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Old 11-13-2012, 07:12 PM   #26
nhmtns
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I'll tell you the biggest scam. Next time you sit at the salesperson's desk, notice which way the photos of their kids are facing. Yup, not toward them. They want you to see the kids who will die from starvation if you don't buy the vehicle.
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Old 11-13-2012, 07:44 PM   #27
Jack
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prohobo View Post
Unfortunately from your post, you do not seem to understand the art of this particular con (for lack of a better word). Maybe it was my lack of explanation, so let me try again.

1. They DO order the car.
2. They tell you it would take 4 weeks (which is most likely the TRUTH).
3. They call you a short time latter to tell you it has been delayed to 8-10 weeks. (the LIE).
4. They call you in 4 weeks when your car DOES arrive, but they TELL YOU it is a random car that arrived in inventory and does NOT have all the FACTORY options you ordered. However, if you want that CAR now, they can install those as "dealer options" but it will cost you $500 - $1000 more or you can wait.

Obviously no skin off the teeth of the dealer - he can sell it to someone else, sell it to you for more, and also has you locked into a car with a deposit. What's the worse case scenario for him, a loss of a deposit? Seems simple enough and plausible.

I apologize if you didn't understand this the first time, maybe it was my inability to effectively communicate it. For that I apologize.

However, I think your ad hominem efforts and calling my friend a noob is a little extreme. Are you not a moderator?
Ok, so I will say for argument's sake that this is how things went.

You get the car and look at the Monroney......this is the federally required sticker that lists all of the options with costs. How does the dealer explain that all the options that "he installed" are listed on the car as factory installed options?

sorry about calling your friend a n00b.
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Old 11-13-2012, 08:48 PM   #28
LL247
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This all blows my mind, especially since Subaru is VERY particular about how their dealers behave and treat their customers. How do I know? I'm the Business Manager for a Subaru dealership.

I will have to agree on a few points in this thread, SOME dealers can be shadier than others and if you get 'scammed' it's because you let it happen. There are a billion mandatory disclosures throughout the entire process, just make sure to ask questions and read everything!

I can also say from experience, there's some serious wait time on orders right now. I went from ordering to locating mine out of state at another dealer.
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Old 11-13-2012, 10:42 PM   #29
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ALL dealers are shady in someway.
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Old 11-13-2012, 11:27 PM   #30
flargggWRX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prohobo View Post
I was talking with a friend who works at an Audi Dealer and told him about my experience with the Subaru dealer (which was very positive).

He told me to make SURE to get the VIN number on the car if I ordered one, PRIOR to it showing up to the dealership. This would help prevent that scam from happening. He also said to check the forums and chat with other buyers that buy from your dealership to see if anything similar has happened to them. He didn't think this would happen to me and never heard that it happened with a Subaru dealer.

I just thought I would share this story and see if anyone else has heard of such a thing.
First of all, it's obvious your friend was looking out for you when making what is supposedly one of the biggest investments we make in life (x2 here in your case). Kudos to him for that.

Second, the original point of this post, as I interpret it, was to find out if this was just a bunch of porky pies or if it was based on real stories. This is a community of Subaru owners, so it seems like it was a good place to ask the question, considering he is buying a Subaru.

I've never heard of this, but I waited almost 4 months for my WRX to arrive after we placed the order. I sure was starting to get impatient, but luckily my dealer was amazing through the whole process. Hodges Subaru in Ferndale, Mi kept me up to date on almost a biweekly basis. I was pleased with every step of the process, from ordering it to the full, in-vehicle tutorial our salesman gave us

The point is, especially for inexperienced or young buyers, this is a real plausibility. Not all of us are Scooby Specialists from diapers And hey, they don't call them "stealerships" for nothin'. Anyways, OP, thanks for sharing this. I'm sure "newb" questions get annoying to all the seasoned veterans out there, but these threads could use a little more and less

My 2 hundreths of a dollar.
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Old 11-14-2012, 08:37 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack ffr1846 View Post
Ok, so I will say for argument's sake that this is how things went.

You get the car and look at the Monroney......this is the federally required sticker that lists all of the options with costs. How does the dealer explain that all the options that "he installed" are listed on the car as factory installed options?

sorry about calling your friend a n00b.
Perhaps they order the car without the factory options and just do it as a dealer install. I am only telling you what I have been told and while it may seem improbable, it is certainly not impossible. I was just sharing to see if anyone else has heard of this or had any insight. I certainly was not trying to start an argument and I am sorry if my explanation was not clear. No worries about using the noob comment, as a newbie on the forums I certainly don't want to be a polarizing contributor that upsets anyone. I didn't know if I came off the wrong way, and it was certainly not my intention.

Last edited by prohobo; 11-14-2012 at 09:32 AM.
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Old 11-14-2012, 10:25 AM   #32
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When I tried to buy my car I saw the salesman's search screen as he searched for the car I wanted. He said there was one on the west coast. I could see the computer screen, and saw that the car was actually just on the west side of town. (Maybe he got confused and thought Vancouver was a suburb of Toronto?) So I drove across town and bought the car there from a different liar.

What really drives me crazy is that people I explain stories like the OP's or mine just don't believe or understand how salesmen actually do business each and every day.

As far as I'm concerned all salesmen should be mailed to Auschwitz for live cremation.
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Old 11-14-2012, 11:41 AM   #33
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Yup. This sounds real. I have very similar story. It's not Subaru dealership. It involves Jeep dealership.

My girlfriend's sister bought a jeep about 4 weeks ago. She wanted brand new jeep wrangler and she ordered the car from the website. This way, she can get exact color and options that she wanted. She was willing to pay the full MSRP price and all.

She showed me what she ordered and the price. Personally, I think it's over priced, but whatever. If she wants it and is willing to pay for it, why not?

Fast forward couple of days.
She comes to visit, and things have changed little bit. She got a call from a dealer. The dealer said they found one wrangler that's very close to her order in west cost, and she can get it quicker if she takes that one. EXCEPT, it has few upgrades that she didn't ask for. It had upgraded tires and 17' rims (stock is 16') and better radio/audio system.

Her jeep is now 30K+

I told her to **** that. I advised her to tell the dealership, she will walk, if she does not get what she ordered on the web or give her the jeep as it sits. She will never go off-roading, or even take the top off. She ordered it with a hardtop, so she doesn't have to take it off.

I gave her all the advice I can give. I also told her that I think dealership is ****ing with her. Eventually, I stop trying. She thinks I'm insulting her at that point. She is very head strong, or maybe I was.

Even with all the advice I gave her, she end up paying the extra because she wanted to have the car earlier.

Fast forward to present.

She still DOES NOT HAVE THE CAR.

I can definitely, see how people can fall for this.
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Old 11-14-2012, 11:57 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ixwrxxi View Post
ALL dealers are shady in someway.
That's a slight exaggeration.
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Old 11-14-2012, 02:33 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by Atomic Rooster View Post
As far as I'm concerned all salesmen should be mailed to Auschwitz for live cremation.
That's not funny.
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Old 11-14-2012, 02:43 PM   #36
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I dont know I had a good laugh
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Old 11-15-2012, 10:57 AM   #37
LL247
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swpshgnwgn View Post
That's a slight exaggeration.
I agree, we do nothing shady at my dealership. Full disclosure on everything, show actual invoices, tell people about the holdback. Heck when they're in my office and have questions on the financing, I turn my computer screen to them and show them my actual dealer screen I work/print from.

Now granted most dealerships aren't like us, but they're certainly not ALL shady.
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Old 11-15-2012, 11:12 AM   #38
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We ordered cars every now and then at the Subie dealer I worked at. It was no big deal, but it takes FOREVER. Plan on 6-8 weeks.


We RARELY had to do it. Because whatever combination you want, its pretty easy to find a car close enough, and add the options you want. We would find a car, even if it was in the next state over, and get it shipped to us, then add on the options you wanted. 99% of the time we could do it for the same price if the customer stood their ground hard enough.

9 out of 10 customers, when faced with "leave $2000 CASH/CREDIT CARD, NON REFUNDABLE DEPOSIT for a car we can't promise when it will actually get here, but will likely be 6-8 weeks, possibly 10, but usually around 6" or "We can have another car here and make it exactly like the one you want, for $500 more, in 2-3 days" choice, 9 out of 10 will take the faster option. Of those 9 out of 10, 2-3 of them will hold their ground solid and still get the car for the same price as ordering it.


Then again, we were a pretty honest sales dept. I myself was dead honest, 100% of the time. And strangely enough, it worked. I explained how if they fight and fight for that extra $500, they could see it off the price of their car, but their interest would end up a little higher, or something, because at the end of the day it was a business and we couldn't give them a car for zero profit.
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Old 11-15-2012, 05:40 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poorlilpoop View Post
Yup. This sounds real. I have very similar story. It's not Subaru dealership. It involves Jeep dealership.

My girlfriend's sister bought a jeep about 4 weeks ago. She wanted brand new jeep wrangler and she ordered the car from the website. This way, she can get exact color and options that she wanted. She was willing to pay the full MSRP price and all.

She showed me what she ordered and the price. Personally, I think it's over priced, but whatever. If she wants it and is willing to pay for it, why not?

Fast forward couple of days.
She comes to visit, and things have changed little bit. She got a call from a dealer. The dealer said they found one wrangler that's very close to her order in west cost, and she can get it quicker if she takes that one. EXCEPT, it has few upgrades that she didn't ask for. It had upgraded tires and 17' rims (stock is 16') and better radio/audio system.

Her jeep is now 30K+

I told her to **** that. I advised her to tell the dealership, she will walk, if she does not get what she ordered on the web or give her the jeep as it sits. She will never go off-roading, or even take the top off. She ordered it with a hardtop, so she doesn't have to take it off.

I gave her all the advice I can give. I also told her that I think dealership is ****ing with her. Eventually, I stop trying. She thinks I'm insulting her at that point. She is very head strong, or maybe I was.

Even with all the advice I gave her, she end up paying the extra because she wanted to have the car earlier.

Fast forward to present.

She still DOES NOT HAVE THE CAR.

I can definitely, see how people can fall for this.
Not really the same scenario. The above is a classic bait and switch. They get you in with lower price deal and then try to sell you up to a more expensive model. I've seen many internet deals go bad once the buyer shows up to the dealer to finalize the deal.

The problem I have with the OP is it's just too easy for the dealer to get caught. Not only can you tell what the car came with from the factory, but many people would want to come see the car before they agree the pay for the dealer to add the missing options. Others may just want to pay the lower price and accept the car with out the missing options. Either way the dealer would have to find a way to wiggle out of the deal before you show up so they don't get caught.
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Old 11-15-2012, 05:52 PM   #40
Bo0stin5STI
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davenow View Post
"leave $2000 CASH/CREDIT CARD, NON REFUNDABLE DEPOSIT
This is why I love MD. After contacting several dealers to find out what their deposit amount is ($500), by MD law, deposits are 100% refundable!

MD dealers seem to be a lot less shady for some reason.
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Old 11-15-2012, 06:07 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bo0stin5STI View Post
This is why I love MD. After contacting several dealers to find out what their deposit amount is ($500), by MD law, deposits are 100% refundable!

MD dealers seem to be a lot less shady for some reason.
It's not that they choose to be less shady, it's that the state law stops them from keeping your deposit, so you have the upper hand. A large, non-refundable deposit means a dealer can do whatever they want and you won't walk.

I'd be very skeptical about ordering. I've only ever bought off the lot, even if that means some digging around.
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