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Old 03-17-2013, 06:43 AM   #26
Kean
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leskaman View Post
You generally do not use a clay bar on a newer vehicle as it will only remove surface contaminates that imbed themselves onto the top coat of the paint which a new vehicle should not have. The first thing you want to do to a brand new vehicle is wash, polish, and wax to protect the paint from those contaminants from even affecting your shine. If your car already has "swirl marks" then a clay bar will not remove them. It will however take your paints protection away along with any contaminants it has collected. It should be immediately followed by a wash, polish, and wax to protect your paint from any future abuse. The polish and wax can hide any swirl marks but I do not think anything save from a fresh cat of paint can permanently remove them. I just bought a 2013 Impreza and the first thing I am going to do is wash, polish, wax with Meguiars Ultimate (my personal favorite) to keep it clean, shiny, protected. Maybe once my car is 3 or 4 years old and I can notice physical bumps in the paint will I use a clay bar.
.....its quite simple. Use as needed. Whether a new car can benefit from the use of clay depends on the condition of the finish.

I'll say this..... New vehicles can be subjected to conditions and contamination that can leave deposits on the paint by the time the new owner takes delivery. Rail dust, industrial fallout, acid rain, etc. can all be sources of bonded contamination. In fact, I would even say the use of a decontamination product like Valugard ABC (used in conjunction with clay if needed) would be beneficial to a new vehicle to help ensure any ferrous contamination is completely removed, old product the dealer may have used, residues (ie. from transportation films, etc), environmental substances, etc.
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Old 03-17-2013, 05:08 PM   #27
stierzy34
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+1 let's see em!!!
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Old 03-17-2013, 06:08 PM   #28
09dgmlgt
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It's amazing how much smoother the surface of your vehicle is when you have clayed the entire car!
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Old 03-18-2013, 03:53 AM   #29
silverton
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I had a '91 ford escort gt a few years ago. the shine from the metallic paint was like night and day after a claybar treatment. highly recommend doing to any car that's of age.
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Old 03-18-2013, 02:33 PM   #30
Ftinney84
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love claying..makes life so much easier when it comes time to polish and wax.
On a related topic, has anyone used the Clay Pad Applicator that you can use with a porter/ other DA. Claying by hand is definitely time consuming, but always well worth the time.
Was wondering if doing it by DA is worth it. When thinking about it, clay on a DA is sort of intimidating.
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Old 03-18-2013, 02:38 PM   #31
tnguyen600
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Originally Posted by Ftinney84 View Post
love claying..makes life so much easier when it comes time to polish and wax.
On a related topic, has anyone used the Clay Pad Applicator that you can use with a porter/ other DA. Claying by hand is definitely time consuming, but always well worth the time.
Was wondering if doing it by DA is worth it. When thinking about it, clay on a DA is sort of intimidating.

I use the Nanotech Autoscrub. It's amazing and makes claying 134923842384 times easier.
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Old 03-18-2013, 03:09 PM   #32
Ftinney84
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Originally Posted by tnguyen600 View Post
I use the Nanotech Autoscrub. It's amazing and makes claying 134923842384 times easier.
wow, yea i've been meaning to check that product out for some time now. Looks incredible. How long does each pad typically last?
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Old 03-18-2013, 03:28 PM   #33
tnguyen600
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I've used it about 4 times already and it still looks fine. You'll easily get your money's worth. Think about the time you'll save with using the DA vs. your hands lol
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Old 03-18-2013, 03:37 PM   #34
Ftinney84
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yea im sold on it already lol
Starter kit with the 6inch and shock. Then i'll get the fine 4 inch, and 128oz of glide. Figure this will work out cheaper too, since the clay applicator is 20 and you still need clay to go with it.
Now if it would get warmer than 30degrees i'll be all set!!
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Old 03-20-2013, 02:52 PM   #35
Noek
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I generally *only* clay vehicles before I polish and seal. I never clay a vehicle as a last step in a process. As discussed earlier, it is hard to avoid marring and swirling, which is what you are always trying to avoid.

It will make your finish smooth and glassy but I look at it as a necessary evil in the process of detailing.
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Old 03-20-2013, 11:55 PM   #36
Kean
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Originally Posted by Noek View Post
I generally *only* clay vehicles before I polish and seal. I never clay a vehicle as a last step in a process. As discussed earlier, it is hard to avoid marring and swirling, which is what you are always trying to avoid.

It will make your finish smooth and glassy but I look at it as a necessary evil in the process of detailing.
There are finer clays available that are intended for more frequent use and can even be relatively gentle on some LSPs.
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Old 03-21-2013, 12:27 AM   #37
Noek
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Originally Posted by Kean View Post
There are finer clays available that are intended for more frequent use and can even be relatively gentle on some LSPs.
I've used soft and ultra soft bars and even with my lsp I can never shake the feeling that I am still dragging potentially abrasive material across a finish. I choose not to towel dry my vehicles either for the same reason, so the notion of clay bar as a final step in a detail is just a process I would never entertain.

I would never polish without removing contaminants first, either. I define claying simply as a mid-step process.
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Old 03-21-2013, 12:34 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kean View Post
.....its quite simple. Use as needed. Whether a new car can benefit from the use of clay depends on the condition of the finish.

I'll say this..... New vehicles can be subjected to conditions and contamination that can leave deposits on the paint by the time the new owner takes delivery. Rail dust, industrial fallout, acid rain, etc. can all be sources of bonded contamination. In fact, I would even say the use of a decontamination product like Valugard ABC (used in conjunction with clay if needed) would be beneficial to a new vehicle to help ensure any ferrous contamination is completely removed, old product the dealer may have used, residues (ie. from transportation films, etc), environmental substances, etc.
Truth. I work at a dealership as a porter and I clay new cars all the time. Our storage lot is a dirty place and some of our older units that have hung out back there for 100+ days with dust and what not on them getting cooked all day and cooling at night need to be clayed. I usually just run the clay over the hood, trunk, and roof of the cars while I'm washing them. Detailers only lightly wax the cars during a new car detail if they wax them at all plus being in storage and not being regularly rinsed down means rough finish.

Whats worse than dealers not taking care of their cars is people who don't notice or care about their new car.
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Old 03-21-2013, 01:52 AM   #39
Kean
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noek View Post

I've used soft and ultra soft bars and even with my lsp I can never shake the feeling that I am still dragging potentially abrasive material across a finish. I choose not to towel dry my vehicles either for the same reason, so the notion of clay bar as a final step in a detail is just a process I would never entertain.

I would never polish without removing contaminants first, either. I define claying simply as a mid-step process.
Obviously, we all need to choose solutions that we feel comfortable with. My only suggestion was that there are finer grade clays that have less potential for marring for scenarios where you may not otherwise need correction but still have minor above-surface contamination you want to remove (with less chance of marring).

As far as drying, I too rarely dry with towels and even have a DI filtration setup specifically for rinsing my vehicles. At most I do light touch up with a plush MF and QD/QW to address minor drip areas after using forced air. I had to go this route mainly due to the relatively hard water we have (over 500 ppm last time I checked from the tap).
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Old 03-21-2013, 09:52 AM   #40
Noek
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Originally Posted by Kean View Post
Obviously, we all need to choose solutions that we feel comfortable with. My only suggestion was that there are finer grade clays that have less potential for marring for scenarios where you may not otherwise need correction but still have minor above-surface contamination you want to remove (with less chance of marring).

As far as drying, I too rarely dry with towels and even have a DI filtration setup specifically for rinsing my vehicles. At most I do light touch up with a plush MF and QD/QW to address minor drip areas after using forced air. I had to go this route mainly due to the relatively hard water we have (over 500 ppm last time I checked from the tap).
Yup, and again, this is my practice only. I would never hand over a vehicle to a customer after claying. On my personal vehicles I will fully treat them twice a year. I just cringe at the notion that some may feel it necessary (productive?) to clay a car after every wash.

No disrespect but 500ppm is terrible. I would hesitate to water my plants with that.

We get our water from the Colorado river and my untreated water is 200ppm. When we had it from Oregon, it was much better. I ran my di from a soft water system first and totally ran through my di resin after like 10 washes. Lesson learned: potassium increases your ppm that your di system has to filter.
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Old 03-21-2013, 01:09 PM   #41
Kean
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Originally Posted by Noek View Post

Yup, and again, this is my practice only. I would never hand over a vehicle to a customer after claying. On my personal vehicles I will fully treat them twice a year. I just cringe at the notion that some may feel it necessary (productive?) to clay a car after every wash.

No disrespect but 500ppm is terrible. I would hesitate to water my plants with that.

We get our water from the Colorado river and my untreated water is 200ppm. When we had it from Oregon, it was much better. I ran my di from a soft water system first and totally ran through my di resin after like 10 washes. Lesson learned: potassium increases your ppm that your di system has to filter.
If I've learned anything over the years its that many things in detailing are a YMMV sort of thing. I typically won't do full corrections on my own vehicles for a year or more. ....especially with my wife's Opti-Coated Forester. I have had good results with spot-claying every few months (or as needed) but it really depends on the characteristics of the contaminants, the characteristics of the finish being clayed, etc.

Yeah..... Folks usually have the same reaction when I tell them about the hardness of my water here. Curious..... Have you ever done any readings with your soft water filtration to see if the ppm levels were elevated? In my case, I do run sediment and soft water pre-filters with my di system. Out of curiosity I took TDS readings from the tap and after the pre-filters and found and a drop of roughly 100ppm (post-filter). We have had a couple of discussion on Autopia.org on the subject but no one was ever able to give a firm answer on whether soft water filtration hindered or helped in this scenario. Based on my own readings, I decided to keep them hooked in.

Surprisingly, I get quite a few rinses before my ppm level begins to register above zero on my in-line meter. ......I'm using (2) 20" media canisters. I don't know what I would do without DI now that I've been using it for so long.
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Old 03-21-2013, 02:59 PM   #42
Noek
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kean View Post

Out of curiosity I took TDS readings from the tap and after the pre-filters and found and a drop of roughly 100ppm (post-filter).
This may or may not be the case depending on your system but after speaking with customer service I was still uncertain. Some systems have a lower ppm with treated water (sodium or potassium) and some do not. In the end I decided to trust the TDS meter as my ppm levels were higher after the treated water, which greatly disappointed me since I mounted the di system next to my soft water filtration and "cut it in" with a y adapter. It's really a trick set up but now I have to scrap it and purchase a roll cart for the di since I will no longer be using the treated water with it.

I was at 0 for about 7 conservative spotless rinses when I noticed the numbers increasing rapidly. At 60ppm (10 rinses or so) I determined it was time to order resin and call customer service.

It sounds to me as though your system is helping the di process where mine was working twice as hard to remove the additives that the treated water had.

So I'd say you have a good thing
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Old 03-22-2013, 01:13 PM   #43
JConto
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What type of clay bar lube was used? What does everyone recommend?
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Old 03-22-2013, 04:29 PM   #44
Ian G.
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What type of clay bar lube was used? What does everyone recommend?
My favorite is diluted optimum no rinse , works great and more cost effective than just straight up quick detailer spray
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Old 03-23-2013, 12:55 AM   #45
Noek
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Gloss-it
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Old 03-25-2013, 03:05 PM   #46
abel703
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clay baring is the ****! thumbs up!
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Old 03-29-2013, 07:15 PM   #47
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have always wanted to, little patience though....
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Old 03-31-2013, 08:16 PM   #48
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What type of clay bar lube was used? What does everyone recommend?
I used quick detailer but I agree the cost effectiveness of this is outrageous.
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:06 PM   #49
dsn112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leskaman View Post
You generally do not use a clay bar on a newer vehicle as it will only remove surface contaminates that imbed themselves onto the top coat of the paint which a new vehicle should not have. The first thing you want to do to a brand new vehicle is wash, polish, and wax to protect the paint from those contaminants from even affecting your shine. If your car already has "swirl marks" then a clay bar will not remove them. It will however take your paints protection away along with any contaminants it has collected. It should be immediately followed by a wash, polish, and wax to protect your paint from any future abuse. The polish and wax can hide any swirl marks but I do not think anything save from a fresh cat of paint can permanently remove them. I just bought a 2013 Impreza and the first thing I am going to do is wash, polish, wax with Meguiars Ultimate (my personal favorite) to keep it clean, shiny, protected. Maybe once my car is 3 or 4 years old and I can notice physical bumps in the paint will I use a clay bar.
Wow, absolute worst advice! So you are going to take your brand new car and ignore the key to a good polish? When your car is sent in a dirty container then on a train/truck to its final destination it gets pelted with stuff, and you want to wait 3 or 4 years? You are far from an expert, you need to clay prior to that polish. It's like saying you will skip the primer and go right to the paint. If you are going to take the time to wash, polish, then wax why skip a crucial piece?
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:38 PM   #50
pilfflip
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Everything I've read suggestions to do the whole shebang almost the moment you get the car home from a good wash to wax job.
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