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Old 12-01-2012, 11:19 PM   #51
Spenk
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Originally Posted by AllAWD View Post
Cayman or Boxster doesn't matter. Either one screams to the world, "I'm a **** and can't afford a 911."

or

"I'm a girl with a rich dad/sugar daddy"

Rather get a used 911 for $50k.
So go buy one.

Do you have any insights as to what driving an 11 year old Subaru screams to the world?
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Old 12-01-2012, 11:54 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by Spenk View Post
So go buy one.

Do you have any insights as to what driving an 11 year old Subaru screams to the world?
That he cannot afford a 9 year old Subaru.
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Old 12-02-2012, 12:06 AM   #53
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Originally Posted by Spenk View Post
So go buy one.

Do you have any insights as to what driving an 11 year old Subaru screams to the world?
Because I don't want one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Len View Post
That he cannot afford a 9 year old Subaru.
But I am glad that your guys care about my opinion of your imaginary car.

Check that out, I have a Rolls Royce now.
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Old 12-02-2012, 02:00 AM   #54
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Originally Posted by AllAWD View Post
Because I don't want one.



But I am glad that your guys care about my opinion of your imaginary car.

Check that out, I have a Rolls Royce now.
Well.... the point of course wasn't that there is anything wrong with driving a 11 year old Subaru, or not driving one for that matter. It is that whatever we drive, you could say it screams we couldn't afford something better. But if you really like cars, why would you care?
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Old 12-02-2012, 08:45 AM   #55
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Needs clear engine cover, otherwise the best mid engine Porsche (sans CGT). So second best mid engined Porsche.

Quote:
Originally Posted by E. Nick View Post
I realize it's a great car, and this gen is almost masculine enough for less secure males like myself to consider. I normally give zero weight to styling, but when the car looks like a hot chick, I just can't see it any other way
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Old 12-02-2012, 01:33 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by Hondaslayer View Post
It's all port installed, car was just dropped off Thursday, not even PDI'd yet.
But I don't think ALL of that stuff is port-installed, that's what I'm saying. The packages are legit but those chrome parts (outside of small interior things like the door will plates) and I/C pipes aren't usually Mitsu options.
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Old 12-02-2012, 01:56 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by DeeezNuuuts83 View Post
But I don't think ALL of that stuff is port-installed, that's what I'm saying. The packages are legit but those chrome parts (outside of small interior things like the door will plates) and I/C pipes aren't usually Mitsu options.
And yet it is as I do not stock any of those parts, have never sold any of those parts and service has not even touched the car yet. Again, listed under "port installed accessories"
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Old 12-02-2012, 02:53 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hondaslayer View Post
It's all port installed, car was just dropped off Thursday, not even PDI'd yet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hondaslayer View Post
And yet it is as I do not stock any of those parts, have never sold any of those parts and service has not even touched the car yet. Again, listed under "port installed accessories"
Perhaps I'm mistaken then. But again, that's still an uber loaded version of the highest trim level -- not really indicative of a more common Evo's price. Ill see if I can build one like that online.
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Old 12-07-2012, 08:51 PM   #59
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This is seriously one of the FUNNEST driver oriented cars there is. It has good hp for a small track/big autocross set-up. I'm sure the suspension is as close to perfect and confidence inspiring that you can get.

A guy at my local track has a cayman, I thought they were "almost there" or "girly" or "*****" porches, but with just r compound tires and wheels he kills it. This was before they converted the track to an 1/8th mile strip and smaller track section. I would love to have this thing to enjoy what driving is supposed to be.

It's hilarious the same ppl hating on this love the brz...it's the same thing expect 10x better. Some ppl have a 4 door family car and need something to get the blood pumping and floss a bit on the weekend. This fits the bill.
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:23 PM   #60
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Dude... Correct your spelling of Porsche or else we'll have 2 pages of people talking about putting better tires on your deck...
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:35 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by turtleb00st View Post
This is seriously one of the FUNNEST driver oriented cars there is. It has good hp for a small track/big autocross set-up. I'm sure the suspension is as close to perfect and confidence inspiring that you can get.

A guy at my local track has a cayman, I thought they were "almost there" or "girly" or "*****" porches, but with just r compound tires and wheels he kills it. This was before they converted the track to an 1/8th mile strip and smaller track section. I would love to have this thing to enjoy what driving is supposed to be.

It's hilarious the same ppl hating on this love the brz...it's the same thing expect 10x better. Some ppl have a 4 door family car and need something to get the blood pumping and floss a bit on the weekend. This fits the bill.
BRZ is a poor man's Porsche for sure. I'd love a Cayman S when I have the money to buy it new and ditch it before the warranty's out.
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:37 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by AllAWD View Post
Cayman or Boxster doesn't matter. Either one screams to the world, "I'm a **** and can't afford a 911."

or

"I'm a girl with a rich dad/sugar daddy"

Rather get a used 911 for $50k.
Please, enlighten us!
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Old 12-08-2012, 10:14 AM   #63
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Originally Posted by AllAWD View Post
Cayman or Boxster doesn't matter. Either one screams to the world, "I'm a **** and can't afford a 911."

or

"I'm a girl with a rich dad/sugar daddy"

Rather get a used 911 for $50k.
Why you care what the world thinks about you.

If I had the money, i would buy one, "i'm a girl with a rich dad/sugar daddy" who cares what people think. I like it.

Buy what you like, not what people like.
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Old 12-10-2012, 01:04 PM   #64
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Dig the car, a lot. Two things stick out to me though. The bulkhead behind the seats is dramatically different than the previous car, I wonder what the engine cover arrangement is like now? Hopefully easier to get at the engine.

Second, the wheel size. I know it's for styling, but for Pete's sake, a 3,000lb two seat sports car does not need 19-20" wheels or the giant wheel wells to go with them. I'm sure the brakes on a Cayman S are generous, yet they look tiny inside those giant wheels. More reasonable wheels (17") will require tires that look like balloons for OEM ride height. Lots of cost, lots of weight, no purpose - stupid.

Some Asian manufacturer needs to build a modern MR2 and kick Porsche in the pricing butt. Remember when the S2000 won a couple of comparos against the Boxter? That was back when the Boxter started at ~$35k. A modern FWD drivetrain mounted amidships would make for a great affordable sports car. Just look at a 2nd gen MR2 with a 2GR-SFE swap. Same goes for a modern turbo DI 4-cyl. Porsche knows they're the only ones with a decent mid-engined sports car and they price accordingly.
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Old 12-10-2012, 04:16 PM   #65
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Porsche is stupid. Stupid awesome.
Love it; I can see T-shirts with this wisdom printed on them. So long as you add the disclaimer (*price independent).
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Old 12-11-2012, 10:09 AM   #66
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Some Asian manufacturer needs to build a modern MR2 and kick Porsche in the pricing butt. Remember when the S2000 won a couple of comparos against the Boxter? That was back when the Boxter started at ~$35k. A modern FWD drivetrain mounted amidships would make for a great affordable sports car. Just look at a 2nd gen MR2 with a 2GR-SFE swap. Same goes for a modern turbo DI 4-cyl. Porsche knows they're the only ones with a decent mid-engined sports car and they price accordingly.
You know.. if MINI had made their stupid little coupe version of the Cooper a mid-engined car.. it would have been incredible even at $30k... but they didn't.. and instead it's a stupid looking pointless car.

Subaru could have easily gone the MR route with the BRZ.. it would have been a modern day 200hp 914. The BRZ is good, but it's bloated.. if it had been a tiny MR runabout, I think they could have knocked a few hundred pounds off of it. It could have had a real front suspension, too..

Nissan could easily make a small mid-engined car with a VQ engine behind the front seats.. and sell it worldwide as both a Nissan and Renault... but no.
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Old 12-11-2012, 10:18 AM   #67
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People don't want the engine behind them, they want storage space. Hence no car company outside of specialty brands producing mid or rear engine cars.
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Old 12-11-2012, 10:18 AM   #68
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You know.. if MINI had made their stupid little coupe version of the Cooper a mid-engined car.. it would have been incredible even at $30k... but they didn't.. and instead it's a stupid looking pointless car.

Subaru could have easily gone the MR route with the BRZ.. it would have been a modern day 200hp 914. The BRZ is good, but it's bloated.. if it had been a tiny MR runabout, I think they could have knocked a few hundred pounds off of it. It could have had a real front suspension, too..

Nissan could easily make a small mid-engined car with a VQ engine behind the front seats.. and sell it worldwide as both a Nissan and Renault... but no.
Totally with you, except the bloated part. It's reasonably light for a front engine RWD layout. Transverse transaxle layouts save weight. Subaru could've done it with a tremendous amount of parts commonality. Take the center diff and rear output shaft out of one of their existing transaxles- instant mid-engine setup. Who cares if it's a Cayman knock-off. I keep my cars a long time and I'll take maintenance on a 10 yr old Subaru over a 10 yr old Porsche any day.

Honda actually showed a concept of a new mid-engine S2000. Imagine an updated K20Z3 with direct injection making 220+ hp and spinning to 8,000 RPM in a 2,500lb mid-engine sports car. Drool...
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Old 12-11-2012, 10:25 AM   #69
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People don't want the engine behind them, they want storage space. Hence no car company outside of specialty brands producing mid or rear engine cars.
I understand what you're saying, but the Miata doesn't exactly have tons of luggage room. Switch to run-flat tires in a 2nd gen MR2 and the trunk + frunk space is easily greater than a Miata. Do a Cayman-like arrangement with luggage space above the engine and the situation improves more. Easy to do with a flat engine like Subaru uses.

Don't get me wrong, I really like the BRZ, and it's a bunch more practical than an MR2, so I see why Toyobaru went that direction. I do think they missed the boat a bit on layout, it's too front heavy.
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Old 12-11-2012, 10:37 AM   #70
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I understand what you're saying, but the Miata doesn't exactly have tons of luggage room. Switch to run-flat tires in a 2nd gen MR2 and the trunk + frunk space is easily greater than a Miata. Do a Cayman-like arrangement with luggage space above the engine and the situation improves more. Easy to do with a flat engine like Subaru uses.
I think the Miata has quite a bit of storage given its size, especially the NC. There are bins everywhere and a generous trunk. It all comes down to design: a third gen MR2 has virtually no storage, an Elise has a very good sized trunk (assuming you only put light things in it). But IMO MR is too risky and impractical to be used often.
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Old 12-11-2012, 11:17 AM   #71
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Originally Posted by Calamity Jesus View Post
Subaru could have easily gone the MR route with the BRZ.. it would have been a modern day 200hp 914. The BRZ is good, but it's bloated.. if it had been a tiny MR runabout, I think they could have knocked a few hundred pounds off of it. It could have had a real front suspension, too..

Nissan could easily make a small mid-engined car with a VQ engine behind the front seats.. and sell it worldwide as both a Nissan and Renault... but no.
But the development and production costs likely would've been a lot higher, resulting in a much more expensive car. From what I remember, the last MR-2 started at around $25k or so, and that was with a little 140 hp motor. In 2012 dollars, that would've been well above $30k.
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Old 12-11-2012, 11:33 AM   #72
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Toyota is also planning other models on the BRZ platform. With a MR car you can't really do anything other than a 2 seat sports car.

Last edited by spaceywilly; 12-11-2012 at 12:20 PM.
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Old 12-11-2012, 11:39 AM   #73
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Toyota should badge engineer the new v6 exige into the next supra. It already has a toyota drivetrain of course. Ive said it a few times hoping it will stick.
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Old 12-11-2012, 12:22 PM   #74
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It is because Porsche engineered the cars that way. They built the boxster and cayman to be artificially inferior than their iconic 911. I hate that.
And? Name me a car manufacturer who doesn't have different models built to different price points? A Cayman S is ~$30k cheaper than a 911 S (base prices); why is it "artificial" for the 911 to be superior? (And frankly, the Cayman isn't all that much "inferior" considering that $30k difference; a Cayman S is dead even with a vanilla 911 Carrera, for $20k less, and probably handles better than the 911...)
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Old 12-11-2012, 01:20 PM   #75
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Toyota should badge engineer the new v6 exige into the next supra. It already has a toyota drivetrain of course. Ive said it a few times hoping it will stick.
Badging it as a Toyota isn't going magically make it far more affordable though. People aren't going to drop that kind of coin for a Toyota with that kind of performance. People had enough of a heart attack dropping $70k-100k (depending on which model year) for a GT-R that outran most supercars.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ForceFed4 View Post
A Cayman S is ~$30k cheaper than a 911 S (base prices); why is it "artificial" for the 911 to be superior? (And frankly, the Cayman isn't all that much "inferior" considering that $30k difference; a Cayman S is dead even with a vanilla 911 Carrera, for $20k less, and probably handles better than the 911...)
It's because Porsche purposely chooses smaller engines for them while detuning the motors (look at the torque curves) to not steal too much of the base 911's thunder.
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