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Old 10-07-2012, 04:28 PM   #826
johnfelstead
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No PS here, proper BHP and LbFt.

It's not so bad now, but it used to be quite common to find a 1000BHP Big block Chevy lost 200 ponies on the boat over to the UK back in the 90's.
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Old 10-07-2012, 04:40 PM   #827
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I cannot comment on the power that this, or that engine makes, people are optimistic with dyno results all the time, everywhere.

Industry-wide, there has been a reform couple years ago, where the manufacturers were suggested to have their engine outputs certified, which did result in changes to output in most cases.
This however, only has to do with manufacturer testing methodology.

But as far as the BHP, it's only specifying that it's brake horsepower, as opposed to wheel horsepower.
The brake horsepower, as a measurement unit, does not differ, in terms of watts by example, from a HP, by American definition.
Brake used to be the mechanical measurement device, which BTW could have removed ancilaries as well, such as a powersteering pump, alternator, or even water pump.
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Old 10-07-2012, 04:53 PM   #828
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I am only having a laugh Vlad. As you know all Dyno's give different results, they are only really any use as a tuning aid. I quite like using delta dash road dyno to compare changes too.

Shaun and I are using the same RR, plus we also compare Road Dyno results, so we are getting some good comparison data.

P.S. There is no such car as an STi V9 Spec C, they stopped calling them V* on the STi6, post that they are known as MY**, My own car is an MY05 JDM STi which is often, incorectly known as a V9. (although some people mix them up, the V9 is the first widetrack car, the last MY Blobeye)
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Old 10-07-2012, 05:09 PM   #829
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Well, take a look at my article about EJ207 here:

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2385141

You will find in it that yes, we know they stopped calling them versions at V6, but we, the fans, have chosen to continue this versions talk and there are some conventions as far as what is considered which version.

So, as far as Subaru is concerned my engine is from a GDB RASC REV E. But that's just being technical, there is no fun in doing that..

I also use delta Dash for dyno.
Do you weigh the car with a full tank of gas and you in car? That's the best number to be entered for accuracy.
Which smoothing do you consider to be the most accurate?
I use the heavy setting.
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Old 10-07-2012, 05:22 PM   #830
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Some incorrect info in there.

Yes, i put my car on corner weight scales to get an acurate reading, then reference the amount of fuel in the tank plus how many pies i ate that week to get the total weight.

Heavy weighting is what most people use when referencing RD figures.
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Old 10-08-2012, 07:33 AM   #831
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If you have the correct info and links to information sources for it, I welcome you posting it, it would do me and others a service and I would be happy to correct it.

And yes, I was on the Ecutek forum (I believe that is closed now) and noticed that the tuners that post there were all indicating the heavy setting of the smoothing as something comparable to a roller dyno.

Now to go back to the topic of twinscroll, what type of spring pressure is everybody running with their twinscroll?
I am running a 14 PSI at this point and may go to 16.
One of the guys that is running Kinugawa started with 14 PSI and is going to 18 PSI.
Some guys with the single scroll are starting to use 20 PSI springs, but they aim for high boost running E85.

Also, nice results, Shaun. What is the octane rating of the Vpower?
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Old 10-08-2012, 05:52 PM   #832
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V-Power is 99 RON, which is the equivilent of 95 PON (UK uses RON, USA uses PON)

No idea on spring rate, i leave all that to Owen.
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Old 10-09-2012, 09:48 AM   #833
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Thanks for the RON number and yes, the equivalent AKI (aka PON) in US for this RON in UK sounds about right.
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Old 10-09-2012, 02:25 PM   #834
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I have a 1bar actuator. Can't see any point in needing anymore for my set-up. I have no problems achieving and/or maintaining boost.
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Old 10-10-2012, 07:33 AM   #835
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Thanks, Shaun.

I was thinking more in terms of how wide the wastegate door swings and still have propper preload.
By example, the non adjustable actuator that comes with the VF37-36 only swings the door open at less than 45 degrees. On an adjustable actuator, that rod length is equivalent to 3+ turns.
For that 8sq cm housing and running the OEM 19.5 PSI, that is fine.

Once you run a 10 sq cm and aim for 22 PSI, achieving the needed preload with just 1.5 turns leaves the door swinging open at 45+ degrees.
With an 18 PSI, you may have the preload at 0.5 turns and open the door at above 50 degrees, at full actuator pressure.
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Old 10-10-2012, 10:07 AM   #836
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hey JohnF, any updates with how close the Owen turbo is? its starting to get cold here in Wisconsin and only have about a month before i stop tuning the majority of cars unless the roads are super dry. I got a dom1.5xtr in single scroll in my hands right now as well as a dom2.5xtr i am selling. If blouch will sell me the exh housing that they use for the TS 1.5xtr then i will just swap it myself and run that I guess.

Vlad. just go ewg lol!
you may have seen my posts but i run the oem WG and it seemed that when i added a redneck helper spring i gained about 200 rpms in spool going on the same road starting at 2000 rpms. I am peaking to 24psi tapering to 16 at redline. i wish i had the cash to buy a nice adjustable one.
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Old 10-10-2012, 12:34 PM   #837
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Just finished mapping mine before the final sprint of the season this weekend. We couldnt quite get the peak boost we wanted due to a limitation in the EcuTek MegaROM file which limits max wastegate duty to 90%, (we will ask EcuTek to see if that can be changed to allow the turbo to hit our target) but we are seeing 1.95BAR mid range, it looks like the turbo will pull 2.1BAR if we get the duties up.

Car goes on the rollers tomorrow, but Delta Dash Road dyno is showing it as producing about 470BHP/490LbFt.

Once the Sprint is over Owen is going to do a write up on the turbos and start marketing them, even before this last sprint we have guarateed a 1-2 in the championship, it's just a case of which of the two of us wins. (We have two cars with this turbo at the moment, mine is a forged 2.1 in a full weight JDM STi genuinely daily driven 12K mile/year road car, Pauls is an MY03 lightened Spec C with a stock engine.)

Wastegates on this Owen Turbo are inconel specials, one of the issues with the stock turbos is the size of the waste gates and the materials, it's not uncommon for the waste gates to not shut properly due to distortion and they can be restrictive at the top end due to their size. Uprating the actuators isnt actually fixing the fundemental problems with the stock turbo's.
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Old 10-10-2012, 01:08 PM   #838
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I did not post anything about how the wastegate door shuts, I would be fixing a problem that I don't have with a door that I don't need.
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Old 10-10-2012, 01:34 PM   #839
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Say that again, but this time in the voice of Davros, the master of the Daleks adding "exterminate" on the end, it works quite nicely.



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Old 10-10-2012, 03:01 PM   #840
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Uh... ok, Capt'n Blake, now lower the TV volume and actually follow what I'm posting, if you're going to reply to it..
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Old 10-10-2012, 03:06 PM   #841
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If you read the posts you'll realise i wasn't replying to you anyway.
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Old 10-10-2012, 03:21 PM   #842
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlad View Post
Thanks, Shaun.

I was thinking more in terms of how wide the wastegate door swings and still have propper preload.
By example, the non adjustable actuator that comes with the VF37-36 only swings the door open at less than 45 degrees. On an adjustable actuator, that rod length is equivalent to 3+ turns.
For that 8sq cm housing and running the OEM 19.5 PSI, that is fine.

Once you run a 10 sq cm and aim for 22 PSI, achieving the needed preload with just 1.5 turns leaves the door swinging open at 45+ degrees.
With an 18 PSI, you may have the preload at 0.5 turns and open the door at above 50 degrees, at full actuator pressure.
Apologies as I checked and I'm actually on a 1.2bar actuator.

I'm running 1.8bar peak and 1.6 at 7500+rpm on the Meth map - 1.8bar peak and 1.7 at 7500+rpm on the VPower map.
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Old 10-10-2012, 03:47 PM   #843
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnfelstead View Post
Just finished mapping mine before the final sprint of the season this weekend. We couldnt quite get the peak boost we wanted due to a limitation in the EcuTek MegaROM file which limits max wastegate duty to 90%, (we will ask EcuTek to see if that can be changed to allow the turbo to hit our target) but we are seeing 1.95BAR mid range, it looks like the turbo will pull 2.1BAR if we get the duties up.

Car goes on the rollers tomorrow, but Delta Dash Road dyno is showing it as producing about 470BHP/490LbFt.

Once the Sprint is over Owen is going to do a write up on the turbos and start marketing them, even before this last sprint we have guarateed a 1-2 in the championship, it's just a case of which of the two of us wins. (We have two cars with this turbo at the moment, mine is a forged 2.1 in a full weight JDM STi genuinely daily driven 12K mile/year road car, Pauls is an MY03 lightened Spec C with a stock engine.)

Wastegates on this Owen Turbo are inconel specials, one of the issues with the stock turbos is the size of the waste gates and the materials, it's not uncommon for the waste gates to not shut properly due to distortion and they can be restrictive at the top end due to their size. Uprating the actuators isnt actually fixing the fundemental problems with the stock turbo's.
well i hope its not too damn expensive after conversion rate for money and shipping. the new efr that is coming out is supposed to be super fast spool as well with the best technology you can get. i would just need to get a 1.5 scroll up pipe and mod my DP which is no big deal to me.
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Old 10-10-2012, 03:53 PM   #844
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Thanks again, Shaun.
In your experience the 1.2 Bar is preloaded enough at 1.5 turns from the free-slide position?
I'm going to try a 16 PSI in couple days, can't wait.
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Old 10-10-2012, 05:18 PM   #845
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Shauns turbo isnt a twin scroll, it's a twin entry with a single waste gate port and button. You are wasting your time trying to use that as a reference for waste gate actuator specs on a Twin Scroll turbo.

The $ is quite strong against the right now, sadly!

Not sure what a 1.5 scroll up pipe is? My turbo is a proper twin scroll.
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Old 10-10-2012, 09:03 PM   #846
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Oh, ok, I thought it was twinscroll.
My 1.2 bar spring just came in.. off to install it.
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Old 10-11-2012, 04:56 AM   #847
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnfelstead View Post
Not sure what a 1.5 scroll up pipe is?
I suspect it maybe single to twin or twin to single.
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Old 10-11-2012, 09:15 AM   #848
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Back from the rolling road.

The engine has picked up another 25lbft, but also lost 25BHP at the top end.

Speaking to my mapper and also looking at the logs from the two sessions, my mapper took 1.5-2 degrees timing out, which is why the power has gone down above 5500rpm.

I think with one final mapping session to bring back the top end and we will be there, it's looking like it's a 490lbft @ 3700rpm and 460BHP @ 6500rpm package, which is just what i was hoping for. Mid range is nuts, there is no need to change down from 6th at cruising speeds, it just goes, very impressive IMHO.

Peak boost on the rollers was 1.85BAR @ 3500rpm, it pulls 1.95BAR on the road at the same rpm.

Power against boost


Power and torque


Blue line is current run, red line is the previous run.
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Old 10-11-2012, 09:22 AM   #849
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That is some damn good Spool, overall looks pretty fantastic. Especially once you get your Top End back.
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Old 10-11-2012, 09:35 AM   #850
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Yes, delighted with how it's turned out, it's made a very quick road car!

peak turbo speed is 138,000 rpm, Owen said they would be happy with up to 145,000 rpm
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