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Old 01-17-2013, 02:13 PM   #26
ckyguy68
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Real nice looking numbers! This would be a fantastic daily driver.
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Old 01-17-2013, 02:35 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pet3r View Post
Transient response on the Dom1.5 was very very good, like stock good. The 10cm is the way to go based on the results TopSpeed posted...very little difference in spool with the 8cm vs 10cm. I was very happy with the 10cm.
Transient response might be good once you're above the boost threshold, but the boost threshold itself is moved up drastically with the larger housing. I have also yet to see any significant increases in power with the 10cm on that particular turbo. The compressor just doesn't flow enough to take advantage of the increased hot side flow potential.

-- Ed
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Old 01-17-2013, 02:48 PM   #28
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I'm just kinda shocked at the numbers out of the 1.5xt-r with xluben's numbers out of the smaller 20gXT-r being an honest 80whp higher.
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Old 01-17-2013, 02:52 PM   #29
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how did you not run out of fuel? with those 1400cc inj..

dave
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Old 01-17-2013, 02:58 PM   #30
juanmedina
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Originally Posted by PerformanceAutoSolutions View Post
how did you not run out of fuel? with those 1400cc inj..

dave
why would he?
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Old 01-17-2013, 03:08 PM   #31
pet3r
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zee Biker View Post
I'm just kinda shocked at the numbers out of the 1.5xt-r with xluben's numbers out of the smaller 20gXT-r being an honest 80whp higher.
Not sure either. I had asked him about it and we couldn't identify anything. He was running more boost than I was, and I was having fueling issues that never got resolved before I started the new build.
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Old 01-17-2013, 03:09 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PerformanceAutoSolutions View Post
how did you not run out of fuel? with those 1400cc inj..

dave
Because Walbro 465.

Its a common misconception that you need huge injectors for this kind of HP on E85. What most people really need is more flow from a pump that can actually keep up with fueling demand.
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Old 01-17-2013, 03:21 PM   #33
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ALSO: Do you have a cutout? This is strange to consider, but if you're breathing out the stock exhaust, you're likely to be leaving power on the table. Once again, due to Xluben's findings.

Secondarily, are you on stock cams as well?
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Old 01-17-2013, 03:28 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Equilibrium Tuning View Post
Transient response might be good once you're above the boost threshold, but the boost threshold itself is moved up drastically with the larger housing. I have also yet to see any significant increases in power with the 10cm on that particular turbo. The compressor just doesn't flow enough to take advantage of the increased hot side flow potential.

-- Ed
Haha. Now you're saying the exact opposite of what Phatron says in regards to this turbo. See below:

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhatBotti Tuning TKR View Post
If someone is asking for advice before a build I will recommend the 2.5xtr over the 1.5xtr, because the 2.5 will make more power and spool virtually the same. The 1.5xtr was specifically made for 2L cars....its a 2.5 with a smaller turbine
So now two of the most well known tuners on this board are saying the exact opposite things.

No wonder people have a hard time choosing turbo's, lol.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PerformanceAutoSolutions View Post
how did you not run out of fuel? with those 1400cc inj..

dave
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRXt4cy View Post
Because Walbro 465.
^This. I need to try this one! Really opens up the door for more power with a stock-ish fuel system.
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Old 01-17-2013, 03:34 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zee Biker View Post
ALSO: Do you have a cutout? This is strange to consider, but if you're breathing out the stock exhaust, you're likely to be leaving power on the table. Once again, due to Xluben's findings.

Secondarily, are you on stock cams as well?
Nope. Catted downpipe and stock catback. I'm sure I could gain a bit more with a higher flowing exhaust, but I'm not looking to get super crazy here. I prefer a quieter ride, and I like to romp around town so I dont want to attract any undue attention

Stock cams and heads.
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Old 01-17-2013, 03:49 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xluben View Post
Haha. Now you're saying the exact opposite of what Phatron says in regards to this turbo. See below:


So now two of the most well known tuners on this board are saying the exact opposite things.

No wonder people have a hard time choosing turbo's, lol.



^This. I need to try this one! Really opens up the door for more power with a stock-ish fuel system.
I don't think I'm saying the exact opposite. I don't think the 2.5XTR benefits from the 10cm housing either .

-- Ed
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Old 01-17-2013, 03:52 PM   #37
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This is TopSpeed's results, testing the Dom1.5 8cm and 10cm back to back.

The 10cm didn't hurt spool, but gave it a bit more up top in the higher RPM.

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Old 01-17-2013, 03:58 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WRXt4cy View Post
Because Walbro 465.

Its a common misconception that you need huge injectors for this kind of HP on E85. What most people really need is more flow from a pump that can actually keep up with fueling demand.

really,i have used id 2000cc inj 35r turbo e85 27 psi ,550whp,idc 90 percent,50 degrees,11.8 afr-28 psi...

dave
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Old 01-17-2013, 04:09 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PerformanceAutoSolutions View Post
really,i have used id 2000cc inj 35r turbo e85 27 psi ,550whp,idc 90 percent,50 degrees,11.8 afr-28 psi...

dave
Do you log fuel rail pressure? That's a sure fire way to know if you are running out of pump or not. If you don't have enough pump you have to compensate with higher IDCs to make up for the drop off in pressure.
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Old 01-17-2013, 04:11 PM   #40
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and a walbro 450.with fuel lines and rails. ans regulator

dave
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Old 01-17-2013, 04:12 PM   #41
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Well I can't answer the technicalities of my fuel stuff, but what psi is your FPR at? Is your pump hard wired too?
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Old 01-17-2013, 04:13 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by PerformanceAutoSolutions View Post
and a walbro 450.with fuel lines and rails. ans regulator

dave
Is that a yes or no for logging fuel pressure?
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Old 01-17-2013, 04:24 PM   #43
WRXt4cy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PerformanceAutoSolutions View Post
really,i have used id 2000cc inj 35r turbo e85 27 psi ,550whp,idc 90 percent,50 degrees,11.8 afr-28 psi...

dave
Quote:
Originally Posted by kellygnsd View Post
Do you log fuel rail pressure? That's a sure fire way to know if you are running out of pump or not. If you don't have enough pump you have to compensate with higher IDCs to make up for the drop off in pressure.
Yeah, I'd also suggest checking your fuel pressure. It has to be dropping off. You probably have a restriction somewhere. 90% IDC on 2000's would be A LOT of fuel if the pressure was actually holding.

Edit: Or you are having the same issue the OP had with his.

Last edited by WRXt4cy; 01-17-2013 at 04:41 PM.
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Old 01-17-2013, 04:26 PM   #44
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I had a fueling problem on this setup up until about 4 days ago. I had the 465 installed, and FPR setup. But, after idling for about 10s the FPR gauge would drop back down to base pressure.

I pulled the pump and double o-ringed the fuel pump and its been perfect ever since. The pump was leaking and I lost pressure.
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Old 01-17-2013, 05:08 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pet3r View Post
This is TopSpeed's results, testing the Dom1.5 8cm and 10cm back to back.

The 10cm didn't hurt spool, but gave it a bit more up top in the higher RPM.

I just haven't seen the same results here. Both of those spool about 500-600RPM later than I've seen the 1.5XT's spool here on the 8cm housing. I have seen peak torque at or just before 4000RPM. This being said, I have noticed Blouch turbos to be a bit inconsistent and don't know why. Some spool significantly later than others. This is why I generally prefer the ATP turbos.

Also, the small gains on the top end that are shown on that graph are likely from more aggressive timing. You can see the 10cm graph is not as smooth up there and has a stepped look to it. This is usually indicative of a more aggressive tune that is closer to the knock threshold.

-- Ed
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Old 01-17-2013, 07:10 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Equilibrium Tuning View Post
I just haven't seen the same results here. Both of those spool about 500-600RPM later than I've seen the 1.5XT's spool here on the 8cm housing. I have seen peak torque at or just before 4000RPM. This being said, I have noticed Blouch turbos to be a bit inconsistent and don't know why. Some spool significantly later than others. This is why I generally prefer the ATP turbos.

Also, the small gains on the top end that are shown on that graph are likely from more aggressive timing. You can see the 10cm graph is not as smooth up there and has a stepped look to it. This is usually indicative of a more aggressive tune that is closer to the knock threshold.

-- Ed
Ive often times wondered if the inconsistencies come from different pressure WG actuators. Some people dont know to specify a higher pressure others dont want to pay for it. Another possibility that Ive wondered is both inlet size and whether or not the turbine housing was ported. But as you look around you can find gt/gtx30r's and blouch turbo's and even ATP turbos that spool differently from car to car.

ATP turbos seem to be nice in concept on stock location, but seem to get crushed power and spool up wise by rotated units from perrin etc.
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Old 01-17-2013, 09:08 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Equilibrium Tuning View Post
I don't think I'm saying the exact opposite. I don't think the 2.5XTR benefits from the 10cm housing either .

-- Ed
He's saying that the 2.5XTR is superior to the 1.5XTR because of the larger turbine (ie. the hot side is choking it). The compressor side is identical between the two turbos. You say that changing the hot side doesn't matter because the compressor is choking it. Seems like the opposite to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Equilibrium Tuning View Post
I just haven't seen the same results here. Both of those spool about 500-600RPM later than I've seen the 1.5XT's spool here on the 8cm housing. I have seen peak torque at or just before 4000RPM. This being said, I have noticed Blouch turbos to be a bit inconsistent and don't know why. Some spool significantly later than others. This is why I generally prefer the ATP turbos.

-- Ed
What peak boost? I've seen that the higher the peak boost, the later the torque peaks. Simply because the higher the peak boost the later the peak occurs (spooling linearly) and pushes the peak torque to the right a bit. These TopSpeed plots are at 27-28psi peak from what I recall. I can't say much to the variation as I'm just going by what I see on the internet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KurtP View Post
Ive often times wondered if the inconsistencies come from different pressure WG actuators. Some people dont know to specify a higher pressure others dont want to pay for it. Another possibility that Ive wondered is both inlet size and whether or not the turbine housing was ported. But as you look around you can find gt/gtx30r's and blouch turbo's and even ATP turbos that spool differently from car to car.

ATP turbos seem to be nice in concept on stock location, but seem to get crushed power and spool up wise by rotated units from perrin etc.
That's kind of an interesting thought. My EWG has a pretty stiff spring setup. I'll do around 20psi on spring pressure. My turbo does seem to spool pretty well for the power it makes.
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Old 01-17-2013, 09:52 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by pet3r View Post

Thanks!

Honestly not very much. Ron likes to keep his tunes pretty conservative, but I asked him to step on it a bit. This log saw maybe 21.5-22 degrees by 7k.
At 28 psi? That's a lot of timing.
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Old 01-17-2013, 09:53 PM   #49
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With my Dom1.5 I was at 27 at 6500 and 26psi
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Old 01-17-2013, 09:58 PM   #50
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Got to love holding boost like that! great setup

Nice timing for E on this setup I'd say ;-)
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