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Old 11-18-2012, 10:13 AM   #1
Syndr78
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Default TMIC upgrade as supporting mod--At stage 1 only?

Is there any merit to upgrading to the PW TMIC on a car that will stay at stage one only?

My rationale being that I want the car to be as reliable as possible at stage one (maybe eventual stage 2) levels, and that the upgraded TMIC as a "supportive mod" may provide a little more reliability/cooling/performance.

Overkill, perhaps--but it's worth it to me for the peace of mind that I am providing the car as much as I can to be able to sustain stage 1 power for a LONG time.

Thanks everyone.
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Old 11-18-2012, 10:25 AM   #2
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If u want the car to be as reliable as possible.. skip stage 1 ots map and get a Protune; a tune tailored for your car.

After market tmic is a waste if you don't plan on pushing your car to its limits.
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Old 11-18-2012, 10:39 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by wrxlaunch View Post
If u want the car to be as reliable as possible.. skip stage 1 ots map and get a Protune; a tune tailored for your car.

After market tmic is a waste if you don't plan on pushing your car to its limits.
Where a protune may come down the road--Is there really no benefit, or even a waste to upgrade the tmic just to improve reliability as opposed to upgrading to "push the car to the limits"?

Would the improved function of the PW TMIC not allow for (hypothetically, at least) more longevity for the motor at even sustained stage 1 power?
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Old 11-18-2012, 10:44 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by Syndr78 View Post
Where a protune may come down the road--Is there really no benefit, or even a waste to upgrade the tmic just to improve reliability as opposed to upgrading to "push the car to the limits"?

Would the improved function of the PW TMIC not provide (hypothetically, at least) more longevity for the motor?
you will have a cooler intake charge. ive seen many cars on here at stage 2 levels still with the stock tmic. you start having issues at near 20 psi boost levels with the stocker seperating at the crimp on the core. im running 22 psi on my stage 3 vf52 swap . im using a perrin tmic for about 4 years. a turbo blanket used in conjunction keeps under hood temps much lower as well. dont forget, your tmic is above your turbo. if i did this all over again, i would have gotten a pw tmic over the perrin. i like the design better and it comes with a hood splitter.
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Old 11-18-2012, 10:48 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Syndr78 View Post
Where a protune may come down the road--Is there really no benefit, or even a waste to upgrade the tmic just to improve reliability as opposed to upgrading to "push the car to the limits"?

Would the improved function of the PW TMIC not provide (hypothetically, at least) more longevity for the motor?
Your reasoning is very sound, except for one detail - Stage 1 (and OTS tunes in general) can be dangerous. If it is safety you are after, you should get it tuned by a tuner, utilizing wideband 02 and perhaps even EGT sensors.

I suspect that the TMIC with an OTS stage 1 map could possibly throw something off by enough to either cause damage or unwanted behavior. Less pressure drop also means higher than expected boost, or boost sooner than expected.
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Old 11-18-2012, 11:01 AM   #6
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you will have a cooler intake charge. ive seen many cars on here at stage 2 levels still with the stock tmic. you start having issues at near 20 psi boost levels with the stocker seperating at the crimp on the core. im running 22 psi on my stage 3 vf52 swap . im using a perrin tmic for about 4 years. a turbo blanket used in conjunction keeps under hood temps much lower as well. dont forget, your tmic is above your turbo. if i did this all over again, i would have gotten a pw tmic over the perrin. i like the design better and it comes with a hood splitter.
I actually received my PTP lava turbo blanket yesterday.

I can see where an OTS tune like the TP stage 1 may allow for higher boost with the TMIC, but perhaps some logs an tweaks from eric may rectify that. For me, it's all about reliabilty and longevity--not necessarily max power. Although, the mods would be in place should I want to at some point...
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Old 11-18-2012, 11:09 AM   #7
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Lots of misinformation in here. A bigger TMIC is not needed, but it does help. You can go with a TMIC on stage 1 through Perrin IIRC. Stage 1 maps are not dangerous. Stock maps are worse than stage one. To the OP, research before you do anything and take NASIOC with a grain of salt.
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Old 11-18-2012, 11:41 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Syndr78

Where a protune may come down the road--Is there really no benefit, or even a waste to upgrade the tmic just to improve reliability as opposed to upgrading to "push the car to the limits"?

Would the improved function of the PW TMIC not allow for (hypothetically, at least) more longevity for the motor at even sustained stage 1 power?
Longetivity of the motor will depend more on the tune as opposed to an upgraded tmic which will be for nothing more than a stage 2.

Yes cooler air helps but if you not heating it up with an aggressive tune...? Why drop the money on something that oem unit can handle or sti tmic? Deep pockets?
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Old 11-18-2012, 11:49 AM   #9
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Not exactly DEEP pockets.

Let's say someone "gifted" you the TMIC, but you had no early intentions of going beyond stage 1. Would you NOT install the TMIC because it's "not necessary"?

Certainly the cooler air is helpful above and beyond what the stocker can provide, no?
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Old 11-18-2012, 12:04 PM   #10
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Obviously if its free... i would install it. Would i buy it for extra insurance for stage 1 or stage 2...no.
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Old 11-18-2012, 12:39 PM   #11
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You are ASSUMING that a bigger intercooler will give you cooler air first off. And you are also assuming that cooler air is better for longevity. Those are two assumptions. If you were REALLY concerned about longevity, you'd have already installed an oil bypass unit on your car, but you don't have one do you? Pick your battles. It is 99.86% likely you will sell or wreck your car within 3 years, so why put the lotion in the basket over this or any longevity issue? Why am I coming at you like this?

I have owned my Subaru since 2003.
I have 165,000 miles on the odometer.
I have double stock horsepower.
I pour Walmart oil in my car and my oil filter costs $1.88.

Pouring money into "longevity aids" is like shaking hands with the unemployed. My thoughts, my opinion, your mileage may vary, void in Canada, come at me bro.
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Old 11-18-2012, 01:17 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Unabomber View Post
You are ASSUMING that a bigger intercooler will give you cooler air first off. And you are also assuming that cooler air is better for longevity. Those are two assumptions. If you were REALLY concerned about longevity, you'd have already installed an oil bypass unit on your car, but you don't have one do you? Pick your battles. It is 99.86% likely you will sell or wreck your car within 3 years, so why put the lotion in the basket over this or any longevity issue? Why am I coming at you like this?

I have owned my Subaru since 2003.
I have 165,000 miles on the odometer.
I have double stock horsepower.
I pour Walmart oil in my car and my oil filter costs $1.88.

Pouring money into "longevity aids" is like shaking hands with the unemployed. My thoughts, my opinion, your mileage may vary, void in Canada, come at me bro.
Ha! Point well taken, and I have treated many cars (and my current toy 4x4) with your philosophy. I guess I'm still in the early obsessed/infatuated stage with the Subaru. Kinda like a new girlfriend--at first, you'd do anything for her, but as the mileage racks up, and the newness wears off, she's just transportation with a little fun here and there.

I didn't assume that bigger = cooler = better longevity. I inquired if it makes sense. Had I assumed/decided those things, I would not have inquired--I would have bought one by now. IF indeed those assumptions are at least theoretically accurate (though not proven), then I would consider picking one up. I would guess that for those folks that intend to keep the car beyond the 3 years you suggested, they would consider an upgraded TMIC indeed for "insurance" and longevity...

Remember please, I'm new here and to Subaru. I am grateful for the dialog and replies from everyone so far.

Last edited by Syndr78; 11-18-2012 at 01:29 PM.
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Old 11-18-2012, 01:22 PM   #13
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Quote:
so why put the lotion in the basket
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like shaking hands with the unemployed.
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Old 11-18-2012, 01:23 PM   #14
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Kinda like a new girlfriend--at first, you'd do anything for her, but as the mileage racks up, and the newness wears off, she's just transportation with a little fun here and there.
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Old 11-18-2012, 05:07 PM   #15
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So the question remains. Upgraded IC WILL create cooler air which does translate to increased performance and longevity of the motor at any given stage...Even stage 1?
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Old 11-18-2012, 05:18 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Syndr78 View Post
So the question remains. Upgraded IC WILL create cooler air which does translate to increased performance and longevity of the motor at any given stage...Even stage 1?
i would think any increase in tmic efficiency would help in the long run. is it worth $950??thats up to your wallet.
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Old 11-18-2012, 05:24 PM   #17
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You do know stock unmodified motors still blow up right?

Keep it stock. I'm sure Subaru and its engineers did there home work and your car is fine as it is
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Old 11-18-2012, 05:25 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Syndr78 View Post
Not exactly DEEP pockets.

Let's say someone "gifted" you the TMIC, but you had no early intentions of going beyond stage 1. Would you NOT install the TMIC because it's "not necessary"?

Certainly the cooler air is helpful above and beyond what the stocker can provide, no?
I would install the tmic and get a conservative protune by a well known tuner IMO that would allow for good power and safe longevity
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Old 11-18-2012, 07:11 PM   #19
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In my research I've been told that a larger aftermarket TMIC on a stock or "stage 1" car will increase turbo lag. I'm sure a protune could help this, but doubt an OTS map would. Just something else to consider.
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Old 11-18-2012, 08:00 PM   #20
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In my research I've been told that a larger aftermarket TMIC on a stock or "stage 1" car will increase turbo lag. I'm sure a protune could help this, but doubt an OTS map would. Just something else to consider.
it will only be cause of larger inside dimensions of the core.if you think thats gonna cause a noticeable change in lag, there is no way!
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Old 11-18-2012, 08:14 PM   #21
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Save hundereds of dollars and get the "bullet proof" mod for your stock top mount. Youll have less heat soak then the aftermarket intercoolers and can run just as much psi.
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Old 11-18-2012, 08:16 PM   #22
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Save hundereds of dollars and get the "bullet proof" mod for your stock top mount. Youll have less heat soak then the aftermarket intercoolers and can run just as much psi.
how are you gonna have less heatsoak then a larger quality tmic? get a turbo blanket. not with a small oem tmic.
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Old 11-18-2012, 08:38 PM   #23
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No need for a fmic, No need for a larger tmic. But do what you want. the bigger the ic the more the delay.
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Old 11-18-2012, 09:18 PM   #24
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Old 11-18-2012, 10:24 PM   #25
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Thank you for sharing this, Bookmarked
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