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Old 11-29-2011, 02:49 PM   #451
Flat 4 Motorsport
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Hey Guys/Gals,

I'm trying to spark some interest in these gear sets I'm currently working on. These gears sets would be a complete over haul for a Subaru 5MT and if they do well I may start R&D on the 6MT but that trans is pretty stout as is.

My main focus is to improve the quality of gears and to leave the customer with a sense of not having to worry about launching at 3K and having to worry about shearing the teeth of the helical gears.

I'm working with a company that is world renowned with their gear sets for DP's (Daytona Prototypes) GT Class, and IRL. The don't only make gears, sequential boxes, but also differentials, steering racks, axles and many other drive line products for race cars.

I have spoken many times with one of the engineers with the company and have also spoken with the owner of the company regarding producing a quality gear set for the 5MT at a competitive price along with PPG, Albins, Modena, ect.

The only thing I need from you guys in some general interest into what it is I'm doing with EMCO Gears. We plan on developing new input and output shafts along with custom gear ratios. ALL sets will come with billet selector forks already built into the pricing of the gear sets, so there aren't hidden costs. I want to offer something fresh and new, that I know will blow anything else out there out of the water. I have personally been in the EMCO Manufacturing facility and have seen from start to finish how gears go from a solid chunk of material to a thing of beauty.

I'll leave you guys with some pictures and please let me know if there is a demand for a gear set or if you have any questions regarding EMCO Gear sets. These will last you a lifetime with the ability to custom make a few different options for the different types of motorsport involved with Subaru. Whether it be a daily driver that becomes a weekend warrior, or a full blown out Drag/Road racer looking for that competitive racers edge Flat 4 Motorsport and EMCO Gears will have you crossing the finish line to victory!

-Phil @ Flat 4 Motorsport

This is a sequential gear box used in a Daytona Prototype, Forged gears, billet selector forks, Straight cut gears. This is the real deal! EMCO even makes the cases that the gear sets mount in.



Below: these two gears you see here are almost 12 years old!

Here you can see the overall quality of EMCO Gears. These particular gears are straight cut dog box gears. We can make sycro'd sets, and dog box sets. If you do not know how to drive a dog box, you will wear out the engagement rings very quickly. Dog boxes are very noisy transmissions, but the upside to having a dog box is that you do not need the clutch to shift = quicker shifts, but you do need to be in the correct RPM's and know what your doing or this box is not for you.



Here you can see the quality do detail, removing the burrs on the ends of the gears to reduce friction which causes higher temps inside the gear box.

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Old 11-29-2011, 03:45 PM   #452
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2006 WRX Stg 2, 240whp and 311wtq on a dynojet.

84k, stock clutch and gears, no issues yet. My time will come, i'm sure. I put on a lot of highway miles however so i'm hoping to just do LGT 1-3/4 and be done with it for <$1k.
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Old 11-30-2011, 11:28 AM   #453
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mechatricity View Post
2006 WRX Stg 2, 240whp and 311wtq on a dynojet.

84k, stock clutch and gears, no issues yet. My time will come, i'm sure. I put on a lot of highway miles however so i'm hoping to just do LGT 1-3/4 and be done with it for <$1k.
3rd gear isn't the only weak gear! 2nd and 3rd are both a very common gear to take out of the 5 speed. If you take 2nd out, you have a much larger issue because you'll need a new shaft. If you want a strong 5 speed, you should replace 1-4. Or just risk to continually take it out and spend $1,000 to 1,800 to rebuild it every time.
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Old 11-30-2011, 12:25 PM   #454
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Excellent advice but I would think LGT 1st-4th gears would definitely ease up on shock load on tranny in an 06 wrx. Personally, I am not a fan of the 5th gear for cruising in my RA close ratio gearset but it is definitely more "fun" since boost is essentially on tap at all times. But mechatricity's power and torque should be OK with LGT 1-4 gears.
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Old 11-30-2011, 03:31 PM   #455
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Yeah he doesn't have much power... now, but I assumed since he is on NASIOC that he is looking for more like much of us are. I personally have heard a lot of negative things about the 5 speed even with PPGs and other gear sets, but I also haven't ever used them or had friends that rebuilt them (just things my NASIOC research has told me). I just went with the 6sp because I knew it would hold up to the abuse and future mods without worrying. I was seriously looking into the 1-4 dog box PPG gear set, but it was ridiculous how much the parts actually were (not 100% sure but $7,500 +). I don't think most people on here have seen 5 speed gears next to a 6 speed (I hadn't until last week)... It's a HUGE difference.
The only advantages I see with a 5 speed are 1) they are half the weight and 2) less shifting for straight line racing.

I will try and get a couple pictures up of the 5 and 6 speed gears next to each other, so everyone can see.
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Old 11-30-2011, 05:03 PM   #456
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Flatiron's website has lgt, rallispec, and stock WRX gear set comparisons. I have honestly never seen what the 6 speed sti gears look like next to stock WRX gears. Please share. I also know that the strength of the gear itself can be increased via heat treating and micro honing. Rallispec did this with the RA gearset I installed. One other advantage would be the 5 speed tranny is much simpler in design. It's also lighter. Not that I'm advocating anything...different strokes for different folks. Ppg gears in a dog box was not considered due to noise and the fact that I daily drive the car 500 miles a week. If I had the time and money I'd of done the sti tranny in a heartbeat. Sadly my wife would have removed my balls when she saw the bill
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Old 05-11-2012, 08:18 AM   #457
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Default Stripped 3rd Gear

I have a 2007 WRX with 63K miles. Getting onto the highway yesterday, I'm pretty sure I stripped my 3rd Gear. All other Gears seem to be fine, but there does feel like the teeth from 3rd are making shifting to others difficult. After the stripping the Gear I got off the highway in about a mile, then had it towed to a garage.

My question is, its it possible to just replace the stripped gear, and if so where can I find just a gear, so far I havn't found the part. Or do I need to replace the whole tranny?
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Old 05-11-2012, 10:16 AM   #458
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if you replace the stripped gear, you are literally throwing out money. Yes, you can replace it after they remove your tranny and inspect it and no other damage is present. However, you will most likely blow that same gear again if your car is modified.

Tranny rebuild with beefier gear set is probably your cheapest option that would make sense....unless your stock, then just replace the gear and have your bearings and other gears and clutch inspected while its out. Either way you will need to either complete on your own or pay for the tranny removal and installation and rebuild, even if its just 1 gear. I have someone who decided to just fix the one gear and he spent about 1/2 the $ I did and is in same boat as he was before he blew the gear. Just doesn't make sense to replace same shoddy 3rd gear with same 3rd gear when its pretty obvious its a weak design if you are making more power.

BTW - update for the group - My 06 just hit 127K miles with the Rallispec JDM STi close ratio gear set and its still working great. No a single issue. Car pulls hard and tranny is probably my favorite feature of the vehicle. Shifting is smooth and 1-3rd gears being longer make the car more fun to drive, still have not had a single grind since the rebuild. Running extra-s in the tranny now. Having instant boost in 5th gear at 55 mph is an added bonus. I highly recommend this gear set to anyone who needs a new transmission due to having bigger wheels and/or more power.
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Old 05-12-2012, 02:09 PM   #459
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buckwilly View Post
if you replace the stripped gear, you are literally throwing out money. Yes, you can replace it after they remove your tranny and inspect it and no other damage is present. However, you will most likely blow that same gear again if your car is modified.

Tranny rebuild with beefier gear set is probably your cheapest option that would make sense....unless your stock, then just replace the gear and have your bearings and other gears and clutch inspected while its out. Either way you will need to either complete on your own or pay for the tranny removal and installation and rebuild, even if its just 1 gear. I have someone who decided to just fix the one gear and he spent about 1/2 the $ I did and is in same boat as he was before he blew the gear. Just doesn't make sense to replace same shoddy 3rd gear with same 3rd gear when its pretty obvious its a weak design if you are making more power.

BTW - update for the group - My 06 just hit 127K miles with the Rallispec JDM STi close ratio gear set and its still working great. No a single issue. Car pulls hard and tranny is probably my favorite feature of the vehicle. Shifting is smooth and 1-3rd gears being longer make the car more fun to drive, still have not had a single grind since the rebuild. Running extra-s in the tranny now. Having instant boost in 5th gear at 55 mph is an added bonus. I highly recommend this gear set to anyone who needs a new transmission due to having bigger wheels and/or more power.
This is the Type STi they list on their website? I might have to consider these if the grind between 3rd-4th gets any worse.
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Old 05-12-2012, 07:43 PM   #460
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06 WRX:
Stock Transmission with Redline Lightweight Shockproof gear oil, competion clutch stage 3.5
483awhp and 400ftlb tq for about 3 months now.
before it made 360awhp and and 380ftlb tq for a year with multiple launches and tons of highway pulls.

I do believe the 06 and up trannys are pretty strong. Alot of it has to do with how you drive it and how you maintain it.

I hear people say "Oh im only stage 2 and my tranny crapped out on me" My response is: learn how to drive and stop dropping the clutch at 6500rpm's.

Heck, there is even somebody in the proven power section making 500awhp with the stock 5spd. You just need to know what your doing.
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Old 05-12-2012, 11:00 PM   #461
Diesel Guy1
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I have a 07 Wrx Tr with 115,000 miles on and haven't broken any gears yet.
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Old 05-14-2012, 09:30 AM   #462
buckwilly
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystery Machine View Post
This is the Type STi they list on their website? I might have to consider these if the grind between 3rd-4th gets any worse.
yes those are the gears from Rallispec in my transmission. I am running OEM synchros and bearings and stage 2 organic clutch with extra-s fluid. With the Kart-boy short shifter kit and front and rear shifter bushing, it only makes the tranny that much more fun.
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Old 05-14-2012, 09:42 AM   #463
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Quote:
Originally Posted by banshee04 View Post
06 WRX:
Stock Transmission with Redline Lightweight Shockproof gear oil, competion clutch stage 3.5
483awhp and 400ftlb tq for about 3 months now.
before it made 360awhp and and 380ftlb tq for a year with multiple launches and tons of highway pulls.

I do believe the 06 and up trannys are pretty strong. Alot of it has to do with how you drive it and how you maintain it.

I hear people say "Oh im only stage 2 and my tranny crapped out on me" My response is: learn how to drive and stop dropping the clutch at 6500rpm's.

Heck, there is even somebody in the proven power section making 500awhp with the stock 5spd. You just need to know what your doing.
Lol- no one ever said you couldn't make the power and hold it on the stock transmission, but chances are you will be in the same boat as everyone else in time. I was making about 300 whp and 350 wtq on my stock transmission for abour 10K miles before it went out. And when it went out, it went out, there were no signs prior to it failing.

06/07 trannys are weak on top of that the gearing makes it even worse with a torquier 2.5 liter motor. You are just lucky, it has nothing to do with driver error on my end and I always matched revs and granny shifted. I also never dropped the clutch when I had my stock transmission. When 3rd went out I was shifting around 3/4K rpm and it just popped. However it was after 2 hours of driving hard in the mountains with many upshifts and downshifts, a few beaks in traction in the corners, etc, so I assume that had a lot to do with it. I also had/have 18x8 wheels and sticky tires. Once/if you decided to go with a STi transmission or a STi 5 speed close ratio, you will notice between every shift that the design of our stock transmission are set up to fail with more power. The oem gears are weak, the ratios are weak...its just weak. I like to have fun with my car, I like to drive it aggressively. I also like the increased power. For those making this power and spent that money to drive it faster and harder, getting a tranny that will mate to the engine's new power seems like common sense. Having your tranny fail in the mountains 3 hours from home is not fun. Learn from my mistakes. LOL.
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Old 05-14-2012, 06:53 PM   #464
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I bought a stock 2007 Wagon with 90k put 15k at stage 2 , I had no problems with the gears and the clutch lasted 90k plus 10k at Stage 2 . I only had a problem when I broke my Clutch Fork at that time I pulled it and swapped in a FXT Transmission 4.44 FD and swapped in LGT 1-4 Gears and Synchros .. The combination of tall gears and short final drive is an amazing combination and with a short 4.44 FD it puts most of the stress on the Ring Pinion instead of the gear itself . I've only had this combination for about 1500 miles but I love it and I think it will work perfectly with my 350wtq levels I'm looking to achieve
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Old 06-25-2012, 10:18 AM   #465
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If anyone is looking for a used 07 5spd with Albins helical 1-4 and stock 5th pm me.
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Old 08-16-2012, 04:34 PM   #466
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Bought my 06 tr at 63k . When I did not knowing anything about my car I shifted all wrong and dumped it 3 times. At 72k motor blew. It's rebuilt with forged internals and amr cxr500 10.5 cm hot side. I tuned it to 330 to the wheels along with redline oil, and now at 76k (2k on tune) its holding very well I only do pulls on the highway so usually 4th to 5th and the rest is 75 % throttle clutch slips on peak boost and my clutch is half gone at the rebuild.

It's all about how you drive at this point its all about how you drive specially when you already know about your trans

Be smart thus is why my wife allows me to have a $5000.00 emergency car repair credit card lol
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Old 09-06-2012, 03:56 PM   #467
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Anyone have experience with an STI engine swap with the original 5 speed WRX tranny? With a proper tune and/or a stock STI engine, is the 5 speed tranny built to handle it?

Last edited by Flying Hombre; 10-23-2012 at 10:17 PM.
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Old 09-06-2012, 06:45 PM   #468
WhatTurboLag?
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Vf39 speed density tuned, blew my 3rd gear at 30k miles just driving. Never shifted hard or launched it.
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Old 11-30-2012, 04:17 PM   #469
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Vf39 06 tuned my Clark Turner, about 104.5k miles was driving home on lunch today and 3rd gear exploded, I was doing about 35mph at id say 45% throttle when it happend. 1,2,4,5,R all checked out and work but it sounds like a bucket of bolts got dumped into a washing machine and its on spin cycle.
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Old 11-30-2012, 04:53 PM   #470
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De-ja-vu

Same crap happened to me. Time for an upgrade or at least upgraded gear set on a rebuild. Welcome to the club!
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Old 12-03-2012, 05:46 PM   #471
Gravy188
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I got a 06 STi with stock 6mt. Mods: Intake, Exaust, BOV and a mild tune(19psi). 3rd went out at 33k, warranty replaced syncros and gear. Subaru also over tightened my timing belt after 2 pistons cracked and it smoked my engine, thats a whole other story. Most recently(less than a month) i had the center diff bearings go out(it made a loud whirr after 35+) so i replaced the bearings myself, put it all back together and everything seemed great. Then last night i made a U-turn and felt a binding, got straightened out and now i have a whining whirring noise again :/ Pretty sure ill have to do the bearings again and replace the center diff. Any ideas on where i should get the diff? Idk about the 6mt or any subaru tranny it seems hit or miss i guess. I got hit input on the diff purchase would be greatly appreciated, thank you in advance!
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Old 12-04-2012, 03:56 PM   #472
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07 WRX Wagon, 64k miles
Stock trans. - gears, clutch, flywheel.
VF43, DW 750cc injectors, STi tmic, Invidia catless 3" exhaust, tuned by Sean Ivey, Kartboy short shifter w/ bushings, Cobb SF intake. Made 321whp / 343awtq @ 21psi

Only issue is some clutch slip at WOT in low RPMs in 4th. Trans is fine... no launches, no lift shifts, etc. I take care of my **** and don't drive like a retard.

Last edited by scoobasaurusrex; 12-05-2012 at 06:52 PM.
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Old 12-04-2012, 09:02 PM   #473
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I haven't updated in awhile so here are my numbers

07 wrx 63.5k miles
stock tranny, ACT HD clutch and ACT lighter flywheel
I had a VF30 for 12k~ miles
308whp / 315wtq on stock clutch
then I had a Deadbolt td06 20g
363whp / 347wtq stock clutch for 1st year and then it started slipping
been over 300whp/wtq for over 30k on stock tranny and its been good so far
every now and then i'll have a grind or get locked out of a gear but it rarely happens

I don't launch it, but i do bang through gears when i'm moving.
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Old 03-12-2013, 03:05 PM   #474
devlin0311
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Update now at 93k tranny still running great I think I'm go for e85 sooon
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Old 03-12-2013, 09:30 PM   #475
some dude
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Stock 06' WRX with 149,000 miles on original tranny. Original clutch. Original owner.
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