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Old 04-04-2013, 01:53 PM   #101
amoore131
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I havent gotten a cel at all...and it it is a 98, so it has a maf. but im kind of confused about that too, cause when i had my vf-11 turbo on it, it spiked too high once, and threw a high intake manifold pressure code. so that makes me want to think there is something monitoring manifold pressure.... If it was detecting knock, wouldnt that throw a code as well? im not using em, just stock ecu. thanks for your help, guys!
Get a check valve for the map sensor on your strut tower. I had that code and used an oem Nissan check valve and it hasn't come back.

Sounds like you are probably hitting fuel cut and running lean. You need an fmu unit. I'm running an 8:1 plate with my td04.
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Old 04-05-2013, 03:22 AM   #102
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ok, do you think that a fmu would work ok with a stock fuel pump? or will that kill it? also, i have a narrowband air/fuel ratio gauge, and it shows it pegging rich at WOT......but i probably shouldnt trust a narrowband, huh? but also, my egts stay lower than stock at wot(around 1250 degrees), and that leads me to believe that i have enough fuel. what do you think? oh, and what year of impreza do you have? do you know exactly what your air/fuel ratio is at wot with a 8-1 plate?

Last edited by mutydog; 04-05-2013 at 03:43 AM.
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Old 04-05-2013, 04:22 AM   #103
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Watching this thread...

have a Ej25D in my '97 Outback but thinking about a Ej22e build.. I would of still had my 95 Legacy with the EJ22e but totaled it 2 years ago :-/

Also curious how you deal with having to pass the OBDII test for emissions? I assume it would throw a code?
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Old 04-05-2013, 11:39 AM   #104
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ok, do you think that a fmu would work ok with a stock fuel pump? or will that kill it? also, i have a narrowband air/fuel ratio gauge, and it shows it pegging rich at WOT......but i probably shouldnt trust a narrowband, huh? but also, my egts stay lower than stock at wot(around 1250 degrees), and that leads me to believe that i have enough fuel. what do you think? oh, and what year of impreza do you have? do you know exactly what your air/fuel ratio is at wot with a 8-1 plate?
Well first thing i would do is upgrade your fuel pump. That stock one isn't efficient enough. See how it runs, then buy an fmu. Narrowbands really aren't accurate. I have a 96 impreza ej22e. I don't know the af ratio but did extensively research on other builds that tells me i have a safe af ratio. I might get a wideband one of these days.
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Old 04-05-2013, 01:23 PM   #105
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yeah, i was afraid of that did you get a walboro 255lph? also, are you using the stock injectors with your fmu? how much boost are you running? i am trying to decide whether to just keep my td04, and get a fuel pump and fmu...and maybe a wideband too....or i could just switch back to my little Vf-11 turbo, and just get a wideband to moniter it. i really like how the td04 spools much faster than the vf-11, and doesnt run out of breath at high rpms It still seems so wierd to me that a bit bigger of a turbo at 5psi would use have more issues than a vf-11 at 7-8 psi. i never had any fuel cut issues with it!

Oh, and subaruimprezapower, i didnt have any check engine light from boost until it accidentaly spiked to about 10 psi on my little turbo. with less than that, you shouldnt get any codes at all.
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Old 04-05-2013, 07:17 PM   #106
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yeah, i was afraid of that did you get a walboro 255lph? also, are you using the stock injectors with your fmu? how much boost are you running? i am trying to decide whether to just keep my td04, and get a fuel pump and fmu...and maybe a wideband too....or i could just switch back to my little Vf-11 turbo, and just get a wideband to moniter it. i really like how the td04 spools much faster than the vf-11, and doesnt run out of breath at high rpms It still seems so wierd to me that a bit bigger of a turbo at 5psi would use have more issues than a vf-11 at 7-8 psi. i never had any fuel cut issues with it!

Oh, and subaruimprezapower, i didnt have any check engine light from boost until it accidentaly spiked to about 10 psi on my little turbo. with less than that, you shouldnt get any codes at all.
Walbro 255- yes
Stock injectors- yes
Boost- 7 psi

Upgraded injectors isn't usually needed at these boost levels and won't run properly without some sort of electronic fuel/engine management. vf-11 should be spooling sooner because of the smaller turbines fyi.

Keep the td04, upgrade fuel pump, buy td04, enjoy being faster

This should help you out and should get you out of requiring a wideband. http://www.rs25.com/forums/f7/t10779...arts-list.html

Last edited by amoore131; 04-05-2013 at 10:14 PM.
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Old 04-05-2013, 08:38 PM   #107
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ok, cool! i found a vortech fmu with a 10:1 plate for sale on craigslist for $100, im not sure if im gonna get it yet though....i need $! actually, the vf-11 has a much bigger exhaust housing, so it kicked in at 2800rpm compared to my td04 @ around 2300rpm. i know that susiemk was using a 12:1 plate, but he has a 99 impreza...so im not sure how much different maf cars are in 98 from the map 99's. there was an old thread on rs25 where a company was selling walbros for $80!!! i pm'ed him to see if they still sell them that cheap, so we will see! did you have any issues with blowing up fuel lines from too high of pressure? thanks again for your help!
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Old 04-05-2013, 10:19 PM   #108
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ok, cool! i found a vortech fmu with a 10:1 plate for sale on craigslist for $100, im not sure if im gonna get it yet though....i need $! actually, the vf-11 has a much bigger exhaust housing, so it kicked in at 2800rpm compared to my td04 @ around 2300rpm. i know that susiemk was using a 12:1 plate, but he has a 99 impreza...so im not sure how much different maf cars are in 98 from the map 99's. there was an old thread on rs25 where a company was selling walbros for $80!!! i pm'ed him to see if they still sell them that cheap, so we will see! did you have any issues with blowing up fuel lines from too high of pressure? thanks again for your help!
Buy that! You can go on ebay or summit racing and get a new plate kit for it to make it 8:1 for 30 bucks. Yeah, all MAP EJ22/25's, you would want the 12:1 but it's lower for MAF subarus, like ours.

There is some special rate or group buy on rs25 right now. A vendor is selling those fuel pumps for 90 shipped. I never ran into lines blowing up because the install kit for the fuel pump gives you a new in tank line, I have a stainless line right off the FMU, and a brand new line right off the FPR.
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Old 04-05-2013, 11:10 PM   #109
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Oh, and subaruimprezapower, i didnt have any check engine light from boost until it accidentaly spiked to about 10 psi on my little turbo. with less than that, you shouldnt get any codes at all.
Nice! Can't wait to soak up some more info!
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Old 04-07-2013, 01:05 PM   #110
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I have an extra Blox racing RRFPR with the same 6:1 plate I use for my 98 22e set up. The Map engines usally use the higher rates. Looking to get $75 for it if anyone is interested. Also the walbro 255 is worth it everytime
You can run it with just about any set up and there is really no downside
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Old 04-10-2013, 12:52 PM   #111
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I have an extra Blox racing RRFPR with the same 6:1 plate I use for my 98 22e set up. The Map engines usally use the higher rates. Looking to get $75 for it if anyone is interested. Also the walbro 255 is worth it everytime
You can run it with just about any set up and there is really no downside
Did you have a wideband with your setup to monitor your afr's? also how much boost did you run?
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Old 04-14-2013, 09:31 PM   #112
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I've got my engine running sans turbo right now. It goes great but I'm slightly confused about something. I've used 22T HG 1104AA282 with early 20H heads same as WRX G heads and HLA 25D heads. I calculated 9.2:1 CR but there is another thread floating around here with the same build but using thinner gaskets but calculated the same CR. Is my figure right?
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Old 04-18-2013, 04:33 PM   #113
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Alright, got some numbers from my set up today!
I'll have the graph up later after I scan it in.
Did a few pulls today on my 2.2.
the Third run got me:
176 ft/lbs @ 4000 rpm
151.8 hp @ 5450 rpm


engine was a little lean without real management running in the 13.5 range
boost stayed below 5 psi for a very safe run. Boost was 3.99 psi at the 151 hp mark.


Just a reminder again

Specs:
stock ej22e with 260k miles I just put in after hydro-locking my original.
Blox racing 6:1 rrfpr
walbro 255
subachad uppipe and downpipe
godspeed td05 big 16g
jdm slanty intercooler
bosch recirc valve
full 3inch stainless exhaust after the downpipe with highflow cat
Custom intake pieced together from siliconeintakes.com
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Old 04-19-2013, 12:07 PM   #114
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Old 04-19-2013, 12:37 PM   #115
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heres a quote from my build thread on another site where I am discussing over all impressions of the car and sort of where to go with it.
Quote:
Lacking in the actual peak hp number probably from the single-port head, Never going to flow great. Torque however is very good!
I mean baseline for my stock engine is said to be around 90hp on Kinetics dyno. When I ran at SM5 I set the bar pretty high putting out 113hp with just a leaky oversized exhaust and nothing else so the gains don't seem massive but over stock they are still decent for only around 4psi.
Quote:
I was hoping I could see the HP number up around the torque range but like I said, flow is going to be the issue. I'm also currently capped for boost. I can go up a tad but I am already running on the leaner side. You have to keep in mind I am running with out any real management to speak of, just an rrfpr to bring up the pressure in the rail. That means I am still on stock tiny injectors and all that crap. Also the heads arn't exactly fantastic but fuel control is probably the number one stopping factor. You can see where power just sort of stops building and flattens out between 5k and 6k redline.
Next stop for this car is swapping the engine again because the current block seems to be having balance issues and chewing through and bearing or something. With a fresher block I'll also be going back to a td04 using Tim's that is proven to 300+whp on his 2.5l so that won't be starved in the lower boost range I am looking at. I will also be looking to do something on the fuel side either with a greddy piggy back or setting up Megasquirt as a piggy back/injector driver so I can go bigger then stock and add some more safety to the afr and possibly push into the 8-10psi range. Keep in mind this is also a high compression engine. I can change that fairly easy but I still like having the low end N/A feel where I am not worrying about downshifting to get back into the power. It will move itself along and then the turbo will kick it and you will get a nice little pull all the way up. I like the way the car goes up hill now. Where I used to have to down shift to keep the car going about 60 mph I can now stay in 5th and it keeps pulling all the way past 80 mph where I sort of keep it at 75% throttle. I mean it isn't going to win drag races or anything and that isn't the goal, its really just to make the car feel less starved every time you need a little oomph to get up a hill/mountain or go to overtake. Also the torque has no problem breaking my rear wheels free so what more would I want?
So far this thread doesn't have a ton of numbers so that is why I really wanted to get some for you since I have had it on the dyno before. it was the old block that I hydro locked and it turned out to be a bit of a freak making an extra 23 n/a whp with just a 2.5 inch exhaust on stock headers and airbox (not as restrictive as people convince themselves).
I mean the only real numbers we have are from the 22 with 205 heads which are going to flow sooo soooo much better then the single port 22e's we have. If you start doing head work on those the normal 205 can get up into almost 400 whp with the right turbo.
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Old 04-22-2013, 11:24 AM   #116
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wow Squarebush! That is some great info! with your setup, are you using a check valve/multiple check valves going to the map sensor? also, dont you think it would be a good idea to move up to an 8 or 10:1 plate for your rrfpr to bring down afr's into a safer range?
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Old 04-23-2013, 01:14 AM   #117
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wow Squarebush! That is some great info! with your setup, are you using a check valve/multiple check valves going to the map sensor? also, dont you think it would be a good idea to move up to an 8 or 10:1 plate for your rrfpr to bring down afr's into a safer range?
I currently have one check valve and I never got it to do anything but I figured out how to force readiness to pass inspection so I stopped worrying about it. Right now I am missing the front o2 sensor so the map is the least of my worries. I don't think I am going to bother messing with different rrfpr values because with the set up I am running and that low of boost I am not really creating much extra heat where the extra knock protection would be required thus richening it up. I also run 93-91 octane depending where I am and what they have. When I was at Kinetic doing the dyno I was talking to the tuner who is a great guy and super helpful. We discussed the afr values and he basically said what I already knew... 12ish is where you want to be in a turbo car but until you start getting up to around 10+psi it isn't a huge concern. Obviously when you are in a stg2 wrx up in the 18-20psi range you really need the extra fueling.
If I end up going further with this project and not just run it like it is forever I will be switching over to real fuel management and the rrfpr won't be necessary. I mean I still will use it probably because it worked well even when I was n/a. Otherwise fuel will be more about injector sizing. With the 255 backing up the system it won't run out of fuel. Also I am meaning to do the parallel fuel line set up. I have everything i need including a second set of lines, rails and injectors + the hosing. Plan on doing it the next time I take the engine out when I replace this crappy block.
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Old 04-23-2013, 08:38 AM   #118
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I'd upgrade injectors just because they sre probably older, get a fresh batch if not wrx 06 top feeds ( 550 ) so later down road you'll have them done already. and direct fit. walbro or higher and good tune should be fine, Spark plugs (7) cold lower than that I hear wasted spark coils die early.
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Old 04-24-2013, 11:58 AM   #119
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I'd upgrade injectors just because they sre probably older, get a fresh batch if not wrx 06 top feeds ( 550 ) so later down road you'll have them done already. and direct fit. walbro or higher and good tune should be fine, Spark plugs (7) cold lower than that I hear wasted spark coils die early.
there are lots wrong with this. I don't want to go out of my way to be a dick but I want to make sure someone who reads this does not think this can actually be done.
So the biggest problem with all of that is that our older ecu's are not flash-able. It is an older style of chip and can not/should not be reprogrammed. It can probably be done but it is a super weird process but not through the obd2 port.
So that brings us to injectors which can not be replaced because the ecu is calibrated to the stock sizing. Ecu's do not understand flow rates just duty cycles and load. Also ecu's operate in a fairly narrow range in terms of that. So if you were to double the injector size you would totally mess everything up because it can't re-calibrate and you would basically just flood your engine (worse case scenario)
So the alternative is either replace the ecu with an opensource or piggyback that can be programmed for the new injectors or like I did run a rising rate fuel pressure regulator. Stock a regulator operates in a 1:1 fashion so for every increase in pressure they bring the rail pressure up one psi. With the rising rate you are using a fixed ratio like 6:1 or 8:1 and so on. This adds more psi to the fuel rail so that when the injector opens you are actually getting more fuel in. This only works up to a certain point until the injector runs out of physical flow and becomes too much of a restriction. But since all injectors in the same family have the same size holes essentially you have a pretty good ceiling. However you don't really push past the sort of 8 psi range as far as boost goes with out going to real management. Things in our ecu's will start going a bit batty.
Also when I have seen injectors in the high 200k mile range get sent out to be cleaned and matched they have always been in super good condition and only needed slight tweaking in terms of what we are running in the 2.2
Fuel pump is a necessity so that is totally correct and there is absolutely zero reason not to put a walbro in. Its cheap, effective, and has way more headroom than you will ever need so you don't have to worry about efficiency. I know people with 1000cc injectors only running the walbro 190. Seems silly but works.
Spark plugs are never a bad idea. I have fresh ones and a new timing belt and wires. I did all of that when I changed the block after hydrolocking the original engine.
The coil pack is also spot on and the best way to go is with the dodge neon MSD pack. In N/A form it gives a huge power gain for the 2.2 so why not play it safe on the turbo's, oh on that note, I did not do that yet

So...
injectors: no because ecu can't be tuned
tune: can't
add a piggyback or stand alone and you can do that.
Fuel pump: yes!
spark plugs: yes
coil pack: also yes!
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Old 04-29-2013, 01:41 PM   #120
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tuning options

I personally used an 03 setup to run mine wonder how hard it would be to adapt that ecu. Get some 205 heads and what not
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Old 04-29-2013, 07:52 PM   #121
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1996 impreza wagon, ej22e stock with 350k miles. CT-26 at 8psi. had to put in new clutch and running it now at 5psi for now. Waiting for it to blow up to do a car rebuild. Possible 5.3ls motor turboed rwd once this motor is done!
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Old 04-30-2013, 05:00 AM   #122
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1996 impreza wagon, ej22e stock with 350k miles. CT-26 at 8psi. had to put in new clutch and running it now at 5psi for now. Waiting for it to blow up to do a car rebuild. Possible 5.3ls motor turboed rwd once this motor is done!
Interesting choice of turbo.
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Old 05-25-2013, 03:43 PM   #123
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hey guys, so i got my walbro and 8 to 1 fmu installed, and i verified that it is working. my starting fuel pressure is 32 psi, and under 4psi of boost, it goes up to 60 psi, which is what is supposed to happen. the problem is that im still having the same fuel cut issue, where at 4000rpm, it just cuts out, and the boost drops. i have a check valve before the map sensor, and i tested that to make sure it wasnt seeing any boost....i just dont get what could be causing it to cut out. if it is the knock sensor causing it, would one step colder plugs fix this issue? i am still using stock plugs. thanks so much everyone for your help.
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Old 05-31-2013, 02:02 PM   #124
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BTW 13.5 AFRS is way to lean. your risking damage at that afr
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Old 06-06-2013, 05:31 PM   #125
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Might be joining the EJ22e club soon.. My Ej25D skipped about 10 teeth on the passenger side cams do to slack in the belt.. I've got 265K on it.. for those that switched did you just buy the engine and that was that or did you do a little prep work before hand?

My project is not going to start until next year so I just might be getting the engine a little bit sooner.
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