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Old 11-16-2012, 07:30 AM   #1
Delaware
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Default Odd MPG Question

I have a 2012 Impreza 2.0i Hatchback and I absolutely love it, with the exception of the mpgs. I now have almost 19,000 miles and I initially complained about the mpg when I first bought it. Up until my last oil change over a month ago, I was averaging between 31-32.8 mpg. Now I am consistently average around 28. I know that the gas switches over to "winter gas" and that will have an effect but I wouldn't think they would switch at the beginning of October, which is when I noticed the decrease, and immediately after I had it serviced. Is there something the dealership could have done maybe to the computer system to effect my mpg? As much as I like the sales and gm of the dealership, I have had a couple of incidents with the service manager, who is a complete a$@! The last time I had my oil changed, I did not have an appointment (the gm told me to bring it in whenever and they would take care of me). The Service Manager was very very rude (even though we were dropping my vehicle off, giving them 6 hours to do an oil change). I was ready to leave and schedule an appointment for another day, but my fiance argued with the manager, who agreed eventually agreed to do the oil change. So by chance, is there something they could have done to my car to change the mpg by so much? Thanks for any input!
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Old 11-16-2012, 08:13 AM   #2
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No, if the service department has trouble doing oil changes what makes you think they have mastered how to mess with your car to affect MPG's without throwing codes.

PS what transmission do you have and what kind of driving do you do, those make a big difference in expected MPG's
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Old 11-16-2012, 01:13 PM   #3
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I noticed the same trend then again it got cold and the drop is more than reasonable for stop and go NYC traffic this was on my 5 sp
On long road trips it goes back up so business as usual
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Old 11-16-2012, 02:16 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by Zeeper View Post
No, if the service department has trouble doing oil changes what makes you think they have mastered how to mess with your car to affect MPG's without throwing codes.

PS what transmission do you have and what kind of driving do you do, those make a big difference in expected MPG's
I have an automatic (I did this to save mileage but I really wanted manual) and as far as driving, I am for the most part conservative in that I don't floor it from start, etc. My daily drive is 130 round trip, mostly highway.
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Old 11-16-2012, 03:53 PM   #5
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I have an automatic (I did this to save mileage but I really wanted manual) and as far as driving, I am for the most part conservative in that I don't floor it from start, etc. My daily drive is 130 round trip, mostly highway.
Set that cruise control at 65 and watch your mileage go up. I took a nice little trip that way and was surprised on the outcome. Computer showed 410 after filled. Drove it a bit and saw that drop very quickly...I also thought it was the winter blend. i was not happy. But took it on the highway and cruising and saw total mileage used and 450...I know, don't trust the computer, but its nice to see it go up
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Old 11-17-2012, 03:18 PM   #6
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The exact same thing happened with my car at the beginning of October, and I didn't have it serviced or anything. I'm assuming it is the winter blend gas, because if it was temperature alone it would be more gradual, instead of immediately dropping ~3mpg average after filling up. http://www.fuelly.com/driver/haunty/impreza/fuelchart
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Old 11-17-2012, 08:53 PM   #7
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i would blame the winter blend
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Old 11-26-2012, 12:08 AM   #8
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Been noticing a slight drop in MPG here since the winter blend gas has been around. Cold air can't help much either, but wouldn't cause a sudden drop like that.
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Old 11-26-2012, 02:50 AM   #9
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Apparently we don't get winter blend in the Greater Vancouver Regional District; however, I have still noticed a drop in my mpgs.
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Old 11-28-2012, 07:35 PM   #10
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Just took a long trip a few weeks ago; with the cruise locked on 70 or higher I averaged 30mpg, but when I dropped it to between 60 and 65 I averaged about 35mpg. It's amazing what a few mph can do to your economy. Since the switch to winter blend my average has dropped to around 29 or 30.
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Old 11-28-2012, 07:45 PM   #11
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If you have a CVT, "blip it" to insure that it is in 6th gear at 70+. Sometimes mine appears to stay in 5th for a long time (higher RPMs).
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Old 11-29-2012, 04:55 PM   #12
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Mine is about to go through its second winter..a year old next week with 26K on it.....cold winter starts and winter blend in fuel really hits the MPGs.....I averaged 32-33 in the summer at the highest.....and 28-30 during the winter.....once warmed up using cruise...I can get 30-31.....city driving in cold weather will tank it to 25ish........that has been my experience.....
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Old 12-01-2012, 06:16 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G-Omaha View Post
If you have a CVT, "blip it" to insure that it is in 6th gear at 70+. Sometimes mine appears to stay in 5th for a long time (higher RPMs).
I'm beginning to think that's the problem with the cvt and mpg's. At very low speed (too dangerously low to be driving at with a 75 mph limit) it jumps easily to 6th gear and I get okay mpg's, but when trying to keep up with traffic or even on a small hill it doesn't have enough power and drops to 5th, where it sucks gas pretty hard according to my Scangauge. I'm not sure why it "steps" like it has gears if it's supposed to be continuously variable though, but mine does. Is that normal?
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Old 12-01-2012, 08:38 AM   #14
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My first CVT as well, but I too notice that sometimes it feels like a drop in the gears. I'm wondering if what we feel is the locking torque converter rather than the transmission. Just about, (maybe not all), every automatic in the last several years use them.

John
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Old 12-01-2012, 09:24 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevehnm View Post
I'm beginning to think that's the problem with the cvt and mpg's. At very low speed (too dangerously low to be driving at with a 75 mph limit) it jumps easily to 6th gear and I get okay mpg's, but when trying to keep up with traffic or even on a small hill it doesn't have enough power and drops to 5th, where it sucks gas pretty hard according to my Scangauge. I'm not sure why it "steps" like it has gears if it's supposed to be continuously variable though, but mine does. Is that normal?
translation: My car gets crappy mileage when I drive faster than 70mph. I blame the transmission.
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Old 12-01-2012, 09:46 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeeper

translation: My car gets crappy mileage when I drive faster than 70mph. I blame the transmission.
Don't forget the aggressive driving
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Old 12-01-2012, 09:58 AM   #17
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ZeepFly, I'm not talking about *my* mileage. That is only anecdotal information. I'm talking about real world independent testing by Consumer Reports vs. what Subaru told the EPA. Do we need to go through that again?
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:30 AM   #18
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Quote:
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ZeepFly, I'm not talking about *my* mileage. That is only anecdotal information. I'm talking about real world independent testing by Consumer Reports vs. what Subaru told the EPA. Do we need to go through that again?
Sure!

Did I hear you right that Consumer Reports was up in arms about it and plans on retracting their recommendation for our fuel saving AWD Imprezas?
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Old 12-01-2012, 12:58 PM   #19
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Did I hear you right that Consumer Reports was up in arms about it and plans on retracting their recommendation for our fuel saving AWD Imprezas?
Nope, that must have been somebody else. Maybe it was the person who said they get 36 mpg at 65 mph, because that wasn't me either. Did you run out of your medicine?

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Old 12-01-2012, 02:18 PM   #20
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My first CVT as well, but I too notice that sometimes it feels like a drop in the gears. I'm wondering if what we feel is the locking torque converter rather than the transmission. Just about, (maybe not all), every automatic in the last several years use them.

John
I don't think the cvt has a locking torque converter, even in "manual" mode because it still drifts a little bit. Supposedly the final drive ratio in high gear is 2.11:1, (0.570:1 high gear and 3.70:1 diffs) and in the manual xmission it's 3.03:1 (0.738:1 high gear and 4.11:1 diffs).

http://www.concordvillecares.com/spe...13-353799.html

However, in 6th gear (about the same as loping along in Drive) at 70 mph mine is turning 2200 vs. 1980 rpm, which seems to indicate the cvt also has 4.11 diffs and that spec sheet is wrong. I don't have a service manual yet so I don't know what that says. If the gearing is correct for the 5 speed it would be turning about 2850 rpm at 70 in 5th. With the cvt in "5th" and manual it's turning about 3150 rpm at 70.
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Old 12-01-2012, 04:30 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevehnm View Post
I'm beginning to think that's the problem with the cvt and mpg's. At very low speed (too dangerously low to be driving at with a 75 mph limit) it jumps easily to 6th gear and I get okay mpg's, but when trying to keep up with traffic or even on a small hill it doesn't have enough power and drops to 5th, where it sucks gas pretty hard according to my Scangauge. I'm not sure why it "steps" like it has gears if it's supposed to be continuously variable though, but mine does. Is that normal?

With a year of driving mine, I think that subie programmed the cvt to act like it's downshifting on aggresive accel, to give the driver some familiar feedback. If you are gentle, the cvt will smoothly increase rpm once you're going 35 or so. I don't think most posters here are that gentle, given the crappy mpg most are getting.
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Old 12-01-2012, 04:36 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevehnm View Post
I don't think the cvt has a locking torque converter, even in "manual" mode because it still drifts a little bit. Supposedly the final drive ratio in high gear is 2.11:1, (0.570:1 high gear and 3.70:1 diffs) and in the manual xmission it's 3.03:1 (0.738:1 high gear and 4.11:1 diffs).

http://www.concordvillecares.com/spe...13-353799.html

However, in 6th gear (about the same as loping along in Drive) at 70 mph mine is turning 2200 vs. 1980 rpm, which seems to indicate the cvt also has 4.11 diffs and that spec sheet is wrong. I don't have a service manual yet so I don't know what that says. If the gearing is correct for the 5 speed it would be turning about 2850 rpm at 70 in 5th. With the cvt in "5th" and manual it's turning about 3150 rpm at 70.
I graphed each 'gear' a year ago. Both 'first' and 'sixth' -ratios- change at higher speeds. 1st gradually shifts to a higher ratio (lower rpm) at higher speeds, and 6th downshifts.

The converter does lock-up, only if the cvt is fully up to temp, and you aren't going really slow. When slowing for a stop, you'll notice the revs drop to about 1200 below about 33 mph, and stay there, even when in manual mode in 6th. This is better than having the cvt downshift and jerk the car.

I have occasionally noticed revs jump for half a second, when I go WOT in 6th, but then it locks up tight and continues to accel.
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Old 12-01-2012, 08:57 PM   #23
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I will have to check 6th again. I thought I noticed that, but figured I wrote it down wrong since I couldn't duplicate it. I understand the "gearing" is artificial anyway, so I'm not sure I understand how that would "lock up" like a typical torque convertor.

What would help immensely is if the paddle shifter would hold when climbing a hill - Slowing a bit but keeping in a taller gear would help the mileage a lot, as it does in the 5 speed. Unfortunately one has to reach down, pull to manual, then hit the paddle shifter, then reach down and pull back to auto after the hill. I wonder if there is a mod for that?
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Old 12-02-2012, 04:27 PM   #24
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I will have to check 6th again. I thought I noticed that, but figured I wrote it down wrong since I couldn't duplicate it. I understand the "gearing" is artificial anyway, so I'm not sure I understand how that would "lock up" like a typical torque convertor.

What would help immensely is if the paddle shifter would hold when climbing a hill - Slowing a bit but keeping in a taller gear would help the mileage a lot, as it does in the 5 speed. Unfortunately one has to reach down, pull to manual, then hit the paddle shifter, then reach down and pull back to auto after the hill. I wonder if there is a mod for that?
The torque converter is NOT the CVT, so there's two things going on. Think of the TC as a clutch that can slip forever if the designer wants it to.

You can temp go to manumatic by clicking the down, then up paddle. It'll hold the gear for a minute or so. If you just up-click, it goes back to auto in a few seconds. I hate that.
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Old 12-02-2012, 07:53 PM   #25
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The torque converter is NOT the CVT, so there's two things going on. Think of the TC as a clutch that can slip forever if the designer wants it to.

You can temp go to manumatic by clicking the down, then up paddle. It'll hold the gear for a minute or so. If you just up-click, it goes back to auto in a few seconds. I hate that.
Thanks - I'll try that!
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