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Old 02-09-2013, 03:34 AM   #1
ammfab
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Default so I ported a set of ej25 heads

well I think they are ej25 heads anyways. Basically im here to ask some questions about the intake port design on these heads. I believe these are 257 heads but I'm not sure. I'm doing a quick port job for a quick buck for one of my machinist buddies. I've seen on the forums the divider in the intake port getting taken back and trimmed..... ending in a look similar to a Honda b16 intake port design. I'm wondering if this design is better for flow verses the stock design where the divider comes all the way out to the front edge of the intake port. wether the gains are low lift or high lift if you guys know could you shed some light for me please. I've already ported these heads I've got but I still would like to know the answer. I didn't get them flowed before and I'm not going to get them flowed after basically because I'm not getting extra cash from the guy to do so. I will put some before pictures up and as soon as I get the heads wrapped up here which should be tomorrow I'll put finished pics up also.


Mike
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Old 02-09-2013, 04:13 AM   #2
ammfab
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intake ports...












exhaust ports.....













mike
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Old 02-09-2013, 05:37 AM   #3
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are these before porting?

you still have casting seams..
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Old 02-09-2013, 10:05 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by jaxscuby View Post
are these before porting?

you still have casting seams..
Wouldnt seems be removed during polishing?

EDIT: They look clean ^____^
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Old 02-09-2013, 10:59 AM   #5
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Here is some of the work I do :










Check out Fuji K's thread, he is AMAZING with porting. He posts up a lot of tip and tricks too.

You're are going to need to buy some expensive porting tools, if you don't already have them.


a variable speed router controller and die grinder with some aluma cut carbide burrs are your friend.

Goodluck!
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Old 02-09-2013, 11:47 AM   #6
ammfab
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the pics above are before porting, i clean all my heads before i port them and i should have mentioned iv been porting heads for years. i was just asking because i havent done any of these heads yet and i didnt know if leaving the divider there was better or was trimming it back some better for flow an at what lifts.

flat 4, looks pretty good sir..... i saw that the gasket has the wider injector nipple area compared to the stock port but i dont see how gasket matching it is going to help flow at all being that thats just where the fuel enters the port and not really any airflow if u know what i mean, so i opted to not do that. but other then that it looks good.


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Old 02-09-2013, 01:04 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by ammfab View Post
the pics above are before porting, i clean all my heads before i port them and i should have mentioned iv been porting heads for years. i was just asking because i havent done any of these heads yet and i didnt know if leaving the divider there was better or was trimming it back some better for flow an at what lifts.

flat 4, looks pretty good sir..... i saw that the gasket has the wider injector nipple area compared to the stock port but i dont see how gasket matching it is going to help flow at all being that thats just where the fuel enters the port and not really any airflow if u know what i mean, so i opted to not do that. but other then that it looks good.


mike
Mike,

Your thread title was a little misleading.

Gasket matching just makes it easier for me to get in and open the port up and get a little more meticulous.

I don't like going more than 80grit on the intake side. the exhaust gets nice and smoothed though. I'll try and find some pics of the dog leg porting on those D25's

Post up your pics when your done!

As for your question, I haven't flowed a set of these heads yet, (no one wants to pay for it.) We have a Superflow, next set of heads I do, I'm going to use it. It was down for over a year, but has finally been fixed.

Here's Fuji's thread he has flow nnumbers

Last edited by Flat 4 Motorsport; 02-09-2013 at 07:42 PM.
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Old 02-09-2013, 03:04 PM   #8
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Here's mine, not 100% complete yet
80 intake and polished exhaust

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Old 02-09-2013, 04:17 PM   #9
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The JDM BIG PORT heads have the same design as the B16 head. Honda does have some of the best flowing heads for what they are. They all use this similar shape. Not surprised the JDM STi big ports use similar style as well as a nice round floor to the short turn.

USDM small port heads are kind of like B18 GSR. More of a straight shot. The JDM big port are like the B16 heads. They have a nice round arch from entry to valve.

My splitter only sits around 5mm lower than the lowest point of the factory small port splitter.
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Old 02-09-2013, 04:34 PM   #10
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looks good also gotsugg......... i finish all my ports in 60 grit and nothing else even on the exhaust ports. mirror polishing is a waste of time imo, it does nothing for flow. i may help to slow the build up of carbon over time but thats about it.


heres some pics of some of my port work on other heads......






















mike
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Old 02-09-2013, 04:51 PM   #11
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and here are some before and afters.....

evo 8 exhuast port.....





l61 ecotec exhuast port.....





srt 4 exhaust port and throat....









honda 6.5 hp go kart.....






mike
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Old 02-09-2013, 04:59 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by FuJi K View Post
The JDM BIG PORT heads have the same design as the B16 head. Honda does have some of the best flowing heads for what they are. They all use this similar shape. Not surprised the JDM STi big ports use similar style as well as a nice round floor to the short turn.

USDM small port heads are kind of like B18 GSR. More of a straight shot. The JDM big port are like the B16 heads. They have a nice round arch from entry to valve.

My splitter only sits around 5mm lower than the lowest point of the factory small port splitter.
but uve taken some usdm heads like ive got pictures of up above (the b25 cast) and have trimmed the divider back to make it similar to the jdm big ports correct.... thats kind of what i was asking.

and ur saying the jdm big ports are that deign (similar to a honda b16) from the factory correct?


mike
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Old 02-09-2013, 07:09 PM   #13
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Beautiful work Mike. I have some work to do
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Old 02-09-2013, 07:34 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by gotsugg View Post
Here's mine, not 100% complete yet
80 intake and polished exhaust

Those look great! how much time do you have in those?

We generally do a four hour job unless the customer wants to pay more.

Those D25's have about 3.5hrs of time into them, those were a personal set that I ended up selling.

-Phil
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Old 02-09-2013, 07:39 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by ammfab View Post
looks good also gotsugg......... i finish all my ports in 60 grit and nothing else even on the exhaust ports. mirror polishing is a waste of time imo, it does nothing for flow. i may help to slow the build up of carbon over time but thats about it.


heres some pics of some of my port work on other heads......






















mike
Mike,

simply stunning! I typically wont go over 120 grit on the exhaust side for the same reason you stated and going with a finer grit usually will show minor imperfections very well.

Great work man!

-Phil
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Old 02-09-2013, 08:21 PM   #16
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Here's the intake ports on the heads I built for my motor. They're about 85% in this photo.
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Old 02-09-2013, 08:28 PM   #17
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thanks guys, still working on these damn heads right now.... im on the second stage of 3 on the 2nd head right now then i gotta do the final finish on them. i must say ive never seen such good work from diy's in any other forum, most of the time it looks like crap, good job guys.


mike
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Old 02-09-2013, 08:40 PM   #18
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Post up more pictures when you are done. And show us the tools you are using, if you don't mind
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Old 02-09-2013, 10:35 PM   #19
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oh i def will..... as for the tooling...... ill show some of it but not all.


mike
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Old 02-09-2013, 10:47 PM   #20
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I just did some light porting for the first time on a set of usdm phase 1 ej22 single exhaust port heads and would be interested in seeing what tools are used and maybe a few hints on some specialty tools. I just blended the valve seats to the head casting, then put a small radius on the short turn on the floor?, then opened up the exhaust port some since there is only one. I de-shrouded around the valves as there was a little lip around each valve.

For tools, I used an air die grind with a double cut bur with a 80 grit flapper wheel and then going to go back with a 120 flapper wheel for the intake side. Then, leave the exhaust at 120 grit flapper wheel.

Last edited by subi400; 02-09-2013 at 11:27 PM.
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Old 02-09-2013, 11:02 PM   #21
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I jsut did some porting for the first time on a set of usdm phase 1 ej22 single exhaust port heads and would be interested in seeing what tools are used and maybe a few hints on some specialty tools.
get a variable speed die grinder like a Makita, or look for a single high speed and run a router speed control unit.

I use long shank and short shank carbide aluminum single cut burrs, and sanding madrels/drums. Mounted stones are decent for bowl blending. Just take your time.

The longer the shank the less control you'll have, and when you sand you don't need to spin real fast.

here are a few shanks I use :



Get ready to spend some money 1/4" collet tooling is expensive.

But porting with a dremel works, it just will take you three times longer.

-Phil
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Old 02-09-2013, 11:58 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Flat 4 Motorsport View Post
get a variable speed die grinder like a Makita, or look for a single high speed and run a router speed control unit.

I use long shank and short shank carbide aluminum single cut burrs, and sanding madrels/drums. Mounted stones are decent for bowl blending. Just take your time.

The longer the shank the less control you'll have, and when you sand you don't need to spin real fast.

here are a few shanks I use :



Get ready to spend some money 1/4" collet tooling is expensive.

But porting with a dremel works, it just will take you three times longer.

-Phil
Thanks for the comments I bought a short shank like a 2 inch single cut aluminum bur for around $30, where do you buy the longer shank burs and such? Which one is that bur on the right? I just bought some more spiral sanding drums and roles in 80 and 120 grit. Haven't found 40 grit ones yet. I really prefer the double cut over the single cut bur after working with both, but the single cut bur removes material pretty quickly..

The real thing next is widening the combustion chamber to almost match the ej25 bore since I am putting ej22 heads on a NA ej25 block. Thinking the double cut bur to get it widened, then getting a much smaller carbide bit for a dremel to get to the tight spots. Going to try the 80 grit spiral role then the 120 role to smooth out to see how it looks.

These usdm phase 1 ej22 heads have small ports... But, for what I am doing they will work for port velocity and torque.

What's interesting is that the usdm phase 1 ej22 single exhaust port heads have small stock D port intake ports but the spark plug tube is in the way on the bottom side of the splitter so it is not a full D port.

Any links to a good but cheap Makita electric die grinder?
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Old 02-10-2013, 12:29 AM   #23
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ok one head is done, now i need to finish the last stage on head #2. i think im gonna start a new thread when i post the finished pics cause these things deserve a dedicated thread as they turned out way better then i initially expected them to and this one has kind of turned into a q&a thread about porting. not that its a bad thing or anything. i do love these intake ports, so easy to port..... wish i could say the same about the damn dog legs.


mike
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Old 02-10-2013, 12:41 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subi400 View Post
Thanks for the comments I bought a short shank like a 2 inch single cut aluminum bur for around $30, where do you buy the longer shank burs and such? Which one is that bur on the right? I just bought some more spiral sanding drums and roles in 80 and 120 grit. Haven't found 40 grit ones yet. I really prefer the double cut over the single cut bur after working with both, but the single cut bur removes material pretty quickly..

The real thing next is widening the combustion chamber to almost match the ej25 bore since I am putting ej22 heads on a NA ej25 block. Thinking the double cut bur to get it widened, then getting a much smaller carbide bit for a dremel to get to the tight spots. Going to try the 80 grit spiral role then the 120 role to smooth out to see how it looks.

These usdm phase 1 ej22 heads have small ports... But, for what I am doing they will work for port velocity and torque.

What's interesting is that the usdm phase 1 ej22 single exhaust port heads have small stock D port intake ports but the spark plug tube is in the way on the bottom side of the splitter so it is not a full D port.

Any links to a good but cheap Makita electric die grinder?
The double cut burrs are typically for ferrous applications, not saying you cant use them though. I buy most of my carbide burr porting tools through Buckeye Carbide They are by far some of the best quality I have used and their pricing is great!

and sanding mandrels from MSC or KBC tools.

I bought my Makita off fleabay, they're expensive so you just have to be patient and catch someone not paying attn.

I got a single speed and bought a router speed controller, dont be ghetto and use a dimmer switch.

My favorite burr is the middle one with the real tight spiral flutes, it's doesnt chew through the material as aggressively so once you get a good amount of material removed I 'll swith to that to start smoothing and go the the sanding mandrels.

Don't even bother with 40 grit, 60-80 on the intake side. you dont want it to be (mirror) smooth, and if you want to make it pretty on the exhaust side a 120 but no more than that IMO.

Goodluck
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Old 02-10-2013, 01:16 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by ammfab View Post
ok one head is done, now i need to finish the last stage on head #2. i think im gonna start a new thread when i post the finished pics cause these things deserve a dedicated thread as they turned out way better then i initially expected them to and this one has kind of turned into a q&a thread about porting. not that its a bad thing or anything. i do love these intake ports, so easy to port..... wish i could say the same about the damn dog legs.


mike
The picture of the srt 4 ports in that head are crazy... Nice job with the finished product.

So, what specifically surprised you about the current heads you are working on? Any particular reason for not sharing some of your other tools?
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