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Old 04-16-2013, 02:42 PM   #226
RexFTW
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Build Updates:

Well, things are changing fairly substantially and I think for the better.

Instead of the 2.5 +4mm 75mm stroke longrod we are going to go with a 2.6 +2mm 79mm stroke revving to 8800ish instead of 10k. So we will get a bit better spool out of it and things are matched a bit better so the powerband should be the same or better.

10k rpm would have sounded amazing but oiling on long pulls, plus the custom cams I would have had to get to make it make sense to rev there aren't worth it for a car that will be street driven (not daily driven, just will see street time and cruises). Not to mention I was already over-geared anyway with that much RPM.

I also already ordered the Cosworth 79mm billet crank. I know a lot of people have said the stock ones are adequate, but the oiling looks drastically better on the billet options and the car will spend a lot of time over 8k rpm, not just short bursts during mile runs.

Apparently we are now just waiting on the new crank and pistons to show up.

Edit: Also forgot to mention we are going to target 9.4-9.5:1 compression ratio.
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Last edited by RexFTW; 04-16-2013 at 03:26 PM.
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Old 04-16-2013, 02:50 PM   #227
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Should be pretty brutal!
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Old 04-16-2013, 02:52 PM   #228
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Just build a eg33 instead haha.

I hope u have better luck with the new motor.
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Old 04-16-2013, 03:06 PM   #229
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Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
Just build a eg33 instead haha.

I hope u have better luck with the new motor.
As do I, but I can't think of any other potential problems.

That said, I thought the same thing about the last engine, .
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Old 04-16-2013, 04:30 PM   #230
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900rr Brian? Maybe next time?
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Old 04-16-2013, 04:43 PM   #231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RexFTW View Post
Build Updates:

Well, things are changing fairly substantially and I think for the better.

Instead of the 2.5 +4mm 75mm stroke longrod we are going to go with a 2.6 +2mm 79mm stroke revving to 8800ish instead of 10k. So we will get a bit better spool out of it and things are matched a bit better so the powerband should be the same or better.

10k rpm would have sounded amazing but oiling on long pulls, plus the custom cams I would have had to get to make it make sense to rev there aren't worth it for a car that will be street driven (not daily driven, just will see street time and cruises). Not to mention I was already over-geared anyway with that much RPM.

I also already ordered the Cosworth 79mm billet crank. I know a lot of people have said the stock ones are adequate, but the oiling looks drastically better on the billet options and the car will spend a lot of time over 8k rpm, not just short bursts during mile runs.

Apparently we are now just waiting on the new crank and pistons to show up.

Edit: Also forgot to mention we are going to target 9.4-9.5:1 compression ratio.
I think arrow makes the cosworth cranks so good choice there!

What are the power goals now?

glad to hear/see things are back on track!!

Matt
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Old 04-16-2013, 05:21 PM   #232
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Originally Posted by Matty_STi View Post
I think arrow makes the cosworth cranks so good choice there!

What are the power goals now?

glad to hear/see things are back on track!!

Matt
Same, 4 digits or bust. 900-950 on boost, a little over 1000 with nitrous added on e98 or this e90 race blend I picked up (I am going to run both and see what I like better). If that is enough power for 200 in the mile I will leave it there. If not, I'll step up the turbo, either to a PTE 7175 or a larger Borg Warner.

I have started looking into the necessary aero as well.
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Old 04-16-2013, 05:41 PM   #233
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Old 04-16-2013, 06:17 PM   #234
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Originally Posted by RexFTW View Post
Same, 4 digits or bust. 900-950 on boost, a little over 1000 with nitrous added on e98 or this e90 race blend I picked up (I am going to run both and see what I like better). If that is enough power for 200 in the mile I will leave it there. If not, I'll step up the turbo, either to a PTE 7175 or a larger Borg Warner.

I have started looking into the necessary aero as well.
Wow! what are you going to do to the transmission? modena dog box?
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Old 04-16-2013, 07:05 PM   #235
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Surprised you didn't do 10:1 since ull be running e90+

Good to see things changing I'm looking to that build also!

It's joe btw lol.


Still am considering a eg33 to make over 800 myself. I just want it to be reliable.
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Old 04-16-2013, 07:09 PM   #236
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Originally Posted by WhatTurboLag? View Post
Surprised you didn't do 10:1 since ull be running e90+

Good to see things changing I'm looking to that build also!

It's joe btw lol.


Still am considering a eg33 to make over 800 myself. I just want it to be reliable.
6 cylinders vs 4. 50% less the effort it has to be more reliable.
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Old 04-16-2013, 08:33 PM   #237
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I know what you are saying and yeah, I get it.

But at the end of the day how many shops out there would actually handle it like this, especially something this catastrophic? Few and far between. I have been bent over by a local shop before then told to take a hike when I wanted it resolved, and the particular shop I am referring to is quite well known even on NASIOC. Even to the point I was blatantly lied to, to my face.

Ideally, he shouldn't have to do any crazy amount of checking but clearly there are part manufacturers with poor quality control.
For a shop, putting a warranty on a performance engine build/rebuild can be a tough thing. For a customer, always ask up front, get it in writing(email is a great way to ask this and get a response in writing) and have it attached to the final bill. I know a few shops I have been at firmly stood by the "NO warranty on a performance engine build" for the simple fact that they know the build is likely on the edge already. Most were 90 days parts and labor from the final invoice date.

All of the shops I have been at, would have covered this on their dime with out a doubt. This comes down to a builder or assembler who did not check the parts they were using and it came back, assuming it is not melted bearing material in the passage.

Most of these passages are drilled from one side, not from both. So it is odd that the passage has a blockage midway, yet being to size(assumed) on both journals(entrance and exit). A good cleaning and inspection of the bottom of the hole(middle of the passage at the blockage) would reveal if it was mis-aligned(drilled from both sides), transfered bearing material.

It isn't always about poor quality control either. It has more to do with statistics. Make enough parts long enough, some one is going to mis something at some point regardless of your quality control practices. It is an unavoidable fact of manufacturing.
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Old 04-16-2013, 10:42 PM   #238
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Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
Wow! what are you going to do to the transmission? modena dog box?
Havn't 100% decided yet and there are a quite a few options. Modena is one of the front runners.

Quote:
Originally Posted by flstffxe View Post
For a shop, putting a warranty on a performance engine build/rebuild can be a tough thing. For a customer, always ask up front, get it in writing(email is a great way to ask this and get a response in writing) and have it attached to the final bill. I know a few shops I have been at firmly stood by the "NO warranty on a performance engine build" for the simple fact that they know the build is likely on the edge already. Most were 90 days parts and labor from the final invoice date.

All of the shops I have been at, would have covered this on their dime with out a doubt. This comes down to a builder or assembler who did not check the parts they were using and it came back, assuming it is not melted bearing material in the passage.

Most of these passages are drilled from one side, not from both. So it is odd that the passage has a blockage midway, yet being to size(assumed) on both journals(entrance and exit). A good cleaning and inspection of the bottom of the hole(middle of the passage at the blockage) would reveal if it was mis-aligned(drilled from both sides), transfered bearing material.

It isn't always about poor quality control either. It has more to do with statistics. Make enough parts long enough, some one is going to mis something at some point regardless of your quality control practices. It is an unavoidable fact of manufacturing.
I don't know about your area, but I was blatantly lied to by a shop, given something other than what was paid for and told to get bent when I wanted it fixed on a $8,000 purchase & install. It is a well known shop in Chicagoland. I was actually fed the line "When you order a transmission from Subaru, you don't know which gearing you will receive" when I paid for a brand new 07 6 speed and was given an 06 6 speed (so gearing difference and no oil pump). I don't automatically have faith in shops anymore.

Maybe I'm just jaded due to that experience.
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Old 04-17-2013, 05:53 PM   #239
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Sorry for the loss and looking forward to the new beast in the making! Unfortunately, many of us here in the built engine world have felt your pain at one time or another. It is a labor of love that is for sure!

+1 for MPS. They are dedicated to making each and every person who comes through their doors happy (and fast) when they leave. Dom spent many late nights on my build and I feel very lucky to have a shop like that in my backyard.

Hoping you make it to 4 digits and post lots of videos for us mere mortals hahahaha
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Old 04-17-2013, 06:12 PM   #240
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Sorry for the loss and looking forward to the new beast in the making! Unfortunately, many of us here in the built engine world have felt your pain at one time or another. It is a labor of love that is for sure!

+1 for MPS. They are dedicated to making each and every person who comes through their doors happy (and fast) when they leave. Dom spent many late nights on my build and I feel very lucky to have a shop like that in my backyard.

Hoping you make it to 4 digits and post lots of videos for us mere mortals hahahaha
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Old 04-17-2013, 09:10 PM   #241
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I want pics of the manifold
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Old 04-18-2013, 12:48 PM   #242
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I want pics of the manifold
Exhaust manifold or intake manifold?
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Old 04-19-2013, 05:13 PM   #243
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Havn't 100% decided yet and there are a quite a few options. Modena is one of the front runners.



I don't know about your area, but I was blatantly lied to by a shop, given something other than what was paid for and told to get bent when I wanted it fixed on a $8,000 purchase & install. It is a well known shop in Chicagoland. I was actually fed the line "When you order a transmission from Subaru, you don't know which gearing you will receive" when I paid for a brand new 07 6 speed and was given an 06 6 speed (so gearing difference and no oil pump). I don't automatically have faith in shops anymore.

Maybe I'm just jaded due to that experience.
SUBBED!

I think anyone with some real passion could have very easily lost there heart for modifications due to some crack in integrity from that situation.

I'm glad you stayed in it though, it was great talking to you the other day. Remember, fluid dynamics are your friend, you just need to make them do what YOU want. Build your walls and create your veins my friend.

-Mark
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Old 04-19-2013, 05:44 PM   #244
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SUBBED!

I think anyone with some real passion could have very easily lost there heart for modifications due to some crack in integrity from that situation.

I'm glad you stayed in it though, it was great talking to you the other day. Remember, fluid dynamics are your friend, you just need to make them do what YOU want. Build your walls and create your veins my friend.

-Mark
Yeah, I seem to be a glutton for punishment some times .

I am glad I stayed in it too even if my wallet is sometimes annoyed .
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Old 04-19-2013, 06:53 PM   #245
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Exhaust manifold or intake manifold?
Both, preferably exhaust
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Old 04-22-2013, 09:09 PM   #246
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I'm liking the idea of a +2 2.6 more and more.

I just wish it could rev safely to 9k and that's it.
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Old 04-22-2013, 10:22 PM   #247
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I'm liking the idea of a +2 2.6 more and more.

I just wish it could rev safely to 9k and that's it.
It's doable. It'll take a serious rod at that speed/loading but is very doable. As for rings, you're still under that magical 25 m/s but peak acceleration is going to be up there.

-Micah
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Old 04-23-2013, 01:42 PM   #248
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It's doable. It'll take a serious rod at that speed/loading but is very doable. As for rings, you're still under that magical 25 m/s but peak acceleration is going to be up there.

-Micah
What do you mean by a serious rod? I don't know how much crazier of a rod exists (I'm not being sarcastic, I just plain don't know) than the ones I am getting or do you mean like some titanium/unobtanium option?

Have the triple plate en route I was talking about before so the 6 puck won't matter anymore from a previous conversation in this thread.
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Old 04-23-2013, 02:08 PM   #249
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I still don't understand the obsession with high reving motors...

EVOs have 2.0L that can rev to the moon.... and most of them are switching to 2.3L and 2.4L with similar rev limit as our motors.... and we are going the other way
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Old 04-23-2013, 02:18 PM   #250
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I still don't understand the obsession with high reving motors...

EVOs have 2.0L that can rev to the moon.... and most of them are switching to 2.3L and 2.4L with similar rev limit as our motors.... and we are going the other way
My theories/understanding.

Part of it is gearing.

I would rather keep a smaller diameter tire and keep my gearing shorter (final drive number higher) to keep up acceleration if I can hold power higher in the RPM band. I might end up going to a taller tire regardless depending on how things turn out. It wouldn't be such a big deal if I could just swap out a ring & pinion in a rear diff to impact gearing.

Part two is powerband.

I am not committed to this being the last turbo on the car, the larger the turbo the longer it will take to spool and I would like it to at least have enough room in gear to be usable off spray.

Part three is stroke.

We can't fit as much of it without running out of block height/rod ratio. Even the 83mm crank gives the piston wiggle room at bottom dead center. We have to look elsewhere.

The other, less substantial, part is audio orgasm. But I guess that is personal preference.
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