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Old 02-14-2013, 04:33 PM   #6951
Phatron
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They don't work when utilizing an ap either.....and you can input a negative value in the ap.
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Old 02-14-2013, 06:02 PM   #6952
amalgrover
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 02RexWI View Post
I doubt you're maxing out the stock fuel rails at that power level, but you're probably getting close, so it wouldn't be a bad idea to upgrade while you have it apart.
I doubt he is even anywhere close to maxing the stock rails. There are plenty of people pushing well over 100whp more than what he is on the stock rails right now.

Also, your walbro 255 is maxed out probably around 180lph with the boost pressure you are probably running and if you are running the stock wiring and everything (closer to 200lph with a pump re-wire). That equates to approximately 75% IDC (85% if you are re-wired) on your 1000cc injectors (assuming 100% IDC = 1000cc). So, if you are seeing over 75% IDC (85% if re-wired) now, then your fuel pump is maxed, which means that the fuel pressure and injector flow is dropping. This requires you to hold the injector open longer to get the same afr, which means IDC is going up significantly.

If you got a bigger pump and bumped fuel pressure up enough (approx 55psi base pressure), you should be able to get to the power level you are looking for...REMEMBER THOUGH...as fuel pressure increases, fuel pump output decreases. This means that if you bump fuel pressure up to 55psi and run 27psi of boost, you are looking at 82psi of fuel pressure. This means that the fuel pump output at 100% IDC now has to be approx 275lph.

Last edited by amalgrover; 02-14-2013 at 06:08 PM.
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Old 02-14-2013, 11:55 PM   #6953
AnthonyWang
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Im gunna be going e85 soon, after i save up a little more.

my current setup right now:

EJ207
VF37 Twin Scroll
Turboback Catless
340 Fuel Pump
295 WHP
250 TRQ


Torque is a bit low, maybe to lack of AVCS. But top end is heavenly.

Future mods (for E85)
DW 1000cc
Boost Controller
Fail safe lean meter

Im excited to see the outcomes of E85 on my setup.

Last edited by AnthonyWang; 02-15-2013 at 12:02 AM.
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Old 02-15-2013, 01:18 PM   #6954
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Thanks for the great feedback guys...

So I can switch to an AEM map sensor and that should be able to be scaled correctly with the AP on my ECU. Thats where i thought i was gonna be there.

Any one tried swapping ECU's? It's not something i have tried before...wondering if it's possible.


So on the fuel issue...looks like everyone agrees that a bigger fuel pump/ pressure regulator (even on stock rails) should get me to where i want to be without upgrading injectors?

Last edited by Squidz; 02-15-2013 at 01:50 PM.
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Old 02-15-2013, 02:38 PM   #6955
simon021
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnthonyWang View Post
Im gunna be going e85 soon, after i save up a little more.

my current setup right now:

EJ207
VF37 Twin Scroll
Turboback Catless
340 Fuel Pump
295 WHP
250 TRQ


Torque is a bit low, maybe to lack of AVCS. But top end is heavenly.

Future mods (for E85)
DW 1000cc
Boost Controller
Fail safe lean meter

Im excited to see the outcomes of E85 on my setup.
Here is my virtual dyno of the latest log on my catless v8 w/vf37 on e85. I'm running 1200cc injectors ~65% duty cycle with a walbro 255.

22psi peak to 17.5 holding out till 8k

It's such a nice curve.

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Old 02-15-2013, 03:37 PM   #6956
Maxwell Power
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simon021 View Post
Here is my virtual dyno of the latest log on my catless v8 w/vf37 on e85. I'm running 1200cc injectors ~65% duty cycle with a walbro 255.

22psi peak to 17.5 holding out till 8k

It's such a nice curve.

you willing to post a log?
Did you tune it yourself?
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Old 02-15-2013, 04:12 PM   #6957
simon021
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxwell Power View Post
you willing to post a log?
Did you tune it yourself?
No I haven't done any tuning on the EJ207.

What are you wanting to see?
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Old 02-15-2013, 04:26 PM   #6958
Maxwell Power
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AVCS and timing curves. it looked a bit wavy and power seemed to fall a little more than the many 207's we have on the dyno so I was curious how aggressive the timing was.

Obviously someone had to tune it with 1200cc injectors. I don't want to step on toes, so if you paid for the tune, don't post a log.
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Old 02-15-2013, 04:35 PM   #6959
simon021
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Dom 1.5XTR Twinscroll!

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxwell Power View Post
AVCS and timing curves. it looked a bit wavy and power seemed to fall a little more than the many 207's we have on the dyno so I was curious how aggressive the timing was.

Obviously someone had to tune it with 1200cc injectors. I don't want to step on toes, so if you paid for the tune, don't post a log.
How much timing are you running up top?
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Old 02-15-2013, 04:36 PM   #6960
simon021
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Dom 1.5XTR Twinscroll!

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I meant I haven't personally done any tuning on this motor. I paid for a tune.
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Old 02-15-2013, 04:49 PM   #6961
Z0rr0
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 02RexWI View Post
Like stated above, the issue is due to the limitation of the ECU not being able to put in a negative offset number.
You can get around this by using an AEM 3.5 BAR MAP sensor, but they are expensive compared to the Omni MAP sensor.
I doubt you're maxing out the stock fuel rails at that power level, but you're probably getting close, so it wouldn't be a bad idea to upgrade while you have it apart.
Buy the non-stainless AEM 3.5bar, they are much more affordable. like $65 i think.
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Old 02-15-2013, 05:46 PM   #6962
02RexWI
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^They don't recommend the brass sensor for engine management applications... Can't say I know anyone that has tried it for that.
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Old 02-15-2013, 06:06 PM   #6963
Maxwell Power
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 02RexWI View Post
^They don't recommend the brass sensor for engine management applications... Can't say I know anyone that has tried it for that.
I have. Worked great on my car.
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Old 02-15-2013, 06:06 PM   #6964
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simon021 View Post
How much timing are you running up top?
enough.
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Old 02-15-2013, 06:07 PM   #6965
Z0rr0
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As Have I, been working great for a year now.
Just be smart about placement. I placed mine away from direct heat sources.
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Old 02-15-2013, 06:15 PM   #6966
simon021
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Unfortunately that's pretty much the answer I expected.
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Old 02-19-2013, 12:12 AM   #6967
Maxwell Power
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxwell Power View Post
probably too much timing. People seem to think that e85= 7 more degrees of timing when it only means 2.5 to 5.
Simon, this is from earlier in the thread as a comparison between pump and e85.

Regardless, I'm not going to give specifics on a national forum. I release tons of information on a daily basis to the community. Information that didn't come free or cheap. Things that I rarely get any compensation for. I have to draw the line somewhere. Exact tuning parameters is that line. There are a ton of hacks who call themselves tuners, people who have taken my open source maps and sold them as their own, people who talk trash because they lack knowledge and experience, people who just want a taste of this "tuner lifestyle" that some seem to think is glamorous or something. In the end, I'm protecting my art and my job as well as the community. The fakes will be discovered and disappear and the professionals will be known and trusted.

Until then the motto of these noobs will be: "Have laptop, will tune".

Watch out for guys that price match.
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Old 02-19-2013, 12:27 AM   #6968
simon021
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Dom 1.5XTR Twinscroll!

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I wasn't asking for all your secrets. You asked a question that I'm not in a position to answer. However, you could have gave a general answer and we could have continued the discussion.

How about you just post a graph or two so we can compare the curve. I'm not interested in the numbers, just the shape. You can edit out the numbers if they are top secret ;-)
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Old 02-19-2013, 12:28 AM   #6969
Maxwell Power
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simon021 View Post
I wasn't asking for all your secrets. You asked a question that I'm not in a position to answer. However, you could have gave a general answer and we could have continued the discussion.

How about you just post a graph or two so we can compare the curve. I'm not interested in the numbers, just the shape. You can edit out the numbers if they are top secret ;-)
You mean the timing curve?
The 207 should have a progressive timing curve to around 7k or so.
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Old 02-19-2013, 12:31 AM   #6970
Maxwell Power
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simon021 View Post
You asked a question that I'm not in a position to answer.
;-)
That's why I said, if you had someone else tune it, don't answer the question.
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Old 02-19-2013, 12:48 AM   #6971
Junior2JZ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxwell Power View Post
Simon, this is from earlier in the thread as a comparison between pump and e85.

Regardless, I'm not going to give specifics on a national forum. I release tons of information on a daily basis to the community. Information that didn't come free or cheap. Things that I rarely get any compensation for. I have to draw the line somewhere. Exact tuning parameters is that line. There are a ton of hacks who call themselves tuners, people who have taken my open source maps and sold them as their own, people who talk trash because they lack knowledge and experience, people who just want a taste of this "tuner lifestyle" that some seem to think is glamorous or something. In the end, I'm protecting my art and my job as well as the community. The fakes will be discovered and disappear and the professionals will be known and trusted.

Until then the motto of these noobs will be: "Have laptop, will tune".

Watch out for guys that price match.

This is the BEST POST on NASIOC.. PERIOD!!

Everyone is a tuner, reality is 90% are just map flashers
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Old 02-19-2013, 11:00 AM   #6972
TPG Tuning
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Junior2JZ View Post

This is the BEST POST on NASIOC.. PERIOD!!

Everyone is a tuner, reality is 90% are just map flashers
Couldn't agree more!

Nate
TPG
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Old 02-19-2013, 11:45 AM   #6973
simon021
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Dom 1.5XTR Twinscroll!

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Look, I saw a guy asking about the exact setup I have, so I posted up a dyno plot to give the guy an idea of what to expect. I was posting so he could see the curve of the plot and get an idea how his car will perform. Maxwell comes on here asking about my setup, but since I did not personally do the tune, I can't answer his questions. I've already heard your soap box speech about how you give so much to the community blah blah blah. I would never ask any of your "top secret" tuner information. I was simply trying to continue the conversation that YOU started. I dont want or need any of your trade secrets. It's like you just look for an opportunity to come on here and talk about how great you are and how other "laptop tuners" are just punks.

It's unfortunate that most of you guys come off as ********. I know you are probably not that way in real life, but the tone here is pretty sad. I was just trying to have a friendly conversation.

In all honesty, I have not been following this thread, so if somehow I struck a nerve from some previous postings, I apologize. I would have NEVER asked any specifics about your tune had you not inquired first.
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Old 02-19-2013, 01:40 PM   #6974
Maxwell Power
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simon021 View Post
Look, I saw a guy asking about the exact setup I have, so I posted up a dyno plot to give the guy an idea of what to expect. I was posting so he could see the curve of the plot and get an idea how his car will perform. Maxwell comes on here asking about my setup, but since I did not personally do the tune, I can't answer his questions. I've already heard your soap box speech about how you give so much to the community blah blah blah. I would never ask any of your "top secret" tuner information. I was simply trying to continue the conversation that YOU started. I dont want or need any of your trade secrets. It's like you just look for an opportunity to come on here and talk about how great you are and how other "laptop tuners" are just punks.

It's unfortunate that most of you guys come off as ********. I know you are probably not that way in real life, but the tone here is pretty sad. I was just trying to have a friendly conversation.

In all honesty, I have not been following this thread, so if somehow I struck a nerve from some previous postings, I apologize. I would have NEVER asked any specifics about your tune had you not inquired first.
you're the only one pissed off here. I have no idea who tuned your car. I was trying to help you. Don't get mad at me because I'm not giving specifics.

I asked a question.
you couldn't answer
I said nevermind because I didn't want to see the tune if it was done by a tuner.
You asked me for timing values
I expressed why I won't tell you.

I don't know why you're so angry. You can't contribute to the discussion AT ALL. You have been asking me questions since...

Last edited by Maxwell Power; 02-19-2013 at 01:57 PM.
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Old 02-19-2013, 01:52 PM   #6975
Squidz
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It beats being pissed on...

Now..about that ECM swap...

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