the Taurus. I need to go for a test drive in a new Taurus. My dad has an Altima, I'd say they are sort of similar, and I can't see it being such a minor difference. I'm certain I would have ended up off the road/track in any other car than my WRX, and I've driven plenty of cars.) You really believe this number?

Second, good luck getting your pedestrian car up to 90mph. I think Fred Flintstone burned stone a few times, but never got up to 90mph
I did 110 mph in an Echo in Highschool. It was as stupid dangerous thing to do. The point being that any "pedestrian" car now a days can hit 90mph. Doesn't mean it is safe. Also, the skid pad difference between a Taurus and STi aren't as massively different as you would expect. The truth is that most cars now can pull a fairly decent corner mostly due to the advances in the tire technology.
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Old 10-09-2012, 05:13 PM   #122
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Originally Posted by CopperTopNWOR View Post
I did 110 mph in an Echo in Highschool. It was as stupid dangerous thing to do. The point being that any "pedestrian" car now a days can hit 90mph. Doesn't mean it is safe. Also, the skid pad difference between a Taurus and STi aren't as massively different as you would expect. The truth is that most cars now can pull a fairly decent corner mostly due to the advances in the tire technology.

My point was, I just never heard of "pedestrian car". Maybe I've been missing out.

Anyway, it sounds like STIs are pretty worthless for such minimal gains.
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Old 10-09-2012, 05:37 PM   #123
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Remember he was not alone in the car,he was behind the wheel of the car which makes him responsible for all of them,but that went out the window as you can see.
If he was alone this would be all so different but that's not the case , so he better pray the chargers (if any)don't stick cause it jail or back to the Caribbean.
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Old 10-09-2012, 05:56 PM   #124
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Originally Posted by LostAndFound View Post
My point was, I just never heard of "pedestrian car". Maybe I've been missing out.
See your favorite dictionary. Or:
Quote:
From WordNet (r) 3.0 (2006) [wn]:

pedestrian
adj 1: lacking wit or imagination; "a pedestrian movie plot"
[syn: {pedestrian}, {prosaic}, {prosy}, {earthbound}]
I left off the "noun" definition, as "pedestrian" in "pedestrian car" is clearly an adjective.

So, a "pedestrian car" is a basic, boring, run-of-the-mill car. A Camry or similar. It's not exactly a stretch to use the word in that way.
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Old 10-09-2012, 06:02 PM   #125
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Now I know why my parents wouldn't let me drive with anyone in my car until I was 18... Instead of hating my parents at the time, I guess I should have thanked them instead.

Since the driver is under 18, the families of the passengers can and probably will go after the parents of the driver for damages.

But... There is no use in trying to point any blame here as the deed is already done. The only thing to do now is to try to prevent this from happening again in the future. My thoughts and prayers go out to everyone involved.
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