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Old 12-24-2012, 09:33 PM   #1
Bow_Extreme
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Default 1999 Subaru Forester Start, Sputter, Die - Need Additional Help Please & Thank You

I apologize for posting here but I feel I'm almost at a dead end and need to ask for additional thoughts and ideas. I have a 99' Forester. 11,000 miles ago I replaced the engine with an 05' Impreza engine with 40,000 miles on it. I swapped in my intake, swapped the proper timing gears, cam gears, put new plugs and wires in place, timing belt, etc. and it's run fine up until a few days ago.

I pulled the car up on my ramps and shut it off. I drained the tranny fluid from the 5MT, removed the air filter assembly to get better access to the fill point, and refilled. I went to start the car and the car would start, run for a few seconds, sputter, and quit. This seemed very odd as this had never happened before and I had it out running all morning before I started this tranny oil change. I hooked my buddies Snap on Computer up to the car to read the computer codes. I came up with the following:

P1443
P0136 -O2 sensor circuit bank 1 sensor 2

These fault codes really don't seem to coincide with problems I'm having although I haven't eliminated them. I knew that I had an issue with my charcoal canister as I cannot fill my fuel tank without disconnecting the tank vent tube at the charcoal canister(Picked up another canister today so hopefully this is fixed now). Yes, I already put in a new fuel neck assembly. I figured vapor lock so I removed the gas cap and tried again. Same issue still there. I disconnected the front O2 Sensor and still the same issue. I disconnected the MAF. This time the car would run great from 1000 plus RPM's but would not idle. I figured I had a bad MAF sensor so I bought a new one from the dealer and stuck it in. Still same issue persisted. I thought I might have a bad coil so I tried one from a running Subaru and still same issue. I removed the incoming fuel supply line and ran fuel into a cup and I'm getting plenty. I disconnected the battery to reset the ECU and still, same issue. The car smells of fuel when this happens as in it's getting plenty of fuel and not burning it all. Again I can still disconnect the MAF and the car will run but not idle. I don't know what to do next. I disconnected all the wiring connections around the intake where I filled the tranny with my long extension funnel thinking I might have a short or something to that effect. I reconnected all and still the same issue persists.

The only thing I can think of is to pull the belts, timing covers, etc. and check the timing but it will start and run for a few seconds or run above 1000 RPM's with the MAF disconnected so I don't think timing has anything to do with it. The MAF cost me $73.00 and the Coil cost me $30.00 plus dollars used so I'm not out much yet but none of this makes sense. I have not disconnected the rear O2 sensor yet and tried to start it but maybe I will do this tomorrow. I just don't logically understand why it ran fine all this time and I change the tranny fluid and it immediately acts up.

I feel I've almost exhausted all efforts here and I could really use some help with this so I look to the experts on this board. Thank You and all help is greatly appreciated!!
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Old 12-25-2012, 12:04 AM   #2
Legatron02
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check your fuel pump and filter if you havent yet, that may cause these symptoms
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Old 12-25-2012, 02:50 AM   #3
Charlie-III
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OK, since it "runs" with the MAF disconnected, sounds like an air leak in the intake or a funky electrical connection.
I would recheck all the intake stuff, from the MAF to the TB. Also check the PCV hoses (assuming your is very similar to my 1998 2.5L).
You likely just missed a connection.

I wouldn't worry about the timing.

PS, with the pump in the tank, vaporlock is not much of an issue anymore, it was when the pump was by the engine. ;-)
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Old 12-25-2012, 09:49 AM   #4
Bow_Extreme
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Thanks for the input!! I will recheck electrical and hoses but I'm pretty sure I covered them all at least 20 times....lol. I'm pretty sure fuel is not an issue but since it will run with MAF disconnected I could check pressure. I think it's an electrical gremlin of some kind as well. Will have to pull manual and start electrical diagnosis. Thanks for the help and Merry Christmas!!
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Old 12-25-2012, 11:07 AM   #5
Elbert Bass
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Look just below the intake tube that goes from the air cleaner box to the resonator on the throttle body. There is a rubber hose below that that goes from the bottom of that pipe to the idle air control solenoid next to the throttle body. The hose is about 1.5" diameter. You may have left that loose and that will give that symptom.

P1443 is a problem with your canister vent and shouldn't cause the lack of idle.

P0136 won't cause the idle problem either, but the O2 sensor plug is in the area near the fill hole where you were working and you may have knocked the connector loose.
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Old 12-25-2012, 12:14 PM   #6
Bow_Extreme
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elbert Bass View Post
Look just below the intake tube that goes from the air cleaner box to the resonator on the throttle body. There is a rubber hose below that that goes from the bottom of that pipe to the idle air control solenoid next to the throttle body. The hose is about 1.5" diameter. You may have left that loose and that will give that symptom.

P1443 is a problem with your canister vent and shouldn't cause the lack of idle.

P0136 won't cause the idle problem either, but the O2 sensor plug is in the area near the fill hole where you were working and you may have knocked the connector loose.
No loose hoses, no disconnected hoses or electrical connectors. I was able to disconnect the MAF again and get the car warmed up and finally able to idle but not great. As soon as I reconnected the MAF the car died. By the way this is a SOHC 2.5, nothing like the 98 and that 1.5" hose is not present on mine. With the 2005 impreza motor I did not need this hose.
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Old 12-25-2012, 11:07 PM   #7
Elbert Bass
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bow_Extreme View Post
No loose hoses, no disconnected hoses or electrical connectors. I was able to disconnect the MAF again and get the car warmed up and finally able to idle but not great. As soon as I reconnected the MAF the car died. By the way this is a SOHC 2.5, nothing like the 98 and that 1.5" hose is not present on mine. With the 2005 impreza motor I did not need this hose.
Gotcha - misunderstood your comment regarding swapping the intake - under the impression you were using original engine running gear.
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Old 12-26-2012, 02:38 PM   #8
Bow_Extreme
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I removed and cleaned the IAC Valve. It did not change a thing. Will still run with MAF disconnected. Tempted to pay the $25.00 for a used MAF at the parts yard and retry this.
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Old 12-26-2012, 03:58 PM   #9
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Went to the yard and picked up another MAF. Same issue, still not resolved.
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Old 12-26-2012, 04:38 PM   #10
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Another issues to note. I believe I may have a blown head gasket on this engine. If I remove the oil fill tube cap while the engine is running I get a lot of moisture blowing out. I always check the coolant though and I've never used a drop of coolant. This could just be condensation from a warm engine and very cold air too. I just find it odd. This leaves a milky white residue around the inside of the tube.
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Old 12-28-2012, 05:37 PM   #11
Charlie-III
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Short trips will leave water (condensation) in the oil. Warming the engine up will "liberate" the water (basically boil it off) and can show up as "milky crud" in the filler cap. Finding "milky crud" on the dipstick is worse.

Longer runs will boil it all off, thus better oil and less/no "milky crud". Some call it "brown mayonnaise".

Short trips is part of why ALL Mfrs consider this "severe duty/service" and call for shorter oil change intervals.
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Old 01-09-2013, 10:07 PM   #12
future97obs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bow_Extreme View Post
Went to the yard and picked up another MAF. Same issue, still not resolved.
Did you ever figure out what exactly was the cause and how you were able to fix this? Sorry, I am having the exact same issue with my EJ223 engine in my 99 Impreza L Wagon.
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